LA Vikes Fan

Just an FYI on how state income taxes work for pro athletes, entertainers, etc., people who put on "shows" in various states. Each game is a game check and you pay taxes in the state in which that game check is earned. So, Corey Seager still pays California income tax, the difference is that he pays it only on California source income, i.e, the prorated portion of his compensation earned when the Rangers play in the state. These guys all file 20-30 state tax returns every year to account for the income they earn by playing or appearing in states with an income tax. So, the lack of a Texas state income tax is a real difference but it's not like it's a tax vs. non tax difference. The worst place to play for income tax purposes is New York City. There, you pay New York City income tax (3-4%) as well state and federal income taxes. Still, if you want to be a star you gotta play in NY and LA . . .

I like this, except I think both guys will get more from somebody else. I would be fine with making these offers and moving on if not accepted. I think the more likely route is a trade for someone like Lopez in Miami or Merrill Kelly in Arizona. Interestingly, both are roughly .500/high 3s ERA pitchers in their careers although both were good last year. There isn't a lot out there that beats that Sonny Gray threshold. Bottom line, it seems to me very unlikely that the Twins are going to sign a high end SP, and a 50/50 shot at best that they will trade for one. I expect us to go into 2023 with the same group.

This take makes sense to me. I think Polanco is the Plan B at SS if we can't re-sign Correa. If we did trade him, I think Gordon is the replacement if his hitting last year wasn't a flash in the pan. Arraez is not a great replacement given his defensive and injury issues and both Martin and Julien are at least a year away. Plus, Polanco is one of our 3-4 best hitters so there's a real offensive downgrade with replacing him. I doubt if we trade him. There is one scenario where I do think trading Polanco makes sense - if we re-sign Correa and want to free up money to also add a quality starting pitcher, everyday RH hitting OF, LH hitting catcher, or back end bullpen piece. We need a SS, higher end starter, LH hitting catcher, and a closer (if we put Duran in the rotation). I could see them re-signing Correa, trading Polanco to free up $$ in a package him with someone like Larnach and a prospect for a good starter and good BP guy, RH OF or catcher, and using the $$ to fill one of the other holes. Gordon starts out at 2B with some Arraez there also, and Lewis becomes the 2B at mid-season. Easier transition for him. This is probably more than the FO is willing to consider but does offer a way to fill some holes.

Any metrics available out there on whether Urshela has the range to cover SS? I have to admit I kind if shudder a little at the thought of a left side of the infield with Urshela and Miranda. Seems like a defensive nightmare waiting to happen. Urshela paired with a strong defensive 3B might work but I don't think we have that guy. I think we are at least one cycle away from fixing the SS revolving door and that's if Lewis is the answer. If he isn't, we're farther away. I say offer Correa $35-37m a year for 7-8 years. If he declines that offer, the likely result, sign Elvis Andrus and commit to Lewis as the starting SS when's physically ready. Use the money for pitching, pitching, and more pitching. Sign at least Rondon and Fullmer, and then trade one of the young starting prospects plus Larnach for a good young RH hitting OF. Maybe Larnach and Ober to the Pirates for Reynolds? Slight underpay by the Twins so maybe we add Sabato or Noah Miller? In short, I'm hoping for one of 2 things given our real budget issues (1) a combination of moves that gets us a real SP to head the rotation, a good bullpen piece, plus a trade for a young, good hitting RH OF bat, and Lewis playing SS every day by mid-July. That's the deal above. (2) Sign Correa AND a good SP like Rondon, live with the heavily LH OF we have until Lewis is ready and then make him the LF to balance the lineup.

I think you're spot on with what will probably happen in terms of an offer. My guess is that he turns it down, signs for 8-10 years at 340m, and that the placeholder is Elvis Andrus on a 1 yr/6-8m deal.

I would love to see the Twins make Kepler the 4th OF and play him in CF when Buxton is out or DHs. Unfortunately, I don't think Rocco will do that. He didn't play Kepler in CF when he should have this year, and he trotted out Kepler almost every day until he was hurt even though his offense was hurting the team. He even hit Kepler in the middle of the order long after it became clear that he was at best at number 7 or 8 hitter. I would like to see them trade Kepler because if they don't I think this FO/manager combo will play him as a regular. He just isn't a regular on a good team. Larnach, Kirilloff (if healthy), Wallner, Gordon (if not the SS), and any RH bat they can acquire should all start ahead of him. Not because we know they will be better in the case of everyone except Gordon who is better if he's the 2022 version, but because they have the potential to be better and need the shot to play. Kepler is what he is at age 30 and what he is on a good team is the 4th OF who plays CF and the corners. I just don't trust this team to play him that way so I would prefer he was traded for whatever level prospect we can get.

