NFL Playoffs/Early Offseason

[nicksaviking]

Greg Roman is now out too. 

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/chargers-fire-offensive-coordinator-greg-roman

Well, I guess maybe ONE of the Harbaugh brothers has decided to play modern football. TBD of course, it's possible John's doing this so he can hire Todd Monkin.

[TheLeviathan]

1 minute ago, nicksaviking said:

Greg Roman is now out too. 

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/chargers-fire-offensive-coordinator-greg-roman

Well, I guess maybe ONE of the Harbaugh brothers has decided to play modern football. TBD of course, it's possible John's doing this so he can hire Todd Monkin.

They're going to play wishbone and you're going to like it.

[TheLeviathan]

Also...this Addison situation has another layer that bear mentioning:

You could argue the only clear, bright spot pick we've made under KAM in the first 4 rounds of the draft was Addison.  (Turner is on the upswing, Jackson was solid, but not to what Addison showed IMO)

Now that one bright spot is basically drinking his way off the team.

[Parfigliano]

8 minutes ago, TheLeviathan said:

Also...this Addison situation has another layer that bear mentioning:

You could argue the only clear, bright spot pick we've made under KAM in the first 4 rounds of the draft was Addison.  (Turner is on the upswing, Jackson was solid, but not to what Addison showed IMO)

Now that one bright spot is basically drinking his way off the team.

Don't forget Addison "right add it son"  can't catch 

[Parfigliano]

14 minutes ago, TheLeviathan said:

Also...this Addison situation has another layer that bear mentioning:

You could argue the only clear, bright spot pick we've made under KAM in the first 4 rounds of the draft was Addison.  (Turner is on the upswing, Jackson was solid, but not to what Addison showed IMO)

Now that one bright spot is basically drinking his way off the team.

So old a remember when I said Kwesi should not be drafting before last year

[gunnarthor]

1 hour ago, nicksaviking said:

I suggested earlier that Pittsburgh is Flores' best shot.  And it probably still is, still, with how disappointing their offense has been since Roethlisberger retired, they might have to turn to that side of the ball.

I wonder if they'll interview Stefanski. That could be pretty funny.

[nicksaviking]

7 minutes ago, gunnarthor said:

I wonder if they'll interview Stefanski. That could be pretty funny.

If Stefanski went to Pittsburgh, I'd bet that's where Cousins ends up.

He might end up there anyway I suppose. It's unlikely Pittsburgh will get a QB with their draft position.

[gunnarthor]

Sounds like Harbaugh is going to the Giants. He'll make them respectable but I thought the same thing about Pete Carroll last year.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/47616292/sources-john-harbaugh-giants-expected-barring-setbacks

[Danchat]

1 hour ago, gunnarthor said:

Sounds like Harbaugh is going to the Giants. He'll make them respectable but I thought the same thing about Pete Carroll last year.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/47616292/sources-john-harbaugh-giants-expected-barring-setbacks

Unlike the Raiders, the Giants have quite a bit of talent that can be tapped into - hire the right coordinators and get some better injury luck, and I can see them being competitive. The Raiders roster is so bad, they have maybe 3 above average players on the entire roster (Bowers, Jeanty, Crosby), worst OL in the league and worst defensive personnel outside of Crosby. Conversely the Giants have a core on defense to build around in Burns, Carter, Thibodeax, Lawrence, Okereke, etc.

[nicksaviking]

14 minutes ago, Danchat said:

Unlike the Raiders, the Giants have quite a bit of talent that can be tapped into - hire the right coordinators and get some better injury luck, and I can see them being competitive. The Raiders roster is so bad, they have maybe 3 above average players on the entire roster (Bowers, Jeanty, Crosby), worst OL in the league and worst defensive personnel outside of Crosby. Conversely the Giants have a core on defense to build around in Burns, Carter, Thibodeax, Lawrence, Okereke, etc.

Yeah, but sounds like Todd Monkin is coming with Harbaugh. That's going to limit the offensive upside. Could be a really good defense, but if you're still running a ball control offense with less than 500 pass attempts, it's probably going to have to be an elite defense to be an actual competitor. Jaxon Dart can move, but obviously not like Lamar Jackson, and they don't have Derrick Henry, they have an injury prone rookie RB who just snapped his leg in half. 

Their best player, Malik Nabors, is going to be severely under-utilized. And all the mock drafts giving the Giants another top WR can scrap that plan. You only need one WR in that offense. 

I think Harbaugh is a good coach, but I thought he should take a year off, get a good look at league trends and then start over. If he's just going to run it back with the Giants, but without the HOF QB and RB, I don't see much of a ceiling for that team.

[Vanimal46]

4 minutes ago, nicksaviking said:

I think Harbaugh is a good coach, but I thought he should take a year off, get a good look at league trends and then start over. If he's just going to run it back with the Giants, but without the HOF QB and RB, I don't see much of a ceiling for that team.

Yeah the media is still treating Harbaugh like he's a game changing coach. Maybe I'm wrong but I view him as a floor raiser, but no longer a high ceiling type of coach. 

[TheLeviathan]

2 hours ago, Vanimal46 said:

Yeah the media is still treating Harbaugh like he's a game changing coach. Maybe I'm wrong but I view him as a floor raiser, but no longer a high ceiling type of coach. 

Here's one thing I will say in disagreement - I've never seen a team pivot their offensive identity as much at the Ravens did from Flacco to Lamar.  He shows he can put aside his ego, look at what he has to work with, and make it work.

He's a couple of bonehead player mistakes from having multiple SB appearances he didn't get to count.

