Take Advantage of the Banked Wins

[Vanimal46]

It's been 9 years since they won a division title... I think that's a respectable goal for the season. I'll be very disappointed if the FO punts on a division title run for more A ball lottery tickets.

[TheLeviathan]

 

I don't. And didn't. At least in terms of being good in the context of the league. So, I'm with you there.

 

Club is only beating one type of team. Bad ones. Non-divisional opponents that are not Baltimore...record 5-9; run differential...62-83.

 

Thing is, in 2019, you can win an AL Central with that. Sometimes punting is the right thing to do...but it's going to be awkward if the FO finds themselves in a position of punting on a division title.

 

We've done just fine against Houston.  I think people are drawing far too many conclusions, too soon, about where this team ranks with others in the AL.

 

And, frankly, it should be irrelevant.  If this team is competing it's clear where they can do the most upgrading and that's pretty much anybody who throws a baseball to a catcher.  The Twins have the ammo and the finances to be aggressive.  One or two big adds to pair with this lineup could make them a real force to be reckoned with.

[USAFChief]

I'm sure they will sell some of the expiring contracts for prospects, but they will make win-now moves. No reason you can't do both. Reed and Castro will probably not yield major league ready pitching, but presumably have trade value if healthy.

 

Depending on who they decide to retain, we should be able to get pen arms for Gibson, Pineda, and/or Ordirizzi.

none of this makes much sense. They'll make win now moves that dont yield major league pitching? Make win now moves by trading starting pitching?

[jokin]

 

I’m not ready to get a starter... yet.

I’ve been ready to get a reliever going on six months.

But yes, this is the year to be aggressive. It’s basically impossible to make a decent trade at this point of the season but roll the dice with some aggressive call-ups, maybe you get lucky.

 

This, this and especially this.

 

They've already worked their way through just about every 40-man pitcher with short-term "tryouts".

Time to consider when the optimal moments are to debut the best swing-and-miss minor league starters:

 

Just to throw some names out there in no particular order:

Graterol

Poppen

Thorpe

Smeltzer

 

AAAA relievers with high K-rates:

Adams

Gullmet

Jake Reed

 

Gotta be someone in this group of 7 that can come up and throw a clean inning twice a week...

[bird]

 

Everything you say is a valid point.  I still pick up the phone and try,

 

With the exception of their inexplicable pitching staff decisions (decisions to NOT act) over the winter, I think we've seen that Derek and Thad are prone to making moves they think are smart and aren't likely to be walking through the doors of their office hollering out "hold my calls!"

 

But I'm wondering if those off-season decisions to refrain from big ticket trades and FA spending are likely to persist regardless of their playoff probabilities.

 

I somehow have this peculiar notion in my head that they actually LIKE what they have in terms of pitching depth a lot more than we do. I mean, could it be that they think that if Pineda falters or someone else comes up lame that they can count on a couple of the AAA or AA guys to step up among the ranks of Thorpe, Gonsalves, Graterol, Stewart, and Littell? Scary thought, but hey, we've been nervous about a lot of players who are showing signs of being more than just filler until 2020, in particular Odor and Perez in the rotation.

 

Maybe they can pull off a difference-maker BP upgrade without handing over a prospect as valuable as, say, Rooker, Gordon, or Gonsalves. Or maybe they wait out the draft pick issue and outbid the market for Kimbrel?

[bird]

 

It still baffles me that JAKE Reed has yet to even get a shot at the MLB level. He has nothing to prove at AAA. He’s either capable of getting outs at the MLB level or he’s not. IMO, the Twins owe it to him and themselves to find out.

 

 

There's seemingly been a perpetual dissonance between what the Twins think of Reed and what we do. We should take note of the fact that we AND the Twins have regarded John Curtiss more highly than Reed more recently, and yet Curtiss was just DFA'd by the Angels. For the purposes of this discussion, I personally don't think Reed really enters the calculus.

[bird]

 

Does it matter? If they are two, getting one gets them closer.

When does the FO act like they think this is a winning team? Because they haven't yet, imo. If they want better attendence, maybe the team should act like they are trying their hardest to win, at the FO level.

