Top 20 Florida State League Prospects

[Seth Stohs]

Baseball America released its Top 20 Florida State League Prospect List today. Three members of the Ft. Myers Miracle were on the list:

 

#15: Kohl Stewart

#16: Stephen Gonsalves

#19: Engelb Vielma

 

I think those three all make complete sense. Anyone missing?

[2wins87]

I imagine Tyler Jay wasn't there long enough to qualify?

 

It's a little interesting to see Vielma not too far behind Stewart and Gonsalves.  I guess you have to respect someone who can play plus defense at SS.  His bat has shown a little improvement too.

[Jeremy Nygaard]

During the summer, despite how Stewart was struggling to strike people out and Gonsalves was dealing, I had heard that scouts still preferred Stewart's stuff to Gonsalves's. People ripped me for it.  And then Twins Daily left Stewart out of their mid-season Top 10. They're both Top 10 for the Twins. 

 

Good for Vielma, too.

 

I like all three. Glad they're in the organization. So many assets. (And for people that preferred Hu to both, he wasn't ranked at all.)

[Seth Stohs]

That's not to say Hu shouldn't be ranked, but yeah, he's not the prospect that Stewart and Gonsalves are. That said, I think that he's likely thought of as a trick-pitch guy by many scouts because of his palm ball. In reality, he has three good pitches and probably is underrated as a prospect.

 

No questioning Stewart's talent, and I would agree with those who say that he has more raw stuff than Gonsalves. He's also much more raw. Gonsalves is very advanced mentally/baseball IQ/pitch knowledge wise that he has put up better numbers. I also think that in saying that, it might minimize how good his stuff is too. 

[nytwinsfan]

 

During the summer, despite how Stewart was struggling to strike people out and Gonsalves was dealing, I had heard that scouts still preferred Stewart's stuff to Gonsalves's. People ripped me for it.  And then Twins Daily left Stewart out of their mid-season Top 10. They're both Top 10 for the Twins. 

 

Why did they rip you for it? Were you just reporting that scouts preferred Stewart's stuff, or did you endorse that view?  Why do scouts prefer Stewart's stuff, and if you agree, why do you? What about his stuff makes scouts (and you?) think it may ultimately be better than Gonsalves? Be really interested to hear more about this.

[clutterheart]

Most of the guys on this list from other teams where promoted to AA during the year.  

[Bob Sacamento]

Having seen the Miracle in action weekly this year, Stewart's stuff is better but just isn't playing up.

 

Synopsis of Stewart:

 

-K rate one of worst in minors

-generates lot of groundballs

-looks like back of rotation starter

-FB, sinker, changeup all lead to groundballs

-pitch sequencing needs to improve

 

.

[nytwinsfan]

 

Having seen the Miracle in action weekly this year, Stewart's stuff is better but just isn't playing up.

 

What does that mean? What about his stuff is "good" or better than Gonsalves' stuff? Fastball is faster, curveball is curvier,  slider is slidier, and changeup is changier?

[Jeremy Nygaard]

 

Why did they rip you for it? Were you just reporting that scouts preferred Stewart's stuff, or did you endorse that view?  Why do scouts prefer Stewart's stuff, and if you agree, why do you? What about his stuff makes scouts (and you?) think it may ultimately be better than Gonsalves? Be really interested to hear more about this.

 

There's a lot of layers to putting together prospect lists. For some people, it's just preference, box-score reading, reading what's readily available, etc. John Manuel put together the FSL list, but you know there is a lot more to it than what I mentioned. He probably didn't see all of those guys, but yet he put the list together and will hear about it from the people that agree/disagree with it.

 

So on my mid-season list, I heard about it when I had Stewart above Gonsalves. Part of the reason for that ranking wasn't because of anything I saw or read it a box score, it was what I heard from scouts. 

 

I think BA sums it up pretty well in their blurbs: Stewart throws four pitches for strikes that produce groundballs. Batters just aren't missing those pitches. They also aren't hitting them hard.

 

Gonsalves needs to figure out a breaking ball. He's going to struggle to find success in the upper levels if he doesn't. Why do you think Gonsalves is at instructs?

 

The flip side of this coin? Gonsalves is a lefty with a (maybe) 95 mph fastball as a starter. He will pitch in the major leagues in some capacity simply because of that. Stewart, well, if he doesn't improve, that's a completely different story.

[TRex]

 

Having seen the Miracle in action weekly this year, Stewart's stuff is better but just isn't playing up.

 

Synopsis of Stewart:

 

-K rate one of worst in minors

-generates lot of groundballs

-looks like back of rotation starter

-FB, sinker, changeup all lead to groundballs

-pitch sequencing needs to improve

 

.

Knowing that it is the most talked about pitch in DT MLT section...

 

Is the lack of comment on Stewart's slider indicative of either how much you've seen it, or what you think of it?

[Bob Sacamento]

 

 

Gonsalves needs to figure out a breaking ball. He's going to struggle to find success in the upper levels if he doesn't. Why do you think Gonsalves is at instructs?

