Good Problem to Have

[yarnivek1972]

There may be some stretches where he is sent to AAA but I would expect there will be opportunity on the big league roster for the majority of the remainder of the season and the playoff roster.

 

If he has a stretch in AAA it will be an opportunity to work in the OF.

 

I am confident in his talents and would plan on him as the starting 2B in 2020.

While it might be worthwhile to get him some time in the OF, IMO time at 3b and ss would likely be more beneficial to his career. He’s not ever going to be anything but a fill in outfielder.

[Squirrel]

If the Twins go down to 12 pitchers on the active roster, by way of a revolving up/down door in Rochester for the BP, we can keep one of Arraez or Astudillo when everyone is healthy. The only other way one stays, is if someone is traded, and I don't really expect that to happen of our starters. Stranger things have happened, but not in Twinsland. Arraez is valuable for right now because he can fill the void when we have injuries. That's his role, for right now. Next season? It's a whole different ballgame. As I said before, I don't consider this a problem, good or bad; I consider this team management.

[DocBauer]

If the pitching staff allows it, you want to keep 13 position players. If that is the case, it obviously comes down to Arrez or Astudillo. And there are various reasons for keeping each of them. But that is a slightly different debate.

 

I like him playing if he is up. It's the only way for him to develop and to see if you really have something for next season rather than a flash in the pan. (Not that I think that is what he is).

 

But youth an options works for him and against him. Healthy, you certainly aren't going to dump Adrianza or Gonzalez in favor of him. Not at this point. You keep as many good players and as much depth as you can.

 

I'd like to keep him up, but I am not opposed to sending him down if everyone is healthy. At Rochester he is only a call away and can continue to work on his defense, even getting some more OF time. I like the "creating pur own Marwin" idea very much, even though he could potentially start at 2B in 2020.

 

This roster shuffling is similar to the staff, juggling options and the IR to keep everyone healthy and keep the best team on the field.

 

Yes, I'd like to keep him. But no, I dont feel bad sending him back down. It's temporary for the next few months and he would be back up again.

[darin617]

The easy solution when everyone comes off the IL is to just dream up a reason to be Schoop on the IL with some sort of soreness to give him time to clear his head.

 

Then throw Arraez into 2b full time and see how it goes from there.

[Squirrel]

 

The easy solution when everyone comes off the IL is to just dream up a reason to be Schoop on the IL with some sort of soreness to give him time to clear his head.

 

Then throw Arraez into 2b full time and see how it goes from there.

I don't think they have to do that with the ASB coming up. 

[jokin]

 

I was that guy but that argument has a shelf life based on current team context.

 

When I was talking about the need for 13 pitchers... It was under the context of not getting the amount of innings we are currently getting from our starters... It was also under the assumption that Baldelli coming from the Rays would bring some Rays bullpen magic with him. That hasn't been the case so far. 

 

So current context is... We got a bunch of guys who can hit that would require an extra 25 man spot to roster. However... I can see that changing quickly when we start adding bullpen help at the trade deadline. 

 

"Limit his OF time?" - So far his OF performance doesn't scare me at all. I'll simply recommend getting him in the lineup wherever and if it's the OF... OK with me. Arraez is the perfect opportunity to develop our own Marwin and as you know... I'm all about that. 

 

I think Arraez has to come down naturally but his bat to ball skills are similar to Astudillo with the added bonus of being much much more selective and that will make that K% more useful.

 

Will the pitchers find a soft spot? Probably and that would be perfect because the sooner they find it, the sooner he can adjust to it.

 

His book is still being written... I don't want to gush too soon but at this point, you gotta keep playing him to see if he can keep it up. If he keeps it up or simply regresses to what he showed on the farm... he will be hard to send down. 

 

The story goes... that back in '67, Calvin Griffith insisted that one Rod Carew be promoted from AA, jumping over 2 AAA prospects. Of course, Carew was an immediate star, forcing the Twins hand on the question of whether or not he deserved to be on the roster.

 

Somebody in the Twins hierarchy saw something in Arraez in ST as well as at AA, and while all of us were figuring out which AAA guy's turn was up next and should get his ML shot, the Arraez promotion looks like a stroke of genius- and makes the "Twins Top 30 Prospects" list a might less meaningful.

 

Slight disagreement, though.... He has all the looks of a real gamer, but he's still a long way from ever being considered a good OF. 2B/3B looks like the best outcome for him. It's too premature to suggest there's anything in store for him close to a Carew-like career, but there's a lot to be intrigued about by his play thus far. ***

 

He's built almost identically like a left-handed Toy Cannon, aka Jimmy Wynn.

While he'll never be a great power hitter like Wynn, he has the short, quick swing- definitely not a slap hitter like Carew was at times- but great bat control and massive core body strength to regularly fill the gaps, as well as hitting some line drive homers- such as the one tonight.

 

***(I sure hope the Twins have had/will have opportunities for Rapid Rodney to provide some mentorship to Arraez).

[jz7233]

 

Everybody thought Eduardo Escobar was just a fill-in too.

