Eduardo Escobar Watch

[yarnivek1972]

 

There's no reason to get rid of Escobar. Most teams carry two backup IFs on the 25 man roster, particularly if one of them can be the 5th OF.  The only reason its an issue for the Twins is the 8 man bullpen. Really, the question should be do we carry Escobar, a  backup OF with a better glove than Grossman  while retaining Grossman's bat, the eighth member of the bullpen, probably Haley, or a 3rd catcher. We can have 2 of the 4 but not three. I'm frankly okay with the decision to keep  Escobar and the eighth bullpen picture because there really isn't anyone in AAA that really deserves to be up at the major-league level and Granite and Garver are both better off getting playing every day in AAA for now. 

 

 

Not sure that's accurate.  Looking at AL rosters, the only ones carrying 5 listed infielders are the Tigers, Royals, Angels, Rangers and Twins.  That's 1/3, certainly not most.  The Astros only have 4 listed. I'm sure NL teams do, but NL teams don't have a DH.

[jimbo92107]

 

To me, the term "super sub" implies a guy that is good enough to be a regular starter and perhaps maybe even be the guy who gives most of the rest of the regulars a day off.

 

IMO that isn't Escobar.  Even at his BEST, you are talking about a barely replacement level hitter (.709 career OPS vs LH starting pitchers).  He's even worse vs RHP, which is what 65% or more starters in MLB are.  YEs, I think it is legit to pigeon hole numbers vs STARTING pitchers if the implication is that Escobar is a "super sub".  A lot of hitters can beat up on mediocre middle relievers.  How you do against STARTERS determines whether or not you deserve to be one.

 

 

IMO Escobar is a back up infielder, nothing more.  If you are expecting consistent offensive contribution from your back up infielder, you are setting yourself (and your team) up for failure.  To that extent, Adrianza and Escobar clearly overlap roles.  Adrianza is without a doubt the superior defensive player.  And while he really hasn't had much of an opportunity to display it, the "eye test" sure suggests that he is fast.  Times he's made routine plays at first look very close, etc.

 

Point being, would the Twins be better served with Zach Granite on the roster?  Possibly.  Given Byron Buxton's penchant for crashing into walls, perhaps most definitely.  But wouldn't Palka provide more punch?  Perhaps, but wouldn't he also duplicate Kennys Vargas?  BH Park?  OK.  To do what? The Twins already have 2 (3 if you include Grossman) DH/1B types.  How do balance playing time for a 4th?  I know many have suggested cutting Vargas.  You are certainly entitled to that opinion, but I pretty strongly believe that he is a better hitter than Park.  One of Falvey's most noteworthy actions was to NOT add Park to the 40 man roster this spring.  If he wouldn't do it when Park was hot, why would he when he is not?  btw, Park's numbers in AAA this year are lower than Vargas'.  Park has about 10 more PA.

 

Would that disrupt Granite's development?  Development for what?  First off, he projects as a reserve type.  Second, he's older than 2 of the 3 current OF starters and less than a year younger than the third - who has roughly 2 seasons at the MLB level under his belt.

 

So, yeah, if someone makes an offer for Escobar, you'd better believe I'm listening.  Right now, I doubt any offers are coming in.

A lot to unpack here, but the main point about Zach Granite is valid. He's hitting well (.293), and he's a legit sub for Buxton in CF and on the bases. 

 

Meanwhile, how to replace what Esco does? My own definition of "super-sub" doesn't really require starter-level quality, more like positional flexibility and a decent bat, which Esco brings. Depending what areas of the field you want to back-up, you could go with any of Palka (DH, 1B, RF), Granite (OF, pinch runner), Vielma (3B, SS, 2B pinch runner), or Goodrum (IF, OF, pinch runner). The closest to another Escobar probably would be Goodrum, who can play anywhere but pitcher and catcher. 