 

The flip side of this coin? Gonsalves is a lefty with a (maybe) 95 mph fastball as a starter. He will pitch in the major leagues in some capacity simply because of that. Stewart, well, if he doesn't improve, that's a completely different story.

Well you might want to tell Stephen that's why he's in Instructs because when I asked him, he seemed pretty much clueless why he was back after the season he just had.  But yes, Gonsalves' slider and curveball are lagging behind his FB-CH.  There is also the worry that he needs to build up better stamina and strength to go further into ballgames

[Bob Sacamento]

 

 

Knowing that it is the most talked about pitch in DT MLT section...

 

Is the lack of comment on Stewart's slider indicative of either how much you've seen it, or what you think of it?

It's not a swing and miss pitch at this point and doesn't look like its' going to be.  Of his four offerings the slider is used the least and is the least effective.

[sane]

 

Baseball America released its Top 20 Florida State League Prospect List today. Three members of the Ft. Myers Miracle were on the list:

 

#15: Kohl Stewart

#16: Stephen Gonsalves

#19: Engelb Vielma

 

I think those three all make complete sense. Anyone missing?

Kohl Stewart? ...RATS!

Matt Batts had better stats!

 

That is my poetry contribution!

[nicksaviking]

 

Knowing that it is the most talked about pitch in DT MLT section...

 

Is the lack of comment on Stewart's slider indicative of either how much you've seen it, or what you think of it?

 

Good question, it would seem to be the biggest unknown with Stewart even while there's no reason for it not to be known.

 

Nearly everyone who is anyone when it comes to strikeouts, throws a slider or a curve on 20% or more of their pitches, and their fastball is generally used less than 55%.

[nytwinsfan]

 

So on my mid-season list, I heard about it when I had Stewart above Gonsalves. Part of the reason for that ranking wasn't because of anything I saw or read it a box score, it was what I heard from scouts. 

 

I think BA sums it up pretty well in their blurbs: Stewart throws four pitches for strikes that produce groundballs. Batters just aren't missing those pitches. They also aren't hitting them hard.

 

Gonsalves needs to figure out a breaking ball. He's going to struggle to find success in the upper levels if he doesn't. Why do you think Gonsalves is at instructs?

 

The flip side of this coin? Gonsalves is a lefty with a (maybe) 95 mph fastball as a starter. He will pitch in the major leagues in some capacity simply because of that. Stewart, well, if he doesn't improve, that's a completely different story.

Thanks Jeremy. I really appreciate the insights into these details.

[sane]

Matt Batts     8 4 2.77 17 17 1 1 0 100.2 96   36 31 3 5 17 85 1.12 0 0
Kohl Stewart 7 8 3.20 22 22 1 0 0 129.1 134 63 46 2 6 45 71 1.38 0 0

name            WL ERA G GS  SO   IP       H    R   ER     BB K  WHIP

 

MATT BATTS HAD BETTER STATS!

[nicksaviking]

 

 

It's not a swing and miss pitch at this point and doesn't look like its' going to be.  Of his four offerings the slider is used the least and is the least effective.

 

I want to like your post for the provided insight, but geez, the content is so completely unlikeable I just can't do it.

 

That would be disappointing considering we were sold on the belief that Stewart had mid-to-upper 90's heat which seems to have turned into low-to-mid-90's heat and he had a wipeout slider.

 

If he can't get that slider going, I don't see what there is to look forward to.  Sinkers and changeups are the calling card of low-ceiling, high-contact, back-of-the-rotation starters everywhere.

[Bob Sacamento]

 

 

What does that mean? What about his stuff is "good" or better than Gonsalves' stuff? Fastball is faster, curveball is curvier,  slider is slidier, and changeup is changier?

If you base it off the old 20-80 scout grade (50 is MLB avg), currently Kohl's FB is 55, SL 45, CH 50, CV 50, command 40.  Gonsalves FB 55, SL 40, CH 50 CV 35, command 40.  My personal grades on the two.

[Jeremy Nygaard]

 

 

Well you might want to tell Stephen that's why he's in Instructs because when I asked him, he seemed pretty much clueless why he was back after the season he just had.  But yes, Gonsalves' slider and curveball are lagging behind his FB-CH.  There is also the worry that he needs to build up better stamina and strength to go further into ballgames

 

I agree. How many other players not going to the AFL are in instructs that pitched in FM? 

 

It just seems far-fetched (to me) that throwing these innings is going to make a strength/stamina difference next July/August. Working on developing/new pitches in a game situation (against inferior hitters) seems much more likely. 

 

Regardless, all of this goes without saying that Gonsalves is a Top 4 pitching prospect in the organization and also someone the Twins didn't seem overly willing to part with during trade talks. 

[Dman]

I like the season Vielma put together.  Defense is his calling card but his offense improved significantly IMO.  Not sure if he can keep the offense up in AA but if he can then we have a really good SS on the way.  Won't likely hit for power but if the OBP is good then he can be more than a utility player.

[Jeremy Nygaard]

 

 

If he can't get that slider going, I don't see what there is to look forward to.  Sinkers and changeups are the calling card of low-ceiling, high-contact, back-of-the-rotation starters everywhere.

