First Playoff Series Win in Decades has Falvine Fingerprints All Over It

[Trov]

Nothing has a bigger debate on here than the FO and the job they are doing.  They came in after the 2016 season, ending a long run of the Terry Ryan FO, even with the short stint Ryan was gone it was still his guys running the show.  This created a huge shift in how the organization worked, as Terry Ryan was as old school as you could get.  I think Clint Eastwood shadowed him in preparing for "Trouble with the Curve".  Falvey was hired in part because he was known to be the guy to help Cleveland build their pitching pipeline.  

Many fans wanted a quick turn around after several terrible years and magic would just happen, forgetting it takes years to change things up normally.  Having most guys from the past teams there was the surprising 2017 team, followed by a let down in 2018.  Then the surging bomba squad 2019, built in part of guys brought in by Falvene FO.  Pitching was still terrible and no pipeline was in sight.  Most guys were not developing and no big names were see, outside of Gratoral, but questions about his ability to start were out there.  

2020 we trade him to get Maeda, who is Cy young runner up and leads team to playoffs.  We then make a trade for Sonny Gray.  Many different trades and signings including CC, twice, shocking the baseball world.  There are still a few guys from before 2017 season on the roster, and some came from the organization before hand too.  Mainly Buck, Kepler, Polanco, and AK are from the old FO.  AK was drafted in 2016.  Of course this is natural that over 6 years there will be turn over, but all the major contributors were guys from this FO.  The whole starting rotation was either traded for in last couple of years, or drafted by FO.  The main pen guys, outside of Griffin Jax, drafted 2016, were either drafted, or traded for by FO. 

The team was built slowly, but has a solid core for hopefully years to come.  We have to have debates on where to play guys like Lewis because others are knocking on the door.  Who do we put out there as starter, not because they are terrible, but because five guys have shown an ability to pitch in post season.  We have pen that despite many calling to have gutted farm system to upgrade at deadline has been great in 2 games so far. 

There are some outside Twins fans that think this is a good team for the playoffs and it is mostly because the Falvene FO has brought in the right guys.  Yes, it took some years, and they got many things wrong, but so does every FO.  

[2wins87]

I think the overhaul they made in the organizational structure and in bringing in player development people has been huge.  Following the minors closely, and seeing all the big improvements from previously unheralded guys, I've never really doubted that under this regime.

I have questioned some of the decision making around signing/not signing, trading, and self scouting.  I don't think its fair to expect any front office to get all of those decisions right, and they have made some really good moves along with the bad.  But they had kind of seemed to be pretty mediocre.  Given some time, many of the moves that have seemed to be the worst during the knee-jerk reaction phase, actually don't seem so bad.

I was thinking about the Mahle trade, and it is never going to look good, but I think it is interesting that a very similar package at the time could have included Julien and Wallner instead of Steer and CES.  There is still a lot of time for this to play out, but right now, I'll take the duo we kept over the duo we let go.  I don't know if either Julien or Wallner were a part of the discussion, but the self-scouting may have been better there than we realized at the time.

[jorgenswest]

Jax was also selected in 2016. He had a military commitment so it was 2018 before he had any significant minor league time. The pitching team in the organization certainly helped develop a valuable pitcher that was hard to imagine in 2021.

[Trov]

1 hour ago, 2wins87 said:

I think the overhaul they made in the organizational structure and in bringing in player development people has been huge.  Following the minors closely, and seeing all the big improvements from previously unheralded guys, I've never really doubted that under this regime.

I have questioned some of the decision making around signing/not signing, trading, and self scouting.  I don't think its fair to expect any front office to get all of those decisions right, and they have made some really good moves along with the bad.  But they had kind of seemed to be pretty mediocre.  Given some time, many of the moves that have seemed to be the worst during the knee-jerk reaction phase, actually don't seem so bad.

I was thinking about the Mahle trade, and it is never going to look good, but I think it is interesting that a very similar package at the time could have included Julien and Wallner instead of Steer and CES.  There is still a lot of time for this to play out, but right now, I'll take the duo we kept over the duo we let go.  I don't know if either Julien or Wallner were a part of the discussion, but the self-scouting may have been better there than we realized at the time.

You hit many of the things I generally try to point out.  The Mahle trade ended up bad, but Steer and CES would have been in minors most of year for us, and taking room on 40 man most likely. No move can be looked in a vacuum, but what other moves were made.  Many were upset we traded Garver for what we did, but then we flipped that to dump Donaldson so we could sign CC. The FO trusted certain people to help carry us along.  We traded for Lopez because we trusted Lewis would get healthy and possibly Julien would be ready, both pretty much came true. 