I agree here with only 2 comments. First, assuming they don't re-sign Correa and think Lewis can play SS when he gets back, I am completely against signing a fill-in placeholder type to play SS. That fills a roster spot and does little for you other than slightly improve the defense over a combination of Gordon, Polanco and Palacios. Give Gordon first crack at the spot and tell him that NOW so he can work on his fielding over the winter. It's a win-win on both sides if he can be even a little below average at the spot. Second, I love your idea of a RH hitting corner OF and trading Kepler. I just am not a big fan of Tommy Pham at 34 years old. I might think about AJ Pollock (also 34) Trey Mancini, or Mitch Hanigar. Maybe even Martin or Prato can make the jump from AA. Otherwise, good plan.

Lot of good comments here about the roster for next year. Obviously, the key is Correa. Keep him AND add a quality SP - either a FA like Rondon or trade corner OF and pitching prospect to Miami for Lopez (or something similar) - and I think you can run the same group back with Winder or Sands as a long man in the BP instead of Megill. No Correa and Polanco and Gordon play SS and 2B and we better get Rondon and Benintendi/Josh Bell. Just so much uncertainty going into 2023. Is Larnach the quality hitter we've seen in stretches or the easy out we've also seen? Will Kirilloff ever play at the MLB level again and, if he does, will the wrist injuries sap all of his power? Are Miranda and Gordon the 2022 versions again or do they get better or fall off? The rotation actually looks fairly solid 2-5 but where do we get a #1 starter? The back end of the BP is pretty good, what about those 5-8 spots? 2022 was supposed to help answer those questions but instead has lead to even more uncertainty. The 2023 Twins look like a lot of Twins teams in the past - about 2/3 to 3/4 of a contending team with the big holes in the most crucial spots, we're short a #1 starter and one middle of the order bat. And that's with Correa coming back. With him gone we are closer to 1/2 to 2/3 of a contending team because now we're short 2 middle of the order bats on a team that was mediocre to poor offensively to start out with. Plan? Add a top end starter (Rondon, Lopez, someone similar) and a middle of the order bat (Benintendi, Bell, someone similar). If Correa leaves, don't pick up a defense first lousy mediocre vet like Iglesias, play Polanco or Gordon and live with the defensive downgrade for the offensive upgrade. Trade, release, do something so that Pagan and Kepler are not on the team next year. Current management cannot be trusted to only use either as a bench/spot player. Find a spot to play Miranda, Larnach, and Kirilloff (if healthy) every day for a least the first half of the season to see if they can play. Put Maeda in the BP to start, re-sign Taylor Rogers, and leave Gray, Ryan, Mahle, and Ober in the rotation with SWR, Varland, and Winder as backups. See if that works through the 2023 ASB. If it doesn't, blow it up. Trade our vets and play only the young guys. Move on.

This sounds right to me. I see 2023 as running out the same guys and seeing if we get better health and thus a better result. IF we have better health, this team could "contend" if that means being in contention for the division title or a playoff berth but not really having much hope of a deep playoff run. With the guys you have if they are all healthy we have a solid rotation missing a number one starter, about two thirds of a good bullpen with quality at the top end but lacking depth, and a pretty good lineup missing one quality middle of the order bat if we keep Correa, two if he goes. That probably is good enough to contend in that division and, if it isn't, we'll probably know about midseason and can make trades and embark on a rebuild. While I would love to see the Twins sign Correa, plus a true number one starter and a middle of the order bat, I think that is a fantasy. My prediction is that they actually sign Correa to a 5-7 year deal and do basically nothing else other than maybe signing Sonny Gray for another two or three years, both with at most limited no – trade protection. The pitch is then "look at us, we re-signed Buxton and now re-signed Correa, we are on our way to contention". They then see how it plays out and make the decision on where to go midseason with both trying to contend and a tear down and rebuild on the table. If it works, great, if not they trade most of the veterans they have including Correa and Gray and start a full rebuild.

