Nashvilletwin

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Bremer today: “Kyle Garlick has stepped into the on deck circle. Apparently he will be hitting for Kepler.” Hahahahaha.

First Base and the occasional DH batting lead off - every day.

Ok, I’ll take the bait. First, I completely understand the rationale behind the trade. The FO understood how high the risks were re Mahle and Maeda being able to accumulate IPs, let alone quality IPs. Unable, and rightfully so, to be willing to trust in a few up and comer SPs, and realizing that with an offensively challenged lineup predicating a pitching led strategy for the campaign, they felt the need to add an innings eating quality starter. Got it. Perfectly reasonable. Check. Second, the issue is whether this was the right trade for personnel, strategy, and fan support reasons. On this front, I’d argue no on all three. A. Lopez prior to the trade had been a solid, yet unspectacular performer. Chourio has a better chance to see a major league park in the field than Salas (and even that’s huge leap). We all know about Arraez. It’s ok if some people, myself included, did not like the trade on face value. Was this the only option for a quality starter of that ilk? Maybe, but who knows, B. Given our offensive woes, and the inability of our starting staff and bullpen to overcome them, the loss of Arraez as an everyday fixture at the top of the lineup is devastating. That’s, right, devastating. Arraez at first, Kiriloff in the OF, and cash to help fund an additional SP beats Gallo hands down all day long. C. Many fellow TDers, and I respect their position, argue that fans are not interested in watching a “singles” hitter. I disagree. Arraez was a fan favorite. He brought a spark, which this club do badly needs, to the park each and every day. He remains an exciting player and was the only Twin whose every AB I made sure to watch. In a season in which none of our position players can even spell All Star, he’s a shoo in for the NL squad. If he keeps up his pace (and he probably won’t, but a batting title seems assured), do my fellow TDers think fans will be interested? Of course the genesis of the the Arraez trade was the Mahle trade disaster. The inability of Mahle to play his projected role led to the need to acquire another starter late in the off season (precluding us for possibly playing in the FA market). In addition, even if we still wanted to acquire another starter, who’s to say a package including Steer, CES and possibly others could have been utilised instead of Arraez. The FO had excellent intentions and a defensible strategy for both deals, one precipitated by the other. One definitively hasn’t worked and the other, well, we shall see. But this club and fan base clearly miss Arraez.

Dad to his kindergartener: “How was baseball after school?” Kindergartener to his dad: “I was doing fine until the older kids got out.” Does it just seem a little bit like that watching the game tonight? Oh well, let’s get ‘em tomorrow.

That would be ideal. CF is our biggest hole now and going forward. The second derivative is that Lewis in CF also opens up additional positional opportunities for others. As much as we all wish it would happen, it just doesn’t seem probable at all.

They need to be up if they are going to contribute. That means the FO has to have the intestinal fortitude to make room for them. The FO didn’t have to make the tough call when Mahle and Maeda injuries led to them being replaced fortuitously by the superior Ober and Varland. Maybe that’s what they are waiting on. But make no mistake, Larnach, Wallner, Julien and Miranda will continue “mashing” in AAA until something is done with Kepler, Gallo, Solano, Castro and Garlick. MAT is safe with Gordon’s injury.

100% agree Ted. Correa has been superb defensively and Lewis, in his brief recent appearances, has flashed both leather and arm. Twins fans should not be losing any sleep over the left side of our infield hopefully for several years. Lewis at 3B sets the dominoes in motion. Lee, therefore, looks like the 2B of the future. Ideally, Miranda and Julien battle it out for 1B and DH (when BB is unavailable). Miranda can sub at 3B and Julien at 2B when needed (and, btw, Lee and Lewis can sub at SS when CC needs a break). Kiriloff, Wallner and Larnach are your three corner outfielders with the occasional DH role against RH pitching. They all hit lefty, but with only Julien (and Gordon if he stays as a super sub utility player) a purely left handed bat among the rest of the team (Jeffers and Vasquez are both RH bats), it should be ok. Now, we (sadly) need to find a CF of the future - ideally probably one who bats RH. Rodriguez?

