Replacing Ron Gardenhire

[drjim]

I also think Gardy is gone, will be more of a mutual thing than a straight firing. Will be Molitor or outside the organization - I like the Dave Martinez idea personally.

[USAFChief]

I also think Gardy is gone, will be more of a mutual thing than a straight firing. Will be Molitor or outside the organization - I like the Dave Martinez idea personally.

Concur on all points.

 

I would prefer Martinez, but wouldn't complain about Molitor.

[gil4]

If any of us were actually qualified for this, we wouldn't be talking about it on fan sites, would we? It's kind of a self selecting group of 'No.'

GM then?

[gil4]

If only Gardy can somehow muscle this team up to a 73-89 record!

 

And just think, a couple months ago people were going all in, 85 wins, multiple guys who were having breakout seasons and several representatives in the All Star game!

Actually, that was me last night on the game thread.  

[howeda7]

I think Molitor deserves a shot. But if you want to go 'outside' Mike Redmond would probably welcome a chance to join Girardi and Gonzalez in the 'escape Jeffrey Lauria' club.

[TheLeviathan]

A coach treats certain players different from others? Perish the thought!

 

The criticism of Gardy mistreating young players is so lame and so blind to what happens around the league. Someone mentioned he called out Danny Valencia. He was right! And also, who cares? It's Danny Bleepin' Valencia.

 

This may be somewhat of a surprise, but coaches are generally most critical of players who they think can still improve. That would generally be younger players.

 

If you want to rationalize the double standard, that's fine.  I may even agree with you.

 

Others, however, argue that such is not even the case.  

[drjim]

 

If you want to rationalize the double standard, that's fine. I may even agree with you.

 

Others, however, argue that such is not even the case.

People argue that Gardy treats everyone exactly the same?

 

I only see people argue he doesn't treat young players poorly. Which is true.

[Craig Arko]

Are you two married or something?

[TheLeviathan]

People argue that Gardy treats everyone exactly the same?

I only see people argue he doesn't treat young players poorly. Which is true.

Part of the distinction Gardy, and other managers make, is preferential treatment to veterans. You will commonly see public remarks about rookie mistakes and virtually never see that with veterans.

 

I believe public admonishment of mistakes is wholly unnecessary, even more so for players trying to get better. Gardy has gotten better at that and I'm happy to compliment him (as with Arcia) when he does so. But he has made it almost a staple of post games to dog some kid - that accomplishes nothing but knocking the kid down.

[drjim]

Are you two married or something?

I'm just side action.

[Ipswichfan]

Charlie Montoya, the Rays AAA manager. He comes across well in John Feinstein's latest book.

And for pitching coach, that guy from the Pirates who fine-tuned Vance Worley.

[Thrylos]

I think that it is more than Gardenhire & Co at this point (and this comes from someone who started the Fire Gardy bandwagon after the 2006 post-season, when it was cold and lonely out there.)   

 

This team needs wholesale changes. 

 

I'd offer Joe Maddon a President/CEO position (sorry Mr St. Peter, no more concert planning for you) and let him hire the GM, front office, manager and the rest of the staff of his choice.

Got to do it at the top.

 

Ryan is done.  The worst think that can happen to this organization (as if not 99+96+96+9? were bad,) it would be if Rob Antony were to be the one who runs this club.

[drjim]

I think that it is more than Gardenhire & Co at this point (and this comes from someone who started the Fire Gardy bandwagon after the 2006 post-season, when it was cold and lonely out there.)

 

This team needs wholesale changes.

 

I'd offer Joe Maddon a President/CEO position (sorry Mr St. Peter, no more concert planning for you) and let him hire the GM, front office, manager and the rest of the staff of his choice.

Got to do it at the top.

 

Ryan is done. The worst think that can happen to this organization (as if not 99+96+96+9? were bad,) it would be if Rob Antony were to be the one who runs this club.

Why would you waste Joe Maddon's skillset in that position?

[Thegrin]

People who want to see Gardy gone, are not watching closely how these Twins keep fighting, even when the game seems to be lost.  A team that plays hard is a sign of a very good manager. 

The Twins are young and not very good yet, but they are working at it and in 2015 or 2016 we will see that Arcia, Parmalee, E. Escobar, Plouffe, Dozier and company are good players. Lets hope it is with the Twins. Lets hope Gardy is here to reap the rewards of his patience.

[drjim]

People who want to see Gardy gone, are not watching closely how these Twins keep fighting, even when the game seems to be lost. A team that plays hard is a sign of a very good manager.

The Twins are young and not very good yet, but they are working at it and in 2015 or 2016 we will see that Arcia, Parmalee, E. Escobar, Plouffe, Dozier and company are good players. Lets hope it is with the Twins. Lets hope Gardy is here to reap the rewards of his patience.

I suspect Gardy will leave more on his own. It will be a mutual parting, not a firing.

 

He is a good manager and will have another job if he wants it, but it is time for a change.

[Thrylos]

People who want to see Gardy gone, are not watching closely how these Twins keep fighting, even when the game seems to be lost.  A team that plays hard is a sign of a very good manager. 

The Twins are young and not very good yet, but they are working at it and in 2015 or 2016 we will see that Arcia, Parmalee, E. Escobar, Plouffe, Dozier and company are good players. Lets hope it is with the Twins. Lets hope Gardy is here to reap the rewards of his patience.

 

That might had been right/correct about 2002 or so

after that.......................

[USAFChief]

People who want to see Gardy gone, are not watching closely how these Twins keep fighting, even when the game seems to be lost.  A team that plays hard is a sign of a very good manager. 