It's true. I'm both a football and baseball fan and watch both on TV. I would much rather watch a playoff ballgame between two teams I don't follow that up layout baseball game between two teams I don't follow. Why? Because football is better entertainment. It is more fun to watch, there is twice or three times as much action in a three-hour football game that there is a 3.5 hour baseball game, and it is "win or go home" not just a game in the series. And I'm almost 65 years old; my three sons aged 32, 30 and 28 all like both sports but are much more interested in watching a football game that a baseball game. This is baseballs existential problem. The product is not sufficiently fast-paced or exciting for modern America. It is already way behind football, and is being passed by the NBA of all things. I hope the new rules help but what needs to happen the most is the game needs to be cut down to 2 1/2 hours or less, including breaks and commercials.

Correa is the best player we have had for a number of years and the Twins have the opportunity to sign him long term. All we have to do is pay the market value or close to it for his services. That's all he's saying. I'm a little surprised people are upset or put off by that statement. The good news is we got a one-year trial and both sides seem to be interested. That was the best we could possibly hope for and frankly that is exactly the way the contract was structured - a one-year trial for both sides who can now decide whether they want to go forward. I think we should go forward and try to sign Correa long-term. I don't think we have another shortstop on the horizon with Lewis having torn his ACL now twice, Palacios unable to hit, and Lee an unknown. A quality free agent shortstop is going to cost almost as much as Correa or maybe even more and we will not have the depth of experience with that player. I am completely against signing mediocre veterans on one-year deals to cover shortstop. How much? I would absolutely give him five years, $200 million but I don't think that's going to carry the day. I think he'd be looking for at least seven years and probably north of $250 million. To me, that would be worth it but it's not my money. The real conundrum I see is I think we need to sign one top end starter to go with him, and then I think we can carry the rest of the team with what we have. I would love to see them sign Correa long-term and sigh a three or four year deal with Carlos Rondon, run the rest of the team back and see how we do. Actually, I would like to see them sign Justin Verlander or Jacob deGrom but neither one of those two is coming to Minnesota and we couldn't afford them even if they wanted to come. I would also think about trading young pitching with real upside like SWR, Ober, Varland, etc. to a bad team that happened to have one really good starter but I'm not aware of any such situation.

I agree with you here. I originally saw Urshela as a starter on a second division club but he has won me over. I think he can be a starter on a contender hitting 6 or 7. I'd like to keep him. I do think we're a little over subscribed in the corners. My solution would be to trade Kepler and keep Urshela. By the way, I really think that's the key decision based upon who we have and where they can play.

I agree. I think it's about a 30% chance he's as good as new, a 30% chance he's a lesser player with a chronic condition, and about a 30% chance he never sees the big leagues again for any length of time. the other 10%? He's the next Justin Morneau. Wouldn't that be nice.

Two thoughts. First, it's hard to know if Kirilloff is ever going to be able to play at a high level again. If he can, he has to be an OF/DH. 1B is taken by Miranda and Arraez - both of whom have so far shown themselves to be better hitters and better players. The only way Kirilloff can play much 1B is if we either trade Arraez, make him solely a Utility guy (why we would limit opportunities for a guy hitting .313 with a .789 OPS is a mystery to me), or move Miranda to 3B. The latter means no Urshela, who has probably been our 3rd or 4th best hitter this year and fields the position pretty well. Kirilloff is a question mark to begin with and not a guy for whom I think you trade or displace other guys who have performed. Second, you saw the hitting stats above for 3 guys who are adequate in the OF. Now, let's look at a guy who's slash line is ..272/.319/.432 (.751) with a 115 OPS+, speed, and who's as good or better in the OF with more talent to improve defensively - NIck Gordon. Again, why would we displace him for any of these 3 very unproven guys. If this year is real for Gordon, always an if for any player, he's is ahead of all 3 especially since he's basically the same age and has both the room and the natural athletic ability to get better. Also, look at the lines Neither Kirilloff or Larnach has shown much. Yes, we can and should blame injuries but the sad truth is Miranda and Gordon have performed, Kirilloff and Larnach have not. Now I WOULD displace Max Kepler with one of these guys. Why? Max can't hit and he's 30 years old. If we don't trade or bench Max or I guess make Gordon the SS, where are these guys going to get the ABs? The right answer to me is to trade Kepler, put Gordon in LF, have one of the 3 in right (Larnach), one as a DH/occasional 1B/bench bat (Kirilloff if he can play or Wallner), and one in AAA. They can move up IF they perform at a high level AND Gordon, Miranda, or Arraez fall off. That's what the short term future holds for these guys. Larnach and Kirilloff had a shot to take a stranglehold on a starting spot. They didn't. Instead, Miranda and Gordon took advantage of their opportunity and took those spots. Those 2 are now behind and have to beat out 2 other guys who showed they belong on a MLB team in the lineup and may have to beat our the latest new girl in town in Wallner. Critical year coming up for both Larnach and Kirilloff if they want to carve out a long term career with the Twins.

