Article: International Signing Preview

[Jeremy Nygaard]

I read his column since he'll deliver a nugget on occasion. Last season he wrote about Mitch Brown's success in the AFL, which is the last stop before the majors. I emailed him and said he's pitching in the Arizona Rookie League. He responded: misinformation from sources.

[maxisagod]

Jesse Sanchez is reporting Cubs broke the bank on Jen ho Tseng

Cubs Sign Jen-Ho Tseng; Jimenez Likely To Sign Next Week: MLB Rumors - MLBTradeRumors.com

 

After the Jimenez signing it looks like they said to hell with next year's crop and tried to out spend everyone. They can't sign anyone next year for over 250,000. not a bad strategy, they most likely will be trading cap space next year getting some marginal guys that way too.

[howieramone1406390264]

Jesse Sanchez is reporting Cubs broke the bank on Jen ho Tseng

Cubs Sign Jen-Ho Tseng; Jimenez Likely To Sign Next Week: MLB Rumors - MLBTradeRumors.com

 

After the Jimenez signing it looks like they said to hell with next year's crop and tried to out spend everyone. They can't sign anyone next year for over 250,000. not a bad strategy, they most likely will be trading cap space next year getting some marginal guys that way too.

I'm not sure about the strategy, but I do know it's not playing well for the richest franchise in the 3rd largest market. Fans want International signings but by that they mean Cubans or Japanese who can play right now. They don't seem too impressed by what is considered an aggressive mid-market approach.

[TheLeviathan]

On what do you base that claim?

[howieramone1406390264]

On what do you base that claim?

 

 

google

[nicksaviking]

They don't seem too upset to me:

 

International Free Agents Signing Post - Page 43

[TheLeviathan]

google

 

No, the idea that this is "not playing well"? What articles are saying this about the fans? I can only speak via anecdote on this....but every Cubs fan I know from my time down tehre is THRILLED that an actual rebuild is being done with that team. So what exactly should I google search that tells me Cubs fans hate these moves? (In particular Itl FA)

[jokin]

I'm not sure about the strategy, but I do know it's not playing well for the richest franchise in the 3rd largest market. Fans want International signings but by that they mean Cubans or Japanese who can play right now. They don't seem too impressed by what is considered an aggressive mid-market approach.

 

Jorge Soler is Cuban.

[howieramone1406390264]

No, the idea that this is "not playing well"? What articles are saying this about the fans? I can only speak via anecdote on this....but every Cubs fan I know from my time down tehre is THRILLED that an actual rebuild is being done with that team. So what exactly should I google search that tells me Cubs fans hate these moves? (In particular Itl FA)

I have never heard of a fan base thrilled about a rebuild. Could you provide me with the exact words these thrilled Cubs fans you know are using? I work in Schaumburg every winter and I want to share the giddiness with my co-workers.

[TheLeviathan]

I have never heard of a fan base thrilled about a rebuild. Could you provide me with the exact words these thrilled Cubs fans you know are using? I work in Schaumburg every winter and I want to share the giddiness with my co-workers.

 

So wait, now this is flipped on me? I said some of my friends (by anecdote I fully admitted) were happy someone was finally fixing the problem. What they told me is that they were sick of having an awful farm system and always trying to fix everything via big-name FAs. They were happy someone was focused on rebuilding the organization. Something International FA helps with.

 

Now, I didn't flag your sarcastic post. I'm not going to be upset that you flipped this question around on me. (Forcing me to prove something I never claimed) All I want is for you to demonstrate the basis of your initial claim. Did you have a basis or were you just espousing your own perception of what you think Cubs fans as a whole believe? Is there an article, a link, terms for that google search above, anything you care to share to back up that claim?

 

No one likes a rebuild because no one wants to be bad. But you can still be happy that the rebuild is being handled well. I wouldn't have thought I needed to explain that sentiment to you.

[howieramone1406390264]

So wait, now this is flipped on me? I said some of my friends (by anecdote I fully admitted) were happy someone was finally fixing the problem. What they told me is that they were sick of having an awful farm system and always trying to fix everything via big-name FAs. They were happy someone was focused on rebuilding the organization. Something International FA helps with.

 

Now, could you please explain how this happened and answer my original question:

 

You made a very editorial claim above along with a story. I asked you where you got that editorial claim from, you sniped about "google", and now you're flipping it around to force me to source my opinion?

 

No one likes a rebuild because no one wants to be bad. But you can still be happy that the rebuild is being handled well. So again, as nicely as I asked the first time, what's your basis for the claim that Cubs fans aren't happy with Epstein's moves?

 

asked and answered

[TheLeviathan]

asked and answered

 

Not that I have seen, but ok. If there is some kind of discord about Epstein in Chicago, I would've found that interesting. Nothing I google seems to turn that up, however.

 

I found this. It doesn't seem to jive with your take.

[Riverbrian]

OK... I need to so some moderation... And I'm not sure where to begin.

 

I guess I'll ask that you guys stay away from each other for a bit. If the sniping continues... It will certainly make any moderation decisions easier.

[Roaddog]

This is frusrating to me. Sure tje international market is better than it was. But the Cubs strategy shows it is not perfect.

