Roster Utilization Thread

[stringer bell]

2 hours ago, Riverbrian said:

The other thing that you brought up that bugs me and bugs me more than the catcher playing time split. As you mention... No Depth. Injuries will come and when they do... players with OPS under .509 will see a playing time increase. Spots 12 and 13 on the 26 man roster are not trusted to play and this leads to the cementing of average. Ty France has been fine... he's been close to average... he's had some key hits for us. But cementing of average with no one to push Ty France, means that he is playing every day out of necessity. That's a problem. Nobody to push Ty France for playing time is a problem. Ty France being basically not replaceable in the daily lineup is a problem.  

Yes... the team has been average offensively over the course of this season. Average isn't bad but it also isn't good. Average is fine if your pitching is above average... If your pitching stumbles... you'll need that average offense to step up to cover. Offensively we trying to land a muskie with 5 pound test fishing line. There is a good chance that it will snap. This team will have to keep focusing on panfish to sneak into a playoff spot.      

I'm in agreement that the current roster provides for a narrow window for them to be good. Having three players among the lower 5% in OPS as alternatives for slumping or injured players is short sighted. Those guys will play, and in Vázquez' case, play a lot. 

Jonah Bride shouldn't be on this team, particularly in the role he has--platoon player--in light of his less than stellar track record and in that track record he has severe reverse splits. Playing him only where he has had less success is just wrong. I believe Bride has sat against a lefty or two, with one of Larnach or Wallner in the lineup. That makes sense to me, but then what is Bride on the roster for?

[Riverbrian]

34 minutes ago, stringer bell said:

I'm in agreement that the current roster provides for a narrow window for them to be good. Having three players among the lower 5% in OPS as alternatives for slumping or injured players is short sighted. Those guys will play, and in Vázquez' case, play a lot. 

Jonah Bride shouldn't be on this team, particularly in the role he has--platoon player--in light of his less than stellar track record and in that track record he has severe reverse splits. Playing him only where he has had less success is just wrong. I believe Bride has sat against a lefty or two, with one of Larnach or Wallner in the lineup. That makes sense to me, but then what is Bride on the roster for?

Agreed 100%

Bride presence on the roster doesn't improve the team and it further weakens development by taking a developing left hander out against left handers. Not good for now, even worse for the future.

13 Roster spots. That's all we get to work with at a given time. The Twins currently have that reduced to 11 and have done so willingly. If they choose to do that. They better be right... they better not get injured. 

[jorgenswest]

There is a lot of discussion on the Twins not utilizing Bride/Keirsey/Gasper. For the last month I have looked to the week ahead and tried to imagine how I might use 13 players.

I do wonder how often does a player need to get at bats in order to stay in rhythm. I really don’t know and i am sure it varies by player. One start a series doesn’t seem like enough particularly when then start will probably be cur short for a pinch hitter. 

This week is the typical 6 game week. It is a little unusual as it looks to be 6 right handed starters. Priority is winning games at this level and in order to win they need their best hitters playing often and they need defense.

I would start Buxton and Correa get all 6 games, The potential of their defense and gloves is too valuable. I would also start Wallner and Larnach 6 games. The Twins don’t have many left handed bats and their bats will be needed. I don’t like the outfield defense when both are out there so Bader and Castro will each get three games.

Lewis and Lee are getting 5 starts and Castro will get the other two at second and third. Clemens and France will each get three at first base and be useful off the bench to pinch hit.

Catcher is tough because there is usually a lefty where I can put Jeffers at DH. this week is 4 for Jeffers and 2 for Vazquez. The Twins have been extraordinarily healthy at catcher the last three seasons with their 50% play so I may be risking that health but Jeffers gets 4 games.

I am not sure how I would get that thirteenth bat regular enough playing time short of injury (in which case they are really the 12th bat). Would they need at least three start for it to be relevancy. Certainly a start a week isn’t going to help with get them consistent at bats. If it were Bride I don’t think it helps to take a game from Castro or Lee or Lewis. They already have the off day and another day of rest and I am hoping Lewis or Lee are hitting so well that I want them 6 times a week. If Keirsey I suppose I could sit Wallner and Larnach each once but their power is an important element. Bader, France and Clemens are already at just three starts. I have this trouble every week. If they are facing lefty or two then I want to get Jeffers in at DH and I want Bader’s glove in the outfield an extra time. I have come to believe that the best use of that 13th spot is that of a specialist. Keirsey fits as a specialist better than Bride.

I would like to think a pinch hit specialist would be valuable. It would be great to have someone that can consistently put the ball in play that you can call on with a runner in scoring position. Maybe that is a role for France as his career advances. Maybe Gasper can fit that role. It will require both effort and skill. The effort of spending a lot of time in the cage swinging the bat and the skill of hitting when coming in cold.

What happens when Keaschall comes back and everyone is healthy? First that would be awesome. I think I would consider seeing how France does as my pinch hitter. Alternatively Castro in that specialist role would have the additional skill of stepping in nearly anywhere on the field in case of injury. He can pinch hit. He offers defense at several places. He can pinch run.
 

 

 

[RpR]

15 minutes ago, jorgenswest said:

There is a lot of discussion on the Twins not utilizing Bride/Keirsey/Gasper. For the last month I have looked to the week ahead and tried to imagine how I might use 13 players.