I didn't. I like clutch hitters even if they only hit league average. EE has always been clutch. I even liked him better than Polanco in the past. EE's production this season: 66 RBI, .291 AVG, .885 OPS, 18 HR. EE should be elected to the All-Star game this year.

[curt1965]

Esco also proved himself over a couple of seasons, not part of one. Not saying he’s not helping, but he is the obvious one to get sent down when all are healthy.

I don’t think it’s very good club policy to send down a kid who: is hitting over .400, plays good defense, plays multiple positions, and has done everything he’s been asked to do! He’s had 75 AB’s as hasn’t shown any signs of regressing. The simplest solution is to go with one less pitcher. But sending Arraez down would not reflect well on the organization. If his play continues like it has- you tell him he’s going back to Rochester!

[tarheeltwinsfan]

 

.trade Miquel Sano for a serviceable to very good reliever and give 3b to Gonzalez and Arraez.  Sano's prodigious power (a HR every 10 ABs this year) and his youth would likely bring a nice return in a trade.  And I would argue that we may be a better team without him than with him (this year we are 33-16 when he doesn't play, and only 21-16 when he does).  Some complain about his strikeouts, but I have no problem with his offensive production... 6th in OPS on this terrific hitting team is just fine.  But his defense is hurting us...his fielding percentage of .934 ranks dead last on the Twins, and only Gio Urshela has a lower percentage among American League third baseman.   And who knows whether his questionable off-field behavior has a negative impact on the clubhouse. 

I agree.

[yarnivek1972]

I don’t think it’s very good club policy to send down a kid who: is hitting over .400, plays good defense, plays multiple positions, and has done everything he’s been asked to do! He’s had 75 AB’s as hasn’t shown any signs of regressing. The simplest solution is to go with one less pitcher. But sending Arraez down would not reflect well on the organization. If his play continues like it has- you tell him he’s going back to Rochester!

His defense has been good at secondbase. Not enough chances to gauge his ability at ss or 3b. His sample size in the OF is also small but so far he has been horrendous out there.

 

So the message when he gets sent down is work on defense at positions other than second. That is less of a knock on him and more instructions to the minor league staff. The minor league staff needs to recognize the importance of position flexibility and cultivate it where possible.

[Richard Swerdlick]

Right now I suggest that Luis will be the starting 2nd baseman next year as Schoop will not be resigned.

 

[Riverbrian]

 

While it might be worthwhile to get him some time in the OF, IMO time at 3b and ss would likely be more beneficial to his career. He’s not ever going to be anything but a fill in outfielder.

 

He is 22... He has played 7 games in the OF. During those 7 games he has caught everything hit his way, I've seen no examples of range issues and he has hit the cut.  Granted with more innings in the OF, we might discover something along the way but after 7 games, I don't understand the absoluteness of "He's not ever going to be anything but a fill in outfielder". 

 

We certainly don't have a large enough sample of defensive measurements for any kind of stability in the data. I'm not seeing anything with the ole' eyeballs to suggest that we have any OF issues. 

 

I don't understand the absoluteness of "He's not ever going to be anything but a fill in outfielder". 

[Squirrel]

I don’t think it’s very good club policy to send down a kid who: is hitting over .400, plays good defense, plays multiple positions, and has done everything he’s been asked to do! He’s had 75 AB’s as hasn’t shown any signs of regressing. The simplest solution is to go with one less pitcher. But sending Arraez down would not reflect well on the organization. If his play continues like it has- you tell him he’s going back to Rochester!

Then who goes down when everyone is healthy and you have 13 pitchers? He has options, he goes down. It’s the way it goes. If they go with 12 pitchers and continue to revolve them and shuttle them between here and AAA you can keep a 13th position player and that would be Arraez or Astudillo. And I wouldn’t say his defense is better than anyone else’s to justify removing someone else from the team. And I question that ‘good’ comment about him in left field. I also don’t think, defensively, he’s not better than Adrianza at 3rd or SS. Arraez will most definitely be in play for 2nd base next year, but for right now, unless the FO goes with 12 pitchers or removes another player, there isn’t room for him.

[Riverbrian]

 

 

 

Slight disagreement, though.... He has all the looks of a real gamer, but he's still a long way from ever being considered a good OF. 2B/3B looks like the best outcome for him. 

 

What am I missing. I'm pretty sure I'm watching the same games as everybody else. 

 

He's 22 and 12 seconds into his career. How can we project with certainty this early? 

 

[Riverbrian]

 

I don’t think it’s very good club policy to send down a kid who: is hitting over .400, plays good defense, plays multiple positions, and has done everything he’s been asked to do! He’s had 75 AB’s as hasn’t shown any signs of regressing. The simplest solution is to go with one less pitcher. But sending Arraez down would not reflect well on the organization. If his play continues like it has- you tell him he’s going back to Rochester!