The Saints started Miranda, Wallner, Julien and Larnach today. The Twins started Castro, MAT, Solano, Kepler and Garlick with Gallo out. Hmmm, what’s wrong with this picture? All six of those current Twins may very well be gone next season and several will likely be gone by early August. Even if we substitute those four AAA players for our current Twins lineup and they don’t score any runs either, at least they would be getting valuable ABs and innings. Finding the positional fit will be tricky, but soon it will be time to pull the trigger on the young guys and start truly investing in the future. It would be way more interesting to watch too.

Saints lineup with Wallner, Miranda, Julien and Larnach is better than the Twins lineup with MAT, Castro, Kepler, Garlick, Solano, Gallo. Somehow those Saints four have to get the ABs and innings those Twins six are getting. That’s exactly what we need to do to invest in the future.

I think he might’ve helped. Too bad. Just don’t understand. We give up Wallner for the entire weekend because Cleveland is starting a lefty on Saturday and so they call up Garlick. There were multiple instances in both games where we would’ve loved to have Wallner at the plate.

Where was Wallner this weekend?

0 for 4 at the 2022 deadline. Ok, maybe the Fulmer deal was a wash. But the Mahle deal was a disaster (not just for the trade itself, but also because it likely contributed to the Arraez trade) and the Lopez deal is looking like one too. No one is ever held accountable…..lol.

Agree tomorrow is a big game. A split would be very disappointing after winning the first two and having our top two starters up next. Let’s go get ‘em. Lewis flashing leather and arm again tonight at 3B. Wow - he looks smooth! Assuming Lee is thus the 2B of the future, the battle for 1B in ‘24 looks to be between Kiriloff (who absolutely can play OF), Miranda, and, possibly, Julien (who could DH against RHPs when Buxton is out).

Ok, now nobody get mad. I’m just asking a couple of simple, hypothetical questions assuming BB will never play CF again. I’m not advocating anything - just touching the proverbial third rail for kick’s sake. 1. Is BB worth his contract and/or his place on the roster given his seemingly only possible role (i.e. everyday DH) and the likelihood that his overall health will never likely improve much and could, if not will, probably continue to deteriorate over time? 2. Could BB be traded for “value” given his contract and limited role? What might his value in the trade market be? Is it worth considering given our small/mid-market franchise (i.e. can we really afford him in his role/does that really make good baseball sense)?

Good analysis. Yep, history suggests the age (32) and the data to be correlated, especially at catcher. Let’s see how it plays out though. In the meantime, let’s give Rocco credit for playing the hot bat more and not worrying about the optics vis-a-vis the more expensive FA. However, the FO had no choice this off season at C. There just wasn’t enough/any depth in the system and Jeffers couldn’t be relied upon as a sure #1. It could be we end up overpaying on Vasquez, but if we end up over the next two years + with a Jeffers/Vasquez backstop at their weighted average cost, things will probably be ok, if not pretty good. I’m not knocking the FO on this signing (but I reserve the right to later - hahaha); there is a lot lower hanging fruit to pick on that front.

I signed up for AppleTV to watch Ted Lasso. Watched the first season and half of the second when I got bored. Too lazy to cancel it, so I get to watch the odd Twins games now. My two big observations from last night: 1. Royce was flashing the leather at 3rd base. He looked comfortable and capable. Lee to 2nd base in ‘24? 2. It took a couple of injuries to get the FO to get Ober and Varland into the rotation. Had Mahle and Maeda not been hurt, we’d still be seeing each of them every five games no matter how they were pitching. Ober and Varland are now not only performing at a high level, but are also building confidence and experience that will be useful later this season and beyond (and they will be super cheap for years). But it took a couple of “accidents” to get our FO to put our best pitching starter lineup on the field. Credit to Rocco to be giving Jeffers more time over the more expensive Vasquez right now as Jeffers builds his confidence. Meanwhile, our hottest hitting MLB capable player toils away in AAA. Two great one run wins in a row. Now is the time to make a statement to the Guardians. Let’s bury those guys this weekend behind Gray and Ryan!

