How Do You Solve The Catching Problem?

[Mike Sixel]

I'd try Astudillo first.

 

I would have tried VERY hard to trade for Realmuto this last off season, even started a thread on it.

 

IF they are going for it next year, I still try for Realmuto. If not, then no way I deal what it takes to get him.

 

I'm targeting AA and AAA catchers in trades.

 

and, I'm telling the pitchers they can complain all they want, but Garver catches 60% of the games this year if we don't use Astudillo. If they don't like it, too bad for them. 

 

I 100% don't count on Castro returning next year in a productive way, if he does, bonus.

[ashbury]

Target a catching prospect in a trade this month.  Will Smith from the Dodgers? 

I dunno, man. The dude has a crooked face:

A. Crooked. Face. I mean, honestly. I'm not a scout, some of whom prize "the good face", but this guy's seems the opposite.^*

 

Kidding aside, I looked around. If the aim is to get through 2018, with someone better at the plate than Bobby Wilson, it ought to be possible to find someone under-utilized at AAA and do a small cash deal, sending Wilson their way as a mentor in AAA. Tony Sanchez is hitting well at Texas's AAA club, KC has Cam Gallagher, Cincy has Chad Tromp. Not big names, but I'd ask my database guys to check what anybody thinks of their glove, and give those teams a jingle. I found it interesting that when I did my little search, Astudillo's name also popped up as someone to try - I don't understand why he hasn't been given a chance behind the dish. If the manager's standards are that high, no AAA backup is probably going to be given a better chance than Willians - a legitimate bat with Wilson's glove probably would already be a starter and thus unavailable.

 

For a longer term solution, I come to probably the same conclusion, and target the guy with the crooked face.

 

^{* _{If I'm making fun of a congenital condition or an accident, I'm sorry... but I bet he's heard this before.}}

 

[Kelly Vance]

 

No one, for the record is saying this. I think a lot of us think that we will get a lot more production in 2019 out of Sano, Buxton, Kepler, and Polanco to go with Rosario and a new 1B/DH to make it worth getting a guy like Realmutto, especially with him being controllable through 2020 season and likely a draft pick if he leaves in 2021.

 

Now I agree that if the front office thinks that 2019 is realistically out, that you don't get realmutto. You target a AA/AAA type guy at the deadline and trade Gibson for a guy like Justus Sheffield.  I'm not ready to punt on 2019 just yet. I think that would be a mistake. 

Yeah, I am with Die Hard on this. Thing is, I want to say that the Twins are contenders next year. But on my other shoulder is a guy who asks me, what are they going to do to show that they know how to right this ship?  

 

 

[Richie the Rally Goat]

Yeah, I am with Die Hard on this. Thing is, I want to say that the Twins are contenders next year. But on my other shoulder is a guy who asks me, what are they going to do to show that they know how to right this ship?

where I struggle, is if they are contending in 2019, trading away good players is the only way to get value,but I don’t really see any surplus in the org that would return a high quality catcher for ‘18 and/or ‘19.

 

I’d work with Garver and Astudillo in 18. Sign a free agent for 19(as underwhelming of a list as that was) and try to develop the long term solution.

 

They’ve got a much better chance to improve the other 5 or 6 holes than this one.

[Kelly Vance]

 

where I struggle, is if they are contending in 2019, trading away good players is the only way to get value,but I don’t really see any surplus in the org that would return a high quality catcher for ‘18 and/or ‘19.

I’d work with Garver and Astudillo in 18. Sign a free agent for 19(as underwhelming of a list as that was) and try to develop the long term solution.

They’ve got a much better chance to improve the other 5 or 6 holes than this one.

Well, I don't see 5 or 6 holes. But I would allow that some may

Sometimes I think these posts are a battle between optimists and pessimists.  

 

But to your point:   I think you build a team up the middle.  Good catcher and middle infielders and good center fielder.

 

Buck is a superb  center fielder. 

