Dee Gordon PED suspension

[Otto von Ballpark]

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2016/04/dee-gordon-receives-80-game-ped-suspension.html

 

Let's hope he hasn't been training with his brother Nick!

[HitInAPinch]

Always makes me sad that a young man feels the need to use performance enhancing drug.

[Han Joelo]

Wow.  Seems like there has been a flurry of guys getting caught.  I don't condone it, but I hope he sticks with not appealing. I don't expect him to admit anything, but at least he can spare us the faux indignation.

[Squirrel]

Uh oh ...

[bluechipper]

Dee Gordon would have been really low on my list for guys who I would think are using PEDs. I really enjoyed watching him play, but wow is this a surprise.

[Mike Sixel]

PED bans are stupid.

 

Most of them are about staying healthy over the long season. I don't expect any of you to agree with me.

[bluechipper]

 

PED bans are stupid.

 

Most of them are about staying healthy over the long season. I don't expect any of you to agree with me.

Totally disagree. Even playing field.

[Mike Sixel]

 

Totally disagree. Even playing field.

 

So, they all have equal access to trainers, food, coaching, doctors, etc?

 

I don't expect people to agree.......but the VAST majority of these drugs are about keeping a body healthy despite them beating the crap out of their bodies. I fail to see how that is bad for anyone.

[T_J]

PED bans are stupid.

 

Most of them are about staying healthy over the long season. I don't expect any of you to agree with me.

I actually agree with you to an extent. There is a huge stigma about them that they are not being researched well for society as a whole. There is a benefit, but we need to make sure it's safe.

[bluechipper]

 

So, they all have equal access to trainers, food, coaching, doctors, etc?

 

I don't expect people to agree.......but the VAST majority of these drugs are about keeping a body healthy despite them beating the crap out of their bodies. I fail to see how that is bad for anyone.

I'm sure a lot of players wouldn't take drugs that could have negative side effects on their bodies, and putting those players at a disadvantage just isn't right.

[scottz]

I think PEDs should be approved for injuries that put a player on the DL. They recover, they come off the approved list (of course, we'd refer to them as RD - Recovery Drugs - instead). Increase testing and install penalties for athletes taking RDs outside of DL stints. Also install penalties for teams that have players on their team or in their system who are caught using PEDs or RDs outside of DL stints, including loss of draft picks or international player pool money.

[Willihammer]

 

I think PEDs should be approved for injuries that put a player on the DL. They recover, they come off the approved list (of course, we'd refer to them as RD - Recovery Drugs - instead). Increase testing and install penalties for athletes taking RDs outside of DL stints. Also install penalties for teams that have players on their team or in their system who are caught using PEDs or RDs outside of DL stints, including loss of draft picks or international player pool money.

Teams need almost no reason to DL players, and in the past, have used it just for the purpose of making roster space. There is way too much room for abuse if being DL'd is the only criteria for using PEDs.

[Mike Sixel]

 

I'm sure a lot of players wouldn't take drugs that could have negative side effects on their bodies, and putting those players at a disadvantage just isn't right.

 

Why isn't it morally right? It's a choice, like choosing to eat differently, or train differently, or whatever.

[d-mac]

 

I think PEDs should be approved for injuries that put a player on the DL. They recover, they come off the approved list (of course, we'd refer to them as RD - Recovery Drugs - instead). Increase testing and install penalties for athletes taking RDs outside of DL stints. Also install penalties for teams that have players on their team or in their system who are caught using PEDs or RDs outside of DL stints, including loss of draft picks or international player pool money.

 

I think that'd be a nightmare to try to enforce. They should either be banned 100% or allowed 100%.

[bluechipper]

 

Why isn't it morally right? It's a choice, like choosing to eat differently, or train differently, or whatever.

Taking drugs is like artificially getting better. I respect guys like Jim Thome who played through that era but played the game at a high level through their natural talent combined with hard work.

[d-mac]

 

Why isn't it morally right? It's a choice, like choosing to eat differently, or train differently, or whatever.

 

Is it though? To me I view it as the athletic equivalent of fraud. You are materially misrepresenting yourself to gain an unfair competitive advantage. Take PED's to their logical conclusion. Would it be morally wrong for say pitchers to (when technologically available) surgically modify their arms- bionic arms if you will? 

[Mike Sixel]

 

Taking drugs is like artificially getting better. I respect guys like Jim Thome who played through that era but played the game at a high level through their natural talent combined with hard work.

 

so, if they break a leg, they should not take drugs? What if they have a headache, should they take drugs? What is the line, between a pain killer, and a drug that actually helps the muscles recover? Isn't the second one actually better, morally?

[Mike Sixel]

 

Is it though? To me I view it as the athletic equivalent of fraud. You are materially misrepresenting yourself to gain an unfair competitive advantage. Take PED's to their logical conclusion. Would it be morally wrong for say pitchers to (when technologically available) surgically modify their arms- bionic arms if you will? 

 

Like, moving your leg ligament to your arm? Like that?

 

Slippery slope arguements are not good arguments. No one is arguing to allow bionics.

 

Why is a pain killer ok, but not something that actually heals the damage to the muscles? Why is surgery ok, but not SOME drugs (while others are)?

[Rosterman]

It would seem that with the systems the teams have both at the major league and minor league levels, the trainers and strength/conditioning program would MAKE SURE that nothing goes into a player that even has the hint of being a substance for suspension. And if you do feel the need to push an envelope, have a good medical prescribed reason to do so, or at least a note from the trainer so they can suffer the slings-and-arrows of fan and organizational abuse, too.