I do wonder how often does a player need to get at bats in order to stay in rhythm. I really don’t know and i am sure it varies by player. One start a series doesn’t seem like enough particularly when then start will probably be cur short for a pinch hitter. 

This week is the typical 6 game week. It is a little unusual as it looks to be 6 right handed starters. Priority is winning games at this level and in order to win they need their best hitters playing often and they need defense.

I would start Buxton and Correa get all 6 games, The potential of their defense and gloves is too valuable. I would also start Wallner and Larnach 6 games. The Twins don’t have many left handed bats and their bats will be needed. I don’t like the outfield defense when both are out there so Bader and Castro will each get three games.

Lewis and Lee are getting 5 starts and Castro will get the other two at second and third. Clemens and France will each get three at first base and be useful off the bench to pinch hit.

Catcher is tough because there is usually a lefty where I can put Jeffers at DH. this week is 4 for Jeffers and 2 for Vazquez. The Twins have been extraordinarily healthy at catcher the last three seasons with their 50% play so I may be risking that health but Jeffers gets 4 games.

I am not sure how I would get that thirteenth bat regular enough playing time short of injury (in which case they are really the 12th bat). Would they need at least three start for it to be relevancy. Certainly a start a week isn’t going to help with get them consistent at bats. If it were Bride I don’t think it helps to take a game from Castro or Lee or Lewis. They already have the off day and another day of rest and I am hoping Lewis or Lee are hitting so well that I want them 6 times a week. If Keirsey I suppose I could sit Wallner and Larnach each once but their power is an important element. Bader, France and Clemens are already at just three starts. I have this trouble every week. If they are facing lefty or two then I want to get Jeffers in at DH and I want Bader’s glove in the outfield an extra time. I have come to believe that the best use of that 13th spot is that of a specialist. Keirsey fits as a specialist better than Bride.

I would like to think a pinch hit specialist would be valuable. It would be great to have someone that can consistently put the ball in play that you can call on with a runner in scoring position. Maybe that is a role for France as his career advances. Maybe Gasper can fit that role. It will require both effort and skill. The effort of spending a lot of time in the cage swinging the bat and the skill of hitting when coming in cold.

What happens when Keaschall comes back and everyone is healthy? First that would be awesome. I think I would consider seeing how France does as my pinch hitter. Alternatively Castro in that specialist role would have the additional skill of stepping in nearly anywhere on the field in case of injury. He can pinch hit. He offers defense at several places. He can pinch run.
 

 

 

Leave Lewis out and do not start Castro in the outfield, not a bad plan.

[Riverbrian]

18 hours ago, jorgenswest said:

There is a lot of discussion on the Twins not utilizing Bride/Keirsey/Gasper. For the last month I have looked to the week ahead and tried to imagine how I might use 13 players.

I do wonder how often does a player need to get at bats in order to stay in rhythm. I really don’t know and i am sure it varies by player. One start a series doesn’t seem like enough particularly when then start will probably be cur short for a pinch hitter. 

This week is the typical 6 game week. It is a little unusual as it looks to be 6 right handed starters. Priority is winning games at this level and in order to win they need their best hitters playing often and they need defense.

I would start Buxton and Correa get all 6 games, The potential of their defense and gloves is too valuable. I would also start Wallner and Larnach 6 games. The Twins don’t have many left handed bats and their bats will be needed. I don’t like the outfield defense when both are out there so Bader and Castro will each get three games.

Lewis and Lee are getting 5 starts and Castro will get the other two at second and third. Clemens and France will each get three at first base and be useful off the bench to pinch hit.

Catcher is tough because there is usually a lefty where I can put Jeffers at DH. this week is 4 for Jeffers and 2 for Vazquez. The Twins have been extraordinarily healthy at catcher the last three seasons with their 50% play so I may be risking that health but Jeffers gets 4 games.

I am not sure how I would get that thirteenth bat regular enough playing time short of injury (in which case they are really the 12th bat). Would they need at least three start for it to be relevancy. Certainly a start a week isn’t going to help with get them consistent at bats. If it were Bride I don’t think it helps to take a game from Castro or Lee or Lewis. They already have the off day and another day of rest and I am hoping Lewis or Lee are hitting so well that I want them 6 times a week. If Keirsey I suppose I could sit Wallner and Larnach each once but their power is an important element. Bader, France and Clemens are already at just three starts. I have this trouble every week. If they are facing lefty or two then I want to get Jeffers in at DH and I want Bader’s glove in the outfield an extra time. I have come to believe that the best use of that 13th spot is that of a specialist. Keirsey fits as a specialist better than Bride.

I would like to think a pinch hit specialist would be valuable. It would be great to have someone that can consistently put the ball in play that you can call on with a runner in scoring position. Maybe that is a role for France as his career advances. Maybe Gasper can fit that role. It will require both effort and skill. The effort of spending a lot of time in the cage swinging the bat and the skill of hitting when coming in cold.

What happens when Keaschall comes back and everyone is healthy? First that would be awesome. I think I would consider seeing how France does as my pinch hitter. Alternatively Castro in that specialist role would have the additional skill of stepping in nearly anywhere on the field in case of injury. He can pinch hit. He offers defense at several places. He can pinch run.
 

 

 

I love that you are looking at it and doing the math and trying to figure it out.  

That's why... even if we disagree... I will always listen to what you are saying because I know you look at every angle. 