We have decent infielders, most middle infielders are solid... on every team...EE resigning is a bonus.

And here is the thing about EE, and why I like him so much... The pressure does not get to him. Rosie either. It is "see the ball, hit the ball" with these guys. They are cool under pressure.... you can't coach that. 

 

Which is why I like them

 

But when I coached I always tried to get the best catcher I could. Not the best hitting catcher... the best catcher. 

 

So it should be a priority... like signing a stud staring pitcher. 

 

Which is why I am with Die Hard.  Catchers matter

 

 

 

 

[Mike Sixel]

 

Well, I don't see 5 or 6 holes. But I would allow that some may

Sometimes I think these posts are a battle between optimists and pessimists.  

 

But to your point:   I think you build a team up the middle.  Good catcher and middle infielders and good center fielder.

 

Buck is a superb  center fielder. 

We have decent infielders, most middle infielders are solid... on every team...EE resigning is a bonus.

And here is the thing about EE, and why I like him so much... The pressure does not get to him. Rosie either. It is "see the ball, hit the ball" with these guys. They are cool under pressure.... you can't coach that. 

 

Which is why I like them

 

But when I coached I always tried to get the best catcher I could. Not the best hitting catcher... the best catcher. 

 

So it should be a priority... like signing a stud staring pitcher. 

 

Which is why I am with Die Hard.  Catchers matter

 

2B, 1B, DH, C for sure right now....so that's 4 for next year, at least. 

[diehardtwinsfan]

 

I think its ok to say "I don't want to punt on 2019 yet" but also think, this team is WAY further away than most of us thought in April. The Twins are closer to a total tear down and rebuild than they are "in position to trade 2xtop 50 prospects in baseball for a catcher with 2 years left. 

 

I'm not so sure. No one predicted last season either. This team is definitely at the mercy of a few key players right now. Just as we can look in hindsight and bemoan expecting a lot out of Sano and Buxton, we should remember that it can be turned around as well.

[mngopherguy]

Astudillo's name also popped up as someone to try - I don't understand why he hasn't been given a chance behind the dish. If the manager's standards are that high, no AAA backup is probably going to be given a better chance than Willians - a legitimate bat with Wilson's glove probably would already be a starter and thus unavailable.

 

 

If a catcher has 5 gloves, he's not a catcher.  

 

 

 

[mngopherguy]

 

where I struggle, is if they are contending in 2019, trading away good players is the only way to get value,but I don’t really see any surplus in the org that would return a high quality catcher for ‘18 and/or ‘19.

I’d work with Garver and Astudillo in 18. Sign a free agent for 19(as underwhelming of a list as that was) and try to develop the long term solution.

They’ve got a much better chance to improve the other 5 or 6 holes than this one.

 

Haven't people been working with these guys for years?  Maybe someone can help them, but I tend to think they are who they are by now.  

[mngopherguy]

 

He has a career minor league line of .213/.263/.304. No amount of swing voodoo is going to cover that up.

 

Could he be Drew Butera 2.0?

[Kelly Vance]

 

2B, 1B, DH, C for sure right now....so that's 4 for next year, at least. 

Well, but if Buck and Sano come back strong, and we replace Dozier with one of out middle infielders. Gordon or Polanco or Uhire, we are good in the infielder and our OF is as good as anyones'.

 

Joe wants to play at least one more.

We have a decent  starting 5 

 

I don't see this as a panic situation.

 

 

[Brandon Warne]

 

Could he be Drew Butera 2.0?

 

Poor man's Drew Butera.

[Kelly Vance]

I'd take Drew right now, and catch him 65 of the next 80 games

[Mike Sixel]

Well, but if Buck and Sano come back strong, and we replace Dozier with one of out middle infielders. Gordon or Polanco or Uhire, we are good in the infielder and our OF is as good as anyones'.

 

Joe wants to play at least one more.

We have a decent starting 5

 

I don't see this as a panic situation.

