Calling up Jackson to replace Martin?

[HarmonK03]

1 minute ago, chpettit19 said:

Just going to have to agree to disagree. There's 36 games left after tonight. You care far more about them using all 13 position player spots than I do. Larnach-Buxton-Keaschall needs to be their OF for every game against a righty between now and the day they either clinch a playoff birth or are mathematically eliminated. And with Gonzalez struggling in AAA, there really isn't a righty bat to pair with Larnach, so he should probably just start every game. No idea what the point of Roden in the OF today is.

And Bell should start every game at DH. 

Those 4 positions are locked in until somebody gets hurt. They're 4 of their best bats. A competitive team doesn't sit any of those guys during the last 36 games. We're just not going to agree on them using all 13 spots during the last 36 games. Play your best 9 each and every game until you're either in or out of the playoffs. 

DH- Bell
C- Jeffers
1B- Lewis
2B- Clemens
3B- Lee
SS- Culpepper (unless he struggles for a stretch with the bat and then put the better defender at SS)
LF- Larnach
CF- Buxton
RF- Keaschall

Every. Day. Caratini can catcher every 4th or 5th game. Or Jackson. I don't really care. But Kreidler, Roden, Jenkins, Emma, GG, Ross, Wallner, or anyone else people have mentioned on any of these threads have no reason to step on the field for more than an 8th or 9th inning pinch running situation for Bell or Jeffers. Or maybe Larnach. And as we've discussed before, Jackson is actually just as fast as just about anybody they'd use in just a pinch running role.

I simply do not care about having the 13th guy play any kind of meaningful role on this team with the current situation. We aren't talking 162 games anymore. It's no longer a marathon. It's a sprint. There's no more rest days. There's no sitting your best players once a week just so you can put a rookie in the lineup. It's your best 9 every day and see where you go. Jenkins plays the wrong position to get himself in that "best 9" scenario. He's waiting for an injury to Larnach, Buxton, Keaschall, or Bell. It's his only path to the majors before the minor league season ends.

You really believe they will play their best 9 every day because I don't.  This offense has done nothing for the past month plus, so what you call the best 9 is not getting the job done.  Larnach and Clemens both need to get going to play every day.  Clemens has started to hit the last two games, so maybe he is breaking out.  

[HarmonK03]

3 hours ago, LA Vikes Fan said:

Guys, I think the reason for this is pretty obvious. The Front Office believes that Alan Roden is the best choice to get additional ABs over the next two weeks until September 1, or maybe even for the rest of the season, as compared to Jenkins or Rodriguez. I suspect there is more than just baseball potential in the decision matrix with Rodriguez just getting back from 100 days on the IL and Jenkins not yet on the 40 man. Still, we may be overthinking this.

To be fair, Roden is actually coming on a little. His overall line isn't good at .236/.323/.291 (.614). Still, in the last 15 to games where he had 34 at-bats, the line improves to .265/.350/.353 (.703), which is not too bad, and in the last 7 games were he had 16 ABs, it's .313/.400/.500 (.900), which is an incredibly small sample size but is pretty damn good. He also has an 8:9 at BB:SO ratio, also pretty damn good, so he's not a strikeout machine like Kyler Fedko was. Calling Jackson back also allows Shelton to keep Jeffers in the batting order as either a DH or 1B when Caratini catches every third day. It's not hard to see the baseball justification if you believe that Roden is as ready as or more ready to get a full MLB tryout than Jenkins or Emma. That's a case you can actually make.

I can see them having a conversation where someone said something like "Let's give these additional at-bats to Roden so we can really see what we have. We can always call up Rodrigues on September 1 get his feet wet and evaluate his MLB readiness since he is out of options next year. We can evaluate Jenkins in spring training, if there is a spring training. That also leaves open the option of starting Jenkins at AAA if there is a strike or lockout." Look, this is not what I would do. I would call him Jenkins and play him every day. I'm much less enamored of Emma than some of you guys are but he can come up September 1. Like I said, this is not what I would do but I do think it's defensible.

This team seems to have no faith in their player development, especially on the position player side. Even trading for Outman and Roden last year didn't make a lot of sense when reasonably at that time ERod and Jenkins were reasonably knocking on the door to come up some time in 2026.  And ERod should have started the year in Minneapolis.  It is just truly baffling how they won't trust these guys and put a journeyman instead on the roster.  This includes playing Gray over Culpepper before he was hurt.

