The Twins Need to Make Room for Walker Jenkins Before the Trade Deadline

HarmonK03 · July 21

18 minutes ago, DJL44 said:

So call up Jenkins and have him ride the bench while Larnach, Buxton and Keaschall get the playing time?

You can play everybody 4 to 5 days by including the DH slot. Bell doesn't need to be in the lineup every day. This is what a good manager would do.

chpettit19 · July 21

I don't think Jenkins has kicked the proverbial door in, but I think he's getting close to having answered every question he can at AAA. In watching him play, he looks like he could hold his own in the majors. But he's not so dominant that I'm in any rush to call him up before the deadline. You're talking 2 weeks. No need to make roster moves to get him here now. I'd give him until I know I won't lose his rookie eligibility to put him in the driver's seat for RoY and an extra pick next year. Mid- to late-August, or a September call-up would be my timeline.

If you call him up, it's to play every day. Not DH, but play the field. That means there's 3 spots for him. LF, CF, RF. The Twins currently have Larnach-Martin, Buxton, and Keaschall in those spots. You're not replacing Martin with a lefty hitting Jenkins to be the short side of a platoon with Larnach. You're not replacing Bell on an everyday basis at DH to put Larnach there and get Jenkins every day ABs.

There's no easy fit at this point. And if part of your plan to get him playing time in the big picture is to trade Larnach or Bell, you really don't want to bench them in the middle of a huge stretch for your team. Not exactly selling the "he can help you get to, or win in, the playoffs" narrative by benching someone while attempting to get to the playoffs.

I see no real reason at all to force Jenkins into a Twins jersey before the deadline. Or even after it if there isn't an injury. Get him a month+ to get his feet wet at the end of the year. That's a plenty reasonable amount of time for a guy who hasn't done anything crazy at AAA, but is clearly a large part of your future and is answering every question in AAA to this point.

IndianaTwin · July 21

38 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

...If you call him up, it's to play every day. Not DH, but play the field. That means there's 3 spots for him. LF, CF, RF. The Twins currently have Larnach-Martin, Buxton, and Keaschall in those spots. You're not replacing Martin with a lefty hitting Jenkins to be the short side of a platoon with Larnach. You're not replacing Bell on an everyday basis at DH to put Larnach there and get Jenkins every day ABs.

There's no easy fit at this point....

(Bold highlight mine.)

You've also identified another variable -- where does Jenkins play?

Injuries change things, I recognize -- Keaschall wouldn't have played CF recently had Buxton not been hurt. But if Buxton is healthy and able to play defense, he will be in CF. I'll buy the approach that says Buxton will eventually move to a corner spot, but I don't see that happening midyear.

So for now, Jenkins could play CF on days Buxton is off and corner spots on many other days. However, Jenkins hasn't played an inning in the corner since May 2. I suspect we'll get a clue on the likelihood of him coming up when he starts to get some time in corner OF spots in St. Paul.

chpettit19 · July 21

2 minutes ago, IndianaTwin said:

(Bold highlight mine.)

You've also identified another variable -- where does Jenkins play?

Injuries change things, I recognize -- Keaschall wouldn't have played CF recently had Buxton not been hurt. But if Buxton is healthy and able to play defense, he will be in CF. I'll buy the approach that says Buxton will eventually move to a corner spot, but I don't see that happening midyear.

So for now, Jenkins could play CF on days Buxton is off and corner spots on many other days. However, Jenkins hasn't played an inning in the corner since May 2. I suspect we'll get a clue on the likelihood of him coming up when he starts to get some time in corner OF spots in St. Paul.

Totally with you. I'd bet there's a week where he plays a corner 4 or 5 times and he's up the next week. Or maybe it'll be like a 2-week stretch. But, barring injury, there'll be a very clear sign he's on the way when he starts playing in a corner.

Mike Sixel · July 21

3 minutes ago, IndianaTwin said:

(Bold highlight mine.)

You've also identified another variable -- where does Jenkins play?

Injuries change things, I recognize -- Keaschall wouldn't have played CF recently had Buxton not been hurt. But if Buxton is healthy and able to play defense, he will be in CF. I'll buy the approach that says Buxton will eventually move to a corner spot, but I don't see that happening midyear.

So for now, Jenkins could play CF on days Buxton is off and corner spots on many other days. However, Jenkins hasn't played an inning in the corner since May 2. I suspect we'll get a clue on the likelihood of him coming up when he starts to get some time in corner OF spots in St. Paul.

