Vikings Offseason Thread

[nicksaviking]

1 minute ago, Mike Sixel said:

Sure, someone could decide not to take QB....but if you don't have a QB and then have a shot at one and don't take one, well, I'm confused what you are doing.

I guess the Bears could keep Fields....but they Vikings and Bears aren't dealing this many picks to each other, IMO (yes, I know about the trades with Detroit and GB).

The more steam McCarthy, Nix and Penix get, the more likely one of the top three guys fall, even if the top guys don't fall behind McCarthy, Nix or Penix. I could see one team at the top, if not more than one team, start getting starry-eyed about paring Harrison, Nabers or Odunze with one of the 'lesser' rookie QBs and trading back into the 1st round if required. Or pairing the stud rookie receivers up with Cousins, Mayfield or even Wilson to be competitive ASAP.

[Mike Sixel]

4 minutes ago, nicksaviking said:

The more steam McCarthy, Nix and Penix get, the more likely one of the top three guys fall, even if the top guys don't fall behind McCarthy, Nix or Penix. I could see one team at the top, if not more than one team, start getting starry-eyed about paring Harrison, Nabers or Odunze with one of the 'lesser' rookie QBs and trading back into the 1st round if required. Or pairing the stud rookie receivers up with Cousins, Mayfield or even Wilson to be competitive ASAP.

I do agree that one of them MIGHT try the sign Cousins route.......sure. 

I don't think Penix will have steam at this point. Which, wow, he was so great so many games, and so mediocre in others. 

[nicksaviking]

21 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

I do agree that one of them MIGHT try the sign Cousins route.......sure. 

I don't think Penix will have steam at this point. Which, wow, he was so great so many games, and so mediocre in others. 

Yeah, and he's also going to lose out to the others as far as athletic testing goes at the pro days and combines.

He is my least favorite of the group, but, if he has the right attitude (or wrong attitude if this was most other professions) the QBs who hold a grudge often are the ones that end up being later drafted gems.

[Parfigliano]

Seen several reports that Vikes are most likely to sign Cousins.

[Danchat]

On 2/11/2024 at 10:30 PM, Vanimal46 said:

Honestly, is it worth trying to find a “franchise QB” when Patrick Mahomes is breathing? He might be the GOAT right now. And is certainly on his way to being the GOAT if that’s too aggressive. 

Absolutely, I'd say so. Do you think the Texans regretted taking Stroud? Sure, I agree that it's not worth shelling out 3 1st round picks / making a blunder like Carolina did to move up to #1, but if you can find that franchise QB and pair him with a competent HC and a front office that can build a roster, they can compete with the Chiefs. They aren't gonna win it all every year. It's difficult to put all three of those things together but there's no sense in giving up.

[Parfigliano]

9 hours ago, Danchat said:

Absolutely, I'd say so. Do you think the Texans regretted taking Stroud? Sure, I agree that it's not worth shelling out 3 1st round picks / making a blunder like Carolina did to move up to #1, but if you can find that franchise QB and pair him with a competent HC and a front office that can build a roster, they can compete with the Chiefs. They aren't gonna win it all every year. It's difficult to put all three of those things together but there's no sense in giving up.

Hate to say it but as long as Kwesi is around the Vikes do not have a competent front office.

[nicksaviking]

23 minutes ago, Parfigliano said:

Hate to say it but as long as Kwesi is around the Vikes do not have a competent front office.

I've been hugely critical, but I'm not writing him off just yet.

His drafts and free agents have only been done with the intent to continue to patch up the deteriorating jalopy that was here when he was hired.

If does finally allow a rebuild, I'll give him a shot to see if he can do it right. Front seven on defense, QB and OL on offense.

[nicksaviking]

The Vikings aren't willing to do a guaranteed deal with Cousins per reports:

https://www.si.com/nfl/2024/02/19/takeaways-chiefs-parade-shooting-draft-justin-fields-kirk-cousins

Which I think is the smart thing to do. If you could get him for one year and have a QB sit behind him, I could live with that, but two years? No way, only GB gets away with that and it's completely counter-intuitive to taking advantage of the affordable rookie QB contracts.

[nicksaviking]

Also, they renegotiated Marcus Davenports buyout date:

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/vikings-re-negotiate-void-date-on-marcus-davenports-deal-to-march-11

Why? From day one he showed complete indifference to being here and then he completely quit on the team, why on earth would they ever want him back. Just take the hit and move on.

[Mike Sixel]

12 minutes ago, nicksaviking said:

Also, they renegotiated Marcus Davenports buyout date:

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/vikings-re-negotiate-void-date-on-marcus-davenports-deal-to-march-11

Why? From day one he should complete indifference to being here and then he completely quit on the team, why on earth would they ever want him back. Just take the hit and move on.

I'd fire the entire FO if he's brought back. I might insist they fold the team completely. 