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

11 minutes ago, mrmpls said:

 Tom had a vision for this season --   needs a new eye dr.

You obviously haven’t been following the. Tom has been consistent since January. 

[chpettit19]

1 minute ago, HarmonK03 said:

You really believe they will play their best 9 every day because I don't.  This offense has done nothing for the past month plus, so what you call the best 9 is not getting the job done.  Larnach and Clemens both need to get going to play every day.  Clemens has started to hit the last two games, so maybe he is breaking out.  

Isn't your entire complaint that they don't use all their roster spots? That they're "wasting" roster spots by having guys they don't play? I don't follow the logic of then arguing that they're going to play everyone. They've been playing 11.5 guys for most of the recent games. Martin was platooning with Larnach, Caratini is getting 1B (no idea why) and C time, and Kreidler has turned into a utility guy. Roden hasn't been playing much, and as you've been raging against for weeks, Jackson essentially never plays. And you've also been raging about the idea of Roden ever playing for weeks. They haven't been playing. When it comes to the spots that affect Jenkins, the Twins have been playing 5 guys. It's been the LF platoon, Buxton in CF, Keaschall in RF, and Bell at DH. 

Larnach has a 121 OPS+. I'm sorry, but I'm not sitting him for a rookie who's never seen an MLB pitch.

[mnfireman]

1 hour ago, mrmpls said:

Coached young kids for 30+ years ,    cant compare  and when i did and a Parent complained i would tell them where Practice was and time ,  and that would shut em up !!!

Never asked a parent to help coach, normally sent kids home if their parent showed up. Seemed o work well for me...

[mrmpls]

2 minutes ago, Hawkeye Bean Counter said:

You obviously haven’t been following the. Tom has been consistent since January. 

Saying what people wanna hear and striking when the iron is hot are not the same ,  your a Pohlad fan good for you , Bad for Minnesota  Twins will never win till they sell 100% ownership

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

1 minute ago, mrmpls said:

Saying what people wanna hear and striking when the iron is hot are not the same ,  your a Pohlad fan good for you , Bad for Minnesota  Twins will never win till they sell 100% ownership

You obviously haven’t been paying attention to what I have said. 

[mnfireman]

3 hours ago, Mike Sixel said:

Not even close to the same thing. Seriously. 

Seriously, yes this is the same yapping I would hear from parents concerning 9 year old playing time. 

[mrmpls]

5 minutes ago, mnfireman said:

Never asked a parent to help coach, normally sent kids home if their parent showed up. Seemed o work well for me...

They would usually get embarrassed and that would be the end of it ,  had alot of parents thank me for doing that way , couple did show up and i always respected them for the help !  

[mrmpls]

5 minutes ago, Hawkeye Bean Counter said:

You obviously haven’t been paying attention to what I have said. 

Because you say zip,  go argue with a  Mirror , its your best chance

[mrmpls]

4 hours ago, HarmonK03 said:

Should call up Diaw from Wichita, you want to be prepared in case all three catchers get injured in the same game, you need another one to come in.

and he   plays Centerfield

[mnfireman]

3 minutes ago, mrmpls said:

They would usually get embarrassed and that would be the end of it ,  had alot of parents thank me for doing that way , couple did show up and i always respected them for the help !  

My experience was that the only parents that wanted to "help" were there for their kids and their kids alone. I would end practice if one of the kids parents showed up before the communicated end of practice. The kids figured it out and told their parents to not show up until practice was over. This forum seems to have a lot of those "helpful" parents on it...

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

1 hour ago, mrmpls said:

Because you say zip,  go argue with a  Mirror , its your best chance

Show me where I have been a supporter of the Pohlads or Tom- stating you have to listen to what he says does not constitute support.  

[mrmpls]

1 minute ago, Hawkeye Bean Counter said:

Show me where I have been a supporter of the Pohlads or Tom- stating you have to listen to what he says does not constitute support.  

i have listened to everything Tom Pohlad has said - mainly trying to make up for the failures previous years , he has to say those things ,  You mentioned his vision  so i make a eye dr joke , -- Dont be so serious young man !!      later

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

1 hour ago, mrmpls said:

Because you say zip,  go argue with a  Mirror , its your best chance

 

6 minutes ago, mrmpls said:

i have listened to everything Tom Pohlad has said - mainly trying to make up for the failures previous years , he has to say those things ,  You mentioned his vision  so i make a eye dr joke , -- Dont be so serious young man !!      later

I didn’t catch your joke, it appeared to be a rebuke.  

