Chance Twins open season with 75/80m payroll??

[johnnydakota]

Greinke just signed. A couple of mid-level pitchers have signed. Still lots out there and time. Why not at least wait a month to whine about what the Twins didn't do, rather than now about what they might not (or even probably won't) do.

The sqeeky wheel gets the oil....

[TheLeviathan]

sorry but there is no guarrantee that myers can/will be any better than Mostakas/Hosmer have been the past 2 yrs or what Gordon/Butler etc did their first couple yrs......Shields is an absolute top of rotation innings eater (didnt say ace tho). They dealt from percieved strength (young hotshot hitter prospect types) to get what they dont have.

I love what KC has done this offseason to get their pitching in order.

 

The Royals are in a totally different place than the Twins. In three years this might be an appropriate move for the Twins but it isn't now. Even then, the deals where your hand is forced (ala Soriano a few years ago) are often the worst for an organization to pull off.

[johnnydakota]

The Twins will not carryover profit. They are still paying off their portion of the stadium, I believe. 50% of $150 million and then 50% of $200+ million.....hummmmmm did they give everyone in the front office, scouting staff and such a raise? I think not. Because they are :losers" they egt higher draft picks and have to pay more. But if you win, you all sell more tickets, concessions et al. More people watch television and such.

 

They can spend. Not just on a pitcher but now an outfielder or a shortstop or someone. They have another $25+ million off the payroll next year, + $25 million more in TV revenue.

 

22,000 season ticket holders. Another 5,000 game sales. Okay, 10,000 empty seats in 2013.

 

Might as well trade Mauer, too.

 

Be the team with the fastest decrease in attendance with a new stadium ever.

 

You don't always win by spending carelessly, but the Twins supposedly have some money to spend and can spend it and not effect their bottom line, so why not do it. Get someone, something. Even futrue trade chips.

 

Hell, if they are doing nothing more, then they could've spent $24 million on Grienke for six years and let him led the staff when they really become competitive in 2015-2018.

 

Isint the twins paying off there share of the stadium through a tax people are paying on hotels resturants and bars in the city?

[Guest USAFChief]

Isint the twins paying off there share of the stadium through a tax people are paying on hotels resturants and bars in the city?

Huh?

[SpantheMan]

We can't just sign prospects win the extra money because there'a a cap for international signings and draft spending. However, if we use the money to squire better prospects when we trade ( Willingham for b-level prospect vs. Willingham +10mil for a-level prospect), we could use our excess money to get better prospects.

[Gernzy]

The Twins will not carryover profit. They are still paying off their portion of the stadium, I believe. 50% of $150 million and then 50% of $200+ million.....hummmmmm did they give everyone in the front office, scouting staff and such a raise? I think not. Because they are :losers" they egt higher draft picks and have to pay more. But if you win, you all sell more tickets, concessions et al. More people watch television and such.

 

They can spend. Not just on a pitcher but now an outfielder or a shortstop or someone. They have another $25+ million off the payroll next year, + $25 million more in TV revenue.

 

22,000 season ticket holders. Another 5,000 game sales. Okay, 10,000 empty seats in 2013.

 

Might as well trade Mauer, too.

 

Be the team with the fastest decrease in attendance with a new stadium ever.

 

You don't always win by spending carelessly, but the Twins supposedly have some money to spend and can spend it and not effect their bottom line, so why not do it. Get someone, something. Even futrue trade chips.

 

Hell, if they are doing nothing more, then they could've spent $24 million on Grienke for six years and let him led the staff when they really become competitive in 2015-2018.

 

Mr. Rosterman, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points. And may God have mercy on your soul.

 

You sir, have just won the internet.

And yes I also see the penguin.

[TopGunn#22]

They have made 2 good trades in acquiring young pitching. But it is beyond frustrating that they clearly refuse to go after some arms thru free agency. Really, signing Marcum and Saunders to 3 year deals wouldn't kill them. They would at least have a couple major league pitchers controlled thru 2015 to go with Worley, Diamond, Gibson and Hendricks. Depending on how they pitch and how the team performs, you either keep Marcum and Saunders or you deal them to contending teams at or near the deadline. With the TV money each team will be receiving in 2014 and beyond the Twins inactivity is enough to make you grind your teeth.

