RedSox Cheating Scandal

[diehardtwinsfan]

http://nypost.com/2017/09/05/yankees-bust-red-sox-in-high-tech-sign-stealing/

 

Not that the Yankees have room to talk, they just get Phil Cuzzi to ump their games.

[Squirrel]

Took a page out of Belacheats playbook.

[gunnarthor]

Yeah, since I hate the Red Sox, I hope they get a big penalty but it's hard to feel bad for NY.

[jimbo92107]

Why steal signs? People are always telling you what they want to do by how they act. Physical tells are as common as coffee. 

[Rhino and Compass]

What is it with Boston area teams fudging the rules? 

[bird]

More cheating in baseball. Great.

[Vanimal46]

It's always been a "part of the game" to try and figure out the other team's signs, no? This is just an extreme measure to steal signs from the Yankees. At least the Red Sox admitted to it right away. It'll be interesting to see what the penalty will be. 

[gunnarthor]

 

It's always been a "part of the game" to try and figure out the other team's signs, no? This is just an extreme measure to steal signs from the Yankees. At least the Red Sox admitted to it right away. It'll be interesting to see what the penalty will be. 

I think this is a step beyond though. Sign stealing is supposed to be done either by the player or, in some cases, a base coach looking into a dugout. For the players, it was a learned skill that they could use to help their team. Opposing teams would be aware of it and respond accordingly. Some teams were pretty good at it (the Twins, actually, were commonly accused of stealing signs and Torii Hunter has basically copped to it).  But using technology to steal signs - at least to me - feels worse. It's not a skill that players or coaches have had to learn. Further, the opposing team would have a harder time knowing that it is happening (I'm sure this is not the first time the Red Sox pulled this) and have a harder time responding. 

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

Another cheating scandal. Reminds me of a quote about cockroaches but can't remember who first said it. For everyone who gets caught cheating, there are 100 more behind the stove, hiding.

[Vanimal46]

 

I think this is a step beyond though. Sign stealing is supposed to be done either by the player or, in some cases, a base coach looking into a dugout. For the players, it was a learned skill that they could use to help their team. Opposing teams would be aware of it and respond accordingly. Some teams were pretty good at it (the Twins, actually, were commonly accused of stealing signs and Torii Hunter has basically copped to it).  But using technology to steal signs - at least to me - feels worse. It's not a skill that players or coaches have had to learn. Further, the opposing team would have a harder time knowing that it is happening (I'm sure this is not the first time the Red Sox pulled this) and have a harder time responding. 

 

No doubt this is a step beyond. I think teams are not allowed to have electronic devices in the dugout to prevent things like this from happening. 

[diehardtwinsfan]

My guess is a draft pick, or possibly international dollars. Doubt players get suspended.

[Eris]

There is a delay built into live TV broadcasts to deal with wardrobe malfunctions and inappropriate language.  I could not find the exact delay time for baseball games.  For Mets radio vs Fox Sports, it is slightly more than 4 seconds to sync radio with TV.  My point being is that at some time point for delay, the information is useless.  One solution is to have an ~ 10 sec delay on TV broadcasts.

[Mike Sixel]

I hate the delay on radio and tv. Makes it nigh on impossible to listen to the radio and watch the tv. We just need to grow up as a society and let stuff go live. /soapbox

[Intramural Legend]

 

There is a delay built into live TV broadcasts to deal with wardrobe malfunctions and inappropriate language.  I could not find the exact delay time for baseball games.  For Mets radio vs Fox Sports, it is slightly more than 4 seconds to sync radio with TV.  My point being is that at some time point for delay, the information is useless.  One solution is to have an ~ 10 sec delay on TV broadcasts.

 

As I understand it, the delay wouldn't help this scenario.  This was them cracking what sign was the real one and relaying it to the base runners.  Base runners were then responsible to reading that sign and signaling to the batter.  The extra seconds wouldn't help unless the catcher mixed up the order of his real sign for each batter.

