Trov

So going to games, buying the merch, and watching TV, while you complain about the product is like going to a restaurant, paying full price for a meal, then yelling about how expensive it is they should lower the price, but then saying you will be back tomorrow to do this all over again. Sure, the employees will get sick of you yelling, but the owner will just keep taking your money and not changing the price of the food. Only if you walk in, say this food is too much bye, and have a whole lot more follow, will the owner say maybe I need to adjust my business plan because now I am losing money. I agree we are the customers, and the only way you get a business to change their ways is either affect their bottom dollar, or threaten to affect and have them believe you. Sometimes there is not much they can do other than fold up shop because the customer is expecting too much, mainly because they do not know the business to know how viable their plan is. I love watching shows like bar rescue where dumb people buy a bar because they think it would be fun and want to run it the way they think a bar should run. Then they lose a ton of money, call an expert for help and the expert says you do everything wrong to make money. That is like the fans that complain about ownership. I bet if any of the fans on here were given a billion dollars and to buy the Twins and run them as they see fit, they would be out of cash real quickly, or they would change their tune real quickly.

According to Atlanta Braves reported earning, they have to report as they are part of a publicly traded company, their company Braves Holdings, in 2023 they had an operating loss of 46 million. The company is more than just the team itself, but most of it is the team, other than some outside revenue from things near the park is my understanding. So the one team that does open the books say they lost money when reporting to their stock holders. I am sure they are not alone in this loss as they have public investors to answer too, not just their own private funds. So you can add Atlanta to the document loss to your list, and they were not seen as a super over spender reaching for dreams.

I was listening to sports talk show the other day, national show, forget which one off top of head. They talked about that in sports, most owners actually lose money in the day to day operation of a team, but make it up on the sale of the team. I get annoyed with all these post and articles about how the Twins can, and need to spend more. It has been going on for years, since the 90's. Then even when we spend the fans still complain because team comes out and says sorry we are spending too much now and some of our long term revenue is shrinking. I would read article about how much money the Padres spent, but yet they did nothing and they had to take out a loan to pay their payroll and had to sell Soto for pennies on the dollar because they could not afford him. If fans are upset at payroll, then stop watching and stop supporting team. Supporting team and complaining about how it is ran will not affect anything.

I think his cost would be too high. He has many years of control and Oakland has no reason to trade him now. So if they do it will be if the prospects are right. I would not say no if we did not have to give up much for him, but only if the FO feels they can get more from him than what he has showed against us. We have a lot of back end rotation depth right now.

At this point of his career I would disagree that numbers are what matters. It is about development and approach and making sure the results will hopefully get there, even more so when you face better pitching. We see many guys do well numbers wise at a lower level, but then as they move up they do not produce because they crushed weak pitching on weak fastballs, but when they start facing good breaking pitches they chase and or miss in the zone. Over this short sample if he gets a week with 2 to 3 HR his numbers will start to fly up.

Looks like typical draft for this FO. Draft bats early and a ton of pitching late. I was looking at the top prospects list for Twins and only 3 out of the 11 drafted pitchers in the MLB top 30 list for Twins, were drafted before 4th round. 3 of them were after the 10th round. This FO has found possible MLB arms later in draft for years now. Ober was 12th round pick. Varland, who may not be a starter in future, was 15th. Festa was 13th round. So there is possible top prospects that can be MLB starters later in draft. The fans who are upset we do not spend a ton of top draft picks on pitchers, I would suggest looking at how often top guys in 1st round turn out to be busts. Sure, the percent of 1st round guys making MLB level is much higher than percent of each round after I would bet, but it really seems you can find diamonds in the rough in later rounds pitchers than you do with position players. We only have like 2 hitters in top 30 MLB list that were outside top 2 rounds, and they are way down the list.

He clearly has jumped to one of top prospects in our system, and unlike Raya they are letting him pitch deep into games and throw upwards of 90 pitches. Last year he was okay, but this year he has taken his game to another level. If he can pitch to this level from here on out he will be a huge boost for MLB team years to come. Personally, I would not want to give him a pen roll this year unless you feel like you need to protect his innings. If we need to call someone up, provided he dices up AAA like he has AA and high A I would look to him. Festa would be more a pen move or Varland again.

Luck is more than just hard hit and launch angle to outcomes. I agree that if that is all you look at it is poor way to evaluate if someone is getting lucky more than not. However, having a large number of your HR be just over the wall plays into that. If you hit a ball that would be a fly out in 29 stadiums but the one you are in and it is a HR there, that is some luck involved. If you your starting pitchers are always getting out of jams, eventually that will even out some most likely. I have not seen many Cleveland games, only those against the Twins, and I cannot say they got by with a lot of luck, but if you are hitting balls that have low expected hit percentage, unless that was planned to hit where they did, that is luck. Now, it is true you cannot get lucky if you do not make contact so just having the ability to make contact can help you out some. In part, once the Twins lowered their K rate in late April, they started putting up a ton more runs too.