[johnnydakota]

They have made 2 good trades in acquiring young pitching. But it is beyond frustrating that they clearly refuse to go after some arms thru free agency. Really, signing Marcum and Saunders to 3 year deals wouldn't kill them. They would at least have a couple major league pitchers controlled thru 2015 to go with Worley, Diamond, Gibson and Hendricks. Depending on how they pitch and how the team performs, you either keep Marcum and Saunders or you deal them to contending teams at or near the deadline. With the TV money each team will be receiving in 2014 and beyond the Twins inactivity is enough to make you grind your teeth.

 

The Minnesota Twins need to expand payroll and become players for upper tier free agents or commite to rebuilding,

straddling the fence only gives you a case of blue balls,so either go get Hamilton , Sanchez and a shortstop,or trade

Willingham,Justin and Joe and really commite to the future....

[ThePuck]

"Let's make something very clear. Billy Butler, Alex Gordon, Salvador Perez and Alcides Escobar signed here long-term with the full expectation that we, as a baseball operations department, would do everything that we can to put the best team on the field every single night," Moore said. "That's what we've committed to our fans, that's what we've committed to our players, so when an opportunity comes along that you can acquire a pitcher like James Shields and Wade Davis, we have to do it."

[jharaldson]

It's kind of humorous how people are surprised that rebuilding teams trade veterans and are hesitant to sign aging and declining veterans to long contracts.

 

It's incredible, isn't it?

 

I have yet to see any real sentiment about not making the trades Ryan has made or signing guys to long term deals that may block minor league talent from coming up in 2014-2015 but how would have signing/trading for Haren to a 1 year contract and getting Blanton or McCarthy for 2 years impacted the next talent wave? Using our payroll for decent options this year instead of settling on lower tier guys like Myers and Lannan would have sent a message that even though we are setting up for the future when guys like Sano, Meyer, May, Berrios, ect.... arrive we are still trying to compete by maximizing what we have in 2013.

[twinsnorth49]

"Let's make something very clear. Billy Butler, Alex Gordon, Salvador Perez and Alcides Escobar signed here long-term with the full expectation that we, as a baseball operations department, would do everything that we can to put the best team on the field every single night," Moore said. "That's what we've committed to our fans, that's what we've committed to our players, so when an opportunity comes along that you can acquire a pitcher like James Shields and Wade Davis, we have to do it."

 

Fair enough, but what else would you expect him to say? "I took a big risk here folks, gave up a lot but I'm pretty sure it's a good move". His statement is called, rhetoric.

 

This may make sense for the Royals right now, although certainly no given. I don't believe a move like this makes sense for the Twins given where they are at, in a couple of years if Gibson, Meyer, May, Sano, et al are performing as expected, sure, but not now.

[Boom Boom]

I predict the Twins will have a payroll right around $80 million after signing a couple cheap free agent pitchers.

 

TR's on record saying that one player earning 25% of the payroll is bad business. The Twins would need a payroll greater than $92 million to not be in that situation.

[Top Gun]

If I were Gardy I would say stick it!

[Shane Wahl]

They have made 2 good trades in acquiring young pitching. But it is beyond frustrating that they clearly refuse to go after some arms thru free agency. Really, signing Marcum and Saunders to 3 year deals wouldn't kill them. They would at least have a couple major league pitchers controlled thru 2015 to go with Worley, Diamond, Gibson and Hendricks. Depending on how they pitch and how the team performs, you either keep Marcum and Saunders or you deal them to contending teams at or near the deadline. With the TV money each team will be receiving in 2014 and beyond the Twins inactivity is enough to make you grind your teeth.

 

Signing Saunders to a three-year deal would kill ​me.

[zenser]

I guess I was under the illusion a lot of other Twins fans were under a few years ago. I thought, because the Twins told us so, that having a revenue source from a new stadium like Target Field would allow the Twins to be competitive in the FA market. I am not saying to spend money to just spend money. Do you really think they even kicked the tires on Greinke? Me either. I have season tickets too but it is getting harder and harder to write that check.

[Brock Beauchamp]

I guess I was under the illusion a lot of other Twins fans were under a few years ago. I thought, because the Twins told us so, that having a revenue source from a new stadium like Target Field would allow the Twins to be competitive in the FA market. I am not saying to spend money to just spend money. Do you really think they even kicked the tires on Greinke? Me either. I have season tickets too but it is getting harder and harder to write that check.