[bird]

 

I hate the delay on radio and tv. Makes it nigh on impossible to listen to the radio and watch the tv. We just need to grow up as a society and let stuff go live. /soapbox

 

Well, at least the Red Sox grew up enough to be held accountable. Now let's have them grow up a little more and develop a conscience, and hope society grows up enough to not let stuff like this go. /soapbox next door  

[Mike Sixel]

 

Well, at least the Red Sox grew up enough to be held accountable. Now let's have them grow up a little more and develop a conscience, and hope society grows up enough to not let stuff like this go. /soapbox next door  

 

"let stuff go" was about going with live broadcasts and not worrying about a swear word sneaking in, not about the Red Sox cheating. I hope that's clear now. Cheating is wrong.

[bird]

 

"let stuff go" was about going with live broadcasts and not worrying about a swear word sneaking in, not about the Red Sox cheating. I hope that's clear now. Cheating is wrong.

 

 

Ah, we agree then. As usual.

[Pardon My Dinger]

Seems like the competitive edge they'd stand to gain from any of this is razor-thin.  

[biggentleben]

 

What is it with Boston area teams fudging the rules? 

 

They get caught doing what everyone is doing?

[biggentleben]

 

I think this is a step beyond though. Sign stealing is supposed to be done either by the player or, in some cases, a base coach looking into a dugout. For the players, it was a learned skill that they could use to help their team. Opposing teams would be aware of it and respond accordingly. Some teams were pretty good at it (the Twins, actually, were commonly accused of stealing signs and Torii Hunter has basically copped to it).  But using technology to steal signs - at least to me - feels worse. It's not a skill that players or coaches have had to learn. Further, the opposing team would have a harder time knowing that it is happening (I'm sure this is not the first time the Red Sox pulled this) and have a harder time responding. 

 

I realize this is different technology, but some of the previous scandals on cheating have included use of the scoreboard to indicate signs. Is that not still use of technology?

 

The big thing that was copped to was relaying things into the dugout and base coach, but then it still needs to be relayed to the hitter and runner. It's removing the step of someone doing the physical relaying of the sign.

 

Not saying I'm exactly for it, but this seems like a different thing in the matter of it's using modern technology, not so much that it's using technology/electronics at all, because that's been done...

[USAFChief]

Well, at least the Red Sox grew up enough to be held accountable. Now let's have them grow up a little more and develop a conscience, and hope society grows up enough to not let stuff like this go. /soapbox next door

 

We're talking about stealing signs here...which has been done since probably the second organized baseball game...not some nefarious theft of property.

 

I hope the Twins are stealing signs if they can. It's a game.

[amjgt]

There's no rule against using one of those parabolic microphones to listen in on those hand-over-the-mouth conversations that happen at the mound. We all have ears. That's just better ears. Does that make it ok?

 

In the grand scheme of things... not much difference between that and what the Sox were doing.

 

 

[Mike Sixel]

I think you can't use technology, I think that's the rule here.

[Thrylos]

Too much noise for nothing.  

This was an interesting sentence from that article (which, of course, is from the Yankee's perspective) :

 

 

 

MLB rules don’t prohibit stealing signs, but do prohibit using electronics to do so

 

So.  Stealing signs is not a "scandal" and as a matter of fact, it is not against any MLB rule.   The "electronics" component became part of the rules when teams (esp. the Phillies) were using Center Field cameras to do so in the 00s.   It will be interesting to see whether there will be any fines on this, because the use of wearables (like a watch) may or may not fit the description of electronics in the rule.  (Would love to see that rule, btw, but could not find it.) 

 

This will be an interesting one...

[gunnarthor]

Well, unsurprisingly, no real harm to either Reed Sox or Yankees. Small fines but a warning to all other teams that this **** can't happen.

 

http://nypost.com/2017/09/15/red-sox-fined-for-high-tech-scam-as-yankees-hit-with-own-surprise/