Reusse: Let Gardy go

[ThePuck]

At least Ryan has a very good understanding of the situation we're in and Gardy and his role in it.

 

'General manager Terry Ryan gave Gardenhire a vote of confidence before Friday's game, calling reports that Gardenhire and the Twins could part ways inaccurate.

 

"It doesn't bother me at all, because there's no validity to it," Ryan said. "He and I are the leadership of this organization, and we take accountability. He is basically in the clubhouse and in the dugout, and I'm in charge of the whole operation, and we both are feeling like we're letting the people down. It's as simple as that."'

[JB_Iowa]

Gardenhire has no intention of stepping down | twinsbaseball.com: News

 

Bollinger's full take on Gardenhire with the quotes Puck cites above.

[Guest USAFChief]

It's almost always over when it gets so bad someone feels the need for a "vote of confidence."

[Thrylos]

Per your request, an updated list, with a commensurate change in my assessment of the NL qualifier for the K/9 differential:

 

Jason Marquis 3.28 K/9 Twins 7.6 K/9 Padres

Jesse Crain 6.22 K/9 Twins 10.56 K/9 Sox

Kyle Lohse 5.01 K/9 Twins 5.60 K/9 Since traded

RA Dickey 5.88 K/9 Twins 6.83 K/9 Since traded

Kevin Slowey 6.67 K/9 Twins 7.20 K/9 Marlins

Matt Guerrier 5.91 K/9 Twins 6.53 K/9 Dodgers

Matt Garza 7.11 K/9 Twins 7.68 K/9 Since traded

 

 

The trends are all negative, but I'm not sure they are statistically significant. What if the question is asked in reverse, how much does a pitcher's K/9 drop after joining the Twins?---

 

Vance Worley 4.62 K/9 Twins 7.71 K/9 Phillies

Kevin Correia 5.04 K/9 Twins 6.04 K/9 before Twins

Mike Pelfrey 4.90 K/9 Twins 5.08 K/9 before Twins

Josh Roenicke 5.77 K/9 Twins 6.81 K/9 before Twins

Matt Capps 5.39 K/9 Twins 6.93 K/9 before Twins

Carl Pavano 4.83 K/9 Twins 5.75 K/9 before Twins

Probably the National League effect to a certain extent.

 

Your list is more recent including this season's additions, but I went over this topic here last season in depth, looking at things such as WHIP & ERA as well and not only K/9. Conclusion of course is the same

 

So it might be interesting reading

[Brock Beauchamp]

What I've learned from this thread is that pitchers in the NL strike out more batters than pitchers in the AL... Anywhere between 0.5-1.0 more batters per nine innings.

 

Which falls right in line with almost every other study and number comparison I've seen.

[ThePuck]

Is it strange that the top three pitching staffs in strikeouts are AL teams?

 

Top 3

4 of the top 5

7 of the top 10.

 

702Ks in the AL right now, 684 in the NL

[Brock Beauchamp]

Is it strange that the top three pitching staffs in strikeouts are AL teams?

 

In a word, yes. Not exceeding strange, as the AL has been a better league for some time, but still strange.

 

The AL has more strikeouts than the NL this season, period... Now that is exceedingly strange.

[Rosterman]

Who would they get? We hear Molitor. I wonder if Steinbach should be elevated to the post...probably something like that would happen for the remainder of the year.

 

The mistake was that the house wasn't totally cleaned last season. You could've shifted Vavra to be minor league hitting instructor. But you needed to say goodbye to Ullger and Anderson, sadly.

 

The bigger question is who can you bring in as GM. The Twins organization is very stale. Everyone throughout the administration would be considered a lifer in any other business, and a total oddity in the world of baseball.

 

They constantly promote from within.

 

We can assume that future on-field management will include such names as Jake Mauer, Tommy Watkins, maybe Jeff Smith, or perhaps Gene Glynn will get a chance actually manage.

 

Locally, the Twins still have Tim laudner and Roy Smalley who would be great on-field guys if they wanted to commit. Why Ron Coomer isn't a major league hitting coach, instead of an announcer, is beyond me. Or Danny Gladden working on the field. Bert is beyond pitching coach status now, but you never know.

 

But can this team go outside, and continue to go outside when major vacancies occur. Still someone else's Scouting Director, or minor league development manager. Grad up-coming assistant gms from other teams. Get a baseball guy in as president (shades of MacPhail).

[TheLeviathan]

Locally, the Twins still have Tim laudner and Roy Smalley who would be great on-field guys if they wanted to commit. Why Ron Coomer isn't a major league hitting coach, instead of an announcer, is beyond me. Or Danny Gladden working on the field. Bert is beyond pitching coach status now, but you never know.

 

It could be unfair...but when I listen to Laudner, Smalley, Coomer, and Gladden talk about baseball....I can't imagine them coaching. They are very surface-level analysts. Coomer is the only one I see even remotely go beyond that level.

 

When I contrast that to hearing Molitor talk, it's night and day. The difference between how an intelligent 7th grader describes how gravity works compared to an intelligent first grader. The depth of thought and analysis is just so much deeper and more profound.

 

I would be pretty upset if any of those gentleman was handed a coaching position quite frankly.

[ashbury]

The difference between how an intelligent 7th grader describes how gravity works compared to an intelligent first grader. The depth of thought and analysis is just so much deeper and more profound.

