Article: Are Span's Days in Minnesota Numbered?

[DaveW]

The funny thing is, if the Twins trade Span for a young ML ready pitcher(#2 upside) it could actually make the 2012 team quite a bit better (along with the 2013, 2014 etc)

[jorgenswest]

The expectations on this board about what the Twins might receive in trade for Span seem so out of line with the midseason market in previous years. We will almost certainly be disappointed by the return we receive for Span.

 

In response, I am certain someone is going to point to a previous trade like Blake for Santana. The Indians did a great job in finding Santana who was not a top prospect entering the season he was traded. We will have to trust the Twins scouting department to find a great player hidden among the B/C level prospects.

[Curt]

What I found interesting was Dick and Bert discussing it on the telecast this weekend. As I perceive them as mouthpieces for the organization (knowingly or not), I conclude the team is actively shopping Span. D & B discussing it is preparing the fans for the inevitable.

[DaveW]

The expectations on this board about what the Twins might receive in trade for Span seem so out of line with the midseason market in previous years. We will almost certainly be disappointed by the return we receive for Span.

 

In response, I am certain someone is going to point to a previous trade like Blake for Santana. The Indians did a great job in finding Santana who was not a top prospect entering the season he was traded. We will have to trust the Twins scouting department to find a great player hidden among the B/C level prospects.

As it has been stated time and time again Span should at least net a top 50 prospect, for comparisons sake that would mean the guy the Twins got back would probably rank right behind Sano and Buxton in the org chart. (Or possibly Arcia as well if you consider him a top 50 guy currently-which I am starting to believe)

 

Beltran a rental got a stud like Wheeler back, there is no reason why the Twins can't do better than that with a cost controlled, very good CF/lead off guy.

[DaveW]

I don't know if he would be terrible there, especially in Target Field. But I do have trouble seeing the Twins trust him with right field. I can also see him having trouble feeling comfortable there, and taking those problems to the plate.

 

This year he's played just 4 (of 31) games in the OF. Last year it was 0. But in the minors he had 282 starts there. So it's not like it's totally foreign to him. But he's always been a 1B first, and a RF second.

Agreed, I don't see why he can't be at least as defensively sound as Cuddyer in RF, also it should be noted that with Revere in CF Willingham and Parmelee would technically have less ground to cover since Revere has elite range in center.

 

Ideally you want a guy like Arcia or Benson to step up and handle RF since both would be an obvious upgrade defensively, allowing you to move Parmelee to 1st/DH in the future, but for a season or two Parmelee won't kill you in RF IMO.

[DPJ]

Beltran a rental got a stud like Wheeler back, there is no reason why the Twins can't do better than that with a cost controlled, very good CF/lead off guy.

Love Span, but I don't think the Twins could get back a Wheeler type prospect back for him.

 

Just cause one team does something stupid, doesn't mean that sets the bar for a trade.

[kemics]

I think it's a terrible decision to trade Span unless you get pitching in return that can help now. It's clear that the twins won't compete this year, but 2013 shouldn't be written off. The bats are there, Span and Revere at the top of the order have been more than adequate in getting on base for Mauer, Ham, Morneau, Ploufe et al. you've finally found a lineup that works, that scores runs, and that is slowly but surely creeping up the team batting stats.

 

Why not sit on Span, keep the order in tact, and try to make a splash with a Free Agent pitcher like Greinke.

[DPJ]

Why not sit on Span, keep the order in tact, and try to make a splash with a Free Agent pitcher like Greinke.

Besides the fact that will be a cold day in hell before the Twins pony up the type of money Greinke is looking for. Greinke alone doesn't make this a playoff team.

 

By the time this team is good again, Span is long gone so sell high while he's got alot left on a cheap contract.

[wagwan]

Agreed The Twins will not get value for Span. There would be a huge hole at the top of the order. What is needed is starting pitching. That will not come for Span.That will have to be bought If the Twins can get 2 legitimate starters they will win the division next year. Keep Liriano, Diamond, Hendriks add Greinke and one more they will win 90 games minimum

[Thrylos]

What team has ever added 2-3 starting pitchers, that are good enough to win divisions, in 1 year?

Sure. The Viola trade and the AJP trade.

[kab21]

The expectations on this board about what the Twins might receive in trade for Span seem so out of line with the midseason market in previous years. We will almost certainly be disappointed by the return we receive for Span.

 

In response, I am certain someone is going to point to a previous trade like Blake for Santana. The Indians did a great job in finding Santana who was not a top prospect entering the season he was traded. We will have to trust the Twins scouting department to find a great player hidden among the B/C level prospects.

then the Twins shouldn't trade him. It's that simple. He's a really valuable player and he shouldn't be traded just because of this crappy 'we have Revere' argument. The Twins have had awful OF defense for years so there isn't any reason to trade Span just to make a move.