 

 

I acknowledge that it has been your persistent opinion that because the team doesn't do what you think they should do that it means they aren't trying, don't care, etc. Personally, Mike, I love you, but I reject that conclusion. They disagree with you, that's all. 

[jkcarew]

 

We've done just fine against Houston.  I think people are drawing far too many conclusions, too soon, about where this team ranks with others in the AL.

 

And, frankly, it should be irrelevant.  If this team is competing it's clear where they can do the most upgrading and that's pretty much anybody who throws a baseball to a catcher.  The Twins have the ammo and the finances to be aggressive.  One or two big adds to pair with this lineup could make them a real force to be reckoned with.

Agree that the Twins have done just fine against Houston (even if they lose today.) But I'll stick with my opinion on where they stack up against the best in the league. (Although I admit, if Perez and Odorizzi put two or three of these starts together...?) But we're debating the margins, here. Obviously, the objective is to win as much as possible and continue to get better...it's just where you draw the line on what you would be willing to do in 2019 in terms of a 'win now' move where we might differ. In fact, I'm more convinced...with Cleveland just seeming to be caught in 'one of those seasons', that the Twins pitching is going to have to be REALLY bad...worse than it's been...to prevent a division championship.

[yarnivek1972]

There's seemingly been a perpetual dissonance between what the Twins think of Reed and what we do. We should take note of the fact that we AND the Twins have regarded John Curtiss more highly than Reed more recently, and yet Curtiss was just DFA'd by the Angels. For the purposes of this discussion, I personally don't think Reed really enters the calculus.

If the Twins aren’t going to give Reed a shot, what is the purpose of keeping him in the organization?

 

I am not saying Reed is some kind of untapped gold mine. Simply that I think he deserves a shot. The Twins brought up deJong in a pinch earlier this season and eventually outrighted him back. Reed’s AAA numbers are far superior. Reed has averaged nearly a strikeout per inning at AAA over 4 partial seasons and now over 100 IP.

 

The Twins aren’t going to know how he’ll fare against MLB hitters until they let Reed face them. Frankly, I think he is likely to be better than Ryne Harper and Tyler Duffey and probably better than Mejia has been this year. He’s younger than Duffey and Harper and only 6 months older than Mejia.

[Mike Sixel]

I acknowledge that it has been your persistent opinion that because the team doesn't do what you think they should do that it means they aren't trying, don't care, etc. Personally, Mike, I love you, but I reject that conclusion. They disagree with you, that's all.

Given that they have said they won't make a big move until they think they are serious contenders, and that they've sold at the deadline every year, including a RP that would be here this year, I'm not sure what conclusion to draw other than they think they are good, not great. YMMV, of course.

 

And I've never said they don't care, I've said they don't think they are serious competitors yet. Love you too, man. Post more.

[Brock Beauchamp]

Corey Kluber broke his arm. I hate to see injuries like that but Cleveland’s “stars ‘n’ scrubs” roster just took a massive hit.

 

If I was the front office, I’d seriously consider paying what it takes to get Kimbrel today, draft pick and money be damned.

 

The door went from being left open to being violently thrown off its hinges. Take advantage.

[Vanimal46]

After yesterday's 11-0 debacle, does anyone still think we're one pitcher away?

This didn't age well.

[Vanimal46]

Corey Kluber broke his arm. I hate to see injuries like that but Cleveland’s “stars ‘n’ scrubs” roster just took a massive hit.

 

If I was the front office, I’d seriously consider paying what it takes to get Kimbrel today, draft pick and money be damned.

 

The door went from being left open to being violently thrown off its hinges. Take advantage.

Yep. The division is wide open. What better time than now to go for it?

[Brock Beauchamp]

Yep. The division is wide open. What better time than now to go for it?

I only hope the front office’s inability/refusal to sign a reliever - including Kimbrel - has been money- not projection-based.

 

Because if they see something about Kimbrel they don’t like going forward, that doesn’t help the team and we’re still in a holding pattern.

 

But if it’s money, do it. Attendance has been struggling and a first place team going out and getting a top flight reliever would help through the summer a lot.

[ashbury]

This didn't age well.

You think we're one pitcher away.

