EGFTShaw

Meh... Although the price may be right, he seems to duplicate Garlick.

I think the intent here is, what can the Twins provide as value or incentive to lure Big Time FAs that may otherwise not want to come here. Opts Outs are one idea. Smart Agents will look at long term earnings potential vs security and try to maximize both. The downside is exactly that if you make the contract one-sided to the player. If the player gets hurt or declines rapidly or walks off the Flat Edge of the Earth (Hi Kyrie) the team is on the hook. But what if as the contract ages that it becomes a mutual options vs a player only option. So, unless both want to continue the contract ends with whatever agreement is place for said ending. I've been in favor of the Twins thinking outside of the box when it comes to signing FAs that Move the Playoff Needle in our favor. Not the bargains basement stuff. I would rather work with our young players than waste money on bargain basement FAs, (some exceptions of course), or reclamation projects. Although sometimes your farm system does not allow you to take this stance. Check the data, C4 is very similar to Cal Ripken, Jr when it comes to pre-age 28 WAR, body type, smarts and clubhouse impact. Check CRJr's WAR after year 28 to however long you want the contract to be. Then using what I hear is the industry standard of $8M/War and make a case for a good contract.

Well Damn… you have sort of stolen my thunder, but I’m going to ahead with my idea as it is more audacious than yours when we get down to the bottom line ?? ?? financial muscle will be flexed muhahahaha

Sooooo....... If every Twins fan pledged $10 to go to C4 which he and his wife could donate to their favorite charity, I think we may tempt him. Make it happen.

That "I Demand A Trade" BS in the NBA is crap. You signed the contract, suck it up buttercup. Unless there is some item in their CBA that the teams received as compensation for having to try and trade someone. Send him to the G-League.

Thinking outside the box as I have never been inside a box. LOL Could this contract work, not asking if the Twins or anyone would do it but continuing with the theme is this legal. C4: 8yrs/$265M with a $1M bonus for every WAR accumulate during the year. C4 is good for about 4-5 WAR per year. Average year his compensation would be $33.125M + $4-5M in bonuses. If he does a HUGE year, then more power to him as team and C4 benefit. I initially thought of it as 8yrs/$250M with bonuses. Regardless the concept is the same.

Thanks! NBA version I never understood, was the Nets allowing the Warriors to get value back for Durant. I mean the Warriors have been at the top of the heap. Great explanation tho.

I am of the opinion, even if it's Diaz, not going beyond 2 years with a RP when talking Big Bucks.

Maybe I am Old School, I am Old so... It should be a case-by-case plan, I can't help but feel you need 1 (minimum) and probably 2 pitchers who have quality starts of 6+ innings. We also need that one pitcher who can shut down the opposition and give the team a chance to get back on the winning streak. The last part of the season, it looked like Ryan did better when Rocco let him go more than 4.7 innings. Speaking of pitching coaches, how can a college team out bid a professional team for a pitching coach???

I'm with Doc here, " I think not spending huge on your pen is a smart idea". I think we have a good core for the BP. The Mets kept the best one off the market, but they will end up paying for the length of that contract in the end. I kind of hope not, because I love his entrance. :) That said, I am not sure there is anyone out there I would spend money on right now. You are not going to get an AWESOME RP for $3-5M. AND, I can't see spending more than that unless it was a two-year deal for one of the best. I think, to quote The Who, "The Kids Are Alright".

I started out thinking I like this, but then got to Rodon. First, we aren't getting him for $21M. Not because he deserves more, but as lefty with 2 back-to-back really good years there will be a bidding contest. Also, a $15-$20M+ starting pitcher normally is not going to be the Shut Down Ace you are looking for in a team with pitching lined up from #2 on down. I'd rather see DeGromm than Rodon. I think my offseason chart had us at around $160M. A 3-year/$120M deal for DeGromm (if it goes bad, you're not burdened with too many extra years hanging around your neck. A $40M/year deal for C4. I looked at a similar SS in size and age as C4 and looked at results over the next 10 years. There is a very good comparison to be made with C4 and Cal Ripken, Jr. Leadership, size, BA, WAR leading up to their age 28 season, etc... I do like the idea of Trey Mancini. Never thought of him as a RH OF option. Also, Ryan is my #2 with everyone else sliding down a slot and the #5 is between Ober/Maeda with the edge going to Ober to start the season. Typically, it is year 2 after the TJ that a pitcher returns to complete form.

Too funny...LOL

NBA still does. Never quite understood that tho.

One price and we can interchange all of them.

