Article: Twins Ink Doumit to Two-Year Extension

[Mike Sixel]

Doesn't matter if they don't buy pitching before next year. Everything else is nibbling at the edges of mediocrity.

[crapforks]

Upset at the Doumit signing?!?! My word! It's like the argument is, "I put a waaaaayyyyy better team together on my ps3!"

[Riverbrian]

Extremely reasonable contract. Of Course that's easy for me to say... I've never spent $100,000 on anything.

 

So for 2014... Currently -- Mauer, Willingham, Span and Doumit are under contract barring a trade or release.

[jimbo92107]

Doumit is the closest thing I've seen to Mike Redmond in a Twins uniform. Not quite the average, but a bit more power.

[Shane Wahl]

This signing tells me that Doumit really likes it in Minnesota. It isn't unreasonable to think that he may have gotten a 2/$10 million or even 3/$12 million deal in the offseason from somebody else. I really like this signing. I didn't look at the details . . . is it $3.5/$3.5?

[Scheherezade]

I didn't look at the details . . . is it $3.5/$3.5?

Yup. He looked pretty cheerful when talking about the extension.

[DPJ]

You'd rather see Butera out there? This is exactly what the Twins should be doing. Filling the roster with complementary players around Mauer & Co while still letting the young guys play. The Twins have a lot of free money this offseason to build a respectable pitching staff. Their bullpen looks good. The offense is decent. All they really need is starting pitching (admittedly the hardest thing to find).

 

 

 

Please for the love of **** will people stop like the only two options for a backup catcher are Butera or giving Doumit stupid money. The Twins lack of building a roster and for some unknown reason thinking Drew needs to be on the 25 man roster doesn't excuse a stupid and bonehead signing by the Twins front office.

[Brock Beauchamp]

Please for the love of **** will people stop like the only two options for a backup catcher are Butera or giving Doumit stupid money. The Twins lack of building a roster and for some unknown reason thinking Drew needs to be on the 25 man roster doesn't excuse a stupid and bonehead signing by the Twins front office.

Since when is $3.5m for a backup catcher who can hit "stupid money"? Since when is $3.5m for any player that doesn't suck "stupid money"?

[jorgenswest]

It is hard to separate the player from the Twins priorities in building a roster.

 

Doumit is an asset to the Twins. He will likely return the value. He is a valuable hitter on the bench and relative to other catchers.

 

The Twins will have a budget line for next year. We can argue that it should be increased. Assuming that it will be close to this year's line, they just spent 3.5 million on their back up catcher/ role player. I think some would argue that they should allocate the majority of their available resources into pitching as the top priority. Why not spend less for this spot on the roster and free up 2.5 million for pitching?

[Brock Beauchamp]

It is hard to separate the player from the Twins priorities in building a roster.

 

Doumit is an asset to the Twins. He will likely return the value. He is a valuable hitter on the bench and relative to other catchers.

 

The Twins will have a budget line for next year. We can argue that it should be increased. Assuming that it will be close to this year's line, they just spent 3.5 million on their back up catcher/ role player. I think some would argue that they should allocate the majority of their available resources into pitching as the top priority. Why not spend less for this spot on the roster and free up 2.5 million for pitching?

Because Doumit likes it here, he's productive, he's versatile, and $2.5m doesn't get you squat in starting pitching.

 

The Twins will still have plenty of money to chase a good starting pitcher should they wish to do so. After the Doumit signing, they have every position on the field locked up next season. They can literally commit every last dime of money this offseason to pitching. Doumit is not stopping them from doing anything.

 

Even their bullpen is in pretty good shape for next season. They could even skip picking up anyone there as well.

[Fire Dan Gladden]

I think most of the rational posters around here think JR has done a pretty good job with the ML roster on this team. The huge, mammoth, gigantic exception being the rotation, which he didn't address in a meaningful way at all last offseason.

 

But the bullpen and lineup? You'd have to be more than a little delusional to think JR has done a bad job there. Capps was iffy but Burton has been golden. Doumit has met expectations. Willingham has grossly exceeded them. Carroll is somewhat unimpressive but most of us knew that going in.