For example purposes. Let's make it harder by taking the specialist Keirsay out of the mix and let's pretend  Keaschall is healthy for 13 player spots

Here is a 13 player utilization for this upcoming week against all right handed starters. With the catchers a separate consideration (I agree Jeffers for 4 and Vazquez for 2).

You have 8 spots to fill for 6 games... that's 48 spots for 11 players. You could play one player everyday - Sit 5 players once, 2 players twice and 3 players thrice and that will account for all 48 non catcher lineup spots, all 11 players for 6 games. Nobody gets splinters and you can move these things around based on performance as it shifts throughout the season. 

To be clear - I don't recommend this exactly... it's for example purposes only... I'd like the manager to base lineups on data such as "hits sinkers well" to make daily decisions. This is just an exercise to show how the entire roster could be utilized with all 13 players and I don't think the team would take a tremendous hit on any of the days.  

Based on performance - I'd do this:

All 6 games 1 player - Buxton (Make Hay while that sun is shining)

5 Games 5 players - Correa, Lee, Larnach, Keaschall and Wallner 5 games. Correa for defense, Lee because he's picking it up at the moment, Larnach and Wallner because of the left handed pop and Keaschall because he was looking great before he was hurt.  

4 Games 2 players - Castro and Lewis (I could be convinced to make Castro 5 games and Lewis 3 games based on  Castro playing well but Lewis was starting to hit before he got hurt.  

3 Games 3 players- Clemons, Bader and France 

Day One:

CF - Buxton

LF - Larnach

DH - Keaschall

C - Jeffers

RF - Wallner

SS - Correa

1B - France

2B - Lee

3B - Lewis

Bader

Clemons

Castro

Vazquez

 

Day Two: 

CF - Buxton

DH - Larnach

2B - Keaschall

3B - Castro

C - Jeffers

RF - Wallner

SS - Correa

LF - Bader

1B - Clemons

Lee

France

Lewis

Vazquez

 

Day Three:

CF - Buxton

LF - Castro

2B - Keaschall

SS - Correa

RF - Wallner  

1B - France

DH - Lewis

3B - Lee

C -Vazquez

Larnach

Clemons

Bader

Jeffers

 

Day Four: 

CF - Buxton

RF - Larnach

C - Jeffers

SS - Correa

DH - Wallner

LF - Bader

2B - Lee

3B -Lewis

1B - Clemons

Keaschall

France

Castro 

Vazquez

 

Day Five: 

CF - Buxton

RF - Larnach

DH - Keashcall

C - Jeffers

LF - Castro

SS - Correa

1B - France

2B - Lee

3B - Lewis

Wallner

Clemons

Bader

Vazquez

 

Day Six: 

CF - Buxton

DH - Larnach

2B - Keaschall

RF - Wallner

3B - Castro

LF - Bader

SS - Lee

C - Vazquez 

1B - Clemons

France

Lewis

Correa

Jeffers

Again... Just for example purposes but I don't see any places where the lineup is compromised any of the days.

Others I'm sure will disagree. 

 

 

[jorgenswest]

@Riverbrian

That would keep everyone active. We both chose the route of catching Jeffers in 2/3 of the games. I was not confident that is wise but I did it on paper.

I think it does get a little harder when I look at the potential pitching match ups for the week. In that case I really wanted a good defense for pretty much everyone but Ryan and then I don’t want to give Ryan a day that Correa is on the bench with Larnach or Wallner on the corners. It would think about defense a little less if Ober was pitching like we expected and Lopez was healthy. Another thing that comes up are the non-Chicago divisional games or games against teams like Seattle. These games feel like they are almost worth double and I wanted the best.

I also haven’t tried to do it with every position player healthy. I look forward to that problem. When we get there I hope Lee and Lewis are playing so well that it makes it really for me to sit them one game much less two or three in a week. If they are it going to be hard to find space for all 13.

[Riverbrian]

15 hours ago, jorgenswest said:

@Riverbrian

That would keep everyone active. We both chose the route of catching Jeffers in 2/3 of the games. I was not confident that is wise but I did it on paper.

I think it does get a little harder when I look at the potential pitching match ups for the week. In that case I really wanted a good defense for pretty much everyone but Ryan and then I don’t want to give Ryan a day that Correa is on the bench with Larnach or Wallner on the corners. It would think about defense a little less if Ober was pitching like we expected and Lopez was healthy. Another thing that comes up are the non-Chicago divisional games or games against teams like Seattle. These games feel like they are almost worth double and I wanted the best.

I also haven’t tried to do it with every position player healthy. I look forward to that problem. When we get there I hope Lee and Lewis are playing so well that it makes it really for me to sit them one game much less two or three in a week. If they are it going to be hard to find space for all 13.

You are right... It is much harder than the (for example only) template I posted above.

It gets real complicated when you start thinking: Janson Junk starting... fastball/slider guy, flyball pitcher, generates a high chase rate and he doesn't walk anyone. It's hard to work off a template when you are making decisions on matchups. That's an opponent consideration and each individual decision of this nature leads to slight/tiny statistical advantages. 

On the other side of that coin. You list valid Twins considerations that make it hard to work off a template... yet... at the same time your valid considerations also illustrate why all of this is necessary.

Why do I say that? Because those considerations you have, show the individual imperfections, those imperfections show that they don't need to be in the lineup every day. You are not comfortable with Larnach and Wallner on the corners together. That's a valid concern and that concern or imperfection separates them from Buxton who really should be in the lineup every day. So you have established through your defensive concerns that Larnach and Wallner can yield a day of playing time. 

