TNtwins85
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Everything posted by TNtwins85
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Exactly! If you look at a Cleveland or Tampa Bay model which seems to be Falveys MO you trade guys like Ryan this offseason or next offseason. By trading Ryan at his peak you take the prospects rather than a draft pick and you get more lottery tickets that way. For Ryan you maybe get 3 potential Ryan’s with the hope you really get one. That’s how these teams continually compete. Yes they develop well but you’ve gotta have players with upside to develop. The more of those you have the more potential you have for another high level player. It’s all about keeping that wheel churning. Trading players at their height and getting the most in return. Doing that over and over. Why do you think they got so many high end SP’s? They’re restocking the cabinet. So many on here don’t understand what’s actually happening.
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Minimum salary is $760000 per year. Paid over 6 months. That’s $4k per day. If he’s worried about taking care of his family on his salary he’s not getting any pity from 95% of the population. Sounds like he needs to stop taking Boras’ calls and just play baseball. It’s crazy how much money goes to the top players but come on. These guys are better taken care of than most CEO’s of major corporations. I understand the business of baseball but if he was doing what he’s supposed to do the money aspect falls into place. Let’s be honest. The money a team and player argue over is a couple hundred thousand on a million dollar salary. What they argue over is life changing money let alone the actual salary.
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Ok. In that sense Larnach is likely to be non tendered as well. Larnach if tendered probably makes somewhere around $5M next year. Mountcastle makes almost $7M now so likely to make $9-10M next year. So eliminate that happening. The Twins aren’t paying a $9-10M player worth .5 WAR for a .3 WAR player set to make $4-5M. Ober is set to make around $6-7M as a 30yo pitcher who is struggling to throw above 90mph and is worth .8 WAR atm. Rutschman is a former #1 overall who put up big numbers for a catcher and is having his worst season so far but is still 27yo. He’s averaged 3.7 WAR for his career and is set to make somewhere between $8-10M next year. So in that sense there is no way Baltimore makes that deal knowing that Rutschman probably has a bounce back age 28 season. They don’t sell low on him now. Baltimore hangs the phone up right away in essentially an Ober for Rutschman trade. I propose selling high on Ryan and SWR for Rutschman, buying low on Coby Mayo, and Buxton insurance/ legit 4th OFer in the form of Enrique Bradfield Jr. could probably get a lottery ticket as well in the form of a Jordan Sanchez or Wilfri De La Cruz. You can then do a Vazquez/ Jeffers rotation with Jeffers and Rutschman with one playing DH or Rutschman playing 1B in the days they’re not catching.
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Should the Twins Bring Back Luis Arraez?
TNtwins85 replied to Matthew Taylor's topic in Twins Daily Front Page News
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So the Twins would trade prospects for a slightly better and more expensive version of Jeffers? I’m all for Rutschman and looked into this before the deadline but I don’t see it happening. Keep the prospects. I’d love to see the two of them split time like Jeffers and Vazquez with the other as a DH or 1B. But it’s just as easy for the Twins to sign a cheap glove first catcher. Also, I would think Baltimore wants to do just that same thing with him and Basallo. My dream and REALISTIC spitball trade scenario that address’ both teams needs is-Joe Ryan, SWR for Rutschman, Mayo and Bradfield. Baltimore needs pitching. The Twins need hitting. Baltimore gets a frontline starter and a back of the rotation piece. Twins get a catcher to PAIR with Jeffers. A former stud prospect struggling but with immense power and talent to play 1B in Mayo and a TRUE backup CF/ 4th outfielder in Bradfield who is close. I believe it’s a believable scenario and it helps both teams now.
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Yes! I’d rather see Abel struggle with his command and try to figure it out at the MLB level than him dominate AAA while watching a 30yo Urena struggle. The kid showed dominant stuff when it went where he wanted it to go. Exciting!
- 23 replies
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- matt wallner
- mick abel
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There’s clearly a difference between a young guy who clearly has the stuff, ability and missed spots while trying to harness his command and a guy who is just straight up bad. Has absolutely nothing to do with the organization as a whole.
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- matt wallner
- mick abel
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Well, I guess if they don't draft 1B then the Twins will never truly have one and they’ll just have guys learning in the big leagues which is less than ideal. As far as what the Twins got at the trade deadline I’ve been extremely optimistic and bullish on all of them except Outman.