The Twins are young and not very good yet, but they are working at it and in 2015 or 2016 we will see that Arcia, Parmalee, E. Escobar, Plouffe, Dozier and company are good players. Lets hope it is with the Twins. Lets hope Gardy is here to reap the rewards of his patience.

1. It's professional baseball. I expect the team to keep fighting. Gardy would get no credit from me if that were the case...but I don't even see any particular "fight" in this team. What I see is a culture of losing, which is easy and comfortable. Winning is hard, losing is an easy habit.

 

2. A team that wins is a sign of a very good manager, IMO.

 

3. I don't see anyone working all that hard, or any harder than other major league teams. And they're not all that young, either.

 

This organization needs a culture change. Start with the manager.

[Squirrel]

1. It's professional baseball. I expect the team to keep fighting. Gardy would get no credit from me if that were the case...but I don't even see any particular "fight" in this team. What I see is a culture of losing, which is easy and comfortable. Winning is hard, losing is an easy habit.

2. A team that wins is a sign of a very good manager, IMO.

3. I don't see anyone working all that hard, or any harder than other major league teams. And they're not all that young, either.

This organization needs a culture change. Start with the manager.

Culture changes start at the top, IMO. That would be Ryan or higher, then on down.

[naobermiller]

I think the nail in Gardenhire's coffin this off season is going to be if guys like Vance Worley, Francisco Liriano, Danny Valencia, and others keep performing well.  Add in guys like Hardy and Gomez, and you have a lot of players that Ron Gardenhire likely said to the FO that he couldn't work with, that are performing elsewhere.  You can try to make the argument that Gardy didn't have a lot of talent, but when you look at all those guys out there, I think it becomes pretty obvious that he did have talent and they weren't getting it out of people.

 

And before anyone says "isn't it the FO that dealt the players away," most organizations, and most notably the Twins organization, will consult their manager in regard to roster moves.

[Pius Jefferson]

Fan disinterest will be why the Pohlad's 

 

1. It's professional baseball. I expect the team to keep fighting. Gardy would get no credit from me if that were the case...but I don't even see any particular "fight" in this team. What I see is a culture of losing, which is easy and comfortable. Winning is hard, losing is an easy habit.

2. A team that wins is a sign of a very good manager, IMO.

3. I don't see anyone working all that hard, or any harder than other major league teams. And they're not all that young, either.

This organization needs a culture change. Start with the manager.

1, I see a team who's bad at the things that don't rely on talent. If your manager is failing in that area than he needs to fired. No one works harder is such a dead end b.s. argument.

 

2. Most of the time it's true. There are exceptions like Bob Brenly in Arizona.

[USAFChief]

Culture changes start at the top, IMO. That would be Ryan or higher, then on down.

OK, I'm in.

[Thrylos]

Why would you waste Joe Maddon's skillset in that position?

 

Not a waste.  It will be a promotion for him.  Also an opportunity to have a major say in building an organization and an organization culture of competence and competitiveness (which is what the Twins sorely lack)  As far as I am concerned, that is more important for a change than just hiring a new manager (who will fail if the ones above him and around him remain the same or have their chairs rearranged again.)

 

This situation is rotten from the top down, and pending a sale to an owner who cares more about winning baseball games than making movies as a hobby, having a new President/CEO who cares more about winning baseball games than the concert gigs and food options at Target Field, is the next best thing.

[drjim]

Not a waste. It will be a promotion for him. Also an opportunity to have a major say in building an organization and an organization culture of competence and competitiveness (which is what the Twins sorely lack) As far as I am concerned, that is more important for a change than just hiring a new manager (who will fail if the ones above him and around him remain the same or have their chairs rearranged again.)

 

This situation is rotten from the top down, and pending a sale to an owner who cares more about winning baseball games than making movies as a hobby, having a new President/CEO who cares more about winning baseball games than the concert gigs and food options at Target Field, is the next best thing.

We disagree on the extent of the rot for sure. I'm curious what a managerial change would do. A winning culture has been rebuilt throughout the minors, but needs to come to the majors obviously.

 

I also think you are referencing the wrong Pohlad. And I'm not sure why you are critical of St. Peter for doing his job well. I suspect he cares about winning, but his job is the business side, as in maximizing revenues and making the best fan experience possible.

 

Which is my point, not sure why you would want Maddon overseeing that part of a franchise. And are we sure he is any better than Gardy circa 2006, just with a better pitching staff?

[jorgenswest]

They need to find a manager that can figure out how to manage with 12 pitchers and 2 catchers. The Eric Fryer bench is pathetic today. While he is a better hitter than Schafer, so is everyone else in the major leagues.

[Paul Pleiss]

Kevin Correia, we hardly knew you.. wait, um, we knew you, we knew you well. And he pitched a gem for the Dodgers against the Barves. While it's only one start, and KC has been known to throw a good game surrounded by clunkers, I think this is just another nail in the coffin for Rick Anderson and Gardy.

 

I don't know how Gardy sticks with Anderson through this all. I know he hasn't had a great deal to work with and that they've been best buds since their playing days with the Mets, but sometimes you have to make a business decision. I'd be a lot more inclined to let Gardy finish his contract in MN despite all the losing if he was willing to make significant changes, changes that include Rick Anderson working (or not working) somewhere else.

 

I hope KC does well for the Dodgers down the stretch. Who knows, me may even make their post-season roster. Even if he doesn't he's now got a really nice chance at a WS ring. very nice for a wiley old veteran who started his season pitching for the Minnesota Twins.