If I start talking myself into... Correa has to play everyday with a .681 OPS... that's when I run into problems finding work for players who might produce .690.  

What really uncomplicates it. Keirsay and Bride on the roster does a real nice job uncomplicating it.  Two guys that Rocco won't play. Those two would both start 0 out of 6 this week.

From my template, take out the 5 games I gave Keaschall and the 4 games that I gave Lewis. Give none of them to Bride and Keirsay and spread those 9 starts over to the rest. Oh Look... France is playing every day. 

France has been OK... but FRANCE PLAYING EVERY DAY like he's Byron Buxton is a problem and there is no competition to push him for playing time. 

You know what else uncomplicates it. Simply sitting your left handed hitters when lefties are on the mound and simply sitting your right handed hitters when a righty is on the mound. That's auto-pilot. 

Anyway... I'm grateful you are visiting this island. It's been lonely for me. 

[Riverbrian]

15 hours ago, jorgenswest said:

@Riverbrian

That would keep everyone active. We both chose the route of catching Jeffers in 2/3 of the games. I was not confident that is wise but I did it on paper.

I think it does get a little harder when I look at the potential pitching match ups for the week. In that case I really wanted a good defense for pretty much everyone but Ryan and then I don’t want to give Ryan a day that Correa is on the bench with Larnach or Wallner on the corners. It would think about defense a little less if Ober was pitching like we expected and Lopez was healthy. Another thing that comes up are the non-Chicago divisional games or games against teams like Seattle. These games feel like they are almost worth double and I wanted the best.

I also haven’t tried to do it with every position player healthy. I look forward to that problem. When we get there I hope Lee and Lewis are playing so well that it makes it really for me to sit them one game much less two or three in a week. If they are it going to be hard to find space for all 13.

Another way to look at it. A manager or any of us mere mortals on Twinsdaily shouldn't be so afraid of giving up 4 AB's of playing time out of 6,000 AB's during a season because of the POTENTIAL result of one ninth of a lineup in one game out of 162.

Being so afraid of those 4 AB's out of 6,000 on a given day that you are willing to sacrifice 1 roster spot out of 13 and just bench that spot is backwards. That 1 roster spot out of 13 is the most "finite" of all numbers and those 13 roster spots should be what every front office and game manager should focus on. You have 13 roster spots at any given time to improve your team with. 

Willingness to sacrifice that roster spot leads to thinking that we can't do better than Ty France or we might lose this game. It makes Ty France a lynch pin to survival. Willingness to sacrifice that roster spot makes average to below average unreplaceable. it kills discovery. it creates a chain of never ending low budget filler to fill the holes year after year. It can at least partially explain how after years of this type of roster utilization you end up on the low end of pre-arb players. 

It's why the math you are doing is important. It literally changes perspective. It can take you comfortably away from all or nothing every day starting 9 type decisions in a game where all or nothing starting 9 doesn't exist over the course of 162 games.  

[jorgenswest]

I utilize France differently. Clemens would get his time platooning at 1B. I think France would be a great option in the bench. His success hitting with a runner in scoring position will be a good asset on the bench. I also see Correa as a .760 OPS player going forward and that with his defense is hard to take off the field when the playoffs are still a possibility. If I look at slash stats in season I look at the three season aggregate to try to project the player going forward. I don’t think anyone’s slash stats in a half season does a good job of projecting the second half.

[Riverbrian]

47 minutes ago, jorgenswest said:

I utilize France differently. Clemens would get his time platooning at 1B. I think France would be a great option in the bench. His success hitting with a runner in scoring position will be a good asset on the bench. I also see Correa as a .760 OPS player going forward and that with his defense is hard to take off the field when the playoffs are still a possibility. If I look at slash stats in season I look at the three season aggregate to try to project the player going forward. I don’t think anyone’s slash stats in a half season does a good job of projecting the second half.

I won't argue any of that. How much salt and pepper you use is your preference but if you find yourself fearful of playing any of your 13 options.

I'd ask that you step back and reassess the salt and pepper. 😉

 

[Riverbrian]

Back to some Good Ole' Roster Utilization. 

With the return of Royce Lewis... today is game three of an almost entirely healthy offense. The first two days of that health as yielded two runs. We will see what day three of health brings. 

First off the obvious: Keirsay has been up with the club since June 15 for a total of 16 games and has made one start. His utilization is clear. Defense and Baserunning late game replacement. 

The Catchers continue to rotate. Every other day with Vazquez getting a couple of back to backs when Jeffers gets a DH opportunity against left handers. 

As for the other 10 and the 8 other roster spots to fill. Kody Clemons is possibly the short straw. He's not in the lineup today and will have sat two out of the three games for this almost entirely healthy offense. Bader, France, Lewis and Correa will have sat one game... so it appears like a rotation is starting to take place. Rotation rest is what should be done when you have mulitple players that can perform. 

Buxton, Castro and Lee have not taken a seat yet three games into this almost entirely healthy offense.

Larnach and Wallner also haven't taken a seat in this almost entirely healthy offense but I imagine their time will come on Tuesday when Imanaga takes the mound and again next Saturday against Heaney.  

BTW... I say almost entirely healthy offense because Keaschall is still on that IL. Keashall didn't break camp with the club so I'm not sure he counts when it comes to those the front office was counting on when they built this thing. 

I'm under the impression that this roster right now minus Julien and Miranda is what they intended. 

