More meaningful innings for Thielbar?

[IdahoPilgrim]

Was perusing the Twins website and came across this article.

 

Thielbar has solidified himself in Twins' bullpen | twinsbaseball.com: News

 

I'm not a big anti-Gardy person, but I have been wondering a little about how Gardenhire has used Thielbar. Checking baseball-reference.com, I see that Thielbar has never been brought into a game when the Twins were tied or ahead, and only on 3 occasions has he been brought in with runners on base in the middle of an inning. Usually he has been used when the Twins were already down several runs, to handle the final innings and, presumably, save the arms of others in the pen. He has finished 12 of the 14 games he's entered, and with the exception of June 1st, the Twins were the losers in all those games. That tells me that Gardenhire doesn't use Thielbar in high-leverage situations, which indicates a potential lack of trust.

 

In this article, Gardenhire seems to dispell that, saying, "But he's been really good up here, not just marginal, he's been throwing the ball really well. He's at that point where I'm not afraid to bring him in against big boys at any time of the game now."

 

Ryan also has this quote in the article: "We talked about [Thielbar] this morning and whether or not he's going to get some more meaningful innings or whatever that means," Twins general manager Terry Ryan said. "I guess that means moving him back towards the back of that bullpen."

It almost sounds like Ryan and Gardenhire don't see quite eye-to-eye on Thielbar, or that at least Ryan was also wondering about how Gardy was using him. Are we going to see Thielbar pitch in some higher leverage situations now?

 

Thoughts?

[Riverbrian]

In my opinion... Quotes usually mean very little to me.

 

I think you hit on it... Actions are the thing I go by and actions suggest that Thielbar is indeed in the back of the bullpen.

 

Quotes lack context in most cases and that context is extremely significant.

 

Gardy may honestly believe that Thielbar deserves more significant innings and expresses it to the press to support Caleb but in the end... he may... trust Duensing or Fein more because Thielbar hasn't gotten any appearances with the game close.

 

As for Terry Ryan and Gardenhire not seeing eye to eye... Just a guess of course... I believe that they probably disagree quite a bit but still understand each other.

 

I've been in rooms where two people I respect will look at a ball player and both see something different and that happens frequently.

 

I think scouts will disagree with each other and coaches will disagree with each other... There are probably "I told you so" moments inside those walls. I just don't believe that Gardy and TR are lockstep in private.

 

It is kind of rare when those disagreements filter out into the press though.

 

As for Thielbar seeing more meaningful action. 15.2 innings... 0.00 ERA... 13 K's...

 

He better!!! In my opinion.

[howieramone1406390264]

Does it really matter? I think it's great Gardy gave him time before throwing him to the wolves, much like Pressly and other relievers over the years. I can't really get concerned about how we use our 12-13th reliever. How soon we can contend again will be determined by looking in a different direction. Gibson is up, who is the next to claim their spot in the rotation, Meyer or May, and when?

[IdahoPilgrim]

Does it really matter? I think it's great Gardy gave him time before throwing him to the wolves, much like Pressly and other relievers over the years. I can't really get concerned about how we use our 12-13th reliever.

 

If Gardenhire was simply giving him time to adjust, then I have no problem with that. Now let's see what we have when it really does matter.

 

I think the larger question here is, given his results to date, is he really the "12-13th reliever" or can he be more than that.

[diehardtwinsfan]

Gardy typically starts his relievers in lower leverage situations, and then as they perform will gradually rachet up the heat. Theilbar has done well enough to earn some tougher leverage situations, and I have no doubt over the course of the season that he gets them.

[iastfan112]

Fine where he is, he's been good but his HR is unsustainable and he's walking quite a few. He's been good but for the most part so has the rest of the pen.

[Highabove]

Last Thursday against KC, Thielbar was warming up during a tight situation.

Deduno was attempting to hold onto a 2-1 lead in the 7th. Deduno did get out of trouble. Burton came in the 8th. The Twins did win 3-1.

[BabyJesusBuxton]

Caleb's long-term role in the bullpen is going to be as a LOOGY although he has shown ability to get out right handers as well so this could likely be his floor. He has given up 7 BB in 15.2 innings thus far (1 intentional) which isn't great but it isn't terrible either. Through the minors he has shown excellent control so I expect the walk rate may improve as he gets more innings although his WHIP (0.77 currently) is going to increase as more hits are likely to fall in as well.

[BabyJesusBuxton]

One final comment on Thielbar - Out of his walks only 1 has come to a LH batter in 22 at bats as apposed to 6 in 27 at bats against RH batters.

 

I found this interesting as a couple possible things could be happening pointing towards my thoughts of his floor being a LOOGY: A. He is pitching more carefully to RH (possibly around them to get to a LH) B. RH batters are able to foul off his pitches easier and work a walk.

[pab]

One final comment on Thielbar - Out of his walks only 1 has come to a LH batter in 22 at bats as apposed to 6 in 27 at bats against RH batters.

 

I found this interesting as a couple possible things could be happening pointing towards my thoughts of his floor being a LOOGY: A. He is pitching more carefully to RH (possibly around them to get to a LH) B. RH batters are able to foul off his pitches easier and work a walk.

 

Those numbers only say one thing to me: SSS

[johnnydakota]

Does it really matter? I think it's great Gardy gave him time before throwing him to the wolves, much like Pressly and other relievers over the years. I can't really get concerned about how we use our 12-13th reliever. How soon we can contend again will be determined by looking in a different direction. Gibson is up, who is the next to claim their spot in the rotation, Meyer or May, and when?

