Twins trade for SS Eduardo Escobar, option Santana & Polanco.

[Trevor0333]

It's just like adding a SS right? It is about time Escobar got the call to start. Hopefully not moving around as much helps him be a little more consistent at the plate.

[curt1965]

Twins not playing Escobar as a starter at SS should tell you everything.....

[mudcat14]

Today's transactions;

 

Santana to Rochester

 

Polanco to Chattanooga

 

Presumably so each can play SS everyday.

 

Plouffe & Jepsen activated.

[DaveW]

More incompetence by TR, gotta make sure we have 8 RP and a short bench again! God forbid they actually cut one of the bullpen guys.

[stringer bell]

It has been apparent since Spring Training that Molitor wanted to go with the more athletically gifted Santana at shortstop. For this season anyway, that hasn't worked out. While Escobar isn't dazzling, he makes the plays at short and has plenty of arm to make the long throw. I do think it is time to install him as the regular and let him play. I think he'll hit well enough and play well enough in the field. Shortstop wasn't one of the Twins' problems last year and they played Escobar there more than half the time. If they are serious about gaining the wild card, they need to go with the best option for today. That option is Eduardo Escobar.

[huhguy]

Brutal Headline, Polanco did not look good to me, dont think we can count on him as everyday ss

[DocBauer]

It has been apparent since Spring Training that Molitor wanted to go with the more athletically gifted Santana at shortstop. For this season anyway, that hasn't worked out. While Escobar isn't dazzling, he makes the plays at short and has plenty of arm to make the long throw. I do think it is time to install him as the regular and let him play. I think he'll hit well enough and play well enough in the field. Shortstop wasn't one of the Twins' problems last year and they played Escobar there more than half the time. If they are serious about gaining the wild card, they need to go with the best option for today. That option is Eduardo Escobar.

100%! Words right out of my mouth.

 

But Polanco to AA??? I call BS on this one. His bat is ML ready, or awfully close. He's earned his ticket to Rochester. While I like Santana and continue to root for him and hope for the best, if anyone needed to go to AA it's Santana to find himself with less pressure.

[Kwak]

Escobar at SS is giving up. One less bench player?  On most teams that would be a problem--but since Molitor doesn't pinch-hit or platoon--it won't matter.

 

I'm curious about this "farm system".  Oh so many rave about the Twins "prospects"--but what I see is:  Can't Hit,  or Can't catch, or Can't throw, or Can't run.  One (or worse more!) of those attributes.  I'm sorry, please explain to me why all of these guys are too precious to trade?

[stringer bell]

 

Escobar at SS is giving up. One less bench player?  On most teams that would be a problem--but since Molitor doesn't pinch-hit or platoon--it won't matter.

 

I'm curious about this "farm system".  Oh so many rave about the Twins "prospects"--but what I see is:  Can't Hit,  or Can't catch, or Can't throw, or Can't run.  One (or worse more!) of those attributes.  I'm sorry, please explain to me why all of these guys are too precious to trade?

Since the start of the season the Twins have added Sano, Rosario, and Hicks to the everyday lineup. They also have promoted Byron Buxton, who probably will be in the majors to stay in one month. What is left in the system is less than great prospects. Two outfielders in AA are having noteworthy seasons and Polanco has had several cups of coffee and looks like he can hit at the highest level. Only one pitcher has stepped up (Berrios). I think that the trade for a player under team control for next year (Jepsen) has something to do with the failures and lack of improvement of top level relief pitchers.

[Kwak]

 

Since the start of the season the Twins have added Sano, Rosario, and Hicks to the everyday lineup. They also have promoted Byron Buxton, who probably will be in the majors to stay in one month. What is left in the system is less than great prospects. Two outfielders in AA are having noteworthy seasons and Polanco has had several cups of coffee and looks like he can hit at the highest level. Only one pitcher has stepped up (Berrios). I think that the trade for a player under team control for next year (Jepsen) has something to do with the failures and lack of improvement of top level relief pitchers.

Oh, you have forgotten:  Arcia, Pinto, Vargas, D. Santana, Polonco, any Catcher.  Until June Hicks too--and yet  he may return to that group.  Buxton is (for now) in the Can't hit group, Sano--the Can't field group.  I'm not writing them all off completely, but 5 tools?  No way.  I don't give anybody away but no one is untradable--just expensive.

[jun]

 

Escobar at SS is giving up. One less bench player?  On most teams that would be a problem--but since Molitor doesn't pinch-hit or platoon--it won't matter.