So I raise a glass to toast health. We are healthy. Let's see how the front office did.  

[stringer bell]

As of today (July 6), it seems that every player except Keirsey is a possibility to start against a right handed pitcher. Lee hasn't started for two consecutive days, Clemens started a day at first base and Castro has played second. RH hitters France, Bader and Lewis are all pretty much regulars, but could be given a day off versus a righty. Castro can start in the outfield or second base and Lee has recently played a game at short, but has also started games at second and third. We haven't seen a left handed starter since Lewis returned, but it would figure that all the right handed and switch hitters will be in the lineup for a lefty. Who plays DH and which of Wallner and Larnach gets a start seems up in the air. If Jeffers isn't catching, he could be the DH and the Twins could start an all right handed hitting lineup. 

[jorgenswest]

On 7/1/2025 at 10:13 AM, jorgenswest said:

This week is the typical 6 game week. It is a little unusual as it looks to be 6 right handed starters. Priority is winning games at this level and in order to win they need their best hitters playing often and they need defense.

I would start Buxton and Correa get all 6 games, The potential of their defense and gloves is too valuable. I would also start Wallner and Larnach 6 games. The Twins don’t have many left handed bats and their bats will be needed. I don’t like the outfield defense when both are out there so Bader and Castro will each get three games.

Lewis and Lee are getting 5 starts and Castro will get the other two at second and third. Clemens and France will each get three at first base and be useful off the bench to pinch hit.

Catcher is tough because there is usually a lefty where I can put Jeffers at DH. this week is 4 for Jeffers and 2 for Vazquez. The Twins have been extraordinarily healthy at catcher the last three seasons with their 50% play so I may be risking that health but Jeffers gets 4 games.

 I have come to believe that the best use of that 13th spot is that of a specialist.

@Riverbrian

A week ago this is how I said I would utilize the roster. Here is what the Twins did with my suggestions in parentheses..

Buxton, Castro(5), Wallner and Larnach started 6 games. Larnach and Wallner alternated at DH. Castro was useful playing moving positions in three of the games.

Correa(6) and Lewis started 5 games. Lewis pinch hit in one.

Lee(5) and Bader(3) started 4 games. Lee pinch hit in both the other games. Bader came off the bench in one game.

Vazquez(2), Jeffers(4), Clemens and France started three games. Jeffers played in the other 3 games. Vazquez was a defensive sub in one. France pinch hit in two and Clemens 1. France and Clemens appear to be platooning.

Keirsey came in for defense once and pinch ran twice. I still would have a hard time finding him three starts. Any fewer doesn’t seem enough to keep him fresh and could be counterproductive.

Castro took a start from Correa, Bader took one from Lee and I knew Vazquez and Jeffers would each get three starts.

The Twins did utilize their bench. There were 10 times a player didn’t get in at all. Keirsey three, Vazquez and Clemens with two and Correa, France and Bader with 1.

This week they will see at least one lefty and probably two. Heaney is lined up for Sunday. Would Austin Martin be more helpful in that 13th spot? Would it be easier to find three games for him to start? I can see starts against the two lefties and they can find one against right handed pitching. He can take on the pinch running duties from Keirsey and he probably has a better chance to get on base in a pinch hit role. Defense? Keirsey is better but reports from spring training about Martin’s improvement was encouraging. That defensive sub was needed once last week. The Twins can make better use of that spot.

[Riverbrian]

23 hours ago, jorgenswest said:

@Riverbrian

A week ago this is how I said I would utilize the roster. Here is what the Twins did with my suggestions in parentheses..

Buxton, Castro(5), Wallner and Larnach started 6 games. Larnach and Wallner alternated at DH. Castro was useful playing moving positions in three of the games.

Correa(6) and Lewis started 5 games. Lewis pinch hit in one.

Lee(5) and Bader(3) started 4 games. Lee pinch hit in both the other games. Bader came off the bench in one game.

Vazquez(2), Jeffers(4), Clemens and France started three games. Jeffers played in the other 3 games. Vazquez was a defensive sub in one. France pinch hit in two and Clemens 1. France and Clemens appear to be platooning.

Keirsey came in for defense once and pinch ran twice. I still would have a hard time finding him three starts. Any fewer doesn’t seem enough to keep him fresh and could be counterproductive.

Castro took a start from Correa, Bader took one from Lee and I knew Vazquez and Jeffers would each get three starts.

The Twins did utilize their bench. There were 10 times a player didn’t get in at all. Keirsey three, Vazquez and Clemens with two and Correa, France and Bader with 1.

This week they will see at least one lefty and probably two. Heaney is lined up for Sunday. Would Austin Martin be more helpful in that 13th spot? Would it be easier to find three games for him to start? I can see starts against the two lefties and they can find one against right handed pitching. He can take on the pinch running duties from Keirsey and he probably has a better chance to get on base in a pinch hit role. Defense? Keirsey is better but reports from spring training about Martin’s improvement was encouraging. That defensive sub was needed once last week. The Twins can make better use of that spot.

Nice job with the predictions. 

I'd have Martin up yesterday if Rocco would schedule playing time for him because he ain't doing it for Keirsay. 

I'll contend until I can't contend anymore that we do not have a roster that prevents the utilization of 13 players. We have a roster that makes the utilization of 13 players necessary.

And I would prefer a rotation to a platoon. I think Clemons/France is turning more into a rotation than platoon. With a tonight's lineup... it appears that we are back to all lefties sit. 

