Reusse: Sano has some growing up to do

[HitInAPinch]

 

Ballplayer Peletoro (spelling?) is another good one to watch.

 

Also to a comment I saw above about (it's easy for a 270 lb athlete to lose 20 pounds) I don't think that's accurate since all bodies all completely different, especially those of a 22 year old who may not be done growing.

He's a big guy, no question.  However, he really, really needs to watch his weight and get in better shape.  Depending on natural talent will only take him so far.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

4) Sano made no effort to show-up early and/or put in additional effort.

5) Sano opted to hang with his friends instead of getting a jump on learning a new position.

Sorry, no.  Sano was voluntarily in Ft Myers as early as January 20:

 

http://www.news-press.com/story/sports/mlb/springtraining/2016/01/21/minnesota-twins-arrive-early-prepare-practice/79060770/

 

Reusse's beef was that he later took a break to go back home before the mandatory reporting date.

[alarp33]

 

He's a big guy, no question.  However, he really, really needs to watch his weight and get in better shape.  Depending on natural talent will only take him so far.

 

I'm curious how you know what kind of shape he is in?  Was he struggling with conditioning last year when he had a .916 OPS in his 1st taste of the majors? What is his body fat %?

[Bob Sacamento]

 

Sorry, no.  Sano was voluntarily in Ft Myers as early as January 20:

 

http://www.news-press.com/story/sports/mlb/springtraining/2016/01/21/minnesota-twins-arrive-early-prepare-practice/79060770/

 

Reusse's beef was that he later took a break to go back home before the mandatory reporting date.

He was here for three days, then didn't come back til mandatory date

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

Lots of guys from the Dominican put on extra weight.

 

So instead of continuing to defend a Reusse column he has already admitted wasn't very clear, can we get some hard hitting five-point analysis of how extra weight has ruined the careers of David Ortiz, Pedro Martinez, etc.

[alarp33]

 

Let’s just talk about what we do know.

 

4) Sano made no effort to show-up early and/or put in additional effort.
5) Sano opted to hang with his friends instead of getting a jump on learning a new position.

 

 

Yeah, its a shame he made no effort this winter. Wonder if he even picked up a bat. Oh, wait...

 

"After ending his Dominican Winter League stint after just 15 games in early December, Sano spent several weeks working with San Francisco Giants right-hander Johnny Cueto and several minor leaguers. Twins first-base coach Butch Davis, who also handles the team’s outfielders, made a two-week visit to the Dominican to work with Sano, as did minor-league strength-and-conditioning coordinator Erik Beiser.

Sano would start his daily workouts at 6 a.m., pushing himself through conditioning drills until 10. From there, he’d chase fly balls for a couple of hours.

After lunch, he’d head back to the field for batting practice. He wouldn’t stop until he’d put in at least six hours every day."

[Bob Sacamento]

 

I'm curious how you know what kind of shape he is in?  Was he struggling with conditioning last year when he had a .916 OPS in his 1st taste of the majors? What is his body fat %?

Actually, this time last year Sano was struggling mightly with his conditioning.  Reported to camp overweight, they held him out of game action at the end of Spring to work with AA Strength and Conditioning Coach Dax Fiore.  Miggy actually had "tweeked" his wrist sliding and Fiore told him several times it's because you're fat.  Sano did the master cleanse diet for 3-5 days to jump start his metabolism and to shed some extra weight he came to camp with.  Fiore also had his ass running ALOT which Miggy absolutely hated.

 

Here's a couple videos I took last year of Sano getting pushed by Fiore

 

Sano last year 1

Sano last year 2

 

 

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

Yeah, its a shame he made no effort this winter. Wonder if he even picked up a bat. Oh, wait...

 

"After ending his Dominican Winter League stint after just 15 games in early December, Sano spent several weeks working with San Francisco Giants right-hander Johnny Cueto and several minor leaguers. Twins first-base coach Butch Davis, who also handles the team’s outfielders, made a two-week visit to the Dominican to work with Sano, as did minor-league strength-and-conditioning coordinator Erik Beiser.

Sano would start his daily workouts at 6 a.m., pushing himself through conditioning drills until 10. From there, he’d chase fly balls for a couple of hours.

After lunch, he’d head back to the field for batting practice. He wouldn’t stop until he’d put in at least six hours every day."

Slacker.

 

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

Oh yeah, add Johnny Cueto to the list of Dominican guys who gained weight and were never heard from again.

[Major League Ready]

 

Sorry, no.  Sano was voluntarily in Ft Myers as early as January 20:

 

http://www.news-press.com/story/sports/mlb/springtraining/2016/01/21/minnesota-twins-arrive-early-prepare-practice/79060770/

 

Reusse's beef was that he later took a break to go back home before the mandatory reporting date.

Fair enough.  You have a point but how does this change the plan or the result. The team had a plan with Sano.   So, I ask this of those of you who defend him.

 

1.  Did he fail or did the FO made this up?  

 

2.  Is it fair to say that it would not be all that difficult for a 270 athlete to lose 20 pounds by watching his diet and a maintaining a reasonable workout regimen?