Agreed, except I think Kirilloff is much more of a crapshoot since we have no idea how he will come back from the major surgery he just had. i would add Larnach to the mix, again assuming he comes back from his injury, and we are pretty strong in the 4 corners. I wasn't a big fan of Urshela to start with but he has grown on me plus he hits RH, soemthing we desperately need. I'd be fine with him starting at 3B next year and hitting no higher than #6 or #7 but ONLY if we an work things out so that Miranda, Arraez, Gordon, Kirilloff, and Larnach are all getting 500 plus ABs. I think that's doable if Miranda mans 1B most of the time, Gordon, Larnach and Kirilloff man the two corner OFs and half time DH, with Gordon the backup CF, and Arraez plays 40 games at 1B, 25 at 2B, 50-60 at DH, and another 15-20 at 3B. It's tight and frankly a little too LH in the batter's box but it works. We could also create room if Correa doesn't come back and Gordon plays SSS but I would much rather have Correa. I kind of think with the roster set up the way it is it's kind of a choose 2 of 3 but not all 3 choice between keeping Kepler in RF, keeping Urshela at 3B, or playing Larnach, Kirilloff, Gordon and Miranda at least semi-regularly. You cannot do all 3 of those things. My view would be to trade Kepler given his age and poor bat. Others may disagree but I would love to hear how you can accomplish all three of those things within the roster.

I used to be on this train but just can't stay there with Cave. I'm fine if he has another split contract - I think this year it was 300k when in the minors, 800k in the majors -and he our 6th or 7th OF standing by in AAA. I think that's the best deal he will get from anybody else. He just doesn't hit well enough to play a corner OF and he doesn't field well enough to play CF. Also, he'll be in his age 30 season next year so you would expect him to plateau or decline, not get any better than he's shown. Besides, IF we're reasonably healthy we go into spring training with at least 5-6 guys who are already better or have much higher potential - Buxton, Gordon, Larnach, Kepler, Wallner, Kirilloff (don't kid yourself, Arraez and Miranda are the 1Bs next year) and maybe Celestino (not so sure about him). Love Cave's hustle but if he is on the roster at the start of next year we are in big trouble. I am ok if he is playing every day at AAA available if we have a run of injuries. I would love to be wrong, but i that's really his highest and best use.

I completely agree. Palacios is not the answer at SS for even half a season - he can't hit, at all. It's one thing ot have a defensive wiz who hits .225 with no power for half a season but Palacios isn't a defensive wiz and hits .115 with no power. You just can't do that and expect to compete. My view is don't go out and get some veteran retread play Gordon at SS and see if it works. First off, there's nobody out there to get hat's any good who we would sign. Second, Gordon ahs hit well this year and played well, he's earned a shot. Let's give it to him. With all that said, I'd still rather they signed Correa.

Well put. This was supposed to be the year where the core of Buxton, Polanco, Kepler and Sano complimented by Correa and maybe Arraez would form a fearsome lineup. The pitching staff would be young and improving, and we could be competitive in 2022 with 2023 the true break through deep playoff run competitive year. Instead, Sano played his way out baseball, Kepler played his way to the bench or out of town, and both Polanco and Buxton were injured a whole lot. The only young pitchers that stepped forward were Ryan becoming a solid mid rotation starter with some higher potential and Duran becoming a lock down bullpen guy. Ober looked good last night so maybe he's ready to break out. Miranda and Gordon look like solid MLB players, and possible stars (?), and nothing else happened in the lineup. So where are we? Very hard to tell. There's enough talent with potential to imagine a solid lineup for next year but we again will be dependent on Buxton's health, Polanco and Arraez staying on the field, and break throughs from younger guys. The rotation has 3 vets with injury issues, Ryan, and …. maybe Ober or Winder or Varland? God help us if the 3 vets have more injury issues and Ryan gets hurt. Then we're screwed. The bullpen has to be rebuilt . . . again. The coaching? Wasn't great this year. All frustrating. :Looks like 2023 is another crapshoot year for the Twins. We could win 90-95 games, we could win 70-75 games next year.