[jorgenswest]

2 hours ago, Riverbrian said:

Nice job with the predictions. 

I'd have Martin up yesterday if Rocco would schedule playing time for him because he ain't doing it for Keirsay. 

I'll contend until I can't contend anymore that we do not have a roster that prevents the utilization of 13 players. We have a roster that makes the utilization of 13 players necessary.

And I would prefer a rotation to a platoon. I think Clemons/France is turning more into a rotation than platoon. With a tonight's lineup... it appears that we are back to all lefties sit. 

I hate the all right handed line up but if they have faced one lefty starter in the last 14 games. I hate the all right handed line up. I do think it knocks some pitchers off balance and gives us a better chance to beat that lefty if there are a couple of left handed bats in the line up. It does help the get right handed batters 

I don’t think a rotation or an every other day platoon is wise. Rocco spoke about match ups when deciding in Clemens or France. That is why they didn’t anlternate and each had two days off in a row. Maybe it is the same for Lee, Lewis and Castro. Rocco’s priority right now has to be to win the game in front of them. They have to fight to get back to relevance by the end of the month. Put up the line up that gives them the best chance to win today’s game.

If the Twins get to August and are sellers every player on the roster that they control next year needs to get regular playing time. Until they become sellers it is playoff baseball mindset.

Also… I am not trying to predict. I was just saying what I would do. 

[Riverbrian]

13 hours ago, jorgenswest said:

I hate the all right handed line up but if they have faced one lefty starter in the last 14 games. I hate the all right handed line up. I do think it knocks some pitchers off balance and gives us a better chance to beat that lefty if there are a couple of left handed bats in the line up. It does help the get right handed batters 

I don’t think a rotation or an every other day platoon is wise. Rocco spoke about match ups when deciding in Clemens or France. That is why they didn’t anlternate and each had two days off in a row. Maybe it is the same for Lee, Lewis and Castro. Rocco’s priority right now has to be to win the game in front of them. They have to fight to get back to relevance by the end of the month. Put up the line up that gives them the best chance to win today’s game.

If the Twins get to August and are sellers every player on the roster that they control next year needs to get regular playing time. Until they become sellers it is playoff baseball mindset.

Also… I am not trying to predict. I was just saying what I would do. 

I like hearing that Rocco is playing the match ups in regards to Clemens and France. Use of data other than the left/right split data that had seemingly trumped all other data. 

How can I argue the logic that Rocco needs to put the best lineup out there. I really can't argue that statement. But I'll ask the question... how do you know who the best lineup is? Was Royce Lewis part of that best lineup a month ago? Is Matt Wallner? How come Kody Clemons isn't suffering the same fate Jonah Bride is suffering.

4 AB's out of 6,000?  WIlli Castro gets on base 36% of the time. Royce Lewis gets on base 28% of the time. We are so afraid someone might be 28% that we allow 28% because we think he will 36%. 

 

[stringer bell]

Currently, it isn't a plug and play against right handed pitching. Excluding the catchers, the Twins have 10 options for eight positions in the batting order. Right handed hitters France, Lewis and Bader start more often than not (Bader is hot right now, France is not, Lewis seems to be going slightly better) but any of them could be out of the lineup against a right hander. Clemens has started at both second and first, but also has been on the bench, Lee also has started at multiple positions, but has been on the bench a couple of times. Castro is a regular, but could be starting at any of three positions. 

I was mildly disappointed that Baldelli went with the all-right handed lineup last night. From an offensive perspective, having Vázquez in the lineup shortens it greatly, not only because he is in it, but because he won't be pinch hit for unless it is the bottom of the ninth and the Twins have a chance to tie or take the lead. I have zero problem with one of Larnach or Wallner out of the lineup against a lefty. Right now Bader and Castro are better options.

[jorgenswest]

2 hours ago, Riverbrian said:

I like hearing that Rocco is playing the match ups in regards to Clemens and France. Use of data other than the left/right split data that had seemingly trumped all other data. 

How can I argue the logic that Rocco needs to put the best lineup out there. I really can't argue that statement. But I'll ask the question... how do you know who the best lineup is? Was Royce Lewis part of that best lineup a month ago? Is Matt Wallner? How come Kody Clemons isn't suffering the same fate Jonah Bride is suffering.

4 AB's out of 6,000?  WIlli Castro gets on base 36% of the time. Royce Lewis gets on base 28% of the time. We are so afraid someone might be 28% that we allow 28% because we think he will 36%. 

 

How do the Twins know what is the best line up? We need the Twins to have the staff that does a better job at knowing than any other staff. We also need them to fight the urge to react to all of the partial season stats and trust in their staff. If their staff is wrong it will lead to more losses. I don’t want a staff that doesn’t think they can answer that question though. That can’t lead to wins. If they have assessed that Wallner and Lewis give them the best chance to win they have to trust it.

How do I know what the best line up is? I clearly don’t. My knowledge compared to the Twins knowledge would be a grain of sand on a beach. For what it is worth I thought Rocco used the thirteen position players well last week. Most found their way into games when they started on the bench. Keirsey was only used three times and all three probably improved their chance of winning. He ran for Larnach and took his spot in right field in a one run win. He ran for Jeffers and stole a base in a one run win. He ran for Vazquez in an extra inning game. I don’t think Bride (instead of Keirsey) would have been helpful anywhere last week. He could have been available to pinch hit for a left handed bat but would have been at best the third option to do so and that would be in games that Vazquez was also on the bench. I wonder if Martin would be more useful particularly in a week with a few left handed starters. I would say he would be a better option.