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Very good observation! I’ve said this before as well. When you are like the 2014,2015 Royals you do what they did. You go all in! They built up a core. Sold high on a star player(Grienke) to supplant their in house core. Supplanted that core with a few great trades that depleted their system a bit but ultimately those prospects didn’t amount to star players like almost all prospects. They were able to make it to two World Series. They won one. Down or middling years for 6-7 years. Developed another star in BW Jr. now building around him. Didn’t sign big money big name stars. Made two WS appearances and will probably make it to another one in the next 4-6 years when Witt is in his absolute prime. I’ve argued forever that’s what the Twins should have done in the Mauer, Morneau, Santana years. Instead they held the prospects. As a result we got the down 2010’s with no deep playoff runs to show for it.
- 65 replies
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- harrison bader
- jhoan duran
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Exactly. I don’t expect them to spend all $20M but if they can add a couple of veteran guys that total $10M—$15M that’s great. Also that’s for 3 more years so if they were to supplant the next 3 rosters with any group of guys in the $30M-$45M range that’s much better than on an aging Correa who has only gotten less capable and more injured. Getting out from that contract is a blessing and not a curse. There’s a path to winning as a smaller market team and as much as everyone around here wants a salary cap and floor I advocate non of that. Look at some teams right around us in Milwaukee and Cleveland. MLB doesn’t want it to create parity they want it for the money it brings in. Just like everything else it helps the owners and not the fans. A salary floor does the same thing only for the players. Just like everything else in this world one thing is said while the intention is something deeper. Everyone cry’s that the Twins can’t do what the dodgers and Yankees do but my question is why would you want that when there’s a model of winning without doing what they do? Yeah you don’t get to go out and make the big splash but that ultimately handcuffs your franchise at the back end of those contracts.
- 65 replies
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- harrison bader
- jhoan duran
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I would agree! Thank you for the rational comment amongst the rabid, the world is ending comments. Other than the Stewart trade I think they brought in quite a bit of talent that was needed for this team. When the players aren’t getting it done it’s time to reload. As long as they don’t trade any of the 3 headed pitching monster or Jeffers they’ll be ok. If they trade any of those guys then they’re rebuilding. If that’s the case there’s reinforcements next year and the year after. Not the end of the world and what were the Twins to do.
- 65 replies
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- harrison bader
- jhoan duran
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I can’t speak to the other places but working and spending a lot of time in Nashville they would find a way to get an MLB team and a stadium. The culture is infused with hundreds of thousands of transplants ready to grow Nashville with state and local money to fund it. A downtown site next to the new titans stadium prime for development coming. A population ready for the idea of MLB in Tennessee.
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I heard reporting from Phil Miller that the two groups were an internal to Minnesota group and an east coast group. That the two groups were taking a significant position( likely the 30-40% as you speak) and I believe they still have 15 years still on their current lease. I believe the new groups bought out the percentage of Pohlads no longer interested in the team while also solving this $450M problem they have while also leaving Joe Pohlad in this position he wanted with Pohlads still being the majority owner. Although the lease could be bought out I don’t believe MLB would let that happen after finally solving the A’s and Rays situations opening the door for expansion in the next CBA which will bring in more money which had been the goal for Manfred since he came in. He doesn’t want the stain of another franchise moving I believe anyways. The new minnesota group infusing more positive faces to this. Cash from the outside group. If the Pohlads had to still be in charge I guess I can see this as a win. Time will tell as long as a Pohlad still holds the final decision but at least there’s other voices in that room. That’s coming from a guy who would be happy to see the Twins just an hour away from me in Nashville too. I think this is a win for the Twins really.
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Falvey isn’t leaving. He’s not being fired. When he became president of the Twins and retained his PBO title he essentially married into the family. Without new owners he’s here to stay indefinitely.
- 288 replies
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- jim pohlad
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I think you’re right on point. Derek Falvey came from Cleveland. He’s operated like Cleveland as far as pitching goes. So we have to ask what Cleveland does with aging pitchers. Also, look at what they want d for the players traded. Pitching. Draft position players in the first couple rounds. Pitching in the middle rounds. Developed pitchers. Hit on a few per year. Ride them for a few years. If I look at Cleveland I’m gonna make the prediction that Ober gets shopped this off-season if he is solid the next few months. They either ride Ryan and Lopez through their contracts or shop them a year from now. By then you have a better idea of your next crop of SP’s. Rinse and repeat. They won’t extend Ryan.