 

3. If 1&2 are true, how do you conclude anything other than he did not care enough to put in the requisite work?

 

I guess we should also ask the question ... Is it fair to expect athletes with the potential of making hundreds of millions in a 12-15 year career to get in shape and stay that way?  How can an athlete claim to want to be great if they are not willing to eat at least reasonably well and work-out?

[Bob Sacamento]

 

Oh yeah, add Johnny Cueto to the list of Dominican guys who gained weight and were never heard from again.

Well the Venezuelan Sandoval just ate himself out of a starting gig this offseason

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

He was here for three days, then didn't come back til mandatory date

Well, he was at Twins Fest in Minnesota from Jan. 29-31 too, should we hold that against him too?

 

Any way you slice it, the other poster's statement that he made "no effort" to show early or put in additional effort is flat-out wrong, and was clearly a talking point made to fit his conclusion rather than the other way around.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

Fair enough.  You have a point but how does this change the plan or the result.

I don't think a discussion with you on this issue will be a productive one, since you clearly formed your opinions before bothering to learn the facts.  So don't expect any further response from me on this thread.

[alarp33]

 

Actually, this time last year Sano was struggling mightly with his conditioning.  Reported to camp overweight, they held him out of game action at the end of Spring to work with AA Strength and Conditioning Coach Dax Fiore.  Miggy actually had "tweeked" his wrist sliding and Fiore told him several times it's because you're fat.  Sano did the master cleanse diet for 3-5 days to jump start his metabolism and to shed some extra weight he came to camp with.  Fiore also had his ass running ALOT which Miggy absolutely hated.

 

Here's a couple videos I took last year of Sano getting pushed by Fiore

 

Sano last year 1

Sano last year 2

 

I'm not really interested in your hearsay, but thanks for sharing.  I'm interested in results, and he had a phenomenal 2015 coming off of a missed season, and his conditioning was never an issue. 

[DaveW]

 

Well the Venezuelan Sandoval just ate himself out of a starting gig this offseason

I'd suggest that perhaps his replacement level play in 2015 may have something to do with him losing his starting gig...

[ken]

 

Well the Venezuelan Sandoval just ate himself out of a starting gig this offseason

Another would be Jesus Montero, was once rated the third best prospect behind Trout and Harper.  Wasn't it last year that a scout was throwing donuts at him?  Just go cut by Seattle.

 

 

[DaveW]

 

Another would be Jesus Montero, was once rated the third best prospect behind Trout and Harper.  Wasn't it last year that a scout was throwing donuts at him?  Just go cut by Seattle.

Montero weighed 235.

 

Keep in mind there are plenty of "top prospects" who have failed to live up to expectations, this literally happens every year, so it's a bit fool hardy to draw a comparison here and claim Montero "failed" because of his weight.

 

Of course the Blue Jays just picked up Montero which means he will probably hit 30 HR and drive in 100 RBI this year. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Bob Sacamento]

 

I'm not really interested in your hearsay, but thanks for sharing.  I'm interested in results, and he had a phenomenal 2015 coming off of a missed season, and his conditioning was never an issue. 

Not hearsay, first hand witness.  Huge difference

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

was clearly a talking point made to fit his conclusion rather than the other way around.

I'd argue that's the problem with Ruesse's article as well. It seemed he reached a conclusion and then sought out "facts" to confirm this conclusion instead of doing the exact opposite.

[ken]

 

Montero weighed 235.

 

Keep in mind there are plenty of "top prospects" who have failed to live up to expectations, this literally happens every year, so it's a bit fool hardy to draw a comparison here and claim Montero "failed" because of his weight.

 

Of course the Blue Jays just picked up Montero which means he will probably hit 30 HR and drive in 100 RBI this year. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

http://www.seattletimes.com/sports/mariners/jesus-monterorsquos-season-over-after-altercation-with-scout-in-boise/

 

Sorry - it was ice cream.  There are a lot of reason for a prospect to fail and fitness can be a factor in the failure.  Nobody is saying Sano is going to fail, just that staying in peak physical condition is good for all players and at 270lbs, it's hard to say that an ideal playing weight.

[Squirrel]

 

I'd argue that's the problem with Ruesse's article as well. It seemed he reached a conclusion and then sought out "facts" to confirm this conclusion instead of doing the exact opposite.

Yeah ... I see a lot of that in other places.

[DaveW]

 

Yeah ... I see a lot of that in other places.

But it's a really weird conclusion to make in the first place.

Again, if Sano is struggling then by all means try come up with these ideas, but at this stage Sano has done nothing but been the one of the most dynamic rookie seasons the Twins have ever had.

[spinowner]

 

I'd argue that's the problem with Ruesse's article as well. It seemed he reached a conclusion and then sought out "facts" to confirm this conclusion instead of doing the exact opposite.

 

 

Yeah ... I see a lot of that in other places.

As for me, I don't watch the Presidential candidate debates.

[USAFChief]

Everyone...let's try not to get too personal.  

 

Thanks

[Thrylos]

 

Let’s just talk about what we do know.