 

I'm curious about this "farm system".  Oh so many rave about the Twins "prospects"--but what I see is:  Can't Hit,  or Can't catch, or Can't throw, or Can't run.  One (or worse more!) of those attributes.  I'm sorry, please explain to me why all of these guys are too precious to trade?

They just traded Hu though.

[Kwak]

 

They just traded Hu though.

I know that.  Please consider all of the posts concerning said trade.

[BrianTrottier]

 

Oh, you have forgotten:  Arcia, Pinto, Vargas, D. Santana, Polonco, any Catcher.  Until June Hicks too--and yet  he may return to that group.  Buxton is (for now) in the Can't hit group, Sano--the Can't field group.  I'm not writing them all off completely, but 5 tools?  No way.  I don't give anybody away but no one is untradable--just expensive.

 

Why does everyone buy into the narrative that Sano can't field? Is it because he's big, and we assume that big guys can't field? It's just wrong. As far as Buxton being in the "can't hit" group, why don't we give him some time to develop at the major league level? He's played all of 11 games, and appeared to be turning a corner right before he went on the DL. And yes, those other guys you mentioned have shown signs of being capable major leaguers. Some guys just need more time to develop. I'm not saying that they will all be ML regulars, but they do have upside.

 

Finally, regarding the farm system as a whole, I'll believe the experts that have consistently ranked the Twins' in the top 3 over the past two-three years over individual Twins Daily posters venting their emotions on a message board. 

[GM64]

 

 

 

 

I'm curious about this "farm system".  Oh so many rave about the Twins "prospects"--but what I see is:  Can't Hit,  or Can't catch, or Can't throw, or Can't run.  One (or worse more!) of those attributes.  I'm sorry, please explain to me why all of these guys are too precious to trade?

 

 

Players pretty seldom arrive at the big leagues fully formed.  Plouffe couldn't very well, and was not near the hitter he is, Dozier couldn't hit and couldn't really play short.  Gibson had a poor beginning at the big league level, May began brutally. Perkins, too.  Anyone remember Hunter's first pass at the majors?  Banjo-hitting, sent back to AAA, then came back better, but still slugged .380 on the year.  It takes time -- development doesn't stop at AA or AAA.  

 

If the bar a prospect needs to meet is: from  day one, being an average or above major leaguer -- displaying competence across the board, then the list is pretty short.  Mauer.  Liriano.  Maybe a few others. The bar can't be that high.  

 

 I have great respect for the value of an average MLB player, and I don't object to trading prospects to fill a slot or two when it can make a big difference.  Average (not replacement level -- average) is good.  Probably a WAR of 2 or so.  And over the course of a season, having a bunch of such players is very valuable.  Right now, for this season, such a player is worth 1.0 WAR, or less.  I don't want to give away a player with a 50/50 chance of being an MLB regular for that.  To get average MLBers in bulk at an affordable price, you grow them in your farm system.

[AKTwins]

I'm fine with Escobar at Shortshop everyday the rest of year.  In fact, he should have been the everyday shortshop about 2 months ago.  Santana needs to work on a lot of things and AAA is a better place to do it than sitting on the bench at the MLB level.  Hopefully, he has a Hicksian turn around by next year.  Polanco has a lot of things to work on too, whether it is AAA or AA doesnt really matter.  I see why they like Santana's upside, but playing him at CF last year stunted his SS growth.

 

13 pitchers vs. no bench, I suspect a pitcher will get released, I think they are just figuring out who.  I suspect they dont want to trade for Grahm or just give him back to ATL.  I suspect they dont want to release Boyer, Duensing or Fein.  They cant send down O'Rourke, he is pitching too well.  I would be in favor of releasing Pelfry, putting May back in the rotation, and then bringing up a bench bat.  I suspect at some point that would be Arcia. 

[Badsmerf]

This looks like message to Molitor that jr wants Escobar to play ss every day. They need to get boyer out of Minnesota. Too bad arcia and vargas are not forcing their way up. Arcia must be down for a reason.

[AKTwins]

 

This looks like message to Molitor that jr wants Escobar to play ss every day. They need to get boyer out of Minnesota. Too bad arcia and vargas are not forcing their way up. Arcia must be down for a reason.

Releasing Boyer and having another bench bat would be good too.  In fact, releasing Boyer and letting one of our AAA RPs developing would be great too.  Arcia is not exactly lighting the world on fire in AAA. I suppose it makes sense to let him play everyday in AAA than sit on the bench in Target Field.  Same with Vargas.  I think part of the reason Santana was playing so much is that they want him to develop.