I really appreciate the discussion. 
 

Also, that all right handed lineup I hate did pretty well last night. It is a good thing I am not in charge.

[Riverbrian]

13 minutes ago, jorgenswest said:

How do the Twins know what is the best line up? We need the Twins to have the staff that does a better job at knowing than any other staff. We also need them to fight the urge to react to all of the partial season stats and trust in their staff. If their staff is wrong it will lead to more losses. I don’t want a staff that doesn’t think they can answer that question though. That can’t lead to wins. If they have assessed that Wallner and Lewis give them the best chance to win they have to trust it.

How do I know what the best line up is? I clearly don’t. My knowledge compared to the Twins knowledge would be a grain of sand on a beach. For what it is worth I thought Rocco used the thirteen position players well last week. Most found their way into games when they started on the bench. Keirsey was only used three times and all three probably improved their chance of winning. He ran for Larnach and took his spot in right field in a one run win. He ran for Jeffers and stole a base in a one run win. He ran for Vazquez in an extra inning game. I don’t think Bride (instead of Keirsey) would have been helpful anywhere last week. He could have been available to pinch hit for a left handed bat but would have been at best the third option to do so and that would be in games that Vazquez was also on the bench. I wonder if Martin would be more useful particularly in a week with a few left handed starters. I would say he would be a better option.

I really appreciate the discussion. 
 

Also, that all right handed lineup I hate did pretty well last night. It is a good thing I am not in charge.

There are so few I can have discussions like this with and I appreciate it as well. 

How do the Twins know what is the best lineup? 

They don't. 

Don't get me wrong... they do this for a living and they are better at it then you or I. They have more access to data to put together intelligent guesses. However, putting the best lineup together is next to impossible and their evaluation mistakes every year, every month for that matter are clearly visible for all to see. 

Eduard Julien for example. They departed the off-season with Julien as the chosen guy. They didn't search for better, they thought he was their guy. Maybe he is but he certainly wasn't and now he is in St. Paul still trying to become what they thought he could be. 

Kody Clemons for example. When they signed him out of necessity. They were down Wallner, Castro and Keaschall just got plunked by a pitch. Despite the rash of injuries... He still only got inches of playing time for a couple of weeks until there was nobody left to turn to when Buxton and Correa collided. He is inserted into the lineup because Rocco has nobody left and he becomes one of the best hitters in baseball for two weeks. They may have signed him with some belief in his abilities or lack of faith in what was available on the farm but that belief didn't translate to opportunity until there was no one left to turn to. His bat has calmed down a bit since but Rocco believes enough now to keep giving him opportunity. This was another missed assessment and I don't blame them because this type of stuff happens to every organization. I just believe that the only thing that can fix that is to utilize all 13 roster spots and create actual competition so a Clemons can rise. You can go back to every season and see the mistakes every organization makes. Rooker was a missed assessment. Celestino was a missed assessment. There is a huge pile of possibilities of player skils in the middle and the differences are slight. Hard lines are drawn on thin margins.  

The only solution in my mind is to keep your 26 man roster spots in competition with each other. Don't ever waste a spot. Basically... If the manager doesn't trust a player on the roster to give up a mere 4 AB's in one game out of 6.000 in a season because they might be slightly compromised for that one game. Get that player off the roster and give the manager someone he will believe in and allow to compete. If you don't have sufficient answers on the farm... you've got a development problem and you end up with year after year of Margot's.  

I was against the Clemons signing mainly because the faith in Clemons over faith in the farm is concerning to me but at the same time... Clemons is also a good example of what can happen with opportunity. It's why I think it's a huge deal that McCusker and Fitzgerald watched from the bench. It's not that I believed in McCusker or Fitzgerald specifically, it that we are wasting these roster spots and these roster spots should be used to try and get better even if just incrementally better. 

That's why I say being concerned about wasting 4 AB's out of 6,000 in a season and not being concerned about wasting 1 roster spot out 13 is a mistake. 

It's too focused on today. Providing opportunity for players you believe are good enough for one of those 26 spots costs the minimum. One day of playing time spread across a roster of average players will do the trick.    

 

[jorgenswest]

It is so hard to know their motivations.

Did they utilize on of their options on Woods Richardson because they saw something they could fix or did they lose faith in him? Did they send Wallner down last year on options to fix something specific or was it simply his poor hitting? Last year they gave Wallner nearly 300 PAs in AAA to get him right. Is it the same with Julien and Miranda or had they lost faith in his ability to hit. I really have no idea. If they believe in Keirsey as a hitter they need to utilize that option. Right now they are using his speed and glove in most close games and it is helping the team in those close games. It also might be lessening the likelihood he will be a fourth outfielder getting 300+ PAs a year. Perhaps they don’t see that. I hope they send him down and give him a good run in AAA.

[Riverbrian]

2 hours ago, jorgenswest said:

It is so hard to know their motivations.