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- luke keaschall
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I would agree on Jeffers. As a guy to build around I think he is a prime candidate. Also as you pointed out we have no one else to catch and Tait is mildly far away. He would be a good candidate to split time with an aging Jeffers in 2-3years. I’d rather extend Jeffers than go shopping for a guy like Vazquez next offseason. I think they let Ryan’s natural progression play out along with Lopez. They bridge to the next crop of SP’s. As for Lewis, like other Boris clients maybe he plays it out till he’s a FA. Maybe he’s willing to take the guaranteed deal this winter the way things have gone for him. If you think Jenkins or Culpepper are legit then at least give them the deal locking them up for their prime. Keaschall… maybe this winter but they’ll have to see the next 2 months and next spring. Of course none of this probably plays out until ownership figures out what they’re doing.
- 55 replies
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- luke keaschall
- bailey ober
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I wasn’t judging you either. I was simply saying how it’s funny that a lot of people present plans that are not based on reality. My plan would be a full article and would be based on rationality. Yes we could trade all of those guys for something but like you said that probably mires us in a 5 year rebuild plan when that’s obviously not what the franchise is doing or wanting to do despite what the average person thinks. Did they trade a lot of guys? Yes. Did they gut the team? No. There’s still plenty of building blocks here and from a business model Derek Falvey and the Pohlads would never “gut” the team. Why? Because that would completely dry up their income stream.
- 55 replies
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- luke keaschall
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I love how people plan these full scale rebuilds like it’s a video game and all these prospects turn into the 90th percentile outcome and the prospects you trade for all make it to the majors.
- 55 replies
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- luke keaschall
- bailey ober
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I think you do whatever you can to lock up Jenkins. Either next spring depending on how he looks in spring training or the following offseason. As far as Keaschall I believe he should get a deal in spring training if it looks like he took another step forward. Ober I believe is on the Cleveland SP track where Falvey came from. If he finishes out this year strong and continues what he did last night he’s probably shopped this winter. I believe Ryan and Pablo ride out their deals as bridges to the next SP core Consisting of Hill, Abel etc.
- 55 replies
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- luke keaschall
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Love the article! The Twins lucked out on this one and it represents why the Twins shouldn’t be swimming in this end of the pool. These FA contracts almost never turn out worth it. Especially when ownership isn’t willing to supplant spending. They should have went all in after ‘23. The window was wide open to make a 2-3 year run. That window slammed shut when ownership decided to “right size” the product on the field which ultimately led to this point. Not saying we wouldn’t have gotten to this point eventually probably next year but ‘24 and ‘25 should’ve been spend what it takes to make a run. Instead the FO was hamstrung by ownership and here we are.
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I would agree with you on most of this but I strongly disagree with you and almost everyone else on the salary cap and floor. Exhibit one: Luis Severino. While the A’s might have seen this as a good move speculation also points to the fact that per the CBA and previous MLBPA grievances this signing was used as a play to avoid any problems with their move and simply keep the MLBPA off the back of the athletics and MLB. Anybody can read the CBA and the grievances but in a nutshell the Athletics were forced to buy a player past his prime for more money than he really should have got to simply show they are spending money and “playing ball”. Now times that by 30 teams. That will force teams to spend money on aging FA’s who don’t necessarily “deserve” these pay days simply to show “hey, we’re spending money.” Meanwhile they’ll have a league wide inflation where the floor and ceiling move by certain percentage points every year. Older aging players will get their payday. Owners picket more money. We all know there are angles to all of this and the strongest angles are gonna be played by owners and established players. It’s gonna be about what’s best for the business and not what’s best for baseball as a game. People need to go read this stuff. There’s a reason some of the most lucrative franchises are all in the NFL. It’s not because of what you think. There’s a reason why MLB players are the highest paid in sports. It’s because they get a bigger piece of the pie. Now do you want the money in owners hands or players hands. That’s the question.
- 105 replies
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- griffin jax
- jhoan duran
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But then you don’t trade him. They could offer to pay Altuves contract too and receive even more. Lol
- 105 replies
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- griffin jax
- jhoan duran
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And the miller trade is only good because of De Vries. The other guys were all lottery tickets. I seen somebody rank it and it only beat the Twins deal by a couple points.
- 105 replies
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- griffin jax
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