Overall, the biggest disappointment has to be the play of our position players as a unit. The FO put together a mix of supposed stars (Correa, Buxton), a couple of returning from injury long term Twins (Polanco, Kepler), emerging young talent (Jeffers, Kiriloff, Miranda, Larnach, Gordon), retreaded vets looking for new life (Gallo, Castro, Solano) and a couple of solid vets to play key roles (Vasquez, Farmer, and Taylor). Has any one of them overperformed expectations? IMHO, Kiriloff, Farmer, and maybe Jeffers would be the closest. But the others range from “Meh” to not even close. Here we are in June and the Twins don’t have a single position player even within the most remote consideration to make the All-Star team. Moreover, as an overall unit, other than some fun moments, they have been pretty boring to watch. All of that is pretty disappointing. Not completely unexpected, mind you; but pretty disappointing nonetheless.

It appears neither does our current FO’s jobs either……lol.

Really nice win. Great to see teammates picking each other up. Nice little win streak going - now is the time to send the Guardians a clear message about their chances in the division. Possibly the hottest hitter in the organization gets a call up if BB needs a few days off.

Three potential pitchers. Zero potential position players - and, at this point, none even close. Just keeping it real.

As always, you make excellent points. Your positions are always well constructed and reasonable. Also much appreciated. But this point above is where we clearly have a difference. “Average” player development is not an acceptable outcome for a small/mid-market team that expects to win and be competitive year-in and year-out. A big market team can “buy” their way out of poor player development. The Twins cannot. Our only saving grace is the division in which we play. If the Twins truly want to create any sort of defensible competitive advantage as a Major League Baseball franchise and truly field a consistently winning team capable of vying for a World Series, they must be well above average, if not clearly superior, in prospect development. The current organization, as you rightly point out, is most definitely not.

He’d fit right in on the Twins. Seriously, my only point is that these touted prospects of ours need the ABs, innings and investment/commitment. They seem to be on the way, then moved back and forth, and lose their momentum. Vet signings with high priced commitments don’t help either. Some of them would likely be very happy if another team gave them a committed shot and were willing to make the investment. It’s only my opinion, of course, but I do not believe developing young talent, particularly position players, to their full potential is a strong point of our current regime. And for a small/mid -market team, it really should be a priority. Here’s hoping that Kiriloff and Lewis (plus Lee and Rodriguez) can reach their true potential and can get beyond what our last “young core” of Kepler, Sano, and even Buxton reached. At the moment, it appears Miranda, Larnach, and Julien (and Martin too), are struggling to reach their ultimate potential within this organization.

Wow, some fellow TDers giving up on Julien already. For those he say he’s limited to 1B or DH, should we exit Julien or Gallo? Honestly, for the Twins future, who is move valuable and deserves investment? Also, with 300-500 more ML ABs and the ability to play in the field every day if needed (and btw way cheaper), could he be more valuable than our current DH? I wonder if Julien wouldn’t actually love a change of scenery. Get a chance where he will get the innings and ABs and the commitment needed to get his confidence back. Ala Steer and Rooker and others. Miranda and Larnach are probably thinking the same thing. Maybe Wallner too.

I think some of my esteemed fellow posters are missing the point. The issue is not necessarily that we traded Steer and CES (yes, they theoretically had several other players in front of them and also may be defensively limited/challenged), but, rather, what we received in return. Which, btw, is nothing, nada, zip, jack diddly squat. Two legitimate major league prospects were given away for nothing. Again, hindsight is 20/20, but the signs were there and, as pointed out above, the talent was not so great. It gets worse. The trade was not only an ill-advised dice roll, but also, even more ominously, likely led to our need to trade Arraez. Why is no one ever held accountable for these debacles?