[SheboyganBrats]

Kluber's injury may have made it easier for Falvine to sit tight.  If they thought they had enough pitching before the injury, it's probably less likely they'll "go for it" now.

[spanman2]

Great start to the season...I like to say wait until around Father's Day to truly get a full gauge of what type of ball club you have...if we are in 1st place within the division or within a few games then it might be time to play poker and make a move.  Win Twins!

[Vanimal46]

You think we're one pitcher away.

This last game had a lot of texture to it, if you look.

[howieramone2]

 

none of this makes much sense. They'll make win now moves that dont yield major league pitching? Make win now moves by trading starting pitching?

Just sit back and watch. The new regime is all about asset management. They won't let those with expiring contracts just walk if they can get some kind of return. 

[yarnivek1972]

You think we're one pitcher away.

In a way this could turn out to be true. It turns out that pitcher happened to be Corey Kluber.

[prouster]

Just sit back and watch. The new regime is all about asset management. They won't let those with expiring contracts just walk if they can get some kind of return.

The problem with your theory is that players on expiring contracts still contribute something if the team doesn’t trade them. The choices aren’t “trade or nothing.” The choices are “trade or two months of that player’s performance during a pennant race.” So if you trade a guy that has been helping the team contend, you might get a prospect or two back, but you’re also costing yourself that player’s performance down the stretch. That’s why contenders don’t sell at the deadline. The final two months of the season are immediately worth more than whatever prospect(s) they’d get in a trade.

 

If they’re out of contention by the deadline, then it’s a different story.

[USAFChief]

 

Just sit back and watch. The new regime is all about asset management. They won't let those with expiring contracts just walk if they can get some kind of return. 

Zero chance, if they are in "win now" mode, that Gibson gets traded at the deadline.

 

Zero. Zip. Zilch.

 

Same for May. 

 

I guess I could see a scenario where Castro goes for MLB pitching, but not for A ball pitcher(s). None.

 

 

[howieramone2]

 

Zero chance, if they are in "win now" mode, that Gibson gets traded at the deadline.

 

Zero. Zip. Zilch.

 

Same for May. 

 

I guess I could see a scenario where Castro goes for MLB pitching, but not for A ball pitcher(s). None.

May has one more year and no trade value. Wouldn't be surprised to see him disappear like Mejia. If A-Stud comes back healthy, believe they will take anything they can get for Castro. I see Gibson or one of the others getting a QO.

[USAFChief]

 

May has one more year and no trade value. Wouldn't be surprised to see him disappear like Mejia. If A-Stud comes back healthy, believe they will take anything they can get for Castro. I see Gibson or one of the others getting a QO.

So in other words, you have changed your mind and agree with me now.

[howieramone2]

 

So in other words, you have changed your mind and agree with me now.

No and no.

[Vanimal46]

The Twins should be buying expiring contracts to push for a division title... Not sell them.

 

8 full seasons since the last division title. I've got to imagine the first step towards 'sustained contention' is, you know, contending.

[Mike Sixel]

 

The Twins should be buying expiring contracts to push for a division title... Not sell them.

8 full seasons since the last division title. I've got to imagine the first step towards 'sustained contention' is, you know, contending.

 

preach it!

[howieramone2]

 

The Twins should be buying expiring contracts to push for a division title... Not sell them.

8 full seasons since the last division title. I've got to imagine the first step towards 'sustained contention' is, you know, contending.

So you wouldn't trade Addison Reed, Castro, and Pineda?   We are already contending. Believe it or not you can do both.  

[yarnivek1972]

So you wouldn't trade Addison Reed, Castro, and Pineda? We are already contending. Believe it or not you can do both. Big difference between a FO and a fan board.

What do you seriously think the Twins would get for any of those 3 right now?

 

Castro might fetch a B level prospect, but then who is your replacement?

 

Someone has to want what you are offering.

[Intramural Legend]

 

The Twins should be buying expiring contracts to push for a division title... Not sell them.

8 full seasons since the last division title. I've got to imagine the first step towards 'sustained contention' is, you know, contending.

 

Agree - the Twins will do whatever they can to improve the season ticket holder base after years of decline.  Creating excitement is the only way to do that right now!