Twins 2016 Amateur Spending Limits

[Seth Stohs]

These came out separately, but MLB Trade Rumors combined each team's current Draft Slot dollars and International Signing limits. 

 

International: $2,399,100 (This is just more than $1.5 million less than last year)

 

Draft Slots: $7,997,200 (This is about $600,000 more than last year since they have a couple of extra picks)

 

 

Last year, the Twins had about $3.95 million in the international signing limit, but they signed Wander Javier for $4.0 million. Enough over, but not enough to be penalized. 

 

 

[gunnarthor]

Does anyone have any rumors about what the Twins are planning to do on the international front this year?

[Hrbowski]

 

Does anyone have any rumors about what the Twins are planning to do on the international front this year?

I have heard that they are one of the teams that could go way over, but I wouldn't be surprised if they spend at about their slot.

[bird]

 

I have heard that they are one of the teams that could go way over, but I wouldn't be surprised if they spend at about their slot.

 

 

 

Have you heard this from a credible source, or just from Chief?

 

 

Kidding, Chief.

[Mike Sixel]

 

These came out separately, but MLB Trade Rumors combined each team's current Draft Slot dollars and International Signing limits. 

 

International: $2,399,100 (This is just more than $1.5 million less than last year)

 

Draft Slots: $7,997,200 (This is about $600,000 more than last year since they have a couple of extra picks)

 

 

Last year, the Twins had about $3.95 million in the international signing limit, but they signed Wander Javier for $4.0 million. Enough over, but not enough to be penalized. 

 

so they spent all their money on 1 player?

[Hrbowski]

 

Have you heard this from a credible source, or just from Chief?

 

 

Kidding, Chief.

Kiley reported this, plus others.

[Seth Stohs]

 

so they spent all their money on 1 player?

 

Someone will have to verify this, but they can sign more guys but no one over a certain number. I don't know if that's $50,000, or $20,000 or what. Those don't count against that cap.

[nytwinsfan]

 

Kiley reported this, plus others.

Yup Kiley did report it.

 

I vaguely also recall at least one Twins management personnel (not sure if it was Radcliffe or someone else) mentioning that they were considering or had considered doing it.  It was definitely an uncertain thing.

[Mike Sixel]

 

Someone will have to verify this, but they can sign more guys but no one over a certain number. I don't know if that's $50,000, or $20,000 or what. Those don't count against that cap.

 

According to a 2 year old article, the limit is $10,000. so, pretty much spent it all on one guy. Wow. 

[Seth Stohs]

 

According to a 2 year old article, the limit is $10,000. so, pretty much spent it all on one guy. Wow. 

 

Yeah, it's an interesting strategy. It's an argument/discussion that has been on the TD forums in the past. Is the better strategy to grab one high upside guy, or try to get 8 guys at $500,000? (or something in between). A year earlier, their highest signee was Ynoa at something like $800K, and a bunch of others for less. I'm sure they signed several others as well for that low-dollar. With a much smaller allotment this year, it'll be interesting to see what they do.

[gunnarthor]

IIRC, the Twins were really in love with Javier - I think BA remarked that the Twins had him higher than almost every other team. 

 

I'm not sure what strategy they'll have this year and I don't know enough about the international market to critique it one way or another (frankly, I don't know enough about the draft, or being a GM, or hitting a fastball, etc to critique but I will).  Hopefully, we get some good talent.

[USAFChief]

Kiley reported this, plus others.

"Yes."

 

The answer you were looking for was "yes."

[Thrylos]

According to some scouts, Wander Javier was the best available player in his class.  Some of them even rank him higher than Sano, and he is a guy who everyone agrees that has a good possibility to stay at shortstop. 

 

I really appreciate what the Twins did here, which is totally out of character, btw: Quality over quantity.   Better to have one player who has a superstar ceiling that 20 who do not and hope that a couple might pan out...

[drjim]

 

According to some scouts, Wander Javier was the best available player in his class.  Some of them even rank him higher than Sano, and he is a guy who everyone agrees that has a good possibility to stay at shortstop. 

 

I really appreciate what the Twins did here, which is totally out of character, btw: Quality over quantity.   Better to have one player who has a superstar ceiling that 20 who do not and hope that a couple might pan out...

 

I generally like the strategy of a couple guys in the 800k-1.5 mil range and the several low 6 figure guys, but if you really like a guy nothing wrong with going for it on occasion. As you said, it is out of character, and something that people call for them them to do in major league free agency.

 

And if there is one place the Twins absolutely deserve the benefit of the doubt, it's international free agency.

[Mike Sixel]

Well, I'm one that argued they should sign a top 10 guy, and then 2-3 others, in the past, so I won't criticize this. But, it is so out of character, they must really love him.

 

As for the coming year, it is supposed to be a good year, and several high flying teams are out of the game. I'm hopeful they go all in this year, but I don't think I'm expecting it.

[DJL44]

By the time the penalties kick in there could be a worldwide draft. The new CBA goes into effect next year.

[drjim]

 

By the time the penalties kick in there could be a worldwide draft. The new CBA goes into effect next year.

 

Teams will be penalized in the first draft, they aren't getting off free.

 

That said, I would like to see the Twins jump in and blow past the budget. Early stories seemed promising but haven't heard as much steam recently, which is a little discouraging.

[Mike Sixel]

 

Teams will be penalized in the first draft, they aren't getting off free.

 

That said, I would like to see the Twins jump in and blow past the budget. Early stories seemed promising but haven't heard as much steam recently, which is a little discouraging.