[Mike Sixel]

Why now? What changed that is different than a month ago?

[DocBauer]

Just for fun and some real perspective sometime, go back and look at early career error totals for 2B, SS and 3B that are/were considered stars and Gold Glovers. I have, and I've posted a few interesting numbers here before. Good to outstanding defensive players seldom arrive that way. Sano will be just fine, given a little time and patience.

[ashbury]

Escobar is a starting shortstop only on a bad team, or is a valuable utility player on a good one.

 

To me this move just indicates a resignation that holding onto the WC spot is a long-shot at best, maybe even a mirage. (An assessment I happen to hold, which obviously may be coloring my interpretation here.)

 

Enjoy the games while they are still meaningful, and it's certainly not politically correct for the front office of field staff to write off the season completely while the standings still show hope. They are human beings on the field, young ones who are still growing in many cases, and good things may still happen.

 

But be prepared to start looking ahead to '16 if and when they slip even a couple of games behind in the race.

[ashbury]

Just for fun and some real perspective sometime, go back and look at early career error totals for 2B, SS and 3B that are/were considered stars and Gold Glovers. I have, and I've posted a few interesting numbers here before. Good to outstanding defensive players seldom arrive that way. Sano will be just fine, given a little time and patience.

Yes, my biggest concern for Sano is that if his bat goes quiet for a while, patience with his glove will stretch thinner than thin.

[jokin]

 

Yes, my biggest concern for Sano is that if his bat goes quiet for a while, patience with his glove will stretch thinner than thin.

 

How so, this year?  He's likely not to play in the field more than once a week until they really fall out of the race.

[jokin]

 

 

 

But be prepared to start looking ahead to '16 if and when they slip even a couple of games behind in the race.

 

Better be prepared looking ahead to '16 earlier rather than later, then?  ( What with the 4 game series in Toronto, and the Blue Jays the favorites in taking at least 3 of 4, the Twins are likely to have already slipped a couple of games behind in the race on August 6, who would have thought that possible just a couple weeks ago? The Blue Jays just moved Dickey up a day early to Sunday vs. KC and gave the Twins yet another look at Price by moving him back to Monday).

[jokin]

 

It's just like adding a SS right? It is about time Escobar got the call to start. Hopefully not moving around as much helps him be a little more consistent at the plate.

 

Yeah, just another in a series of moves in the last month that are about as strategically meaningful and difference-making as adding Jepsen to the pen.

[Kwak]

 

Yeah, just another in a series of moves in the last month that are about as strategically meaningful and difference-making as adding Jepsen to the pen.

"...rearranging the deck chairs..." significance to this season.  Though it sends a loud message to some would-be SSs.

[jokin]

 

"...rearranging the deck chairs..." significance to this season.  Though it sends a loud message to some would-be SSs.

+1  This sort of treatment may have very well worked in the case of Hicks to finally get his act together.

[DaveW]

Escobar sucks. Dude has no business being a starting anything.

[kab21]

 

This looks like message to Molitor that jr wants Escobar to play ss every day. They need to get boyer out of Minnesota. Too bad arcia and vargas are not forcing their way up. Arcia must be down for a reason.

the reason that Arcia is down is that he is 7/52 since the AS break.  Everybody got excited about his first 10 games (HOT) but he hasn't shown that he is consistent.

 

[Boom Boom]

I'm sure they don't want to call up Arcia until there's a spot for him. Rosario's in left, Hunter's in right, and Sano will get the lion's share of DH.

 

We know how averse the Twins are to platooning and rotating players between positions. You can make a good argument against that philosophy, but they're not going to change their ways because we don't like it.

 

The only other option is to send out a pitcher and have Arcia cool out on the bench as pinch hitter, which sounds like a bad idea to me for a player still trying to find his way.

[jorgenswest]

I don't get the spot for him argument. There are 25 spots on the roster and the Twins need to fill those in a way that gives them the best chance to win games.

 

Escobar and Nunez saw a game at DH this week. It could have been Arcia.

 

Hunter's OPS since July 1 is .536. Arcia could be starting against right handed pitching.

 

They had no pinch hitter last night when they had to rely on Suzuki against a closer that is really good against right handed batters. It worked out, but a pinch hitting threat on the bench may have forced them to pitch to Rosario. Do we want to continue with no option late in games with Suzuki batting?

 

I think the roster is better with 12 pitchers and another bat.