Going Paul Bunyon Big (dreaming) bec I don't want to be a AAAA Team C4 7yrs $275M (front load if possible) DeGrom 3yrs $120M (risk but only guy I know that can really be a SHUT done that is available. Not sold on Rodon even though I like him) Trade Kepler and Urshela. Jose "Read my Rights" Miranda gets 3rd base. Matt "Up Against The" Wallner gets RF Backup C goes to Andrew Bechtold just because I am NOT sold on any options, I can see available, and he can play 3rd base. Maeda takes the SP and Ober drops to RP. Final 2 RP are Henrique and Winder. Caveats: 1) Does not take into account injuries, but assumes all players listed will be 100% healthy for Spring Training. 2) I completely understand the Twins, (and owners), have NEVER even contemplated this before. 3) I realize that the money spent on C4 and DeGrom could easily be spread amongst loads of other average players, but I do NOT want and team full of average players. I want players who want to be called on when the team needs them. 4) Assume as well that, the contracts of C4 and DeGrom could possibly be traded if things go south. If the Rangers could trade A-Rod (and his PEDs) then Twins can trade C4. Yes, it may mean paying a portion of the salary. I asked a poster yesterday for options and so I feel I should go out on the Limb and risk getting roasted as well LOL C: Ryan Jeffers ($0.70M) 1B: Luis Arraez ($4.50M) 2B: Jorge Polanco ($7.50M) 3B: Jose Miranda ($0.7M) SS: Carlos Correa ($40M) LF: Alex Kirilloff ($0.70M) CF: Byron Buxton ($15.00M) RF: Matt Wallner ($0.7M) DH: Jose Miranda ($0.70M) 4th OF: Kyle Garlick ($0.70M) Utility: Nick Gordon ($0.70M) Utility: Gilberto Celestino ($0.70M) Backup C: Andrew Bechtold ($0.7M) SP1: Jacob DeGrom ($40M) SP2: Sonny Gray ($12M) SP3: Tyler Mahle ($8M) SP4: Joe Ryan ($0.70M) SP5: Kenta Maeda ($9M) RP: Jhoan Duran ($0.70M) RP: Jorge Lopez ($3.00M) RP: Griffin Jax ($0.70M) RP: Jorge Alcala ($1.0M) RP: Caleb Thielbar ($2.00M) RP: Bailey Ober ($0.7M) RP: Josh Winder ($0.70M) RP: Ronnie Henriquez ($0.70M) Payroll is 8.20% over budget

>>Regardless, there’s no way that the Twins can be more injury-plagued in 2023, right? You Bastard, You Killed Kenny. Dear god I hope not.

What about Bobby Bonilla's contract with the Mets. Free ESPN publicity each July

This is a baseball version of my hockey trades. Player XX, (in my case the Capitals play by play guy) for a bucket of hockey pucks...maybe even frozen ones... LOL

I am running from the Padres as fast a healthy Byron Buxton chasing down a deep fly ball can... LOL I am not sold on Paddock. Also, not sure who got the worst end of that deal. LOL

I like Ober, a lot. Like Ryan I feel there is more there. But I would trade him for Woodruff. Just like I like the Perry pick in the draft, but 100% in trading him for Gray. Proven quantity vs potential. I like our pitching options, Gray, Mahle, Maeda, Ryan, Ober at the moment. But you are always one odd injury to a pitcher away from disaster. AND most importantly, none of these have proven that they are the shutdown type of guy you want as your #1. The guy who can stop a losing streak. The guy you want out there in Game 1 of a playoff. Maeda showed some of this, but one shortened season is not proven. I think Ryan may get there as he has the right mentality. Needs a killer pitch like change-up like Johan. AND I really do not buy into this 5-6 inning/twice through order stuff for my Ace. He needs to be able to 7+ when he is rolling in the proper context of pitch counts.

C: Ryan Jeffers ($0.70M) 1B: Luis Arraez ($4.50M) 2B: Jorge Polanco ($7.50M) 3B: Gio Urshela ($9.00M) SS: Carlos Correa ($40M) LF: Alex Kirilloff ($0.70M) CF: Byron Buxton ($15.00M) RF: Max Kepler ($8.50M) DH: Jose Miranda ($0.70M) 4th OF: Kyle Garlick ($0.70M) Utility: Nick Gordon ($0.70M) Utility: Gilberto Celestino ($0.70M) SP1: Sonny Gray ($12.00M) SP2: Tyler Mahle ($8.00M) SP3: Kenta Maeda ($9.00M) SP4: Joe Ryan ($0.70M) SP5: Bailey Ober ($0.70M) RP: Jhoan Duran ($0.70M) RP: Jorge Lopez ($3.00M) RP: Griffin Jax ($0.70M) RP: Jorge Alcala ($1.00M) RP: Caleb Thielbar ($2.00M) Payroll is 9.64% under budget

I like this. But I don't see years for the C4/Rodon contracts. Maeda could very well earn his way back into the starting rotation if he pitches like he did in the COVID shortened season. I like Max. I like Jeffers. I understand hitting is NOT easy, but to me this is like shooting in basketball. You will never be a Steph Curry/Ted Williams but you should be able to get to MLB average. I am a firm believer in bringing your prospects in when your options are veterans who are at or below average. I would like to see if Thor kicks i back up, (Verlander did), after this season. But I am tired of retreads that have a history of ceilings that are average. Draft position does not determine if they have a high ceiling after they have been around the block. One last thing. With the injuries, the nagging ones that never went away, it was time to restart the head trainer role.

Thanks, this is what I was trying to understand, if the 3rd BC sent him, why would it be Sano's fault???

And they aren't going to be stealing too many bases either...

>> It kinda feels like Cave sticking around in MLB camp is just some epic-level trolling of Twins fans Exactly...