 

I'd guess you'd lose a 2nd round pick.......that is TOTALLY worth blowing through your limits, if you can sign 3 or 4 excellent prospects imo.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

I'd guess you'd lose a 2nd round pick.......that is TOTALLY worth blowing through your limits, if you can sign 3 or 4 excellent prospects imo.

I'd guess the penalty would be stronger, closer to the June draft penalties which are pretty severe.

[Mike Sixel]

 

I'd guess the penalty would be stronger, closer to the June draft penalties which are pretty severe.

 

Possibly.....I wonder how much teams will KNOW what the penalties will be before the signing time. Also, I wonder how far back the penalizing will go......

 

Also, if the penalties apply to an international only draft, they'll pretty much be the same as the current penalties, in effect.

 

I hope there is not international draft, but then I don't want a draft at all.....

[drjim]

 

Possibly.....I wonder how much teams will KNOW what the penalties will be before the signing time. Also, I wonder how far back the penalizing will go......

 

Also, if the penalties apply to an international only draft, they'll pretty much be the same as the current penalties, in effect.

 

I hope there is not international draft, but then I don't want a draft at all.....

 

Would you prefer a spending pool or just a free-for-all free agency? Because the latter would be a disaster for baseball in my mind.

[Mike Sixel]

 

Would you prefer a spending pool or just a free-for-all free agency? Because the latter would be a disaster for baseball in my mind.

 

A sort of combo deal. I think I have a thread started here, I'll find it and link it. But, basically, the worst 10 teams get some number, say, $10MM, to spend on any three players they want. They have an exclusive window of 7 days to get deals. Then, they and the next 10 worst teams get $5MM to spend on any players they want, but the worst three can only sign 3 across the two sessions. Etc.....

 

It isn't fully fleshed out, but basically, let the players have more choice where they go, and let the team that sits with the 5th best record to go all out for 1 guy if they want, or the worst team to sign 3 guys instead of 1, if they want.

 

Some combo of a pool, and a draft.

[old nurse]

 

According to some scouts, Wander Javier was the best available player in his class.  Some of them even rank him higher than Sano, and he is a guy who everyone agrees that has a good possibility to stay at shortstop. 

 

I really appreciate what the Twins did here, which is totally out of character, btw: Quality over quantity.   Better to have one player who has a superstar ceiling that 20 who do not and hope that a couple might pan out...

If there are players with the superstar ceiling, by all means they should go after them. There is no need to really pick up the players who have merely the potential to be a below average player. They are found easily in the dumpster dive, minor trade ares.

[diehardtwinsfan]

 

Kiley reported this, plus others.

 

Sickles mentioned it as well.

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

Better to have one player who has a superstar ceiling that 20 who do not and hope that a couple might pan out...

Both strategies have their merits and I'm hesitant to elevate one over the other. The Twins have scored on "good but not great" signings over the years. Guys like Kepler, Thorpe, Arcia, etc. were smart acquisitions and didn't break the bank. On the other hand, a smart team should occasionally step up and pay the likes of Sano as well.

 

If you don't see somebody you *love* in the signing pool, I have no issues with going after 2-3 guys you really like over one big-name player. In fact, I'd argue most years the smart move is to go after the group of "like" guys because you never know when you'll strike gold. Save the big allocation money for the (somewhat) rare occasion it makes the most sense.

 

If your scouts like the best player in the international pool so much they want you to outbid 29 other teams for his services every single year, you should probably go find new scouts because they're not scouting, they're group-thinking.

[Seth Stohs]

It comes down to risk. 

 

I mean, signing Sano for big money at that time certainly made sense (I know there weren't limits back then, but the theory is still the same) and worked out.

 

Michael Ynoa had the largest signing bonus out of the Dominican for several years, and he hasn't panned out at all. 

 

In other words, if you go with the big dawg, you have to get it right, pretty much. (I know, there are no "have-to's" in baseball, but still...) 

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

Michael Ynoa had the largest signing bonus out of the Dominican for several years, and he hasn't panned out at all. 

Hey, Ynoa was one of Winston-Salem's better relievers last year!

 

Kind of rooting for him, he's gone from hyped prospect to underdog now.  He's still on the White Sox 40-man roster, and has one more option year remaining.  Maybe they will give him a look this year, or someone will claim him in 2017.

[bird]

If anybody knows, I'd be curious about what Kiley plus others "reported" and Sickles "mentioned" about whether or not the Twins have decided or are at least contemplating non-compliance with the quota agreement on international spending. Specifically, I'd want to know if they had actual conversations on the topic with the Twins. If it's simply speculation on their part, that's not worth much.

 

Sure wish our own writers would tackle the subject head-on with the Twins.

[Seth Stohs]

 

Hey, Ynoa was one of Winston-Salem's better relievers last year!

 

Kind of rooting for him, he's gone from hyped prospect to underdog now.  He's still on the White Sox 40-man roster, and has one more option year remaining.  Maybe they will give him a look this year, or someone will claim him in 2017.

 

He may very well become a solid big league reliever... but I'd say that you could get similar quality accidentally for $25,000 instead... which is why, when talking about signing 16-year-olds from the Dominican, I have no problem with a philosophy of quantity as much as quality.

[AlwaysinModeration]

If anybody knows, I'd be curious about what Kiley plus others "reported" and Sickles "mentioned" about whether or not the Twins have decided or are at least contemplating non-compliance with the quota agreement on international spending. Specifically, I'd want to know if they had actual conversations on the topic with the Twins. If it's simply speculation on their part, that's not worth much.

 

Sure wish our own writers would tackle the subject head-on with the Twins.

Well, Kiley usually has a fairly accurate list of where all the top players sign, so when that comes out, and the Twins are listed on 50% of the top targets, we will know.