[nicksaviking]

19 hours ago, TheLeviathan said:

Here's one thing I will say in disagreement - I've never seen a team pivot their offensive identity as much at the Ravens did from Flacco to Lamar.  He shows he can put aside his ego, look at what he has to work with, and make it work.

He's a couple of bonehead player mistakes from having multiple SB appearances he didn't get to count.

But I think Lamar changed the identity, I think the offense stayed the same. Baltimore ran the fewest sets in 11 personnel last year; only 30% of the time. The next closest team was Pittsburgh at 38%. They were running 13, 21 and 22 personnel constantly. They almost always were in two TE or two RB, or two TE AND two RB sets. Baltimore hasn't had a meaningful 2nd wide receiver in decades, both under Jackson and Flacco. Plenty of years they didn't even have a meaningful WR 1.

So when you have all these TEs and RBs and only one or two WRs on the field, the other team is going to stuff the box. Meanwhile the Ravens had the best running QB of all time. If they had spread it out and forced the other teams to open up the box and put their smaller and worse tackling DBs out there, Jackson would have put up even more impressive running numbers. And obviously, his passing numbers would have been better too considering WR are typically better after the catch than even a good TE like Mark Andrews. I really think Harbaugh put a damper on the best years of Jackson because he wanted to play football the way Harbaugh liked to play football.

[TheLeviathan]

3 hours ago, nicksaviking said:

But I think Lamar changed the identity, I think the offense stayed the same. Baltimore ran the fewest sets in 11 personnel last year; only 30% of the time. The next closest team was Pittsburgh at 38%. They were running 13, 21 and 22 personnel constantly. They almost always were in two TE or two RB, or two TE AND two RB sets. Baltimore hasn't had a meaningful 2nd wide receiver in decades, both under Jackson and Flacco. Plenty of years they didn't even have a meaningful WR 1.

So when you have all these TEs and RBs and only one or two WRs on the field, the other team is going to stuff the box. Meanwhile the Ravens had the best running QB of all time. If they had spread it out and forced the other teams to open up the box and put their smaller and worse tackling DBs out there, Jackson would have put up even more impressive running numbers. And obviously, his passing numbers would have been better too considering WR are typically better after the catch than even a good TE like Mark Andrews. I really think Harbaugh put a damper on the best years of Jackson because he wanted to play football the way Harbaugh liked to play football.

I understand the point, but I think we make way too many assumptions about what is best for winning.  

Top 12 teams in run percent - 7 are in the playoffs.  Bottom of that list?  Dregs of the NFL.  Baltimore has the same problem Buffalo has - the KC meat grinder.  One that Baltimore nearly overcame last year without a catastrophically bad drop.  They also consistently rank in the top ten on explosive plays too.

I get that seeing their formations may seem super old school - but their execution and results are anything but.  They've been a dangerous offensive team....no matter how many TEs or FBs are on the field.

[gunnarthor]

From what I've seen on line, it seems like the main criticism of Harbaugh (this year anyway) was not running the ball with King Henry enough. Maybe the argument is that his offense wasn't modern enough but he also wasn't calling the right run plays?

[Vanimal46]

I’m cheering hard for the Bills in the 1st game. Screw Sean Payton. 

The night game it sucks Sam Darnold is banged up for the game. I want Seattle to win, but if Darnold hasn’t been able to throw since his injury, I’m not confident in the pick. 

[nicksaviking]

3 hours ago, Vanimal46 said:

I’m cheering hard for the Bills in the 1st game. Screw Sean Payton. 

The night game it sucks Sam Darnold is banged up for the game. I want Seattle to win, but if Darnold hasn’t been able to throw since his injury, I’m not confident in the pick. 

Yeah, go Hawks.

Darnold reaaaaaly needs to win that game. Everyone turned the page on him since the poor end of last year’s season with the Vikings. Oblique injury or not, I think the national narrative is going to flip again real quick if he struggles and they lose.

Oh right, and most obviously, go Bills. Payton can get run over by a cement mixer on the way to the stadium too.

[Aggies7]

I kind of want Buffalo to win it all but then that just leaves one less team who’s never done it ☹️

[Vanimal46]

11 minutes ago, Aggies7 said:

I kind of want Buffalo to win it all but then that just leaves one less team who’s never done it ☹️

I’ve been cheering for them the last 4-5 years to take down the Chiefs. Maybe I’m the problem 

[Parfigliano]

12 minutes ago, Aggies7 said:

I kind of want Buffalo to win it all but then that just leaves one less team who’s never done it ☹️

The few...the proud

[Aggies7]

3 minutes ago, Vanimal46 said:

I’ve been cheering for them the last 4-5 years to take down the Chiefs. Maybe I’m the problem 

If not this year when 

[Vanimal46]

1 minute ago, Aggies7 said:

If not this year when 

That’s what I’m thinking. Denver is no slouch but if they get thru this game then they should beat either NE or Houston 

[Aggies7]

The bills are the AFC version of the Vikings and always will be 

[Vanimal46]

Kirko preparing for life after football? He’s on the CBS crew this game 

[Vanimal46]

11 minutes ago, Aggies7 said:

The bills are the AFC version of the Vikings and always will be 

I’ve always thought the Chargers were the AFC version of the Vikings 

[Vanimal46]

Another strip sack of Allen wow 

[flpmagikat]

Denver looking a lot better than I expected 

[gunnarthor]

Doesn't look good for Buffalo

[Vanimal46]

3 minutes ago, flpmagikat said:

Denver looking a lot better than I expected 

Defense wins championships 

[Parfigliano]

1 hour ago, Aggies7 said:

If not this year when 

Looking like not this year