[Parfigliano]

2 hours ago, nicksaviking said:

The Vikings aren't willing to do a guaranteed deal with Cousins per reports:

https://www.si.com/nfl/2024/02/19/takeaways-chiefs-parade-shooting-draft-justin-fields-kirk-cousins

Which I think is the smart thing to do. If you could get him for one year and have a QB sit behind him, I could live with that, but two years? No way, only GB gets away with that and it's completely counter-intuitive to taking advantage of the affordable rookie QB contracts.

That mean he's gone?

[Vanimal46]

39 minutes ago, Parfigliano said:

That mean he's gone?

Yeah, probably so. The hold up last year is Kwesi not wanting to guarantee 2025. Can't imagine that has changed now that he's coming off a torn achilles. I've got no issue guaranteeing him for 2024, but there's no way I'm guaranteeing 2025 for him. 

[Vanimal46]

3 hours ago, nicksaviking said:

Also, they renegotiated Marcus Davenports buyout date:

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/vikings-re-negotiate-void-date-on-marcus-davenports-deal-to-march-11

Why? From day one he should complete indifference to being here and then he completely quit on the team, why on earth would they ever want him back. Just take the hit and move on.

If Davenport is willing to take on a vet minimum deal, sure. I'm not paying any more to a guy who doesn't care to play football. He robbed the organization of $13 million last year. 

[nicksaviking]

48 minutes ago, Vanimal46 said:

If Davenport is willing to take on a vet minimum deal, sure. I'm not paying any more to a guy who doesn't care to play football. He robbed the organization of $13 million last year. 

Not sure I want him rubbing off on what should be a defensive squad made up almost entirely of guys on their first contracts.

[Mike Sixel]

Every penny spent on dudes that don't play is money not spent on guys that do. Hard pass. 

[Danchat]

11 hours ago, nicksaviking said:

His drafts and free agents have only been done with the intent to continue to patch up the deteriorating jalopy that was here when he was hired.

It's worth noting that his 2023 draft class looks pretty good for only having one top 90 pick... but the 2023 FA class is about as bad as it gets. Davenport was a huge miss, Lowry was a waste of money and appears to have his money guaranteed in 2024 due to injury, Oliver was a waste and made little impact on the run game, and Murphy was scarcely a success as he is barely startable. Not to mention having Mattison be the only notable RB acquisition after missing on Montgomery. Nothing was stopping them from signing free agents who could help in the long term but they chose to mostly sign short-term deals.

1 hour ago, Vanimal46 said:

If Davenport is willing to take on a vet minimum deal, sure. I'm not paying any more to a guy who doesn't care to play football. He robbed the organization of $13 million last year. 

Yeah, I think the only reason why the date was pushed back was in case he doesn't land anywhere in FA right away, the Vikings would take him back for a very small amount, near the minimum. He earned $11.3M last year (he failed to get $1.7M in incentives).

[Mike Sixel]

56 minutes ago, Danchat said:

It's worth noting that his 2023 draft class looks pretty good for only having one top 90 pick... but the 2023 FA class is about as bad as it gets. Davenport was a huge miss, Lowry was a waste of money and appears to have his money guaranteed in 2024 due to injury, Oliver was a waste and made little impact on the run game, and Murphy was scarcely a success as he is barely startable. Not to mention having Mattison be the only notable RB acquisition after missing on Montgomery. Nothing was stopping them from signing free agents who could help in the long term but they chose to mostly sign short-term deals.

Yeah, I think the only reason why the date was pushed back was in case he doesn't land anywhere in FA right away, the Vikings would take him back for a very small amount, near the minimum. He earned $11.3M last year (he failed to get $1.7M in incentives).

They brought in a RB, he got hurt.... To be clear, I'm no defender of this front office.....

[Mike Sixel]

I'm guessing Hunter and Cousins are gone. This is going to be ugly for a couple years.

[Vanimal46]

I think we all knew Adrian Peterson was going to be broke once he got out of football… Some of his possessions are now up for auction in Houston. 

https://hibid.com/catalog/524140/adrian-peterson-final-auction

[nicksaviking]

20 minutes ago, Vanimal46 said:

I think we all knew Adrian Peterson was going to be broke once he got out of football… Some of his possessions are now up for auction in Houston. 

https://hibid.com/catalog/524140/adrian-peterson-final-auction

I think he was broke while STILL in football.

The NFL seems to have made it a point to educate the new players about their money, but they didn't while AP was making all of his.

I could use a new office chair though....

[gunnarthor]

Stories of athletes losing their money after they retire sucks. Bummer.

[Mike Sixel]

I'm trying to be a better person, so I'll feel bad for him for a minute or two. He's one of the final straws for me ever rooting for individual athletes......

[nicksaviking]

23 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

I'm trying to be a better person, so I'll feel bad for him for a minute or two. He's one of the final straws for me ever rooting for individual athletes......

Yeah, to an extent I feel bad. Though THAT incident didn't cause this auction, it's almost certainly due to the well publicized issues with not paying child support, which I'm also fairly unsympathetic to.

I was done with the athlete idol before Peterson came around, but I mean, this stuff is a pretty big reason why I cheer for the team and not the player. I come across pretty cold sometimes always wanting to move on from long time players, but we don't really know these guys. The guys that replace them could be fantastic humans for all I know, or they could be scumbags. So best course is just to cheer to win a trophy is my take.