[Shane Wahl]

The Twins offense has turned around not simply because Ben Revere and Trevor Plouffe have been such fantastic performers (with the 3 and 4 hitters too, obviously). Just as much has to do with Span and Revere at the top together with .350 OBP. Even if Revere can "replace" Span, that doesn't mean that it is a good idea to mess with the top of the lineup, especially with no Joe Benson involved in the OF picture until probably 2014. If it was guaranteed by Gardy (!!) that Mauer would move up to the second spot and the whole lineup would just shift up, that might be one thing. But who knows if we wouldn't see Carroll/Casilla/Dozier batting there instead as Gardy goes with his "heart" or "gut" or whatever, instead of a simple statistic like OBP.

[Shane Wahl]

And I cannot get my head around the notion that Denard Span is blocking Chris Parmelee. That's absurd. Chris Parmelee needs to actually perform well SOMEWHERE for an extended period of time this year before he should be appointed the next anything. He should have about 150 more PAs at Rochester by now, but alas . . .

[DaveW]

Agreed The Twins will not get value for Span.

What are you basing this off of?

[diehardtwinsfan]

The Twins shoudln't trade Span to trade him. That's why Bill Smith got fired. He bashed his players publicly, destroyed their value, and then traded them for crap. If those are the offers on the table for a above average, cost controlled CF, then you keep him and consider retooling for next year (assuming we can get 3 starts in FA).

 

If not, you trade him for two very good starting pitching prospects. Ryan isn't the best GM out there, but in this I know that he isn't going to trade a guy simply to do it. He's going to want value.

[DaveW]

And I cannot get my head around the notion that Denard Span is blocking Chris Parmelee. That's absurd. Chris Parmelee needs to actually perform well SOMEWHERE for an extended period of time this year before he should be appointed the next anything. He should have about 150 more PAs at Rochester by now, but alas . . .

Um, I don't think anyone is claiming that Span is blocking Parmelee.

 

The whole point of trading Span has been:

A. The Twins are rebuilding

B. Span could have a lot of value on the trade market due to his skill set and team friendly contract.

C. The Twins think they have a CF replacement (at least in the near term) for Span in Ben Revere.

D. By trading Span the Twins can fill other areas of need (Starting pitching, MI) while possibly getting younger/cheaper.

 

As finding someone to handle RF isn't exactly a hard proposition, if Parmelee can't handle it the Twins can continue to look for internal options for 2013 (Benson, Arcia, etc) or can go out and sign a veteran stop gap for a year to handle RF (Hunter?)

[CDog]

That's why Bill Smith got fired. He bashed his players publicly, destroyed their value, and then traded them for crap.

When did Smith ever bash a player publicly?

[chopper0080]

You make a deal that improves your organizations pitching or middle infield depth. If you can't upgrade either of those areas, you hold onto Span until next year and shop him again. We hold all the cards to get the best deal possible.

[gunnarthor]

When did Smith ever bash a player publicly?

Dude, he's on a roll. Don't stop him with things like facts.

[old nurse]

Gardy goes with his "heart" or "gut" or whatever, instead of a simple statistic like OBP.

 

Without decent starting pitching it does not matter what statistic Gardy uses. The more the "advanced" statistic will not change the caliber of Twins player. When Gardy has enough starting pitching his gut feelings done by observing what the player does has won enough games to win some pennants.

[DaveW]

When did Smith ever bash a player publicly?

The Perkins, Liriano and Slowey situations come to mind.

[diehardtwinsfan]

When did Smith ever bash a player publicly?

You are correct, Smith himself never did that. The PR machine under smith did this all the time, and he did nothing to stop it. JJ Hardy was a fairly recent one, as was Delmon, Perkins, Baker, Slowey, Neshek, etc. It happened quite a bit, and its only purpose was to lower the value of the guys he wanted to get rid of.

[CDog]

The Perkins, Liriano and Slowey situations come to mind.

And what did Bill Smith say of them that was considered "bashing?"

[CDog]

You are correct, Smith himself never did that. The PR machine under smith did this all the time, and he did nothing to stop it. JJ Hardy was a fairly recent one, as was Delmon, Perkins, Baker, Slowey, Neshek, etc. It happened quite a bit, and its only purpose was to lower the value of the guys he wanted to get rid of.

When and how were these players bashed? And do you really think that was the purpose?

[Guest USAFChief]

When and how were these players bashed? And do you really think that was the purpose?

Do you not read the papers? Do you not watch FSN Twins telecasts?

 

If you don't think it's readily apparent when we're getting PR through JoeC/LEN, or from Dickbert, then I don't know what to say.

 

They all but accused Slowey of child molestation last year.

[CDog]

Do you not read the papers? Do you not watch FSN Twins telecasts?

 

If you don't think it's readily apparent when we're getting PR through JoeC/LEN, or from Dickbert, then I don't know what to say.

 

They all but accused Slowey of child molestation last year.

You could actually provide an example.

[Guest USAFChief]

You could actually provide an example.

They all but accused Slowey of child molestation last year.

[CDog]

They all but accused Slowey of child molestation last year.

That's your version of an example? And another piece of the puzzle falls into place.

[Shane Wahl]

All I remember in most cases were "rumors" bandied about by the "access" journalists. And then one time the camera caught Slowey yawning in the bullpen and Blyleven lit into him with no class whatsoever.

[TheLeviathan]

That's your version of an example? And another piece of the puzzle falls into place.

Seriously? Thanks for the input Dr. Doofenshmirtz.