Mauer isn't good at baseball. And they don't have a second baseman under contract for next year. Or a DH, and the catching is bad. These are all facts. Unless you consider Grossman a DH, I guess. Are these disputable?

[mngopherguy]

 

I'd take Drew right now, and catch him 65 of the next 80 games

 

I was thinking the same thing, which is why I asked the question.  Not sure how I feel about a poor man's Butera….

[Richie the Rally Goat]

Yeah, when you say Mauer isn't good at baseball, you need to step back and remember, he is the best catcher in a century and a possible Hall of Famer. .. No, that's not good... its great.

 

Wise up.

Mauer is today a first baseman with an OPS of .697. Concussions are to blame, but I don’t see how Levine can re-sign him.

 

Mauer is no longer a catcher.

 

To the subject, I think ‘18 should be spent grooming Garver to be a backup. Sign a stop gap in the offseason, as Castro can’t be counted on for next year.

[jorgenswest]

They need to give Navaretto every opportunity to develop his bat in the minors. Give him that opportunity.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

 

Well, I don't see 5 or 6 holes. But I would allow that some may

Sometimes I think these posts are a battle between optimists and pessimists.  

 

But to your point:   I think you build a team up the middle.  Good catcher and middle infielders and good center fielder.

 

Buck is a superb  center fielder. 

We have decent infielders, most middle infielders are solid... on every team...EE resigning is a bonus.

And here is the thing about EE, and why I like him so much... The pressure does not get to him. Rosie either. It is "see the ball, hit the ball" with these guys. They are cool under pressure.... you can't coach that. 

 

Which is why I like them

 

But when I coached I always tried to get the best catcher I could. Not the best hitting catcher... the best catcher. 

 

So it should be a priority... like signing a stud staring pitcher. 

 

Which is why I am with Die Hard.  Catchers matter

I wouldn't be continually posting here and BYTO previously if I weren't both optimistic and steadfastly loyal.

 

(1) Mauer, (2) Morrison, (3) Adrianza, (4) Grossman, (5) Escobar (6) Dozier are all gone

Buxton, Gordon, and Sano are still projects, not all 3 are going to hit, 1 or 2 will struggle (7) 

Castro can't be counted on (8)

I'm not sure what to think of Kepler, it looks like he should be succeeding, and hes not. I'm at a loss.

 

Catchers matter a lot, but no one player can make up for all of that, and high end catchers cost the most trade capital of all position players.

 

try to develop in 18 and 19, if it still really needs be addressed, do it in 20 when contention is real.

 

Maybe you re-sign Esco and Adrianza

 

(Edit- how could I forget Dozier?)

[TheLeviathan]

You guys realize that a poor man's Drew Butera is literally an out machine at the plate right?  As in, worse than most national league pitchers at hitting?

 

"Solving" this problem should perhaps aim a bit higher.

[Brandon Warne]

 

I'd take Drew right now, and catch him 65 of the next 80 games

 

Why? Everyone is already bitching about Bobby Wilson playing as much as he has.

[Squirrel]

I'd try Astudillo first.

 

I would have tried VERY hard to trade for Realmuto this last off season, even started a thread on it.

 

IF they are going for it next year, I still try for Realmuto. If not, then no way I deal what it takes to get him.

 

I'm targeting AA and AAA catchers in trades.

 

and, I'm telling the pitchers they can complain all they want, but Garver catches 60% of the games this year if we don't use Astudillo. If they don't like it, too bad for them.

 

I 100% don't count on Castro returning next year in a productive way, if he does, bonus.

Was that reported somewhere that the pitchers wanted Wilson over Garver, or is that speculation because there seems to be no other plausible explanation?

[Mike Sixel]

 

Was that reported somewhere that the pitchers wanted Wilson over Garver, or is that speculation because there seems to be no other plausible explanation?

 

I thought it was in teh Reusse column, but that may be his opinion, and not something they said.

 

But I can't think of one other rational explanation at this point....