 

1 Is a Tommy John canidate, and the other will probally spend 2 to 3 years struggling as a starter before he moves to the bullpen

[johnnydakota]

To me (a Gardy hater) Ron has done just fine by Thielbar, Let him get his feet wet ,without

having to carry the team on his back, but i do agree, maybe it is time to see what he can do in more situations.

[diehardtwinsfan]

1 Is a Tommy John canidate, and the other will probally spend 2 to 3 years struggling as a starter before he moves to the bullpen

 

The UCL is in the elbow, not the shoulder.

[YourHouseIsMyHouse]

Thielbar should be getting Duensing's innings.

[BabyJesusBuxton]

Thielbar should be getting Duensing's innings.

 

At least some of them.

 

Also, I am glad Gardy has stopped using Burton as THE 8th inning pitcher recently. Burton's has not been the same pitcher he was in 2012 and I think if Gardy were to play matchups more in the 8th with a combination of Duensing, Burton, and possibly Fien then there would be more opportunities in the 6th/7th for Thielbar.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

Was perusing the Twins website and came across this article.

 

Thielbar has solidified himself in Twins' bullpen | twinsbaseball.com: News

 

I'm not a big anti-Gardy person, but I have been wondering a little about how Gardenhire has used Thielbar. Checking baseball-reference.com, I see that Thielbar has never been brought into a game when the Twins were tied or ahead, and only on 3 occasions has he been brought in with runners on base in the middle of an inning. Usually he has been used when the Twins were already down several runs, to handle the final innings and, presumably, save the arms of others in the pen. He has finished 12 of the 14 games he's entered, and with the exception of June 1st, the Twins were the losers in all those games. That tells me that Gardenhire doesn't use Thielbar in high-leverage situations, which indicates a potential lack of trust.

 

In this article, Gardenhire seems to dispell that, saying, "But he's been really good up here, not just marginal, he's been throwing the ball really well. He's at that point where I'm not afraid to bring him in against big boys at any time of the game now."

 

Ryan also has this quote in the article: "We talked about [Thielbar] this morning and whether or not he's going to get some more meaningful innings or whatever that means," Twins general manager Terry Ryan said. "I guess that means moving him back towards the back of that bullpen."

It almost sounds like Ryan and Gardenhire don't see quite eye-to-eye on Thielbar, or that at least Ryan was also wondering about how Gardy was using him. Are we going to see Thielbar pitch in some higher leverage situations now?

 

Thoughts?

TR seeing what he has to replace Perkins if there were a trade?

[JB_Iowa]

[h=1]Thread: More meaningful innings for Thielbar?

YES, PLEASE[/h]

[TheLeviathan]

I know somebody that could use a few less 8th inning appearances right now....

[Kwak]

I know somebody that could use a few less 8th inning appearances right now....

 

Only one someone?

[Highabove]

Patience Folks,

meaningful innings will be coming for Thielbar much sooner then latter.

[Highabove]

Ron Gardenhire has announced that Case Fien and Caleb Thielbar will take over the 8th inning duty's.

Gardenhire also stated that Duensing and Burton will be taking a mental break???

 

Per La Velle E Neil

 

 

[beckmt]

This is just a temporary situation where Burton and Duensing have not been preforming well. It will be good to see what Thielbar can do and Duensing may be traded or be too expensive next year for the Twins.

[stringer bell]

As of 7/2, Thielbar and Duensing will be switching roles. Good idea for now. I'm sure they don't want to overuse and overexpose Thielbar, but he is getting folks out with a good number of Ks, while BDuns isn't.

[Otto von Ballpark]

Curious why we didn't see Thielbar earlier last night? True, we were already down 3 runs in the 7th when Cano came up, but it would have been excellent practice for Caleb to face Cano in that situation, instead of working another mop-up inning later.

 

Also, we're past the point where we really should be loosening the reins on Perkins. Unlike last year when Burton was strong too, Perkins is BY FAR our best guy out of the pen, it doesn't make sense to exclusively save him for ninth-inning leads anymore. This doesn't have to be revolutionary -- he can still come in to start innings, and only pitch an inning per appearance, but he should be making appearances in the 8th inning of close games if the matchups warrant.

[ThePuck]

Ron Gardenhire has announced that Case Fien and Caleb Thielbar will take over the 8th inning duty's.

Gardenhire also stated that Duensing and Burton will be taking a mental break???

 

 

 

 

I believe you, but do you have a source.

[jokin]

I believe you, but do you have a source.

 

I heard it clearly stated on the broadcast last night.

[ThePuck]

I heard it clearly stated on the broadcast last night.

 

So Gardy himself said it last night or someone else said that's what Gardy told them? I ask because Gardy also said Thielbar would get more meaningful innings before Monday's game, then he brought Burton in to blow another game and then last night he uses Thielbar when we're losing by 6 runs.

[Nick Nelson]

I'll be interested to see how quickly the fan base turns on Thielbar after his inevitable rough patch hits. I don't have a problem with this switch given the way things are going, but ultimately Duensing is a better pitcher.

[ThePuck]

I'll be interested to see how quickly the fan base turns on Thielbar after his inevitable rough patch hits. I don't have a problem with this switch given the way things are going, but ultimately Duensing is a better pitcher.

 

You know for sure that Duensing is better? I'd be interested in why you believe that.

[Highabove]

I believe you, but do you have a source.

 

 

La Velle Star Tribune