It sounds like both top picks may struggle to hit for power with the wood bats, which surprise me knowing the Twins loving the power bats.

I think the Twins can catch Cleveland, and really all they have to do is play like they have been and can. Cleveland is winning on career years from guys that could carry through the year, but also could regress to their career norm. Twins generally are playing close to their career norms overall. Cleveland also has been known to fade the second half as well in recent years.

Not sure the overall number of that specific question, but the team has one of the best overall offenses in baseball. Yeah, this weekend they did very poorly with RISP and those will happen, but as a whole the team has done very well scoring runs.

They could use a LH pen arm, and for the right price an upgrade at top end of rotation. I am sure the team can make the money work for rental guys, but it is unlikely they would agree to take on much future payroll. They may still look for controllable guys on arb year, where you have a pretty good idea what that budgets to be. I think there is little out there for high end arms though that are clear upgrade over Ober. As an article pointed out, you need to be at his level or better to be an upgrade for playoffs. I do think the uncertainty for long term financial could play into taking on future money, but not rental guys. It is not just the Twins own TV deal, but as other teams TV deals are up in air it affects the revenue sharing from those as well. Teams split local TV deals about 50%, which makes sense as they are the other team playing, but as other teams contracts get cut or dropped that is less money to share as well. I do feel like the slow start and lack of TV for most people, I have Spectrum so get to see them, but my sisters do not. have affected interest in the team. I think also the long run of Wolves affected early season too as many local sports fans that like both were more engaged in Wolves, I was for sure, than what was going on with Twins at the time.

SS are generally the most athletic guys on a team. Most high school SS never pan out at majors, and the few of the college guys do as well, however, if they can play SS they can play just about anywhere else. If they can play only 1B they have limited options if they suck there. SS is a hard position to fill, so having plenty that can fill in is helpful too. Also, they have increased trade value if they can actually stick there. In terms of Camaniti, from what I read he is LSU commit and was expected to go much higher, meaning he most likely will be looking for above slot deal. Atlanta may be able to get it done, but sometimes guys slide in drafts for a reason. HS pitchers are so volatile as well. He may just decide to go to LSU and in 3 years hope to be much higher pick.

Read up on him that he did terrible with wood bats last summer, lets hope is new found power will translate to the wood bats. At least with good contact and low walks even if he is a gap to gap mainly double type guy with solid defense that has value.

Ehh, he strikes me as a typical 3 outcomes guy with limited defense. I hope he can contribute, but sounds like may have been looking at his improvement and buying in on that. I would not be surprised if he tops out at AA or AAA.

Prep pitchers are roll of the dice. Even the top guys burn out in a few years. I got no issue with taking one, but do not expect much from him for about 4 to 5 years.

The only reason the Twins make this trade is if they think they can tinker with Detmers to get him to where they want. I am for it, but if Detmers is out of options after this year you better plan to do it at MLB level or hope no one takes him off waivers next year.

You also have no clue had they been left in if they would have got the win. We will never know. We attack a move when it does not work, but rarely say that was a great move there when it does work. If we leave in any of those guys longer and they give up the lead Rocco gets attacked for leaving a guy in too long.

He is climbing up prospect rankings, MLB has him 5th in Twins right now, behind Jenkins, Lee, Rodriguez, and Festa. Prospect rankings are fun to look at but they do not mean a whole lot when it comes time to play at the MLB level. Lee was/is ranked higher because he was at least an average defending SS, Keaschall is considered a poor defender overall. If he can learn CF and play it even average and hit like he has show, then yeah he will be huge. Lee was always talked big on because he was expected to have solid floor but not sky high ceiling.

Compare Kurt Schilling and Zach Greinke. Schilling did not make hall, and maybe because of his political views, but his numbers are better than Greinke, and he had more big moments people remember. The numbers are very close but Schilling never made it. I do not think voters care if he is the best on the ballot at pitching for years. There is no requirement anyone needs to go in any year, let alone a pitcher. The last pitchers voted in were 2019, when 3 went in same year. Before that, 2018 1 went in. Then in 2015 3 went in as well. Point is they do not have to put in a pitcher, and you never know what the voters will look at to decide.