[David HK]

If they trade Escobar, who is the back up third baseman? Adrianza doesn't have the bat, and there in't many deserving options in AAA or AA.

Sano won't go the whole year without an injury. So I say its best to keep Escobar on the 25 man roster.

Free Matt Hague!

 

Lol

[mlhouse]

If you can make a trade for Escobar, then do it.  He does not figure into the long term plan.   Escobar had two pretty solid seasons in 2014 and 2015, but his career OBP is < 300 and OPS < 700.  He isn't a great hitter to begin with and he did not hit well last season and this season doesnt look that great either.

 

Give Adrianza an opportunity to come back to his mean OPS of 620 and then get a handle on if his fielding is worth it.  There is a reason he has been DFAs twice in 2017.  But of course, our management would rather have a 27 year old career .227 hitter on the roster than any of the internal prospects.  

 

 

[Rosterman]

They went after shortstop depth because they weren't certain about Polanco going out there everyday. I think we can rest assured that Polanco can be the shortstop for the immediate future and, at worse, the backup infielder for a few years to come. Of course, moving Dozier might change things. But both of the vets could be tradebait (a la last year's all-star) as there is ample replacement for bench infielders in the minors come mid season.

[caninatl04]

I'm not ready to give up on a backup middle infielder that posted an OPS+ over 100 in two of the past three seasons.

 

Most middle infielders who hit that well are called starters.

 

I'm not sure why anyone would want Escobar off the roster. Are you going to find a more capable player in the minors? No. Then why get rid of him?

 

Never mind that one injury to Sano, Polanco, or Dozier and Adrianza is a starting player. He's slick with the glove and everything but no thanks.

One of the few spots where the Twins' minor league system is full is in middle infielders

[DocBauer]

Adrianza has the glove, had a nice ST, had a nice milb rehab, and has looked good so far. But we still don't know if he can hit ML pitching with consistency. For the most part, Escobar has proven he can, and is a quality glove man. The whole roster is getting to play, and is largely contributing.

 

At the moment, there are no obvious deficiencies offensively or defensively, and no-one screaming they are ready to come up and do better with the exception of Garver. Not a knock on prospects, just a today reality.

 

Why would we trade Escobar?

[Linus]

If you can make a trade for Escobar, then do it. He does not figure into the long term plan. Escobar had two pretty solid seasons in 2014 and 2015, but his career OBP is < 300 and OPS < 700. He isn't a great hitter to begin with and he did not hit well last season and this season doesnt look that great either.

 

Give Adrianza an opportunity to come back to his mean OPS of 620 and then get a handle on if his fielding is worth it. There is a reason he has been DFAs twice in 2017. But of course, our management would rather have a 27 year old career .227 hitter on the roster than any of the internal prospects.

Which internal prospect are you proposing?

[mlhouse]

 

Which internal prospect are you proposing?

 

 

I would have no problem calling up Gordon myself but I doubt the Twins management would even consider that.  The only problem is working out the ABs but I play Gordon 75% of starts at SS, Polanco 25% SS, 33% at 2B, and maybe 15% at 3B to expand his playing options in the field.

 

Another guy I would consider calling up is Levi Michael.  He would not need as much playing opportunity and can play a variety of positons on the field, some even adequately.  I doubt he would stick, but he is a former 1st round draft pick who has spent part or all of the past four seasons in AA. He aint gonna get any better in the minors and I think he is the type of hitter that his minor league stats might translate.  

 

The other guy to consider calling up is Zach Granite and let the infield utility work be handled by Adrianza and Polanco.  Let both of those guys play 2B, SS, and 3B and use Granite as the utility OF and make Robbie Grossman the mostly full time DH.

[strumdatjaguar]

If Nick Gordon is the real deal future at SS and both Dozier and Polanco remain here - Then Polanco slips into the role currently occupied by Escobar.    I understand, that's a lot of "ifs"  - but that's how I see it.  Other options are available in the minors if there is an emergency (injury)!