I've never been a big fan of Kepler but I agree with this. He really would be a good 4th OF/CF replacement. That's what he is and at age 30 he isn't likely to get better. My concern is that the Twins would still view him as an everyday player rather than giving those ABs to Gordon or Larnach, both of whom are better hitters, and still be unwilling to play him in CF when Buxton is the DH or out. I just wonder if it wouldn't be better for both him and for the team to eliminate that potential misuse and just trade him. BTW, there was an article in the Athletic about increased hits due to the shift ban and they made it sound like a Kepler might get 4-8 more hits a year at most. Based on a 500 AB season at his 3 year average of .220, that's a move from 110 hits to 114 to 118 hits or from .220 to .228 to .236 at best. Let's not forget all of those hits are ground ball singles so the SLG % would not go up and the OPS would hit around .720, and that's supposedly the optimistic side. Look, in a perfect world we would keep Kepler and he would get 300 ABs or so as the 4th OF and usual replacement CF when Buxton is the DH or can't go. That's worth the price tag. It's not worth it if he takes playing time away from Gordon or Larnach because they at least have the potential to be so much more than he is. Even worse if AK comes back strong (complete crapshoot) and playing Kepler takes time away form AK or Miranda because Kepler in RF means AK has to paly 1B and Miranda has nowhere to play. I just question whether this manager will be able to make that switch so on balance I think we should trade him for a prospect and move on.

Agree almost entirely with your analysis of the players. I think we all may be falling victim to overestimating Waller as the new guy in town. To me, looks like he needs a season AAA with the possibility of a midseason call up. Gordon looks real. I hope we find him an everyday spot next year in LF or RF; he's athletic and can learn to play OF. On the other side of the coin, Palacios is completely overmatched. This hopefully eliminates the thought that he could be the replacement for Correa while we wait for Royce Lewis next year. We have to find someone else, even if it means putting Polanco back in short for half a season with Arraez or Gordon playing second. I also agree with you and the Angels announcers on how sedentary the Twins look on the bases. No stolen bases and no even attempt to hit and run. We got to do something about that because with the change in base size next year and limits on throwing over its quite possible there's really be a lot more base stealing and a lot more running in general. I'm a little surprised that we aren't running guys like Jake Cave on those rare occasions he gets on base, but the real problem is outside of Gordon you just don't see anyone likely to be in the starting lineup next year that brings much speed other than Buxton. That is going to be a real problem if it is not addressed. We have spots open in the lineup is at least one corner outfield spot and backup CF (plays there 40-50% of the time). I've been advocating for really looking for impact bat in the off-season but maybe needs to be an impact bat with speed.

I agree. It's funny how we all thought the lineup would be a strength this year when the season started and it's turned out to be as big of an anchor as the bullpen. Injuries do have a lot to do with that but they aren't the only story. We just don't have the horses at depth and the front line hasn't improved. I wondered when Sanchez and Urshela were hitting 4 and 5 early in the season instead of 7 and 9 where they belong. It just didn't get any better and now is pretty awful. Realistically, next year's OF is Buxton, Gordon (unless we need him to play short), and …? Larnach maybe but the last 2 years don't provide much hope of consistency or health. Ditto for Kirilloff and I think it's a complete crapshoot whether he will ever play at a high level again after the invasive surgery. Kepler is a 4th OF/defensive specialist/8th place hitter on a good team. Wallner has had all of about 25 ABs at the MLB level so he's a complete unknown. Celestino would have to make a major leap to be more than a 5th OF/replacement CF. There is nobody else. I think a couple of hitters is just as critical for the 2023 team as a couple of bullpen pieces. I would love to see us get Andrew Benintendi to play LF and Josh Bell to be a 1B/DH. They could hit 4 and 5, move Miranda and Gordon back to 6 and 7, and strengthen the whole thing.