That was my point. The problem is that most of the posters here are not rational. I don't think anybody they signed as a FA this year (outside of Marquis) has underperformed.

 

The Twins took the stance that last year was essentially a mulligan. The replaced or filled their position players as needed and otherwise counted on all of their injuries to heal up. The lineup has essentially done that. They took the same stance with the rotation, but did not have the same luck. The Zumaya, Baker, and Wimmers injuries were killer. Not having Gibson hasn't helped. Factor in Liriano and Blackburn underperforming, along with Marquis thinking he was playing slow pitch softball, the rotation was unable to recover.

 

Everybody who thinks the Twins are going to be super active at the trade deadline are delusional. They are not typically active as sellers, and I do not see that changing this year. They also are not going to go out and spend big money on a FA starter. They already have too much locked up into M&M, they will not destroy any flexability by siging a $15-18m pitcher long term.

[jorgenswest]

I apparently wasn't clear enough.

 

I am not suggesting that the 2.5 million would be used alone to buy a pitcher. I am saying that I would not spend any other money on offense since as you pointed out all of the positions are locked up.

 

I would also suggest that the Twins stop looking for decline phase players who will take a 3-5 million dollar deal. Take three of those players like Carroll, Doumit and Marquis and instead spend it on one larger contract and two near minimum contracts.

 

Why not after an Edwin Jackson first and see what you have left? Instead they sign Doumit and Carroll first and then are stuck with 3-5 million which got them Marquis and Zumaya. It is no different now. Their first priority for 2013 was a role player. That money is gone. My assumption is the budget will not change much. Is there anything that they have said otherwise?

 

Maybe their assumption is any contract 3-5 million must be a good one. The sign Blackburn and Span to long term deals in that range to avoid arbitration. Span worked out. Blackburn didn't. They gave that level of contract to Carroll, Doumit, Nishioka and Marquis. Is the total worth the sum of the parts?

 

I think the philosophy needs to change.

[John Bonnes]

Here's the thing: Doumit isn't a backup catcher. He's a starting DH who can backup at catcher. The Twins could absolutely have gotten another backup catcher at $1M, but he isn't nearly as productive as Doumit.

 

Turns out, the Twins have a guy just like that who they're on the hook for big money for the next few years. They compliment each other perfectly. The other option is going out and buying a backup catcher for a couple of million dollard less, except:

- his offensive production likely won't come close to Doumits

- it'll put pressure on the Twins to have Mauer start more behind the plate, which risks his production going down and further injury AND

- you still have to sign a DH, which isn't an issue next year because of Morneau and Parmelee, but could be the year after.

 

When they signed Doumit in the offseason, I didn't like it. I felt they were better served getting a cheaper platoon partner for Joe because I didn't trust Doumit to keep Butera out of the lineup. But I'm wrong. The Twins catching tandem is top five in the league offensively, even with Butera getting some at-bats. Continuing that for the next two years for $7M is a bargain. And I think it still leave them plenty of money to spend on pitching. I don't think they will, but they still could.

[jorgenswest]

Are you saying that Doumit projects as a league average or better DH for the duration of the contract?

[Ultima Ratio]

I think it's clear that the Twins will not be using the DH more and more as a 'day off' -- an unconventional use of the DH for sure and without much evidence to support this use of the DH.

[East Coast Twin]

And I think it still leave them plenty of money to spend on pitching. I don't think they will, but they still could.

You don't think they will pursue starting pitching in the offseason?

[Shane Wahl]

Here's the thing: Doumit isn't a backup catcher. He's a starting DH who can backup at catcher. The Twins could absolutely have gotten another backup catcher at $1M, but he isn't nearly as productive as Doumit.

 

Turns out, the Twins have a guy just like that who they're on the hook for big money for the next few years. They compliment each other perfectly. The other option is going out and buying a backup catcher for a couple of million dollard less, except:

- his offensive production likely won't come close to Doumits

- it'll put pressure on the Twins to have Mauer start more behind the plate, which risks his production going down and further injury AND

- you still have to sign a DH, which isn't an issue next year because of Morneau and Parmelee, but could be the year after.

