Squirrel

I think I've made myself clear in every ace discussion ... I have a very narrow opinion of what an ace is. We aren't going to pay for one and developing one is a crap shoot, imo. So, work toward a quality starting rotation of 2's and 3's, and get off this 'we need an ace' mindset. (Berríos, imo, is a good #2 starting pitcher. While he may have been the best pitcher on the team, and earned him the moniker 'staff ace', he is NOT an ace pitcher by my definition.) It's not that I think we are focussed on the wrong part of the team, I think we are making the discussion impossibly and irrevocably muddied with everyone's various opinions of what is an ace, so the discussion is lost before it even begins. We need quality starters, and then we need a GREAT bp. And yes, we need our hitting to come through. We have proven hitters, but we have very poor consistency, so maybe we don't have proven hitters? In my humblest of opinions, you cannot focus on any one part. You have to focus on them all and find the parts that make the whole work. I personally think we need to move away from Kepler ... but he needs to be replaced with someone who has RECENT established consistency ... not a once-upon-a-time consistent hitter/fielder. I think we need another starter of the Rodon level. I think we need another relief pitcher or two who can be relied upon. Hitting ... I'd throw a ton of money at Rowson to get him back. There is something in the process that isn't working, not in the talent or ability, imo. I think we have some very good pieces, but I think we need a few more ... in balance. I'm not sure I subscribe to this point, but most here think ... good pitching beats good hitting ... great pitching beats about everything. Which is why I think people are pitching focussed.

I'm one of those who has a narrow definition of 'ace.' I don't subscribe to the 'Well, he's the team's ace' as some did with Berríos. He always was a good #2, but I never classified him as an ace or even a #1 pitcher, even though he was the best we had and loved having him on the team. We just needed another of that calibre and a couple of other better options behind him. And, after having said that, I think aces are rare, not easy to come by and expensive, something this team will never sign because of the cost. And who knows if we will ever develop that, as I think it's a crapshoot. Santana was an ace. I'm not even sure I'd classify Morris or Viola as that, but they certainly provided the feel of that in 91 and 87/88 respectively. It's so difficult to have these discussions when there is no definitive definition. But, and again, that all said, if we had a staff of #2's and 3's and a shut down BP, I think that could work and it's what I've been ascribing to for this team for a bit now. Would it 'win the WS' work? Hard to say ... depends on who gets hot, when and if one of our pitchers is having an 'ace-like' season. I think that's our best hope.

I think this is a good suggestion, although I think we could break this into two topics: Pitch clock: pro or con Ban the shift: pro or con If you or anyone else would be interested in these, please PM me privately. DO NOT RESPOND PUBLICLY EITHER WAY. We want to keep all identities anonymous through the debate.

This would make me not look forward to the season! But would also not surprise me if the FO did something like this.

This is almost identical to what I would do with a couple of minor exceptions. I think I might leave Maeda in the starting rotation and move Ober to the BP. I would also go out and sign or trade for another relief pitcher ... not a reclamation project, but a legit, durable, competent relief pitcher ... and leave Henriquez in AAA for depth. But if what you've done is the end result of the off-season? I'd be okay with that, too. I may also put Martin in as utility and leave Celestino in AAA, depending on what happens in ST. Martin will need some reps in the outfield, although I'd use him primarily in the infield, still, he needs some reps out there. And when Lewis is ready mid-season, depending on how he's performing, he would take over that utility role, or, possibly 3rd base, trading Urshela.

well said

Topic suggestion: managerial impact on individual games

We will be ramping up the debates once the post-season is over. If you are interested in being a participant and/or have a topic suggestion, please PM Squirrel and Otto in a joint PM! Now that we had our test run last season, we are looking forward to getting this moving forward soon!