[mrmpls]

28 minutes ago, Hawkeye Bean Counter said:

 

I didn’t catch your joke, it appeared to be a rebuke.  

 You mentioned his vision    ==eye dr

[Riverbrian]

10 hours ago, chpettit19 said:

Isn't your entire complaint that they don't use all their roster spots? That they're "wasting" roster spots by having guys they don't play? I don't follow the logic of then arguing that they're going to play everyone. They've been playing 11.5 guys for most of the recent games. Martin was platooning with Larnach, Caratini is getting 1B (no idea why) and C time, and Kreidler has turned into a utility guy. Roden hasn't been playing much, and as you've been raging against for weeks, Jackson essentially never plays. And you've also been raging about the idea of Roden ever playing for weeks. They haven't been playing. When it comes to the spots that affect Jenkins, the Twins have been playing 5 guys. It's been the LF platoon, Buxton in CF, Keaschall in RF, and Bell at DH. 

Larnach has a 121 OPS+. I'm sorry, but I'm not sitting him for a rookie who's never seen an MLB pitch.

I've been a utilize all 13 guys guy for quite some time. Still am... Probably will always be. 

I do agree that as the season starts to enter a stretch run you should be able to label your key guys to over utilize for that stretch run.

The thing is... I'm not so sure that we have identified those guys. Still got a lot of average on our roster claiming the playing time. 

I also agree that this may not be the time to force a Jenkins call up. but I do recognize that a Evan Carter type spark is also possible from a Jenkins or an Erod.  

[chpettit19]

56 minutes ago, Riverbrian said:

I've been a utilize all 13 guys guy for quite some time. Still am... Probably will always be. 

I do agree that as the season starts to enter a stretch run you should be able to label your key guys to over utilize for that stretch run.

The thing is... I'm not so sure that we have identified those guys. Still got a lot of average on our roster claiming the playing time. 

I also agree that this may not be the time to force a Jenkins call up. but I do recognize that a Evan Carter type spark is also possible from a Jenkins or an Erod.  

You don't think the OF/DH spots have had their guys identified? Larnach and his 121 OPS+ hasn't claimed a spot? Buxton is the best player on the team, I assume we're all on board that he has CF when he's healthy. You don't think Keaschall and his .819 OPS since May 1 has claimed a spot? I guess you could argue Bell at DH, but he has a .982 OPS in August.

If those guys haven't claimed spots, I don't know that it's possible to claim spots.

Culpepper could've provided a "spark." I'm all for trying young guys and seeing what they can do earlier in the season. But the Twins have decided they're going to try to back into the playoffs with a sub-.500 record. Larnach, Buxton, Keaschall, and Bell aren't getting benched with the hope of Jenkins or Emma being immediate successes. And they shouldn't be. Those 4 guys have claimed everyday roles. Either that, or you don't believe in the ability to claim an everyday role. Which is fine, but completely different than not having identified the OF and DH guys on this team.

[Riverbrian]

1 hour ago, chpettit19 said:

You don't think the OF/DH spots have had their guys identified? Larnach and his 121 OPS+ hasn't claimed a spot? Buxton is the best player on the team, I assume we're all on board that he has CF when he's healthy. You don't think Keaschall and his .819 OPS since May 1 has claimed a spot? I guess you could argue Bell at DH, but he has a .982 OPS in August.

If those guys haven't claimed spots, I don't know that it's possible to claim spots.

Culpepper could've provided a "spark." I'm all for trying young guys and seeing what they can do earlier in the season. But the Twins have decided they're going to try to back into the playoffs with a sub-.500 record. Larnach, Buxton, Keaschall, and Bell aren't getting benched with the hope of Jenkins or Emma being immediate successes. And they shouldn't be. Those 4 guys have claimed everyday roles. Either that, or you don't believe in the ability to claim an everyday role. Which is fine, but completely different than not having identified the OF and DH guys on this team.

I don't and there are two primary reasons. 

1. Injuries are going to occur. You and I both know that. We don't know who will get hurt but I assume that both of us... if forced to bet... would take the over on zero injuries occurring between now and the end of September. You don't put Roden on ice so you can everyday 3 just to have 1 or 2 of those 3 break a bone for the final week of the season when we are 1 game out of the playoffs heading into San Francisco for the final 6 games of the year... not to mention the playoffs if we survive it all. We also still don't know if we want Roden to be that guy if/when that scenario occurs and it probably will occur. Is Buxton hurt right now?  