It's interesting he's played no corner OF, given Buxton isn't going anywhere soon. You may have hit on a clue.

IndianaTwin · July 21

2 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

Totally with you. I'd bet there's a week where he plays a corner 4 or 5 times and he's up the next week. Or maybe it'll be like a 2-week stretch. But, barring injury, there'll be a very clear sign he's on the way when he starts playing in a corner.

As a hint toward that, here is his game log before getting hurt:

image.png.f862926d9f8e6cf191afdab04f462963.png

At that point in the season, it was worth it to consider not playing the rookie-status game if he was pounding the door in. At this point, I don't see them ignoring that factor.

HerbieFan · July 21

They won't bring him up and start his major league service time clock unless he's going to play everyday....and they shouldn't. With the uncertainty surrounding whether there will be baseball in 2027, I fear they won't bring him up at all and keep from starting that clock until 2028.

Mike Sixel · July 21

mike sixel

2:53

Do the Twins, or other teams, keep Jenkins down all year, so he's not in the 40 man of there's a stoppage? Or because, in this case, he might win rookie of the year in their mind?

Brendan Gawlowski

2:53

I suspect he'll be up soon

TheLeviathan · July 21

If the Twins think he's ready...ok. But then you have to ditch Larnach and Bell and open up some playing time for guys.

What I don't get is the narrative to force him up to save this season or boost some false notion of a playoff run. Do what is right for his development, everything else should be ignored.

jmlease1 · July 21

6 hours ago, NYCTK said:

I don't understand why Boras is painted as a villain. Sure, I wouldn't want to be across the negotiating table from him, but that's not any fans concern.

He does his job well and upsets owners. That's a win in my book.

There's a case to be made for fans in smaller markets that Boras is a villain, because 1) his only concern is maximizing the dollar value for his clients, 2) he has a known preference for targeting the bigger markets for his players because of #1, 3) he uses his influence with his clients to try and influence how the CBA's are structured, which have arguably tilted towards the bigger markets and star players vs a more balanced structure. In a Scott Boras world, not only is there never a salary cap, but there's no luxury tax and no revenue sharing from it either. His preferences are always so that a team like the Mets or the Dodgers will set new records for FA signings.

While I have no interest in protecting owner's pockets, and I always prefer to see more revenue going to players vs owners...I also would like to see a system in baseball where teams like the Twins are able to be more competitive in the FA market, be able to re-sign homegrown players to competitive contracts without nuking the rest of the roster, etc. Boras is not helpful to that goal, IMHO. He doesn't want the Twins signing Walker Jenkins to a market-rate contract; he wants Walker Jenkins' next contract to re-set the market.

Linus · July 21

2 hours ago, TheLeviathan said:

If the Twins think he's ready...ok. But then you have to ditch Larnach and Bell and open up some playing time for guys.

What I don't get is the narrative to force him up to save this season or boost some false notion of a playoff run. Do what is right for his development, everything else should be ignored.

Bingo. The most important thing is his development and nothing else is even close. It’s not clear that is right now and with only two months to go I almost feel it would be better to leave him down there so he can play during the work stoppage. Plus, they need to give EmRod an extended look when he gets healthy.

Linus · July 21

Regarding the ROY draft pick compensation I believe it is one compensatory picks after the first round. I think I also read the player is awarded an extra year of service time. This might be crazy but I think I would rather have the extra year of his play compared to a comp pick.

Otaknam · July 21

Roden is the obvious guy to send down. He had a brief moment in the lineup but has struggled lately with a .190 BA and .470 OPS. Martin bat right handed, which is to his benefit in this situation. It’s time to look to the future with these young players like Jenkins and Culpepper. Also, I think they will trade Jeffers to get something, rather than letting him walk for nothing, especially if they flounder over the next ten days.

DJL44 · July 21

22 minutes ago, Linus said:

Regarding the ROY draft pick compensation I believe it is one compensatory picks after the first round. I think I also read the player is awarded an extra year of service time. This might be crazy but I think I would rather have the extra year of his play compared to a comp pick.

Not quite correct. If the Twins call Jenkins up in May next year and he wins ROY he gets a full year of service time for 2027. They round up to one full season.

Linus · July 21

Just now, DJL44 said:

Not quite correct. If the Twins call Jenkins up in May next year and he wins ROY he gets a full year of service time for 2027. They round up to one full season.

Ah, thanks.