 

I don't understand the lament over the Greinke signing. It's a six year deal at $25m per and Greinke has an opt-out after the third season. Greinke is a good pitcher. He's not a great one and that kind of money and years is ridiculous.

 

I'd rather have Sanchez at five years, $75m or Jackson at four years, $60m over that Greinke contract any day of the freakin' week (plus/minus $5m to the Jackson or Sanchez contracts).

 

The Twins should be playing in the middle of the free agent pool, not the deep end. Those contracts almost never work out for the team that "wins" the free agent whereas there's a damned good chance the Twins would be completely screwed if they had $50m a year invested in Mauer and Greinke through 2018.

[drivlikejehu]

Payroll needs fluctuate over time. There is no real point in throwing away a bunch of money on a rebuilding team. But, there is a lot of value in bolstering a contender. However, the Pohlads will never say anything about investing more down the road, because they have zero intention of doing so.

 

It's not even about what the Pohlads owe to the taxpayers, who handed them hundreds of millions of dollars in exchange for nothing, even though their family tried very hard to make the team disappear off the face of the Earth. I know for sure they couldn't care less about that. But it's actually bad business not to invest in a contending team, because a relatively small investment can pay huge dividends if the team makes the playoffs (particularly if it advances).

[twinsnorth49]

I guess I was under the illusion a lot of other Twins fans were under a few years ago. I thought, because the Twins told us so, that having a revenue source from a new stadium like Target Field would allow the Twins to be competitive in the FA market. I am not saying to spend money to just spend money. Do you really think they even kicked the tires on Greinke? Me either. I have season tickets too but it is getting harder and harder to write that check.

 

I don't understand the lament over the Greinke signing. It's a six year deal at $25m per and Greinke has an opt-out after the third season. Greinke is a good pitcher. He's not a great one and that kind of money and years is ridiculous.

 

This, just this. http://www.websmileys.com/sm/fingers/fing32.gif

[zenser]

I guess I was under the illusion a lot of other Twins fans were under a few years ago. I thought, because the Twins told us so, that having a revenue source from a new stadium like Target Field would allow the Twins to be competitive in the FA market. I am not saying to spend money to just spend money. Do you really think they even kicked the tires on Greinke? Me either. I have season tickets too but it is getting harder and harder to write that check.

 

I don't understand the lament over the Greinke signing. It's a six year deal at $25m per and Greinke has an opt-out after the third season. Greinke is a good pitcher. He's not a great one and that kind of money and years is ridiculous.

 

I'd rather have Sanchez at five years, $75m or Jackson at four years, $60m over that Greinke contract any day of the freakin' week (plus/minus $5m to the Jackson or Sanchez contracts).

 

The Twins should be playing in the middle of the free agent pool, not the deep end. Those contracts almost never work out for the team that "wins" the free agent whereas there's a damned good chance the Twins would be completely screwed if they had $50m a year invested in Mauer and Greinke through 2018.

I am not saying the Greinke deal was a good one. I don't think Sanchez at 15 million a season is a great deal either for a guy with a mid 3 era that pitched half his games in a pitchers park in the NL, but given how free agency is going it will take all of 15 million a season for Sanchez. I am just tired of having the retread free agents be the only one's that we can afford. I don't have the link but ESPN had a story a few days ago where the average salary was something like 3 to 5 million. I don't remember the exact figure. If we aren't willing to spend over what the average salary is, we definitely aren't going to improve via free agency.

[Brock Beauchamp]

I am not saying the Greinke deal was a good one. I don't think Sanchez at 15 million a season is a great deal either for a guy with a mid 3 era that pitched half his games in a pitchers park in the NL, but given how free agency is going it will take all of 15 million a season for Sanchez. I am just tired of having the retread free agents be the only one's that we can afford. I don't have the link but ESPN had a story a few days ago where the average salary was something like 3 to 5 million. I don't remember the exact figure. If we aren't willing to spend over what the average salary is, we definitely aren't going to improve via free agency.

 

And I agree with you. I just don't think Greinke would have been a good idea. The Twins should be targeting mid-tier guys, not bidding against the Yankees, Dodgers, and Cubs of the world.

[ThePuck]

And I agree with you. I just don't think Greinke would have been a good idea. The Twins should be targeting mid-tier guys, not bidding against the Yankees, Dodgers, and Cubs of the world.

