Miller: Twins Ticket Sales "Muted"

[John Bonnes]

Phil Miller finds out from Dave St. Peter that the first day of single game ticket sales wasn't great, but St. Peter doesn't see too precipitous of a drop:

 

Still, the Twins sold 50,000 tickets on Saturday, St. Peter said, and have moved more than 1.8 million for the season. They remain on pace, St. Peter said, for the equivalent of 19,000 season tickets sold.

 

"We remain confident we'll continue to be one of the best-drawing teams in baseball," St. Peter said.

 

That confidence would seem to be misplaced. Last year, the Twins drew 2.77 million - and ranked 12th overall. Last year, the dividing line between the top 15 and bottom 15 was about 2.35M. Would the Twins sink that low?

 

Consider that season ticket sales have gone down from 25,000 to 19,000, which is a 24% drop. A similar drop in overall sales would put the twins at 2.1 million this year.

 

Early indications show decreased demand for Twins tickets | StarTribune.com

[mcrow]

Would serve them right by stuffing money in their pockets and putting out a poor quality product. As loyal as Twins fans are eventually they will stop paying to see this team.

[Oldgoat_MN]

One thing I do not understand about the business side of baseball is how they can put bad product on the field several years in a row.

The Orioles had a great season in 2012, but had a hell of a time getting people to come out to the ballpark. Although attendance jumped in the second half, the results were well below average for the year. They had not been competitive for years and lost fans.

Once fans stop coming to the park it is difficult to get them to start coming out again.

Putting a non-competitive team on the field 3 years in a row can be very, very costly.

[Willihammer]

This 81% figure came up again on your podcast this week John. Maybe St Peter arrived at that figure because some people changed their plans from full season to partial-season, and thus aren't counted in your 19,000 figure of full-season ticket sales above?

[FrodaddyG]

This 81% figure came up again on your podcast this week John. Maybe St Peter arrived at that figure because some people changed their plans from full season to partial-season, and thus aren't counted in your 19,000 figure of full-season ticket sales above?

I'd imagine the "equivalent of" 19,000 full season tickets would incorporate the partial season ticket packages used as some percentage of a "full season" package.

[Willihammer]

That would make sense. Must be that 81% of season "ticketholders" renewed, but actual sales were only 76% compared to last year.

[Brock Beauchamp]

One thing I do not understand about the business side of baseball is how they can put bad product on the field several years in a row.

The Orioles had a great season in 2012, but had a hell of a time getting people to come out to the ballpark. Although attendance jumped in the second half, the results were well below average for the year. They had not been competitive for years and lost fans.

Once fans stop coming to the park it is difficult to get them to start coming out again.

Putting a non-competitive team on the field 3 years in a row can be very, very costly.

 

I've been saying this for awhile. It took ten years to build up the goodwill this team has with fans and now they're pissing it away.

 

But there's no changing it now. They made their bed.

[Mike Sixel]

If I was governor, I'd push for a law requiring the Twins to pay the state and county for every dollar below the last year on the dome, adjusted for baseball inflation. They wanted money, if they won't spend it, pay back the taxpayers.......

 

I hope no one goes this year, if they are bad again. It is the only power we have to get changes made.

[John Bonnes]

This 81% figure came up again on your podcast this week John. Maybe St Peter arrived at that figure because some people changed their plans from full season to partial-season, and thus aren't counted in your 19,000 figure of full-season ticket sales above?

 

Yeah, I thought of that as we were wrapping up that discussion, bue decided to move on. I suspect the difference is people downgrading their ticket packages.

 

I suspect that amount is more than the 5% difference between 19% annd 24%. At the media luncheon before twins fest, St. Peter said the season ticket sales were about 18,000, and that's about when he said 81% renewal, too. That would be 28%. And that also doesn't take into account any new season ticket holders.

[drjim]

If only they signed Saunders, Marcum and another middle infielder - ticket sales would be through the roof!

[drjim]

If I was governor, I'd push for a law requiring the Twins to pay the state and county for every dollar below the last year on the dome, adjusted for baseball inflation. They wanted money, if they won't spend it, pay back the taxpayers.......

 

I hope no one goes this year, if they are bad again. It is the only power we have to get changes made.

 

Two problems. The state didn't contribute any money and payroll is higher than the last year in the Dome.

[snepp]

If only they signed Saunders, Marcum and another middle infielder - ticket sales would be through the roof!

 

Yup, putting a better team on the field would be disastrous for attendance, both now, and in the future. Those marginal upgrades couldn't possibly help one bit.

[Craig Arko]

If I was governor, I'd push for a law requiring the Twins to pay the state and county for every dollar below the last year on the dome, adjusted for baseball inflation. They wanted money, if they won't spend it, pay back the taxpayers.......

 

I hope no one goes this year, if they are bad again. It is the only power we have to get changes made.

 

Well, I plan to attend a few games this year. Sorry if that offends anyone's tender and delicate sensibilities.

 

Okay, I'm really not sorry.

[Mike Sixel]

Adjusted for baseball inflation...ok, give the money to the county.

[Mike Sixel]

Why would that offend me?

[twinsnorth49]

If only they signed Saunders, Marcum and another middle infielder - ticket sales would be through the roof!