I know there has been some disparaging comments about Gordon's ability to play SS. Do we have any data that suggests he's be below average and/or less competent than Polanco? I htink we all agree that Correa returning is the preferred result but that chances of that happening are probably less than 50/50 and perhaps a lot less. He's played very well down the stretch and it seems like a Gold/Platinum Glove winning SS who is posting a .289/.336/.469 (.834) slash line is going to have a lot of options. Palacios can't hit, like not at all. I don't see him as even a short term answer. We've seen Polanco at SS and he's stretched at best. The minor league guys are a ways away and Lewis is a mid-season 2023 guy if we're lucky. I think Gordon makes sense IF he can even be average at SS. He's also position versatile so he can move when Lewis comes back IF Lewis is fit to play SS and doesn't have to move to 2B, LF or 3B after 2 torn ACLs. I'm not sure there are any other short term internal options other than Polanco The FA SS selection is a few high end, verrrrry expensive guys, and a lot of dreck.

I see your point and tend to agree. I do think that the FO did not do enough to address the bullpen this off season. I really wonder if that was the result of thinking that 2022 would be a development year not a contending year. The 2021 deadline and off season moves seemed to have 2023 more in mind than 2022. I do have more confidence that Mahle will be a valuable asset in 2023 and I think SWR may easily be part of the rotation by mid season. I hope the FO has learned its lesson and will be proactive this off season in shaping the bullpen and giving the lineup another bat or two. I think it's unlikely that we will be able to improve the rotation because there's not much out there and it will be badly over priced. I think we could be competitive next year with the rotation we have lined up IF we have a much better bullpen and a lineup capable of scoring more than 3 runs on occasion.

Thanks, Nick. I agree with your thesis. I do think there's room for optimism for the 2023 season IF we have better health but we can't simply stand pat. This was kind of a transition year – out with the old in Garver, Donaldson, Berrios, and Rogers and in with the new in Jeffers, Ryan, Miranda, Larnach and Kirilloff. Unfortunately, injuries really robbed us of development on some of these guys. The only players to really develop this year were Ryan, Miranda, and Gordon. Hopefully the performance of those three is sustainable but we won't know that until at least next season. The trades were a mixed bag but can't really be evaluated in full until next season since a big part of the trades for Lopez and Mahle in particular involved control at least through 2023 and perhaps beyond. I do think we have to continue the housecleaning a little bit for that improvement to really take root. Assumedly Sano is gone. I like Kepler in the field, but he simply cannot hit well enough to start on a contending MLB team. Banning the shift is not going to change that. He either needs to be the fourth outfielder or traded. I would choose the latter. The bullpen has to be cleaned out and improved with at least two quality free agent relievers. Those two can take the spots held this year by Pagan and either Megill or Moran. That assumes that Theilbar will still be effective at age 36. We also need a middle of the order bat to play either a corner OF spot, 1B, 3B. or C. There isn't a lot out there but someone like Josh Bell or Andrew Benintendi would help this team a lot. Bottom line is I don't think were too far away from a contending team but we can't simply sit down, hope for better health, and play the hand we have. I think this team still needs some augmentation in the bullpen and the lineup.

I agree in theory but not in practice. Aim higher for Castillo is a good take but what does that mean? What package gets you Castillo? Seattle sent 4 players to Cincinnati, including 3 of its top 5 prospects. Two of our top 5 were just drafted, Lee and Prielipp, so they are not tradable under MLB rules until next year. The other 3 are Royce Lewis, Emanuel Rodriguez and Matt Wallner. The next 5 are SWR, Rayes, Urbino, Canterino and Varland. You do have to add back in Steer, Hajjar and Encarnacion-Strand since one would assume we wouldn't go after Mahle if we got Castillo. Other than Lewis, none are as good as what Seattle traded. Why? because our real top prospects are in the majors or hurt - Miranda, Kirilloff, Larnach, and Celestino. So looking at this in a factual context, trading for Luis Castillo with basically 1.4 years left on his contract would likely have cost us some package that looked like Miranda or Lewis, or perhaps both, plus 1 or 2 of SWR, Rodriguez, Steer or Wallner, plus one or two from farther down the list but good like Encarnacion-Strand, Julien, Palacios, Varland, or Hajjar. Something like Miranda or Lewis plus SWR, Wallner and Steer or Encarnacion-Strand, That's what it would take to beat Seattle's offer and I'm not even sure that beat Seattle's offer. Is that a trade that you would make? I agree that we should aim high and trade for the best. I actually think the FO did as well as it could with the prospects we had to trade. Now that may be on the FO's drafting and development track record, although many of the AAA players are from the prior regime. Still, you can only trade for the level of quality that you're able to give up and frankly we did not have a lot of quality to trade with all the injuries to young players and stalls in development.