[Squirrel]

Well, but if Buck and Sano come back strong, and we replace Dozier with one of out middle infielders. Gordon or Polanco or Uhire, we are good in the infielder and our OF is as good as anyones'.

 

Joe wants to play at least one more.

We have a decent starting 5

 

I don't see this as a panic situation.

MODERATOR NOTE:

 

Quit characterizing people’s posts as panicking. And quit instructing people what is fact or opinion. Assume that everything posted is opinion unless it has been reported otherwise, with a link attached, or ask such as I did with Mike just now. Their opinions just greatly differ than yours on how to proceed. Neither is right or wrong. Discuss, debate, disagree, but at some point just accept others have something different in mind. When you are at an impasse, agree to disagree and walk away. And the ‘wise up’ or similar comments are not necessary, either. Next time that gets you a warning.

 

This goes for everyone.

[Kelly Vance]

 

Mauer is today a first baseman with an OPS of .697. Concussions are to blame, but I don’t see how Levine can re-sign him.

Mauer is no longer a catcher.

To the subject, I think ‘18 should be spent grooming Garver to be a backup. Sign a stop gap in the offseason, as Castro can’t be counted on for next year.

 

I am sorry that you "can't see" how the FO can sign Mauer. And I'm sorry Mike thinks Mauer is "no good at baseball."

 

Those comments show a very distorted and biased view of a great Twins player.  Someday you will brag to your grand kids that you saw the great Joe Mauer play.  He is a Twins living legend. He is one of the Twins that I want to see play when I go to the games and judging from the majority of #7 jerseys, I am in the majority.... by far.

 

[Mike Sixel]

 

I am sorry that you "can't see" how the FO can sign Mauer. And I'm sorry Mike thinks Mauer is "no good at baseball."

 

Those comments show a very distorted and biased view of a great Twins player.  Someday you will brag to your grand kids that you saw the great Joe Mauer play.  He is a Twins living legend. He is one of the Twins that I want to see play when I go to the games and judging from the majority of #7 jerseys, I am in the majority.... by far.

 

He was great, not sure what that has to do with next year. No one is disparaging his career, we are talking about next year. I'd say he's on the cusp of being in the HoF, and I'd probably vote for him given his peak years.

 

Of 1B with at least 200 ABs this year, he's 29 offensively in the league.....

 

so, yes, I agree, one of the best catchers in MLB history. I'm not sure what that has to do with next year.

[Kelly Vance]

 

Was that reported somewhere that the pitchers wanted Wilson over Garver, or is that speculation because there seems to be no other plausible explanation?

CK, Morris was color commenting on the TV a couple weeks ago that Wilson calls a really good game.  I saw his arm in Seattle.  He is a weak hitter, but according to Morris, the pitchers love throwing to him. He is just a better defensive catcher than Garver, who has had passed balls on a lot of pitches and that includes a couple of called strikes. 

[TheLeviathan]

The last few posts have convinced me of the answer.  We need to sign Ivan Rodriguez.  I think he's a free agent.

[Kelly Vance]

 

He was great, not sure what that has to do with next year. No one is disparaging his career, we are talking about next year. I'd say he's on the cusp of being in the HoF, and I'd probably vote for him given his peak years.

 

Of 1B with at least 200 ABs this year, he's 29 offensively in the league.....

 

so, yes, I agree, one of the best catchers in MLB history. I'm not sure what that has to do with next year.

Mike, I think it is partly sentiment, but the FO will resign Mauer if he still wants to play.

They will retire his jersey when he is done, but I think that only Joe will say when he is done.

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

Astudillo can hit better than Wilson and catch better than Garver, and what's more, he can probably hit better than Garver and catch better than Wilson!

 

So I'd give Astudillo a shot catching regularly.

[Kelly Vance]

 

Astudillo can hit better than Wilson and catch better than Garver, and what's more, he can probably hit better than Garver and catch better than Wilson!

So I'd give Astudillo a shot catching regularly.

 

I agree, so they call him up and play him at 3rd and 2b.

What?