 

[Parfigliano]

4 hours ago, nicksaviking said:

I think he was broke while STILL in football.

The NFL seems to have made it a point to educate the new players about their money, but they didn't while AP was making all of his.

I could use a new office chair though....

Let the bidding war begin

[Vanimal46]

Thank you Swifties for the unprecedented cap increase! The Vikings start the offseason with $38 million to work with. Likely more if Kirk, Hunter, or JJ is extended. 

[nicksaviking]

With a rebuild on my mind, I might let Hunter walk and sign one of the younger pass rushing free agents, but the Vikings could probably do both JJ and Hunter now.

Though I think investing in the OL should be the top free agent priority, particularly if they do get a new young QB. Even with some end of the year troubles, the expensive part, LT, should be fine. Interior guys are cheaper; they could go whole hog on those three spots to make in not a concern for a few years.

[Cap'n Piranha]

On 2/23/2024 at 11:16 AM, nicksaviking said:

With a rebuild on my mind, I might let Hunter walk and sign one of the younger pass rushing free agents, but the Vikings could probably do both JJ and Hunter now.

Though I think investing in the OL should be the top free agent priority, particularly if they do get a new young QB. Even with some end of the year troubles, the expensive part, LT, should be fine. Interior guys are cheaper; they could go whole hog on those three spots to make in not a concern for a few years.

I might be committing heresy here, but I think I would rather have 3 good/great guys on the IOL than 2 good/great tackles.  It's much easier to give a tackle blocking help (attach a blocking specialist TE, send the RB out to chip which gets him closer to the flat as well).  If it's me, I'm gauging the market for Darrisaw (who can't stay healthy), and see what I can get for him.  I then invest heavily in center/guard.

[Cap'n Piranha]

Two things I've read over the last couple days that, if true, definitely have me thinking rebuild.

1. Peter King says the wind is blowing towards CHI keeping Fields.  The idea is that they would first trade down to 2, and then trade even lower (one individual suggested ATL at 8).  Doing this could give the Bears as many as 8 first/second round picks in the next 2 drafts--that's a lot of ammo to surround Fields.
2. Bill Barnwell on ESPN projected that Cousins would get $51M in AAV--I can't see the Vikings doing that, given that they surely could have gotten him for less than that with an extension last year, and didn't.  Accordingly, a writer at ESPN is also predicting Cousins to ATL.

If both of those things are true, here's what I do if I'm the Vikings.

• Pass on signing Hunter, unless you can tag him and trade him (I'm not sure if that's an option)
• Field any and all offers on O'Neil, Darrisaw, Bynum, Metellus, Hockenson, and anyone else that might return anything more than a 5th round pick
• Explore extending JJ, but if you can convince either Arizona or LAC to trade their #4 or #5 for him straight up, do it.  Use that pick along with 2nd/3rd rounders either this year or next year to get to #3 at a minimum, and draft the QB of the future.
• Pray that one of the top 3 WR (Harrison, Nabers, Odunze) drop to #11.  If they don't, trade back moderately and take IOL help.  If a team is willing to give you an extra first in 2025 for a bigger drop (into the mid-late 20's, do that).
• Understand that 2024 will be a horror show on the field, albeit with hopefully an exciting offense between the new QB, new WR, and Addison.  Hopefully a top 3 pick and additional draft ammo in 2025 allows the team to add 3-5 1st/2nd round players in 2025 to accelerate out of the 1 year rebuild.

Of course, all of this depends on Kwesi being competent, so take it with a grain of salt.

[nicksaviking]

23 minutes ago, Cap'n Piranha said:

I might be committing heresy here, but I think I would rather have 3 good/great guys on the IOL than 2 good/great tackles.  It's much easier to give a tackle blocking help (attach a blocking specialist TE, send the RB out to chip which gets him closer to the flat as well).  If it's me, I'm gauging the market for Darrisaw (who can't stay healthy), and see what I can get for him.  I then invest heavily in center/guard.

I'd guess fans of 31 other teams would think you're insane, but everyone watching the Vikings the past several years could easily empathize. It's been downright brutal in the middle.

Not sure I trade Darrisaw though unless the draft capital is significantly higher than I assume it is.

[Cap'n Piranha]

In other news, just saw the article linked below, wherein Kwesi talks about JJ.  A couple things that jump out for me;

• Kwesi claims trading JJ has never even crossed his mind.  I assume this is boilerplate GM lies; if it's true, Kwesi should be immediately fired for massive incompetence--every player should always be regularly assessed for potential trade value.
• Kwesi claims that last summer the Vikings and JJ were "unbelievably close" to a deal before they suspended negotiations.  In my opinion, that has to either be a lie, or Kwesi being completely out of touch.  You're unbelievably close to a deal with an elite player (in the article Kwesi calls him the best receiver in the league, and one of the best non-QBs in the league), and you just decide to give up?  If you're unbelievably close, just get it done, especially in an offseason where you're theoretically pushing for a superbowl.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/39610208/vikes-gm-considered-trading-justin-jefferson