[Mike Sixel]

The cubs strategy shows that some teams are aggressive, and play to win. Are there any top 20 guys left?

[howieramone1406390264]

The cubs strategy shows that some teams are aggressive, and play to win. Are there any top 20 guys left?

But Mike, some fan bases just don't want to wait for 16 years-old to develop. I like what he did and I like King Theo, but standing on the mountain top and screaming you're in the rebuilding mode, doesn't play well in Chicago. They didn't spent all that money to get him away from Boston, to win 1 more game than the Twins and Cub's fans expect more. I really have to question where the OP stated Cub's fans are thrilled.

 

Did I mention King Theo was hired a month before Ryan and presided over the Cubs worst season in 46 years? Cub's fans are thrilled, yet I don't believe a single poster on this board is all that happy about the Twins current plight.

[bird]

I'm curious about the depth of talent internationally. The Twins "only" signed one of the top 20 rated prospects as rated by BA. Does anyone know which of our other top international prospects were rated among the top 20? Arcis, Polanco, Landa, Jorge, Randy Rosario, Danny Santana, Danny Ortiz, etc?

[diehardtwinsfan]

But Mike, some fan bases just don't want to wait for 16 years-old to develop. I like what he did and I like King Theo, but standing on the mountain top and screaming you're in the rebuilding mode, doesn't play well in Chicago. They didn't spent all that money to get him away from Boston, to win 2 more games than the Twins and Cub fans expect more. I really have to question where the OP stated Cub's fans are thrilled.

 

Did I mention King Theo was hired a month before Ryan and presided over the Cubs worst season in 46 years?

 

I think a couple of key things are being lost in this conversation:

 

1) Cubs fans show up regardless of the product on the field.

2) They are diehard fans that want a championship.

3) Theo brought a couple of the trophies to a similarly cursed franchise.

4) Any reasonably intelligent cubs fan should know by now that getting the biggest FA signings doesn't work. They've seen it fail every year for decades.

5) The Cubs are likely closer to the Yankees in terms of revenue than they are the Twins. This is a large market team.

 

 

I'm not sure what the majority of cubs fans think in regards to Theo, but what I can tell you from the ones that I know is that they recognize he's doing this the right way and are willing to be patient. Their patience might wane a bit over time, but this is the mid west and not the east coast. I've yet to hear significant complaints from Cubsville in regards to their GM... though admittedly, I'm not that attached to them.

[Mike Sixel]

Who cares what cubs fans think. I have no idea why you keep bringing that up. They were aggressive in signing and dealing MLB players, and now they are aggressive in international signings. I like that.

[howieramone1406390264]

Who cares what cubs fans think. I have no idea why you keep bringing that up. They were aggressive in signing and dealing MLB players, and now they are aggressive in international signings. I like that.

Whom is continuing to bring up The Shining Light? I'm providing the counterargument for those keeping score at home, that maybe things aren't so joyful in Mudville.

[kab21]

I'm curious about the depth of talent internationally. The Twins "only" signed one of the top 20 rated prospects as rated by BA. Does anyone know which of our other top international prospects were rated among the top 20? Arcis, Polanco, Landa, Jorge, Randy Rosario, Danny Santana, Danny Ortiz, etc?

 

I don't think the Twins landed a top 30 int'l prospect until the year they signed Sano. Thankfully they have changed their strategy on that because they developed very few Latin prospects in the last two decades (that they signed). There have been some like Guzman and Rivas a decade ago and Arcia and Ramos (all low bonus guys I'm pretty sure) recently.

 

Out of your list Polanco and Jorge were fringy top 30 guys. Kepler was about the same. Minier was a top 30 guy easily while Thorpe and Miguel Gonzalez were outside of the top 30 but signed for at least 500K IIRC.

[kab21]

There's a difference between being critical of the MLB team and being critical of spending big money to build up a farm system. As a matter of fact if Cubs fans should be critical of anything it should be of the ignore the farm system strategy that was used for so many years that put them into this hole.

[TheLeviathan]

There's a difference between being critical of the MLB team and being critical of spending big money to build up a farm system. As a matter of fact if Cubs fans should be critical of anything it should be of the ignore the farm system strategy that was used for so many years that put them into this hole.

 

Which they are. As the link I posted said, it's only the "meatheads" that are mad. Of course Cubs fans wish they weren't rebuilding - don't all of us Twins fans wish the same? But being upset we have to rebuild doesn't equate with being upset with how the rebuild is being done. Somehow that equivocation is happening and no logic or evidence seems to be breaking through.

[kab21]

Which they are. As the link I posted said, it's only the "meatheads" that are mad. Of course Cubs fans wish they weren't rebuilding - don't all of us Twins fans wish the same? But being upset we have to rebuild doesn't equate with being upset with how the rebuild is being done. Somehow that equivocation is happening and no logic or evidence seems to be breaking through.

 

We are and were in agreement.

[drjim]

Doogie tweets:

 

Biweekly #MNTwins int'l FA update: still no plans to trade $. Have 7 figures left to spend. Told they're getting very close to a signing.

 

He adds that they are working on a couple of guys, so the remaining money will be spread out over multiple players.