2. Hot Streaks become Cold streaks and Cold Streaks become hot streaks. Locking now? Don't get me wrong based on recent hotness and coldness. I'd like to see Lewis, Keaschall and Bell in the lineup almost every day at the moment because they seem to seeing the ball real good. Larnach, Clemens, Caratini and Kriedler not so much. I'll leave Buxton out of that group although he hasn't been good of late... But I ask again... Is he hurt right now? I don't know if he is or isn't and I'll also ask could these 7 players reverse? Yes they can... maybe they won't? Some may some may not but yes they can.

I think they need to ride the hot hands when hot but it's too soon to say Eureka and lock into something that may not be there on September 20th. 

 

[chpettit19]

5 minutes ago, Riverbrian said:

I don't and there are two primary reasons. 

1. Injuries are going to occur. You and I both know that. We don't know who will get hurt but I assume that both of us... if forced to bet... would take the over on zero injuries occurring between now and the end of September. You don't put Roden on ice so you can everyday 3 just to have 1 or 2 of those 3 break a bone for the final week of the season when we are 1 game out of the playoffs heading into San Francisco for the final 6 games of the year... not to mention the playoffs if we survive it all. We also still don't know if we want Roden to be that guy if/when that scenario occurs and it probably will occur. Is Buxton hurt right now?  

2. Hot Streaks become Cold streaks and Cold Streaks become hot streaks. Locking now? Don't get me wrong based on recent hotness and coldness. I'd like to see Lewis, Keaschall and Bell in the lineup almost every day at the moment because they seem to seeing the ball real good. Larnach, Clemens, Caratini and Kriedler not so much. I'll leave Buxton out of that group although he hasn't been good of late... But I ask again... Is he hurt right now? I don't know if he is or isn't and I'll also ask could these 7 players reverse? Yes they can... maybe they won't? Some may some may not but yes they can.

I think they need to ride the hot hands when hot but it's too soon to say Eureka and lock into something that may not be there on September 20th. 

 

Sorry, at this point of the season (very important in this discussion) I just don't believe in forcing lesser players into the lineup just to keep them fresh in case somebody else gets hurt. Over the course of 162? Yes, you need to consider those kinds of things. But the marathon is coming to an end. If you're trying to win the race you just put your head down and go. If you pull a hammy 10 feet from the finish line, so be it. You're fighting half a dozen teams for 1 spot. If Larnach blows a tire on September 20th, so be it. Roden, or Jenkins, or whoever needs to perform. Or somebody needs to step up and perform better to make up for the rust on Roden. I'm not going to play lesser players now just in case I'm forced to play them in the future. You may not be 1 game out as you head into San Francisco because you're forcing lesser players into the lineup now just in case you are forced to play them then.

If Buxton is hurt then he should be on the IL. But he's played CF every game since he's been off the IL, so he can't be that hurt. Nobody is 100% at this point of the season. If he's not hurt, then you put your best player on the field every day while you're trying to make the playoffs.

What determines a "hot hand?" What's the sample size? 1 game? 5 games? 20 games? A week? 2 weeks? A month? That's much easier said than done. Especially when there's 36 games left in the season. Trying to guess the hot streaks for the last 36 games is a losing proposition. If Larnach slumps the rest of the year, so be it. He got you here. The odds of him going on a hot streak are significantly higher than Roden going on one. 

Jenkins or Emma not being called up instead of Jackson is what got this thread going. Jenkins isn't "on ice" in St Paul. Neither is Emma. I'd guess there aren't a whole lot of people who think Roden is a better baseball player, and preferred injury replacement for an everyday OF/DH, than Jenkins right now. The shocking move would be if an everyday OF/DH goes on the IL and Jenkins isn't the call then. I have absolutely no fear of Roden being on ice because the odds of him being their only option between now and San Francisco are miniscule. Jenkins, Emma, Wallner, Martin coming back, Gonzalez, Mendez, Kreidler to 2B and Clemens to the OF with Gray being the callup. Lots of options beyond just Roden. And most of those other options are going to be playing between now and September 20.