 

You're right, it was a good decision not to do anything the fans might want to buy tickets to see. I guess if the Twins are content to just wait for the future, I'll wait until then as well.

[Brock Beauchamp]

If only they signed Saunders, Marcum and another middle infielder - ticket sales would be through the roof!

 

How long you gonna keep banging that drum?

[drjim]

How long you gonna keep banging that drum?

 

Probably as long as people think any of those moves would make much of a difference in attendance this year.

 

I agree with you that they made their bed, but only in the sense that they have sucked the past two years and the organization is in pretty bad shape as far as young talent in the majors is concerned. That is what keeps people away, not signing Correia instead of Saunders or Marcum.

[Rosterman]

Let's see if the Tins p.r. machine can spark some interest and that someone like Hicks makes us want to see the Twins try and win in 2013. I don't think the return of Bruno and Steinbach should be a Twins 2013 selling point.

[silverslugger]

I was able to attend my first game at Target Field last July. My wife bought tickets in early April, back when some still thought they had a chance for a bounce back year, at face value. I'd like to go to a game again this year. We won't be dumb enough to pay face value as I'm relatively certain their will be an abundance of tickets available on the secondary market by July.

[TheLeviathan]

I would imagine by August you'll be able to pay between 10-25% of face value. And, as a former season ticket holder, I can tell you prices like that will drive season ticket holders away which will hurt the team's available budget.

 

A few of those "marginal" upgrades were not only 2013 investments, they were investments in the 2015-217 fanbase as well.

[FrodaddyG]

Probably as long as people think any of those moves would make much of a difference in attendance this year.

 

I agree with you that they made their bed, but only in the sense that they have sucked the past two years and the organization is in pretty bad shape as far as young talent in the majors is concerned. That is what keeps people away, not signing Correia instead of Saunders or Marcum.

Yep, why even try to get better in any increment and give people the hope that if they are on the fence about going to a game that the team they could go see will be acceptably decent? Hell, why sign Correia or anybody at all? 25 minimum salaries or bust! It doesn't matter!

[Willihammer]

Am I the only one that thinks these figures seem high?

[twinsnorth49]

Probably as long as people think any of those moves would make much of a difference in attendance this year.

 

I agree with you that they made their bed, but only in the sense that they have sucked the past two years and the organization is in pretty bad shape as far as young talent in the majors is concerned. That is what keeps people away, not signing Correia instead of Saunders or Marcum.

 

No, sucking the past two years, not much young, MLB ready talent, razor thin SP and doing absolutely NOTHING to address it, despite ample funds and opportunity, from a paying customers perspective, is what keeps people away.

[drjim]

Yep, why even try to get better in any increment and give people the hope that if they are on the fence about going to a game that the team they could go see will be acceptably decent? Hell, why sign Correia or anybody at all? 25 minimum salaries or bust! It doesn't matter!

 

They did bring in three new starters and a couple of bullpen arms. I think they are trying to get better while also balancing against avoiding bad contracts and not blocking young players.

 

I understand people don't like the Correia signing - I don't either! But to take a decrease in season tickets sales and to suggest the reason is because of some pet signing they didn't do is absurd.

[TheLeviathan]

I understand people don't lime the Correia signing -but I don't either! But to take a decrease in season tickets sales and to suggest the reason is because of some pet signing they didn't do is absurd.

 

Ticket sales are linked to fan enthusiasm. This offseason gave the fanbase ZERO reason to be enthusiastic about next year. So you can cherry pick any names you want to say "that guy wouldn't have done it" but it's intentionally missing the entire point.

[drjim]

No, sucking the past two years, not much young, MLB ready talent, razor thin SP and doing absolutely NOTHING to address it, despite ample funds and opportunity, from a paying customers perspective, is what keeps people away.

 

If you think adding three new starters to the opening day rotation is nothing I don't know what to say. I agree that the upgrade could have been marginally better with McCarthy or Marcum but to virtually all fans that difference really wouldn't register and certainly wouldn't impact decisions to buy tickets.

[twinsnorth49]

They did bring in three new starters and a couple of bullpen arms. I think they are trying to get better while also balancing against avoiding bad contracts and not blocking young players.

 

I understand people don't like the Correia signing - I don't either! But to take a decrease in season tickets sales and to suggest the reason is because of some pet signing they didn't do is absurd.

 

Ok, I'll agree the performance on the field the last 2 years plays a role in the decrease, but thinking the Twins doing pretty much nil to address that in the interim, despite said pathetic performance, is beyond absurd.

[drjim]

Ticket sales are linked to fan enthusiasm. This offseason gave the fanbase ZERO reason to be enthusiastic about next year. So you can cherry pick any names you want to say "that guy wouldn't have done it" but it's intentionally missing the entire point.

 

I disagree. I think the bigger point is there was very little Terry Ryan and the front office could have done this offseason to change fan enthusiasm and the overall ticket sales trend.

 

The names I "cherry picked" were the very guys we have been talking about all offseason.

[TheLeviathan]

Ok, I'll agree the performance on the field the last 2 years plays a role in the decrease, but thinking the Twins doing pretty much nil to address that in the interim, despite said pathetic performance, is beyond absurd.

 

Marginally absurd. Because apparently "significant" = "marginal"