 

Just wait until you talk shop with a college Physics professor someday. Prepare. To. Have. Your. Mind. Blown.

[TheLeviathan]

Just wait until you talk shop with a college Physics professor someday. Prepare. To. Have. Your. Mind. Blown.

 

Would that be analogous to Jon Madden or somenas-yet-discovered, holy grail-type who has not yet been hired? Either way, I'd be quite happy with him too.

 

I think it was Laudner I heard on PA's show the other day and I lasted about five minutes. I'm not sure if it was that my mind was blown, but it was certainly felt like it was starting to leak out of my ears.

[KernelsGuy1]

If the Twins want to line up a manager with the talent that will be arriving at the major league level in 2014-16, etc., there are two clear options within the organization: Doug Mientkiewicz and Jake Mauer. It would be a a leap for both, but Terry Ryan shouldn't put it past himself making the change.

 

Mauer would be more ready, IMO.

[Brock Beauchamp]

If the Twins want to line up a manager with the talent that will be arriving at the major league level in 2014-16, etc., there are two clear options within the organization: Doug Mientkiewicz and Jake Mauer. It would be a a leap for both, but Terry Ryan shouldn't put it past himself making the change.

 

Mauer would be more ready, IMO.

 

Doug Mientkiewicz, maybe.

 

But Paul Molitor looks like a much more viable option than Mauer. In every interview I've seen, Molitor comes across like a baseball professional... A guy that understands hitting and the game. It also explains why he got better with age, too (kind of a position player version of Greg Maddux). He knows baseball. I wish he would have taken a coaching job with the Twins earlier to acclimate himself to coaching but even without doing that, I think he's a good candidate for the job.

[ThePuck]

If Manuel stays the manager of the Phillies after this year, we have to try and get Ryne Sandberg.

[stringer bell]

I think we have to separate between how well someone knows baseball and how well someone speaks. Molitor is good in front of the camera and the microphone and so is Smalley, while some of the other guys are not nearly as literate. It is part of the manager's job to speak for the team on the field, but a larger part of their job is manage his players on the field. As young as the Twins figure to be in the next couple years, they might do well to go with an experienced manager, although it's tough for the public to swallow a "retread".

[diehardtwinsfan]

I think we have to separate between how well someone knows baseball and how well someone speaks. Molitor is good in front of the camera and the microphone and so is Smalley, while some of the other guys are not nearly as literate. It is part of the manager's job to speak for the team on the field, but a larger part of their job is manage his players on the field. As young as the Twins figure to be in the next couple years, they might do well to go with an experienced manager, although it's tough for the public to swallow a "retread".

 

I agree with this, but I'd add to it a bit. Just because someone knows baseball and can look good in front of a camera doesn't mean that they are capable of developing said talent. Whomever replaces Gardy (assuming he's gone) should be someone who is capable of teaching these kids as well as establishing an environment in the clubhouse that allows them to succeed. This type of talent is not the kind the public will see... ever... but it's instrumental to what the team will need.

[TheLeviathan]

I think we have to separate between how well someone knows baseball and how well someone speaks. Molitor is good in front of the camera and the microphone and so is Smalley, while some of the other guys are not nearly as literate. It is part of the manager's job to speak for the team on the field, but a larger part of their job is manage his players on the field. As young as the Twins figure to be in the next couple years, they might do well to go with an experienced manager, although it's tough for the public to swallow a "retread".

 

My contention, though, is that you can tell what kind of teacher someone will be by the nuance, intelligence, and approach they use in public. If you can't get your point across to the public, why should you get it across any better to the players?

[ashbury]

My contention, though, is that you can tell what kind of teacher someone will be by the nuance, intelligence, and approach they use in public. If you can't get your point across to the public, why should you get it across any better to the players?

 

Because the players aren't the general public, for one thing.

 

A manager who tries to bench the public for three games because they didn't hustle will be fired right away.

[TheLeviathan]

Because the players aren't the general public, for one thing.

 

Maybe that matters. And maybe I'm asking too much for our manager to be above what amounts to grunting cliches ala Laudner.

 

I've always thought one of the problems with Gardenhire is he's just not all that bright. Good guy, knows baseball, but he's just very simple. He doesn't try to analyze things at any depth. A guy like Maddon, just comes off as bright and capable of depth of thought. I want that kind of manager.

[The Wise One]

I've always thought one of the problems with Gardenhire is he's just not all that bright. Good guy, knows baseball, but he's just very simple. He doesn't try to analyze things at any depth. QUOTE]

Have you met and worked with Gardenhire? There would be a good number of people on this board that I would make the same assesment of them based on the filter of the board. I know bette than that, but I do wonder a little.

If what you know is Gardenhire on the microphone addressing what he thinkls are a bunch of people that he has to keep it simple for then you have an extremely limited source of informaton. It is also filtered by someone else.

[TheLeviathan]

If what you know is Gardenhire on the microphone addressing what he thinkls are a bunch of people that he has to keep it simple for then you have an extremely limited source of informaton. It is also filtered by someone else.

 

Maybe, but again, not all managers do this. Like I've said - listen to Molitor talk. Liston to Maddon talk. You don't have to be a lumbering cliche-monster every time you speak. Of course that is an outside assessment, but that's all any of us can make here really.

 

(And, for the record, there are things he does as a manager that I think reinforce that: strict roles, one-dimensional thinking about roles, treatment of young players in the past, throwing players under the bus publicly, etc.)