Some moves will fail terribly, like Mahle, and Dyson type trades, and some high draft picks will fail.  However, every FO has these issues.  As long as the team is building overall in a positive direction.  I mean we could be the White Sox who botched a talented group of young guys. 

Not only did we win this year, but I think we will win the division for years to come because we have depth still in minors ready to come up in next few years, assuming positive growth.  

[Fire Dan Gladden]

Considering the number of commentors trashing the FO and Rocco all year for everything under the sun, I will be interested to follow the comments on this article.

[Jocko87]

The proper metric for any management team is incremental sustained improvements.  Peruse this thread from the way back machine for reminders of progress.

 

 

[tony&rodney]

All teams will have shown significant change on their rosters since 2016. The front offices on every team do their best to sign and acquire whatever players they are able to gain with the resources at their disposal. Ownership changes for some teams and some owners change their practices on other teams. The Pohlads made significant financial investments since bringing on Falvey that were not a part of their plan previously. It is fine to think highly of this front office or any other one too. It is neither fair nor useful nor serves a purpose to make comparisons to past management folks. Change happens and circumstances do too.

The players, ultimately, are the decisive factor in a winning year. If one knew before the 2023 season the specific numbers that Byron Buxton and Carlos Correa would finish with this year, there would not be an expectation of an AL Central crown. The Mahle trade was widely lauded across Twins fandom but took an unfortunate turn. Likewise the subtraction of Luis Arraez in a trade for Pablo Lopez was panned heavily, yet that trade helped both teams into the playoffs. Additionally, the Twins received wonderful performances from a number of players who worked hard last offseason to improve themselves. I'm happy for Falvey seeing some of his work bring positive results, but it is always the players who put their jobs on the line. MLB is really difficult. There are more billionaires than major league baseball players. Sometimes it it easy to forget the extremely long odds an athlete faces to reach the highest levels. 

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

11 hours ago, Fire Dan Gladden said:

Considering the number of commentors trashing the FO and Rocco all year for everything under the sun, I will be interested to follow the comments on this article.

Emotions are running high right now. It was nice to get that monkey off our backs. Toronto came out flat and unprepared, period. Smart observers could see it. You saw it too, correct? Hats off to the Twins for taking advantage and finishing them off. That’s what good teams do.

For perspective, there are eight MLB teams still playing — a fourth of the league. Teams with high expectations. Hopefully the Twins will upset Houston and make the final four. Hopefully we can then focus on the ALCS instead of taking pot shots at each other for unpopular opinions expressed over the course of the season.

Who cares what anyone has said about Kepler, Buxton, Correa, Gallo, whoever, right? No, the front office is not great. Who cares? Let’s all set aside our hot takes until the offseason and focus on the next game. I realize I am trying to bring logic to an emotional topic here. 🙂

[Fire Dan Gladden]

9 hours ago, Hosken Bombo Disco said:

Who cares what anyone has said about Kepler, Buxton, Correa, Gallo, whoever, right? No, the front office is not great. Who cares? Let’s all set aside our hot takes until the offseason and focus on the next game. I realize I am trying to bring logic to an emotional topic here. 🙂

I see what you did here.

Go Twins!

[Trov]

10 hours ago, Hosken Bombo Disco said:

Emotions are running high right now. It was nice to get that monkey off our backs. Toronto came out flat and unprepared, period. Smart observers could see it. You saw it too, correct? Hats off to the Twins for taking advantage and finishing them off. That’s what good teams do.

 

I have said that Toronto played like the Twins in the past in playoffs had.  Toronto made several mistakes on the bases ending possible rallies.  In the past the Twins have done many of the mistakes Toronto made.  We were also saved by the near misses.  Chapman specifically had an at bat each game late in game down 2 with a chance to tie or take lead.  In game one he was about 3 feet short of a game tying ball off the wall. In game 2 he was 1 foot from hitting tying ground rule double, only to then hit inning ending double play.  A lot broke right for the Twins, but you need that in short series. 

[Beast]

They’ve been here nearly a decade and just got their first playoff win against a team that played poorly and somehow got out managed by Rocco Baldelli.  Are we so desperate that we now have people peacocking and saying “I told you so?”  Good grief.

Let’s not lose track of reality, here. They’ve still done a very, very poor job overall.  Competent baseball franchises that actually win things would fire their GM for one playoff series win in 8 years.  Let’s actually win something before we give the FO a lifetime extension like we did with Ryan.

I want them to succeed.  But, I need real success before going this far.  Not a consolation ribbon.