But, to me, it's August 18th, not April 18th. They're .5 games out of the wild card because nobody will just put the rest of the bad teams to bed and take that last spot. There are 7 teams fighting for that last spot. I'm not putting a lesser player on the field just so they can stay only 20% worse instead of being 30% worse. Here's my best 9 every day. The only consideration I have from now until the playoff field is decided is who my best 9 guys are on any given day. And right now, Larnach, Buxton, Keaschall across the outfield and Bell at DH have earned the very clear distinction of being their best guys.

[jaimedude]

I would have liked to have seen Mendez get a shot to see if his bat plays at the major league level. 

Does Jackson have any outfield experience? He is not exactly a blazer to be a pinch runner. 

[MMBoys93]

Sabato against lefties would just make most logical sense. 1.300+ ops against them in AAA. The defense won’t be that much worse compared to Caratini at 1B (but it will be bad)

Jackson back up to play the role of team manager just doesn’t make sense 

[Riverbrian]

12 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

Sorry, at this point of the season (very important in this discussion) I just don't believe in forcing lesser players into the lineup just to keep them fresh in case somebody else gets hurt. Over the course of 162? Yes, you need to consider those kinds of things. But the marathon is coming to an end. If you're trying to win the race you just put your head down and go. If you pull a hammy 10 feet from the finish line, so be it. You're fighting half a dozen teams for 1 spot. If Larnach blows a tire on September 20th, so be it. Roden, or Jenkins, or whoever needs to perform. Or somebody needs to step up and perform better to make up for the rust on Roden. I'm not going to play lesser players now just in case I'm forced to play them in the future. You may not be 1 game out as you head into San Francisco because you're forcing lesser players into the lineup now just in case you are forced to play them then.

If Buxton is hurt then he should be on the IL. But he's played CF every game since he's been off the IL, so he can't be that hurt. Nobody is 100% at this point of the season. If he's not hurt, then you put your best player on the field every day while you're trying to make the playoffs.

What determines a "hot hand?" What's the sample size? 1 game? 5 games? 20 games? A week? 2 weeks? A month? That's much easier said than done. Especially when there's 36 games left in the season. Trying to guess the hot streaks for the last 36 games is a losing proposition. If Larnach slumps the rest of the year, so be it. He got you here. The odds of him going on a hot streak are significantly higher than Roden going on one. 

Jenkins or Emma not being called up instead of Jackson is what got this thread going. Jenkins isn't "on ice" in St Paul. Neither is Emma. I'd guess there aren't a whole lot of people who think Roden is a better baseball player, and preferred injury replacement for an everyday OF/DH, than Jenkins right now. The shocking move would be if an everyday OF/DH goes on the IL and Jenkins isn't the call then. I have absolutely no fear of Roden being on ice because the odds of him being their only option between now and San Francisco are miniscule. Jenkins, Emma, Wallner, Martin coming back, Gonzalez, Mendez, Kreidler to 2B and Clemens to the OF with Gray being the callup. Lots of options beyond just Roden. And most of those other options are going to be playing between now and September 20.

But, to me, it's August 18th, not April 18th. They're .5 games out of the wild card because nobody will just put the rest of the bad teams to bed and take that last spot. There are 7 teams fighting for that last spot. I'm not putting a lesser player on the field just so they can stay only 20% worse instead of being 30% worse. Here's my best 9 every day. The only consideration I have from now until the playoff field is decided is who my best 9 guys are on any given day. And right now, Larnach, Buxton, Keaschall across the outfield and Bell at DH have earned the very clear distinction of being their best guys.

It seems that we are far off... but I don't think we are far off. 

Like I said earlier. I agree we are hitting the stretch run and it's OK to start whittling down a bit but I do question if we have indeed found the 9 guys.

I openly question exactly who are the lesser players and that includes Roden. I don't assume that Jenkins or Erod or Wallner is going to be another level above Roden no matter how many articles say he's not and neither of those 3 matter much if the OF is locked for the stretch run anyway.   

Roden doesn't look lost to me no matter what his small sample surface stats are saying. He looks like a player that isn't chasing and making contact. If he starts tonight and goes 3 for 3 his surface stats are going to look real nice. Roden should be allowed the opportunity to get hot just like Lewis was allowed to and Keaschall was allowed to.   

 

[MeleMouth]

3 hours ago, Riverbrian said:

I've been a utilize all 13 guys guy for quite some time. Still am... Probably will always be. 

I do agree that as the season starts to enter a stretch run you should be able to label your key guys to over utilize for that stretch run.

The thing is... I'm not so sure that we have identified those guys. Still got a lot of average on our roster claiming the playing time. 

