Rocco Baldelli and the Case of the Missing Lever

2 hours ago, Twins_Fan_in_NJ said:

Yeah, I'm incredibly disappointed in Correa and Buxton. Morneau hinted at it on Sunday - sometimes its up to the players to create energy and a positive attitude. Correa looks like he's checked out and Buxton just looks totally lost at the plate. If they were playing at even their career average, the Twins are probably hovering around .500 - which isn't great, but which isn't hopeless either.

Great comment by Morneau.  Boy do i miss having Justin and Joe in the lineup.  At least they could hit the ball.

19 minutes ago, Vanimal46 said:

I could see Correa lifting the NTC to join a contending team more than Buxton. I’ll take Buxton at his word that he wants to be a Twin for his whole career. Correa on the other hand was more than willing to leave in free agency until 2 failed physicals forced him back to the Twins. 

I could see that as well.  Correa has got to be frustrated with not only his own play but his teammates play as well as being frustrated with ownership and the lack of moves by the organization.  I would imagine he was sold a bill of goods that with his signing the Twins would be bringing in other talent to build around him and that clearly hasn't happened.  Sure he's getting paid a TON of money, but that only goes so far when it comes to professional happiness especially as an athlete where the bar to reach is competing for championships like he did with the Astros.  

I also believe Buxton wants to remain a Twin his entire career, but I'm not sure that's good for the organization.  Either way his NTC changes to a 5-team no trade clause in 2027.  If he's still playing like this at the conclusion of the 2026 season, the Twins may very well move him out. I mean he's only played an average of 81 games the last 9 seasons.  

3 hours ago, Woof Bronzer said:

The dude started a game as DESIGNATED HITTER.   Joke team.  

A professional joke team some would say , a laughing stock in MLB  ...

Starts with the owners , FO and down the chain to manager and coaches , it's a joke because all of them are unprofessionals  ...

Nothing has improved in years on defense and offense  , it just is getting worse ...

Pitching has improved greatly  , can't those in charge muti task and find a solution to what is wrong with defense and offense  ...

I guess not because  it has been a total system failure , and ownership isn't going to admit it , they would have or should have stated this after the first 10 games ...

Correa and Buxton.

Your star players need to be stars. It is debatable if either one is a star in the true sense of the word, but relative to this franchise and this roster, they're the Twins' best players. If they simply were at their respective career average performances, the Twins' outlook is a lot different. Everyone goes through slumps. But not only are they struggling on the field, there appears to be zero emotion or zero fight. Hard for the rank and file on this roster to not get caught in the wash when the supposed team leaders look like they checked out in spring training.

1 hour ago, Riverbrian said:

Do we have a development problem? Have we just plain failed to produce the number of pre-arb players that other organizations can produce? Have we just plain failed to produce a left handed hitting prospect who can hit left handed pitching? Other organizations are not having that problem? Or has this been just a horrible unnecessary bottle necking of our system for attempted short term gain that may or may not be a gain. 

If the Twins don't have a lever to pull right now. It's because they have built a farm system with 26, 27 and 28 year old levers dying on the vine. 

This nails it. I was hoping Mr Bonnes would make some more of these points in this article, but alas, I remembered he and most of the rest of the TD staff are adverse to actually critiquing the current FO/coaching staff.

1 hour ago, bean5302 said:

He wasn't forced back to the Twins. He rebuffed both SF and NY's attempts at additional negotiations and both SF and NY were on record as surprised/disappointed they weren't able to find a way to get him.

I agree Correa would be more likely to waive his NTC, and he's got more leverage to work out a deal to make it happen with all those vesting options. Buxton's NTC ends after next year so he might be willing to waive the NTC if the 5 team trade list provision got removed as well.

Unless he wanted less flexibility and $$, yeah, he kinda was forced back to the Twins. The additional negotiations with SF and NY came after failed physicals. I'm sure each club was disappointed (at least at the time) that they weren't able to sign him for few years and less money. 

4 hours ago, bean5302 said:

Both full NTC with limited trade value so it would certainly be a tough sell. Pablo Lopez is far more likely to be moved.

Fair pt...I completely forgot about that being in their contracts.  

1 hour ago, Jocko87 said:

I don't necessarily disagree with this premise but its not the driving fault right now.

What we are seeing is not a talent problem.  If the roster was performing to anything near career norms and playing this poorly, we can have that discussion.  Being at roughly 10% full strength for whatever reason overrides any roster construction nibbling.  There isn't a single dollar that could be spent that fixes whatever is wrong right now-it's mental, and maybe not organic.

One of my strongest held leadership tenets is that when we leave the room with a plan-we are all rowing the same direction, trying to make the plan work.  Especially the folks that advocated a different plan.  We can then adjust the plan based on accurate feedback.  If we don't try to execute to the plan, we don't know if the failure was the plan or the execution.

The beauty is, that if everyone is trying to execute the plan, every plan works. 

When you have what I believe we are seeing with the Twins-no plan works.  No roster construction matters. 

The lever Rocco needs is one he needs to create.  That's what leadership is.

Respectfully I believe it is a talent problem. I’m not buying that Rocco not being here magically fixes these guys and I don’t want Rocco or the FO around anymore. 

4 hours ago, Riverbrian said:

 

Do we have a development problem? Have we just plain failed to produce the number of pre-arb players that other organizations can produce? Have we just plain failed to produce a left handed hitting prospect who can hit left handed pitching? Other organizations are not having that problem? Or has this been just a horrible unnecessary bottle necking of our system for attempted short term gain that may or may not be a gain. 