 

When they signed Doumit in the offseason, I didn't like it. I felt they were better served getting a cheaper platoon partner for Joe because I didn't trust Doumit to keep Butera out of the lineup. But I'm wrong. The Twins catching tandem is top five in the league offensively, even with Butera getting some at-bats. Continuing that for the next two years for $7M is a bargain. And I think it still leave them plenty of money to spend on pitching. I don't think they will, but they still could.

Great post. This is exactly correct. With regard to your last paragraph . . . Rod Barajas (in your blueprint . . . ) hasn't been too terrible either (though certainly on the decline) and at $2 million that wouldn't have been a bad outcome. Yet somehow he got $4 million . . . and probably no real future beyond this year.

 

Also, add Chris Herrmann instead of Drew Butera and the situation only gets better.

[Shane Wahl]

You don't think they will pursue starting pitching in the offseason?

I think he is referring to "spending plenty" not simply pursuing starting pitching. I hope he is wrong. $20 million would be plenty enough.

[John Bonnes]

Are you saying that Doumit projects as a league average or better DH for the duration of the contract?

The average OPS of a DH right this year in the AL is 774. That's almost exactly Doumit's career average. So, yeah, he's about a league average DH.

 

But that isn't really my point. My point is that he ISN'T a backup catcher. Backup catchers don't get 500 plate appearances and don't start when the starting catcher is in the lineup and don't have a career OPS of 775. He's an EVERYDAY guy, and just because a good fraction of those days happen to be behind the plate doesn't mean his value is limited to the market of a backup catcher. He really is being used as a DH, only with the very real added benefit of being able to keep Mauer healthy and productive.

 

I'll say it again: I'm surprised he signed this deal. He was 3 months away from hitting the trade market as a switch-hitting catcher with a 775 OPS (in the AL) who finally stayed healthy. I don't think that necessarily means a multi-year deal, but it might have meant a 1-year deal for $4-$6M where he could prove he could do it a second year in a row and get that multi-year deal.

 

Here's another way to look at it: he's a slightly older Kubel, except he can catch quite a bit but looks lost in the OF. Kubel signed for 3/$20M. That's not a perfect comparison, but it's hard to see why one is worth $7M+ per year and one is worth $3.5M+. I'll take the latter.

[John Bonnes]

You don't think they will pursue starting pitching in the offseason?

I don't think they're going to go after any of the premier starting pitchers on the market. They might go after than next level, since there's kind of a glut, but that's where I think have Terry Ryan as a GM works against them. Bill Smith did a nice job of gaming the free agent market. Ryan is too risk adverse. He won't wait for someone to fall to him.

[Brock Beauchamp]

I'll say it again: I'm surprised he signed this deal. He was 3 months away from hitting the trade market as a switch-hitting catcher with a 775 OPS (in the AL) who finally stayed healthy. I don't think that necessarily means a multi-year deal, but it might have meant a 1-year deal for $4-$6M where he could prove he could do it a second year in a row and get that multi-year deal.

I was also shocked at this deal. If Doumit is healthy, I thought he'd be more along the lines of a 3/$18m guy. When the extension talk started, I expected something like 2/$12m, maybe 2/$10m.

 

2/$7m is a steal.

 

This deal reaffirms my belief that JR returning as GM was a great move for the franchise. He replaced Cuddyer with a younger version for 60% of the cost. He nabbed Doumit for less than 75% of what I thought he was worth on the open market. JR needs to stick around for a little longer.

[East Coast Twin]

I don't think they're going to go after any of the premier starting pitchers on the market. They might go after than next level, since there's kind of a glut, but that's where I think have Terry Ryan as a GM works against them. Bill Smith did a nice job of gaming the free agent market. Ryan is too risk adverse. He won't wait for someone to fall to him.

Okay. Thanks.

[East Coast Twin]

I think he is referring to "spending plenty" not simply pursuing starting pitching. I hope he is wrong. $20 million would be plenty enough.

Plus another $22M is freed up after 2013 when Morneau, Nishioka and Blackburn's contracts end. I would think the Twins are in a position after this season to offer a multi-year deal.