I also agree that this may not be the time to force a Jenkins call up. but I do recognize that a Evan Carter type spark is also possible from a Jenkins or an Erod.  

Jenkins has been a slow starter at every level and seems to be in the process of locking in changes to hit with more power made at or around the time of the Futures Game. He should stay at AAA instead of risking with his development on three long-shot chances all hitting: (1) his making an instant impact, (2) it mattering for a team whose playoff odds are overrated, and (3) even if they make the playoffs, their odds of doing anything better than getting swept in Round 1 are quite low. 

An Evan Carter type spark is much more rare than a rookie coming up and struggling.

[chpettit19]

8 minutes ago, Riverbrian said:

It seems that we are far off... but I don't think we are far off. 

Like I said earlier. I agree we are hitting the stretch run and it's OK to start whittling down a bit but I do question if we have indeed found the 9 guys.

I openly question exactly who are the lesser players and that includes Roden. I don't assume that Jenkins or Erod or Wallner is going to be another level above Roden no matter how many articles say he's not and neither of those 3 matter much if the OF is locked for the stretch run anyway.   

Roden doesn't look lost to me no matter what his small sample surface stats are saying. He looks like a player that isn't chasing and making contact. If he starts tonight and goes 3 for 3 his surface stats are going to look real nice. Roden should be allowed the opportunity to get hot just like Lewis was allowed to and Keaschall was allowed to.   

 

I don't get how Buxton, Larnach, Keaschall, and Bell haven't clearly separated themselves as the best players and worthy of everyday play. That's what this thread is about. A catcher coming up for an injured OF instead of Jenkins or Emma. 

The point about Roden wasn't that he's clearly worse than those other non-Buxton, Larnach, Keaschall, or Bell options, it's that I don't care if he's been on ice because there are going to be multiple other options that haven't been on ice and they're all in the same "unproven, hope they're good" box. I don't care about giving ABs to Roden now to see if he may be good if they're forced to play him later. If he's forced on the field for injury reasons later, he's going to have to figure it out. Hope he's been taking lots of BP.

The Twins have their 3 OFers and DH. If a 121 OPS+ over 371 PAs doesn't earn you the status of being an everyday player, then there's no such thing. Lewis and Keaschall didn't require sitting your best player, a guy with a 121 OPS+ in 371 PAs, or a guy with an .819 OPS since May first. And definitely didn't require sitting those guys while .5 games back in the wild card race with 36 games to go.

The Twins 4 best hitters with at least 300 PAs this year are Byron Buxton, Trevor Larnach, Luke Keaschall, and Josh Bell. The only guy who jumps in there if we lower the PA threshold is Jeffers. I think we are miles off if your suggestion is sitting any of them during the final push for a playoff spot in order to see what Roden has and/or so he isn't cold in case one of them gets hurt later. If it was April, I'm all for it. But it's not. There's not 136 games left, there's 36. Yes, an injury likely will happen, but it may not be an OFer or DH. And then you've just lessened your lineup numerous times while chasing a playoff spot for no reason at all.

Larnach has 4 hits in his last 3 games. Is his cold streak over? How much opportunity does Roden get to "get hot" at the expense of one of your 4 best non-catcher hitters? How do we know if he's hot? Does he have to play multiple games in a row or is it 3 random games a week or what? I think "get hot" is a lot easier of a concept on paper than in the real world. Especially with 36 games left.

[Riverbrian]

17 minutes ago, MeleMouth said:

Jenkins has been a slow starter at every level and seems to be in the process of locking in changes to hit with more power made at or around the time of the Futures Game. He should stay at AAA instead of risking with his development on three long-shot chances all hitting: (1) his making an instant impact, (2) it mattering for a team whose playoff odds are overrated, and (3) even if they make the playoffs, their odds of doing anything better than getting swept in Round 1 are quite low. 

An Evan Carter type spark is much more rare than a rookie coming up and struggling.

Playoff odds are subjective. They very from individual. I've never looked at playoff odds and given them strong consideration. The playoffs are just plain hard no matter how you slice it or how loaded your team is. 

Get in and play and whatever happens happens. 