If the voters change up their thoughts, which they do seem to be, based on guys like Helton getting in, but pitching they have lagged behind. Greinke, has the longevity and had a good run for 10 seasons, which should get him HOF, but you never know how voters will go. I was shocked when Santana was bounced first ballot, when in his 12 seasons, but really like 9 seasons, he was one of best if not the best pitcher in the game during those 9 seasons. I do feel the voters now are looking at the larger hall, let the best of their era get in, even if they may not have put up the same numbers as others in the hall. In the past, the voters did not care if they were best of their era, but cared how they compared to others. I think the new voters understand the game has evolved over time and the counting stats are not the same as they used to be. However, I still feel like the voters look more than just a great 7 to 9 year run.

Castro is the type of player the Twins love to have. He can play many positions, hits from both sides, and has speed, not super speed but is not slow. I agree he very well may be our MVP because he has played all over, and allows Rocco to move other guys around because Castro can fill the holes left. Good for him making all star team.

I agree we do not need a righty set up man. We could use upgrade from left side though.

I would say Grienke is not 100%, based on how HOF voting for pitchers have gone. He has a high WAR but he also has pitched a lot in his career. He only has 1 cy young, maybe should have had 2, but he is not a lock in my opinion, and with voters on pitching he is a fringe guy I think. The other starters listed for sure. The closers you never know how voters feel. They have the number of saves but people are getting off save stat as important either. As for the hitters you list, Trout is for sure, Votto I am not sold on at all. He is very good, but based on his age and seasons played his counting stats are a little low. He played an offensive position and much of his OPS which is very good, was done by huge walk rate. I think the fact he played 1b and not considered a strong defender will hurt his chances. Betts is fully on pace and barring huge drop off of production should be in. Paul Goldschmidt I am not sold on either. He is similar to Votto, just not played as long and this year he is not doing well, if he drops off or retires soon, I am not saying HOF for him. He is not even at 2000 hits yet. Freeman will need to play a few more years of good ball to be a lock. He is on his way, but at 34 if he drops off quickly he will be a fringe guy too. Ohtahani is well on his way and barring huge drop off will be a lock. Of your 90% guys, Ramirez will need to have a few more very good years to get there. He is on his way but at 31 could drop off. He is yet to win an MVP or any offense title, and average defender. Arenado is more fringe. He was a top defender but he is going to have to play several more years at a high level. Machado is similar to Ramirez, been good but never great. He is still only 31 so if he can stay good into his late 30's he will have a chance. Perez is hard to judge because he is a catcher and you need to take that into account. Overall his numbers would not warrant HOF at any other position. He only finished top 10 MVP 1 time at 7th other than that just solid numbers as a catcher. Some said Joe, who was first ballot was fringe guy, and Mauers numbers much better than Perez on the whole. Altuve is well on way and not showing signs of slowing down, if he can keep up a few more years he should be a lock. Judge will need to keep hitting HR at huge rate to make it. He will get every chance, and being the best Yankee for his time will give him a boost, but if his power drops he will not make it I think. Harper is on the path too, will just need to maintain into later 30's, he is only 31. I would not put Turner on there yet, not over plenty of others, like Seagar, or Correa, both guys play SS and have better career numbers at younger age. The HOF is in interesting time because pitchers numbers are no where near what they used to be, so hard to tell who will make it. Really, if they are one of best of their time for long period they should go, but how long? For hitters, I think the 3,000 hits are rare to come by now, or the 500 HR that used to be locks, but I still think they look at how they did over their time and how did they compare to others in their time at their position. Where they one of the best, or where they just good? Mike Trout, at this point, does not have the counting stats to get in, but for 8 years was considered best in the game at a top defensive position. You may be right with most of them because the counting stats are not as important any more.

Had we not started so bad we would be talked about one of best teams in baseball, as we have had a top record since our terrible start. The Yankees are on the other side of the coin, they started off so hot. They were 50 and 22 after June 14th game. As of today, they are 56 and 38. Meaning they have gone 6 and 16 over last 22 games. That is terrible. That is only 3 games better than how White Sox started their first 22 games. Of course each game counts, but the Yankees world is coming down but still is leading the wild card by 4.5 games, because they had huge cushion. Cleveland has yet to have a bad run overall. I feel fans here feel like the team is doing much worse than we really are, and since the 7-13 start we are doing pretty well. Since that time we are 19 games above .500. We are testing our starting pitching depth, and do not have anyone that is considered a cy young person, but we have 5 solid starters overall, no one when they start do I say, well we better score a ton today. Our offense has become one of best in baseball, and this has been sustained for awhile. We are 4th in runs scored, 4th in HR, 3rd in OPS. We really need to work on the pen for the most part and hope health of the rotation holds.