 

So it's important for us to know our place? What excuse did ownership use to trick, er, convince the taxpayers that the new park was needed?

[Jerr]

All I know is that my stance is that if they insist they are going to compete next year..and they don't spend the money on a decent pitcher, I'm not spending a dime to go see them play until I actually see they are competitive. If they'd spend the money to make it look.like an effort for 2013 is in place, I'd probably buy some tickets in advance. If their roster solutions consist of the lower tier variety, I'm not forking over a dime in advance.

 

All this talk of people saying how the Pohlads spend their millions of dollars and how it's not our money.. well that is how I will move forward regarding my money and the team.

 

Same here and a Twin Fan since 1961!!!!!!

[Jerr]

Once the Twins went to Target Field...I was priced out of "opening night"...after 8 years of being there with my son (the next generation of their fans)....my money, as is the Twins..... is mine.... they dont spend theirs...... I dont spend mine, ON them.......

[Top Gun]

I am not saying the Greinke deal was a good one. I don't think Sanchez at 15 million a season is a great deal either for a guy with a mid 3 era that pitched half his games in a pitchers park in the NL, but given how free agency is going it will take all of 15 million a season for Sanchez. I am just tired of having the retread free agents be the only one's that we can afford. I don't have the link but ESPN had a story a few days ago where the average salary was something like 3 to 5 million. I don't remember the exact figure. If we aren't willing to spend over what the average salary is, we definitely aren't going to improve via free agency.

 

And I agree with you. I just don't think Greinke would have been a good idea. The Twins should be targeting mid-tier guys, not bidding against the Yankees, Dodgers, and Cubs of the world.

If you bid against the big boys then you have something they want to and you can compete and trade with them too.

[johnnydakota]

After the disaster of 2011 the twins earned 26 million,they cut payroll 18 million and in 2012 earn over 32 million(im seeing a pattern here)

I guess we need to see the big picture,if Ryan reduces payroll to around 78 million this year ,then maybe ownership will earn 40 million for the year.Also we would qualify to recieve profit sharing, and a lottery pick.So thats a double win for the team , just not in the won/loss colume

[Kirby Judson]

I know that this team needs pitching, but I just don't see the point of paying 5-8 million for a back of the rotation guy, when we can just let Hendricks, Deduno, Walters, Devries, etc do the same thing. Signing Liriano or trading for Capuano does absolutely nothing for me. I'd rather spend that money taking a chance on someone like Stephen Drew. Why waist 15 million on the next 2 Jason Marquis. I applaud TR for waiting this thing out.

[Mike Sixel]

Most of us agree...but think instead they should sign one of these expensive guys who should be good for 3 to 5 years.

[zenser]

I was just hoping that we would be competitive in the free agent market like we were told when Target Field was built and not in the market for Jason Marquis or Kevin Corriea.

[Brock Beauchamp]

And I agree with you. I just don't think Greinke would have been a good idea. The Twins should be targeting mid-tier guys, not bidding against the Yankees, Dodgers, and Cubs of the world.

 

So it's important for us to know our place? What excuse did ownership use to trick, er, convince the taxpayers that the new park was needed?

 

The state of Minnesota could be handing the Twins $100m a year and they still couldn't compete with the revenue flow of the Dodgers and Yankees. That's not trickery, that's plain ol' reality. Target Field certainly helps but it's not going to turn the Twins into a financial powerhouse. Minnesota is still a mid-sized population with mid-sized revenue streams through television and radio.

[Brock Beauchamp]

I am not saying the Greinke deal was a good one. I don't think Sanchez at 15 million a season is a great deal either for a guy with a mid 3 era that pitched half his games in a pitchers park in the NL, but given how free agency is going it will take all of 15 million a season for Sanchez. I am just tired of having the retread free agents be the only one's that we can afford. I don't have the link but ESPN had a story a few days ago where the average salary was something like 3 to 5 million. I don't remember the exact figure. If we aren't willing to spend over what the average salary is, we definitely aren't going to improve via free agency.

 

And I agree with you. I just don't think Greinke would have been a good idea. The Twins should be targeting mid-tier guys, not bidding against the Yankees, Dodgers, and Cubs of the world.

If you bid against the big boys then you have something they want to and you can compete and trade with them too.

 

That... Doesn't make sense.