Did they utilize on of their options on Woods Richardson because they saw something they could fix or did they lose faith in him? Did they send Wallner down last year on options to fix something specific or was it simply his poor hitting? Last year they gave Wallner nearly 300 PAs in AAA to get him right. Is it the same with Julien and Miranda or had they lost faith in his ability to hit. I really have no idea. If they believe in Keirsey as a hitter they need to utilize that option. Right now they are using his speed and glove in most close games and it is helping the team in those close games. It also might be lessening the likelihood he will be a fourth outfielder getting 300+ PAs a year. Perhaps they don’t see that. I hope they send him down and give him a good run in AAA.

I generally don't have a problem with options being used when players have options.  

I mostly have a problem with players getting called up and being pre-determined to sit and watch because of lack of faith from his manager or a severe lack of development from the organization. That problem that I have only grows to double/triple in size when a player without options, who can't be sent down is simply allowed to continue with average at best, many times below average, sometimes way below average numbers. We have one player in my opinion who shouldn't leave the lineup ever. Byron Buxton, the rest can give a day up here and there to foster competition.     

Bottom Line to Me:

If they can miss on Julien to the downside and they do. This can't be argued... they miss frequently to the downside. Why can't they miss on a McCusker or Fitzgerald to the upside? Of course in those cases... we will never know because they get 4 AB's never to be seen again. But that's OK... because the front office/manager can pick them out of pile just like they did with Julien. 

I'm never pining for a specific player like McCusker... I never want to get into a discussion about opinions of McCusker. If not McCusker... somebody... anybody has to rise up from the farm and fill these spaces adequately. I don't know who but it starts with whoever was given a 26 man roster spot.  

I don't have the exact number but there are probably close to 400 pre-arb players across major league baseball on 26 man rosters right now. Very few of them are in Minnesota. 

 

[jorgenswest]

Glad Keirsey was in right field last night. Great play off the wall and perfect throw.

Also glad he made that running catch in right field to end the win on Wednesday. Keirsey made the play look pretty routine but that line out by Swanson had a .350 xBA.

I thought Martin would be more useful this week. I don’t think he makes yesterday’s play. Wallner and Larnach are why balls like the one on Wednesday have a .350 xBA. Has Martin improved his first step and routes enough to make that play?

Again it is a good thing I am not in charge.

 

[Riverbrian]

On 7/12/2025 at 9:47 AM, jorgenswest said:

Glad Keirsey was in right field last night. Great play off the wall and perfect throw.

Also glad he made that running catch in right field to end the win on Wednesday. Keirsey made the play look pretty routine but that line out by Swanson had a .350 xBA.

I thought Martin would be more useful this week. I don’t think he makes yesterday’s play. Wallner and Larnach are why balls like the one on Wednesday have a .350 xBA. Has Martin improved his first step and routes enough to make that play?

Again it is a good thing I am not in charge.

 

I'd be alright with you in charge. 

[Riverbrian]

The smoke still hasn't cleared yet.

At the moment - 5 40 man spots open. 

Roster resource currently has 7 26 man spots to fill. 

2 SP - Assuming Ober and Bradley will fill. 

2 RP - No idea who will fill but there were multiple DFA's yesterday if the Twins are inclined. 

3 Position players. We will probably need to add a couple infielders. Ideally one who can play SS and ideally one that can play some 1B. 

Could probably use an OF added to the 26. 

Resource is assuming Outman has a 26 man spot. 

26 man questions will be answered soon. 

It does look like we will be much more left handed at the plate. 

Who knows... smoke hasn't cleared yet. I'm still reaching my hands out to feel for walls walking around the room. 

 

 

[stringer bell]

What do we know? Lee is the everyday SS, Lewis is at third. For now, Clemens will be the primary first baseman and Julien will play against right handers. Keaschall remains on rehab and Outman is still in the minors. 

[yeahyabetcha]

19 minutes ago, stringer bell said:

What do we know? Lee is the everyday SS, Lewis is at third. For now, Clemens will be the primary first baseman and Julien will play against right handers. Keaschall remains on rehab and Outman is still in the minors. 

Sounds ok, for now.  But I hope Keaschall is back soon in place of Julien 

[The Great Hambino]

Now that the dust has settled with all the player acquisitions, the 40-man is still sitting at only 38 players not counting the 60 day IL, even after McCaughan's contract was selected to fill SWR's spot on the 26-man.

If we assume one of those spots will be filled shortly by Keaschall, then what's up with the other one?  I haven't heard any reports that Pablo is anywhere near returning

[bunsen82]

5 minutes ago, The Great Hambino said:

Now that the dust has settled with all the player acquisitions, the 40-man is still sitting at only 38 players not counting the 60 day IL, even after McCaughan's contract was selected to fill SWR's spot on the 26-man.

If we assume one of those spots will be filled shortly by Keaschall, then what's up with the other one?  I haven't heard any reports that Pablo is anywhere near returning

Could we see movement on a Pressly reunion.  Its been mentioned they have reached out.  Sign with us, Houston or retire appear to be his options.  

https://sports.yahoo.com/article/former-astros-reliever-ryan-pressly-163612727.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAMEf04yAU3yOQso7hjZpbqoh7lzrz_P-yo6H_gePof0Ij_qXgfEt_e6AJ0XGPtTlUsky3ais_RVhGFhnHt-IMiH9RfgXr4nyrXuljBI8uIFWpnhWLu_kYsbijaAT0fnqp_w3WIBQUrnnQ5H1yJZfCHzhudSYRnwkI0cg3qxy_D3-

[bunsen82]

I would say we got our answer on Pressley.  We claimed Hatch off waivers.  I expect to see a lot of this in the next 2 months.