 

You know the testing is going to happen. You are a fool to think you can beat it.

 

Will be most interesting to see what happens with the next player contract agreement. Will suspensions be longer (thus REALLY discouraging the use. Is there an advantage to having long-term contracts voided completely and the player thrown back into the marketplace.

 

What happens to alcohol abuse, behavior beyond the norm off the field. How much can MLB regulate, or are you truly at the mercy of the corporation if you do want the job. Yes, keep the playing field as even as possible, I guess. And I still never figured out why people would knowing put things in their bodies that could cause longterm problems. It is bad enough that you do a job where you can develop longterm problems (and then, I see, you have to spend a lifetime taking painkillers and such). Whew!

 

[bluechipper]

 

so, if they break a leg, they should not take drugs? What if they have a headache, should they take drugs? What is the line, between a pain killer, and a drug that actually helps the muscles recover? Isn't the second one actually better, morally?

If they break a leg or get a headache, I think Advil or Tylenol is ok . Take whatever drugs are legal and your body will recover when it recovers. If it never recovers, well then that's sports.

[Mike Sixel]

Things we put in our bodies that cause long term issues nearly every day;

 

sugar

alcohol

ibuprofen

pesticides

.....

 

the list is endless, and none of use have a huge financial incentive to do so. Also, and I know you won't all agree with this......many PEDs are not harmful long term. Many of them will be fairly common drugs for all of us in the next generation....since their role is to help our bodies recover from damage.

[Mike Sixel]

 

If they break a leg or get a headache, I think Advil or Tylenol is ok . Take whatever drugs are legal and your body will recover when it recovers. If it never recovers, well then that's sports.

 

so, if it is legal, like most PEDs, it is ok?

[chaderic20]

 

Dee Gordon would have been really low on my list for guys who I would think are using PEDs. I really enjoyed watching him play, but wow is this a surprise.

PEDs aren't just for building muscle.  Tons of sprinters and cyclists take them for speed and endurance purposes.

[bluechipper]

 

so, if it is legal, like most PEDs, it is ok?

Legal in the MLB or legal in general? I'm not aware of any PEDs legal in the MLB, so I'm assuming you meant the latter.

 

Whatever MLB says you can't take, then don't take it. I want everyone to be on an even playing field.

[nicksaviking]

 

So, they all have equal access to trainers, food, coaching, doctors, etc?

 

I don't expect people to agree.......but the VAST majority of these drugs are about keeping a body healthy despite them beating the crap out of their bodies. I fail to see how that is bad for anyone.

 

Not all are healthy, and they're only healthy if administered by a doctor. That's fine for these pro guys, but if you open the door there, then it becomes acceptable and expected for minor leaguers, college players and high school players, and high school players sure as hell aren't going to be getting them from doctors, they'll be getting them from the seniors on the team who will be telling the freshman that if they don't take this stuff then they are letting the team down. The stigma and the consequences in place now are the only thing stopping a tidal wave of unregulated drugs from being pushed on our kids, and it's already scary the amount that are out there.

 

No thanks, I love the MLB, but I don't love it more than my kids.

[bluechipper]

 

PEDs aren't just for building muscle.  Tons of sprinters and cyclists take them for speed and endurance purposes.

Dee Gordon is so fast to begin with though. The risk doesn't seem to be worth the reward.

[nicksaviking]

 

 

Things we put in our bodies that cause long term issues nearly every day;

 

sugar

alcohol

ibuprofen

pesticides

.....

 

the list is endless, and none of use have a huge financial incentive to do so. Also, and I know you won't all agree with this......many PEDs are not harmful long term. Many of them will be fairly common drugs for all of us in the next generation....since their role is to help our bodies recover from damage.

 

That's not an argument for PEDs though, that's an argument against those other products. That's like saying we might as well elect (insert your personally most reviled candidate) because he won't be as bad as (insert your most despised president).

[Mike Sixel]

 

Not all are healthy, and they're only healthy if administered by a doctor. That's fine for these pro guys, but if you open the door there, then it becomes acceptable and expected for minor leaguers, college players and high school players, and high school players sure as hell aren't going to be getting them from doctors, they'll be getting them from the seniors on the team who will be telling the freshman that if they don't take this stuff then they are letting the team down. The stigma and the consequences in place now are the only thing stopping a tidal wave of unregulated drugs from being pushed on our kids, and it's already scary the amount that are out there.

 

No thanks, I love the MLB, but I don't love it more than my kids.

 

so, adults shouldn't be allowed to do things, because kids might?

 

You feel that way about alcohol? Or other legal activities?

[Mike Sixel]

 

That's not an argument for PEDs though, that's an argument against those other products. That's like saying we might as well elect (insert your personally most reviled candidate) because he won't be as bad as (insert your most despised president).

 

I was responding to "I'll never understand why people put things in their body that are bad for them".....

 

again, is this a moral issue? 

[Mike Sixel]

 

Legal in the MLB or legal in general? I'm not aware of any PEDs legal in the MLB, so I'm assuming you meant the latter.

 

Whatever MLB says you can't take, then don't take it. I want everyone to be on an even playing field.

 

so, it's not a moral issue, it's a rules issue. I agree on that......so if MLB made it legal, would it then be ok to take, HGH for example?