 

1) The Twins pulled Sano from Winter League to concentrate on conditioning.
2) The FO stated publically that the Twins, Sano, and his representation had discussed the  importance of Sano managing his weight and that they all agreed to a “plan”
3) Sano showed up having made no improvement in his conditioning.  In other words, he did not follow the plan.
4) Sano made no effort to show-up early and/or put in additional effort.
5) Sano opted to hang with his friends instead of getting a jump on learning a new position.

I might add #5 – It’s not that hard relatively speaking for a 270 lbs athlete to lose 20 pounds.  That goal would be easily through a managed diet and working out a couple hours.   We don’t know that Sano just did not care enough to put in the work and/or manage his diet but that certainly seems to be the logical conclusion.

 

we know 1 and 2 above.

 

That's about it.  The rest are opinions and not facts, and some of those opinions (e.g whether Sano is "in shape") are contradicted by his performance this Spring.   He spoke on the field. 

 

Also:

 

For anyone who is blaming him about "hanging around with his friends" when he did not have to be at work, I'd love to see them put their money where their mouth is and go to work this weekend, even if they don't have to and even if they will not get paid extra for doing so.

 

 

[Major League Ready]

 

we know 1 and 2 above.

 

That's about it.  The rest are opinions and not facts, and some of those opinions (e.g whether Sano is "in shape") are contradicted by his performance this Spring.   He spoke on the field. 

 

Also:

 

For anyone who is blaming him about "hanging around with his friends" when he did not have to be at work, I'd love to see them put their money where their mouth is and go to work this weekend, even if they don't have to and even if they will not get paid extra for doing so.

I guess I understand your position now that you have added the perspective above.  This is hardly a measure of a substantial effort.   Is this really what you think amounts to “putting your money where your moth is”.  Giving up a weekend or two.   I have a number of colleagues and friends who have taken positions, especially leadership positions where it was necessary to put in 65-70/hrs week for the first few months or more and then work 60 hrs/week as the norm.  In these types of positions, you don’t get paid more, it comes with the responsibility. 

 

This is not an uncommon scenario.  Some of us also worked full-time while we spent 6-8 years in college and graduate school preparing for these roles.  Just in case it is not obvious, that equates to long stretches of working every night until midnight and most weekends so I know about putting my "money where my mouth is" and the premise of giving up a couple weeks being a sacrifice is so ridiculous it is beyond words.

 

So, Yes, I would think there are quite a few people who would consider eating properly and staying in shape to be a very modest effort for a professional athlete who stands to make the equivalent of 4,000 years of wages for the average person.  I would add that the same group of people look at giving up a couple weeks of fun times as an extremely small sacrifice.

 

I love Sano and his potential which is why I find it so disappointing that he does not care enough about being great and his contribution to the team on defense to make the modest sacrifice to eat properly and work-out.  There are a whole lot of people in this country who are not professional athletes who do this simply to stay to healthy.

[alarp33]

 

 

I love Sano and his potential which is why I find it so disappointing that he does not care enough about being great and his contribution to the team on defense to make the modest sacrifice to eat properly and work-out.  There are a whole lot of people in this country who are not professional athletes who do this simply to stay to healthy.

 

You are back to saying things that are just patently false. There is not one shred of evidence that supports your claim that he does not care about being great. You know absolutely nothing about how his offseason went.  You know nothing about how often he works out. You know nothing about what he eats.  

 

What we do know, is that he is a monster 22 year old who is still growing... and has a great chance to be one of the best hitters in the American League this year

[DaveW]

 

You are back to saying things that are just patently false. There is not one shred of evidence that supports your claim that he does not care about being great. You know absolutely nothing about how his offseason went.  You know nothing about how often he works out. You know nothing about what he eats.  

 

What we do know, is that he is a monster 22 year old who is still growing... and has a great chance to be one of the best hitters in the American League this year

This is so oddly such a Minnesota thing, we love to tear down and find flaws with our greatest players. It's sorta like "THIS IS WHY WE CAN'T HAVE NICE THINGS!"

[alarp33]

 

This is so oddly such a Minnesota thing, we love to tear down and find flaws with our greatest players. It's sorta like "THIS IS WHY WE CAN'T HAVE NICE THINGS!"

 

This is a particularly odd one, because he hasn't struggled at any point thus far. Literally all we have seen of Sano is his dominating Major League pitchers and practically single handily keep the Twins in the playoff race (WHILE PLAYING HURT) when veterans like Dozier and Perkins collapsed.   And oh ya, he was 22 and coming off a missed season.  

 

I would've thought it would at the minimum wait until he drops a ball in RF and has a week long slump. 

[diehardtwinsfan]

Having met a few professional football players, I'll simply say that I've met 270 pound people that are in incredibly good shape.  I think we tend to get a little too worried about a number and sometime forget that what is considered ideal for one person isn't ideal for another...

 

Getting back to the article, I'm really hesitant to see where the complaint is.  Nothing Sano has done so far that crosses any lines.  So what if he left voluntary ST earlier to spend time with friends.  It's voluntary.  If there's a problem, it will show up on the field and he'll find himself in AAA.