 

Great post... This is my point. 

 

How can you send him down? 

 

I understand he has options and being stashed is the curse of "having options" and I am a strong advocate of stashing your depth. 

 

However... If the guy is hitting like this... Sending him down weakens your club because he is playing better then the other options. 

 

How can you send him down? 

[Riverbrian]

 

 His sample size in the OF is also small but so far he has been horrendous out there.

So the message when he gets sent down is work on defense at positions other than second. That is less of a knock on him and more instructions to the minor league staff. The minor league staff needs to recognize the importance of position flexibility and cultivate it where possible.

 

I agree with the 2nd paragraph with all of my heart. 

 

But don't understand the "horrendous out there". I'm reading post after post of this sentiment. 

[Squirrel]

I agree with the 2nd paragraph with all of my heart. 

 

But don't understand the "horrendous out there". I'm reading post after post of this sentiment.

 

I don’t think he’s horrendous. He’s adequate but I’d rather have just about anyone else out there.

[Jham]

I don’t think he’s horrendous. He’s adequate but I’d rather have just about anyone else out there.

Astudillo? Close call. It's Awesome to have depth and flexibility. I think it's going to b resolve. Someone's going to get traded...

[Riverbrian]

 

I don’t think he’s horrendous. He’s adequate but I’d rather have just about anyone else out there.

 

He has started 5 games and played in 7 games total   in LF. 

 

He has caught 11 out of 11 fly balls and he has 1 OF assist.

 

Has he had the chance to be anything but adequate? 

[Squirrel]

Astudillo? Close call. It's Awesome to have depth and flexibility. I think it's going to b resolve. Someone's going to get traded...

I wasn’t considering Astudillo when I answered that, as they both aren’t currently on the team.

[Squirrel]

He has started 5 games and played in 7 games total   in LF. 

 

He has caught 11 out of 11 fly balls and he has 1 OF assist.

 

Has he had the chance to be anything but adequate?

 

So, you’ll play him over Rosario?

[Riverbrian]

 

So, you’ll play him over Rosario?

 

Absolutely Not with the occasional Yes

 

It's July. Baldelli has been managing the roster skillfully since day one.

 

Why are we still using phrases like "Play him over Rosario?". 

 

 

 

[USAFChief]

1. Astudillo isnt coming back any time soon. Oblique strains take at least a month, usually more. At which point you need a rehab assignment. Best case scenario is probably late July, probably more like early August. So that reason to send Arraez down won't be a factor for a while.

 

2. That leaves Rosario, who it sounds like should be ready immediately after the AS break. At that point, they will need to decide between 13 pitchers, and keeping Arraez. My guess is they will try, right out of the break, to go with 12. Arraez stays for the short term.

 

3. In the meantime, there's always the possibility someone else goes on the IL, which would push the decision back. There is the small chance a trade involves someone on the 25 man, which could be Arraez, or could open up a spot. If not, it's only a matter of time until they decide they need 13 pitchers again, at which point Arraez goes down.

 

3. Arraez doesnt look very good in LF, but corner OF defense just isnt critical. His hitting so far has been more than enough to not worry about that.

[Riverbrian]

 

3. Arraez doesnt look very good in LF

 

 

Is this a Uniform thing? Something to do with how he wears his socks? 

 

 

 

The rest of your post... is probably how it will play out.

 

 

[Squirrel]

Absolutely Not with the occasional Yes

 

It's July. Baldelli has been managing the roster skillfully since day one.

 

Why are we still using phrases like "Play him over Rosario?".

 

I agree that Baldelli has managed the roster well, moving people around, giving people rest. But I still want to see Rosario in LF most of the time, and yes, I want to see him play there over Arraez.

[Riverbrian]

 

I agree that Baldelli has managed the roster well, moving people around, giving people rest. But I still want to see Rosario in LF most of the time, and yes, I want to see him play there over Arraez.

 

We are in agreement. 

 

It's been awhile since I've said something like that. 

 

 

[Squirrel]

We are in agreement. 

 

It's been awhile since I've said something like that. 

And by most I don’t mean 60%, I mean just shy of all, enough to give him rest when he needs it.

[Riverbrian]

 

And by most I don’t mean 60%, I mean just shy of all, enough to give him rest when he needs it.

 

In consideration of usage. Rosario has only played CF and RF on rare occasion and there is no indication of Rosario playing IF. 

 

Based on that and the fact that he is one of the best hitters in the American League. If Rosario is healthy... He'll play LF at least 62% of the time.    

 

[Squirrel]

In consideration of usage. Rosario has only played CF and RF on rare occasion and there is no indication of Rosario playing IF. 

 

Based on that and the fact that he is one of the best hitters in the American League. If Rosario is healthy... He'll play LF at least 62% of the time.

 

Heh, glad you’re not the manager, other than from your armchair.

[Riverbrian]

 

Heh, glad you’re not the manager, other than from your armchair.

 

What do you mean... I'd be awesome.