We always tend to justify our opinions in the end anyway. The Brewers get knocked out and many will say... see told you they were not a playoff team. The D-Backs will reach the finals and many will say. That's the exception not the rule. We've seen the #1 seed get knocked out in 3. 12 teams get in. 1 gets out alive. Who wins it? We will have to find out but we've seen 6 seeds go far in baseball just like we've seen it in Hockey and all sports for that matter. We've seen Kershaw suck in the playoffs and David Freese and David Eckstein become the heroes.  It can't be predicted.  

Evan Carter sparks happen quite frequently. I spend a lot of time looking at all 30 teams. There are quite a few young sparks happening right now. Benge is starting to become something. Bolte is looking good. Cole Carrigg looks like he could join other young Rockies into the future. Who is Esmerlyn Valdez? Who is Waldschmidt? Pedro Ramirez? Crawford is starting to get it done in Philly. Mesa in TB who is that guy? Who names their Kid Abimelic... I don't know but he's had an impressive debut to his career. Lombard is being counted on at Yankee stadium. Cleveland is going after it with Genoa bouncing around the infield and playing where he is needed and playing well. McAdoo in Toronto! I though he played Basketball. Joshua Baez made the newspaper with a 1 game debut spark and who knows how the next two months go. The Red Sox got real hot and it was Monasterio holding down the fort at SS in Boston during that winning streak.  

Evan Carter since has become a question mark but most recently we saw Julien and Wallner provide a much needed spark in 2023. Not useful now but incredibly useful at the moment back in 2023. 

In regards to Jenkins... I don't know. He could be the Evan Carter type spark. I'm not knocking him but I'm more of pecking order guy. I'd rather they work with players already on the 40 man then leap frog Jenkins to start his clock early but I will give him the benefit of the doubt and believe he could be a spark.    

[ashbury]

Has it been overlooked in all this discussion, the inference that Austin Martin must have been designated as their emergency catcher, so when he went down with injury it was necessary to bring Jackson back up?  🙃

[Riverbrian]

2 hours ago, chpettit19 said:

I don't get how Buxton, Larnach, Keaschall, and Bell haven't clearly separated themselves as the best players and worthy of everyday play. That's what this thread is about. A catcher coming up for an injured OF instead of Jenkins or Emma. 

The point about Roden wasn't that he's clearly worse than those other non-Buxton, Larnach, Keaschall, or Bell options, it's that I don't care if he's been on ice because there are going to be multiple other options that haven't been on ice and they're all in the same "unproven, hope they're good" box. I don't care about giving ABs to Roden now to see if he may be good if they're forced to play him later. If he's forced on the field for injury reasons later, he's going to have to figure it out. Hope he's been taking lots of BP.

The Twins have their 3 OFers and DH. If a 121 OPS+ over 371 PAs doesn't earn you the status of being an everyday player, then there's no such thing. Lewis and Keaschall didn't require sitting your best player, a guy with a 121 OPS+ in 371 PAs, or a guy with an .819 OPS since May first. And definitely didn't require sitting those guys while .5 games back in the wild card race with 36 games to go.

The Twins 4 best hitters with at least 300 PAs this year are Byron Buxton, Trevor Larnach, Luke Keaschall, and Josh Bell. The only guy who jumps in there if we lower the PA threshold is Jeffers. I think we are miles off if your suggestion is sitting any of them during the final push for a playoff spot in order to see what Roden has and/or so he isn't cold in case one of them gets hurt later. If it was April, I'm all for it. But it's not. There's not 136 games left, there's 36. Yes, an injury likely will happen, but it may not be an OFer or DH. And then you've just lessened your lineup numerous times while chasing a playoff spot for no reason at all.

Larnach has 4 hits in his last 3 games. Is his cold streak over? How much opportunity does Roden get to "get hot" at the expense of one of your 4 best non-catcher hitters? How do we know if he's hot? Does he have to play multiple games in a row or is it 3 random games a week or what? I think "get hot" is a lot easier of a concept on paper than in the real world. Especially with 36 games left.

I hope you know that I respect you... always have. You are a sharp poster and always have been so please excuse me if I ask that we try not to make our points on the extreme edges. I've never known you to do that. 

If we are going to have this discussion on the extremes ignoring the miles of nuance in between... I'd say something like OK... Got it... Set it and Forget it... There is no need for Shelton to have daily meetings to put together a lineup. It's done we got our guys they can all walk past the lineup card now without checking. No need for further adjustment.

But... I'm not going to do that because I don't think that is what you are saying but these discussions will go off the rails when the extremes are thrown out to counter points. 