 

And that's what BA calls him in the write-up. There's still hope, though. Remember, he was a Texas footballer, and was still pretty new to pitching when he got drafted. He's also dealt with shoulder stuff so he hasn't thrown as many innings by this point of his career as one would hope.

[nytwinsfan]

 

 

 

I agree. How many other players not going to the AFL are in instructs that pitched in FM? 

 

It just seems far-fetched (to me) that throwing these innings is going to make a strength/stamina difference next July/August. Working on developing/new pitches in a game situation (against inferior hitters) seems much more likely. 

 

Regardless, all of this goes without saying that Gonsalves is a Top 4 pitching prospect in the organization and also someone the Twins didn't seem overly willing to part with during trade talks. 

 

Yup, probably working on the breaking ball. Usually the changeup is the last thing to arrive, so he is kind of in the reverse situation.

[Bob Sacamento]

 

I like the season Vielma put together.  Defense is his calling card but his offense improved significantly IMO.  Not sure if he can keep the offense up in AA but if he can then we have a really good SS on the way.  Won't likely hit for power but if the OBP is good then he can be more than a utility player.

Synopsis on Vielma:

-Best defense in system

-soft hands, plus arm

-no power

-good bunter

-good speed, improved instincts over last year

[Mike Sixel]

Still being patient on Stewart, if there isn't progress next year, I'll worry. I think a player that has success in an unconventional way is often under rated by scouts, and Hu might fall in that camp. But, I have no idea if that is true or not.

[jokin]

 

Matt Batts     8 4 2.77 17 17 1 1 0 100.2 96   36 31 3 5 17 85 1.12 0 0
Kohl Stewart 7 8 3.20 22 22 1 0 0 129.1 134 63 46 2 6 45 71 1.38 0 0

name            WL ERA G GS  SO   IP       H    R   ER     BB K  WHIP

 

MATT BATTS HAD BETTER STATS!

 

24 year old 5'11" bulldog Low-D-1 College pitcher vs. 20 year old 6'3" HS Athletic Stud High Major QB still learning how to pitch-

 

Not comparable-

 

but that's a nice rhyme and it might be the mantra that keeps propelling the Little Engine that Could ever forward.  (BTW,, it's "Mat").

[Monkeypaws]

Because Stewart has only been dedicated to baseball since the Twins signed him, I wouldn't be surprised to see a breakthrough season next year. He's certainly a premium athlete.

[jokin]

 

Synopsis on Vielma:

-Best defense in system

-soft hands, plus arm

-no power

-good bunter

-good speed, improved instincts over last year

 

Bob, Vielma was 1.6 years younger than league average, and the stats show he flipped the switch on June 3-  PA 310 Slash .322/.380/.356  BB%/K% 8.7%/11.5%.  What's not to like if you have a potential OBP machine and speedster to turn it over in the #9 spot- with plus-plus defense @ SS?

 

Did you notice any growth as a hitter in the last 3 months that confirm this nice run and possibly indicate that  this could trranslate to the majors in a couple years?

 

I'm pleasantly surprised that Vielma made this fairly exclusive list.  Did you see enough of the other FSL clubs to affirm that it's warranted?  And again, does such a high honor indicate that he has a legitimately higher ceiling than MLB utility man?

[Thrylos]

Based on age (same), stuff, and success on pro baseball there is little that justifies Stewart over Gonsalves other than draft position and I'd argue that 3 years in the pros, that should not matter

[Bob Sacamento]

 

Bob, Vielma was 1.6 years younger than league average, and the stats show he flipped the switch on June 3-  PA 310 Slash .322/.380/.356  BB%/K% 8.7%/11.5%.  What's not to like if you have a potential OBP machine and speedster to turn it over in the #9 spot- with plus-plus defense @ SS?

 

Did you notice any growth as a hitter in the last 3 months that confirm this nice run and possibly indicate that  this could trranslate to the majors in a couple years?

 

I'm pleasantly surprised that Vielma made this fairly exclusive list.  Did you see enough of the other FSL clubs to affirm that it's warranted?  And again, does such a high honor indicate that he has a legitimately higher ceiling than MLB utility man?

He started to hit the ball more in the air than on the ground and that made big difference in the number of hits tht fell, he also appeared to square more up on the ball.  I saw every club this season, some more than others Cards, Yanks, StoneCrabs (Rays), so yes this is warranted but I wouldn't read too much into it.  Honestly, his ceiling is probably a .270/.330/.330/.660ish line with gold glove defense at SS but that's everything right, still his glove will continue him along the organizational ladder. Utility guy is more likely but a great guy to have on the bench of a MLB club

[Seth Stohs]

 

Still being patient on Stewart, if there isn't progress next year, I'll worry. I think a player that has success in an unconventional way is often under rated by scouts, and Hu might fall in that camp. But, I have no idea if that is true or not.

 

Yup, I think patience is important, and yet they've really pushed him. He's been OK at the levels he's pitched at but not dominating. If it was me, I'd start him back at Ft. Myers for a half season. No harm in that. He's still young. See if he can dominate a little bit for a month or two. It wouldn't set him back, and he can continue to progress.