If the Twins don't have a lever to pull right now. It's because they have built a farm system with 26, 27 and 28 year old levers dying on the vine. 

 

Loved your post, and want to highlight this section.

Yes, the Twins have a development problem.  They are producing some good pitchers, and I will give credit to the current regime for that. 

They are producing some hitters (maybe...I hope).  I mean, Wallner and Larnach and Jeffers are becoming semi-established if you only look at their bats.  Perhaps not stars, but adequate.  They need more.

But man, fundamentally sound play is apparently not being effectively taught in the minors.  The team doesn't run bases well, they don't field well, they make constant mental errors, and even the young players with speed and minimal power apparently never learned to bunt or hit against the shift.  We can complain (and I do) about Rocco not getting good fundamental play out of this current 25 man roster, but somehow these skills were never taught in the many years spent in the farm system.  You shouldn't have to learn these skills at the major league level... it should be innate knowledge by the time players are at AAA.  The coaching issues aren't just a Rocco problem or a MLB problem...it must start much lower in the farm system.

This could have been written about almost every manager in the league.

With the absurd number of pitchers held on active rosters now, there are precious few options when multiple veterans perform poorly. By default you‘re left with young optionable guys that were deemed unready when the season began.

Do other teams have more/better options in the minors? Some do…many don’t. Is the difference between the bottom of the Twins active roster and that of other teams humongous? In most instances it’s marginal, that’s why they aren’t regulars.

The one and only fix is to roster better veteran players before the season begins.

Meanwhile, Rocco can share at least a little of the blame for the regression in performance of multiple players.

1 hour ago, bean5302 said:

Correa didn't even take SF's calls after they balked at the physical despite SF wanting to work something out.

The Mets initially countered with 6yrs $157MM after the physical, but with options to reach the original $315MM based solely on physicals which is more than he could ultimately earn with the Twins. Correa refused to negotiate.

It's almost nonsensical to believe Correa couldn't have gotten something similar to the reduced Twins' offer from SF or NY had Correa been willing to negotiate after the physicals.

Correa was $35M mad at SF, or was that initial Mets offer he signed hours after SF balked the new top offer?

Yeah, so nearly $50M less than what the Twins were guaranteeing him over 6 years. The Mets deal required him to pass a physical each season after year 6 or the contract was voided. Zero chance he was getting anywhere close to $315M there. It was an inferior offer, hence he pivoted to MN. 

SF had a better deal on the table and Boras decided to just take a haircut? We know the Mets didn't match MN. 

4 hours ago, bean5302 said:

Exactly. There are a bunch of reasons to shut down SF/NY in those scenarios. My point is Correa could have chosen to move ahead with negotiations if he wanted to, and he could have gotten a contract at as good or better than what he wound up getting with the Twins. 

For example, the Twins initially offered Correa a fully guaranteed 10 year $285MM contract. The final negotiated deal was 6yrs $200MM guaranteed, 4yrs $80MM vesting (10yrs $280MM with vesting). The Twins' renegotiated offer didn't change much from the initial offer if vesting occurs.

Getting NY or SF to $200MM+ guaranteed (matching or beating the Twins) would not have been hard, but it would have set a bad precedent for players in general, and it would have required Correa to accept what he felt was pretty insulting conduct.

It was a massive departure from the original offer. All those vesting years are reliant on PAs surpassed and/or awards won in his mid 30s onward. Good luck. 

If either of those teams were (allegedly) intent on easily beating MN's offer, how is it also not a bad precedent for a player to spurn them? Negotiations get contentious all the time, look at arbitration, but players almost always end up signing where they'll get paid. Carlos Correa, Dior comments and all, and his famously ruthless agent were totally fine with (allegedly) leaving multiple offers better than MN's on the table? Also, he wasn't upset with the Twins and opted to sign their 2nd offer which objectively worse than the original? Occam's Razor here...

46 minutes ago, TheLeviathan said:

Fire the manager, don't fire the manager - it's irrelevant.  Managers mostly make Ty France level wages, that shows you the impact they make to the game.  Shake it up, do whatever makes you feel better from the couch - I'm going to focus on talent:

The idea that the Twins have blocked Larnach and Julien and Miranda and whomever else just doesn't pass the smell test.  Wallner?  100% yes....bad roster management.  Larnach was up getting plenty of run and managing a high of .231 and 8 hrs.  He just didn't deliver enough to stay in the lineup.  Eddie Julian can't field and last year his at-bats were nothing short of painful.  Miranda got a long run, hit like a beast, and then completely cratered.

The problem isn't opportunities....the problem is development.  We are not developing our hitters to handle the big league level with the bat or the glove.  Feel however you want about Rocco, but the fact he has to keep running out a lineup of stone-handed, plodding oafs in the field is not his fault.  The fact that these hitters - on their 81st hitting coach - can't hit isn't on Rocco.

This is pure organizational failure to develop every day players.  We aren't drafting athletes.  We're not training those we draft to master a position and field it well.  We aren't training them for the adjustments and challenges of the big leagues.  We're going on 5-7 years now without a true impact player being developed.

You want to point fingers - start there.

Talent acquisition needs to be part of the discussion. It's tough to mold what isn't there. 

Your points all still stand though.