I get the nuance in regards to hot and cold streaks. Yes... if you could time them, you'd be a very successful manager much like an investor would be rich if he could time the market. It's hard because a hot streak can turn into cold on a dime... but I know you know what a hot streak is and what a cold streak is so please don't ask me if Trevor Larnach is out of his cold streak because of 4 hits in 3 games. At that point the discussion is no longer honest and it becomes pointless real fast. 

wOBA is your preferred stat and you are using 300 PA's as a qualifier.  That's fine and yes in that regard... You can add Royce and Kody because they are also above league average and just mere points behind Bell. If you include Jeffers who is just 45 PA's short. That's 7 players above league average. And that leaves us with Lee a little below and whoever is going to end up playing SS. Overall it's pretty impressive that we have 7 players above average and that's a good thing and perhaps it's why we are still in this thing with our pitching being questionable.

However... here's the problem. We have a total of 9 players who reached 300 PA's... 10 if you make the number 255 to include the top Dog Jeffers. Lee Martin and Caratini are the other 3 that have surpassed 255 PA's but are below league average wOBA.

Sure looks like we settled on a lineup 300 PA's ago. Players need to continue the journey toward 300. 

I'm not ready to declare anything yet. This lineup is too average to settle in my opinion. 

And I hope you know that I spent the off-season fiercely defending Larnach against what seemed like the majority of this community and I still do. I'm certainly not going to turn on him now when he has been a major contributor to this contending team. He's cooled down... He can certainly heat up again... even with 36 games remaining. 

[HarmonK03]

I posted immediately after this news and 24 hours I am even more frustrated.  I have yet to see a rational argument for this move in any article about this or the comments.  You can debate about who to call up, but at a minimum it should have been a outfielder.  I like Larnach and he has had a good season, but is he really untouchable to sit a day or two.  The same for Bell, he has been league average all year, now he is on a hot streak, ride it while you can, but I am not sure he can't sit either.  

This team is 4 games below .500, the longest winning streak is 4 games and losing streak is 5 games this season.  I understand the argument that you are going to ride the same players but why not try and give them a boost.  Be honest and objective is this team capable of a 10 game winning streak, maybe if everything goes right, but why not try and provide a boost.  Also having an outfielder you could stop playing Kreidler and Clemens in the outfield, they are not outfielders.  Their athleticism will help them run down flyballs the same as Keaschall but they have to make other plays.

But to call up somebody to just sit, at least call up Sabato to play against lefties or Wallner to pinch hit late in games, at least there would be a reason for them to sit on the bench because there is none for Jackson. 

[Riverbrian]

21 minutes ago, HarmonK03 said:

I posted immediately after this news and 24 hours I am even more frustrated.  I have yet to see a rational argument for this move in any article about this or the comments.  You can debate about who to call up, but at a minimum it should have been a outfielder.  I like Larnach and he has had a good season, but is he really untouchable to sit a day or two.  The same for Bell, he has been league average all year, now he is on a hot streak, ride it while you can, but I am not sure he can't sit either.  

This team is 4 games below .500, the longest winning streak is 4 games and losing streak is 5 games this season.  I understand the argument that you are going to ride the same players but why not try and give them a boost.  Be honest and objective is this team capable of a 10 game winning streak, maybe if everything goes right, but why not try and provide a boost.  Also having an outfielder you could stop playing Kreidler and Clemens in the outfield, they are not outfielders.  Their athleticism will help them run down flyballs the same as Keaschall but they have to make other plays.

But to call up somebody to just sit, at least call up Sabato to play against lefties or Wallner to pinch hit late in games, at least there would be a reason for them to sit on the bench because there is none for Jackson. 

My guess is that Jackson was the choice because they are (like Chia Pet and I have been discussing) going to reduce the utilization going forward and go with the guys who have gotten them there. 

Therefore turning the 13th spot into a very specific role. IE Pinch Runner for Jeffers or Caratini when they reach base in the 8th inning. I also think that 4 lefty relievers in the Braves and Padres bullpen is a factor even though Jackson's small sample success has come against right handers. I also think it's possible that they don't feel that the other outfield options are ready yet or it's also possible that they don't see a left handed Wallner or Jenkins as a adequate replacement for a right handed Martin in how the team is constructed. 

I can squint and justify it... but I still don't like it.  

My personal choice would have been Wallner but that would have just started the Wallner attackers to attack. I'd like to see if he still has a .894 OPS stretch in there somewhere. It kept us a float in 2023.