I do not agree with needing an ace before a great SS … see my post above. The Twins will simply not spend on an ace. They won’t. And we are a bad team in a bad division, so … what are you saying, don’t spend the money at all? If we aren’t spending it on a SS, we aren’t spending it on anyone. And my guess is that’s what they do. We will go with a stopgap at SS followed by whoever we have in house who is ready and let the chips fall where they may which is likely 3rd or worse in a bad division. Get the SS, a couple of great BP arms, followed by a quality backup catcher who can split time with Jeffers, and maybe we will have ourselves a team. That’s our only hope, imo.

They far, far, far are less likely to pay for great starting pitching than a position player. So if we have a staff of mediocre to good with no great pitching, then we need to pay for a great SS, followed by great BP arms. Especially with the ban of the shift it is even more important to have a great SS. Even if you have to move that SS to 2nd or 3rd in 6, 7 or 8 years. We are never paying for an ace pitcher. Get the SS. Preferably the one who is better than Bogaerts, but get the SS.

That much under I think they could afford Rodon, too

?

Waaaaa, not fair! <pout> I had no interest in this series at all. Now I want the Astros to win. Then I’ll cheer on either the Padres or Phillies (but hope Padres) in the WS

Glad you said ‘as a whole’ because some will complain no matter what. Every strike out, win or lose, will be waaaaa, waaaaaa, waaaaaa. I’m not sure if it’s a Minnesota thing or what, but some will say no one is worth it. I mean Minnesota modesty is a thing. Or, if the Twins do manage to make a big splash with anyone, it will be the wrong someone. Because it always has to be something. At some point I think you do have to push it all in and just go for it, mid-market or not. We keep waiting for Lewis or Lee or whichever prospect shows promise, and we will be waiting for never.

Okay … I added an ‘I don’t know option’ but not exactly as you put it because it’s my poll ?

Okay, so then what is your answer to the question of the OP? Will the shift help, no change, I don’t know?

Then we will never win. Honestly, that’s what I believe. Realistic for the Twins means “also-ran” is the best we could ever be. This is a Sisyphusian endeavor with this team.

I’ve been wondering, how much effect (if any) will the shift ban have on Kepler’s offensive output next season? I would think that it should help some. Thoughts?

With the defensive shift going away next year, we are going to need a real SS, not a stop gap, and not a prospect who might be great

This is why gold glove awards are a joke. Arraez is a fine player and I'm glad he's on our team, but he is not the best fielder out there.

This is not a Twins philosophy. Rays, Guardians, Pirates, Orioles all come to mind off the top of my head. And some of those teams are even worse than the Twins, even though they have managed to be more competitive than the Twins (Rays and Guardians), and I credit superior scouting and analytics for that. But they still have ownerships that are counting pennies and that sell off assets when they become too expensive and/or could get them high end prospects in return. And the Guardians have yet to win a WS in how long? Are we more forgiving of them because of late they've gotten to the playoffs and have a manager that everyone likes? Their business practices are still the same, and sometimes worse. Even the Cubs are all about the money and business. I really dislike what the ownership there is about. And then you have teams who go out and spend, and do it poorly or to inconsistent results. White Sox and Rangers come to mind there. That said, I am frustrated with this ownership and how they manage their business. But there is little I can do about it except manage my own expectations, or, perhaps, just stop following the team for now. They have ROOM to spend and won't.

The Twins talk forum is thataway ... ---> https://twinsdaily.com/forums/forum/6-minnesota-twins-talk/ Start a topic who you think the Twins should be in on so they can say we were in on them when we don't get them.

I'd say Mauer was a mega-contract. And, at the time, Kirby was. This team has done that, just rarely. It's time. We have the flexibility, we should get it done.

First off, one albatross contract to another? Are you talking about the one year deal? A one-year deal is not an albatross contract. And it didn't deter us from doing anything, getting anyone else. That's all on the FO and their inactivity before the Correa signing. And, we signed Correa very late in the game. He wasn't the plan, it just 'dropped' in our laps. This time around, I want them to truly go for it. This is a business. I'm not sure where you are getting 'we are supposed to feel grateful' ... I mean, what? We have the flexibility, right now. This is the time to go for it. Right now.

Wow, New York really should have put a roof on their stadium.