DJL44 · July 21

24 minutes ago, Otaknam said:

Roden is the obvious guy to send down. He had a brief moment in the lineup but has struggled lately with a .190 BA and .470 OPS. Martin bat right handed, which is to his benefit in this situation.

Alan Roden has had 21 at-bats. The difference between .190 and .238 is one hit when the denominator is that small. If the wind had been blowing out in Wrigley Field on his fly ball to RF he would have a slash of .238/.360/.381

Are you going to demote Jenkins and burn an option if he hits .190 in his first 21 at bats?

IndianaTwin · July 21

10 minutes ago, DJL44 said:

Alan Roden has had 21 at-bats. The difference between .190 and .238 is one hit when the denominator is that small. If the wind had been blowing out in Wrigley Field on his fly ball to RF he would have a slash of .238/.360/.381

Are you going to demote Jenkins and burn an option if he hits .190 in his first 21 at bats?

In a recent interview, Shelton said that a current goal is to "give Roden extended run." I think that's a good move.

But on your question, they already burned an option this year in his not making the Opening Day roster.

wesnewy · July 21

8 hours ago, thelanges5 said:

They should give Jenkins a Pratt-like contract.

Probs not gonna happen because Walker is a Boras Client

NYCTK · July 21

1 hour ago, jmlease1 said:

There's a case to be made for fans in smaller markets that Boras is a villain, because 1) his only concern is maximizing the dollar value for his clients, 2) he has a known preference for targeting the bigger markets for his players because of #1, 3) he uses his influence with his clients to try and influence how the CBA's are structured, which have arguably tilted towards the bigger markets and star players vs a more balanced structure. In a Scott Boras world, not only is there never a salary cap, but there's no luxury tax and no revenue sharing from it either. His preferences are always so that a team like the Mets or the Dodgers will set new records for FA signings.

While I have no interest in protecting owner's pockets, and I always prefer to see more revenue going to players vs owners...I also would like to see a system in baseball where teams like the Twins are able to be more competitive in the FA market, be able to re-sign homegrown players to competitive contracts without nuking the rest of the roster, etc. Boras is not helpful to that goal, IMHO. He doesn't want the Twins signing Walker Jenkins to a market-rate contract; he wants Walker Jenkins' next contract to re-set the market.

The Pohlads are the villains not the players representative. Boras holds exactly 0% of blame for any issues you have with baseball.

It's not even a tiny bit of Boras's job to get the owners to improve their revenue sharing and leveling the system.

thelanges5 · July 21

5 minutes ago, wesnewy said:

Probs not gonna happen because Walker is a Boras Client

So is Pratt. I understand that’s his MO but Boras works for them not the other way around.

DJL44 · July 21

17 minutes ago, IndianaTwin said:

In a recent interview, Shelton said that a current goal is to "give Roden extended run." I think that's a good move.

But on your question, they already burned an option this year in his not making the Opening Day roster.

Burn an option on Jenkins. Would you call Jenkins up, give him just 21 at-bats to prove himself and demote him if he has fewer than 5 hits? I hope not.

jmlease1 · July 21

9 minutes ago, NYCTK said:

The Pohlads are the villains not the players representative. Boras holds exactly 0% of blame for any issues you have with baseball.

It's not even a tiny bit of Boras's job to get the owners to improve their revenue sharing and leveling the system.

Did I say it was his job? But how he perceives his job is an impediment, because he has a great deal of sway over a substantial cadre of players, including ones on the player's exec committee and negotiating committees.

In terms of getting a CBA that improves finance balance, the Pohlads aren't entirely the villains either. (They're villains because the owners are always the villains, but not necessarily on this aspect. I'm sure the Pohalds first choice to flatten the playing field by taking money from the players...but they're more likely to agree to a cap & floor arrangement that wouldn't net cost the player's anything than some of the player's represented by Scott Boras)

None of these parties are on the fan's side. Not the player's union, not Scott Boras, and never the owners.

IndianaTwin · July 21

6 minutes ago, DJL44 said:

Burn an option on Jenkins. Would you call Jenkins up, give him just 21 at-bats to prove himself and demote him if he has fewer than 5 hits? I hope not.

I'm sorry. I thought you were referencing the desire of some to send Outman down after 21 plate appearances -- I clearly misread your post.

(And no, I wouldn't send Jenkins down after 21 at bats either. 😀)

NYCTK · July 21

1 hour ago, jmlease1 said:

Did I say it was his job? But how he perceives his job is an impediment, because he has a great deal of sway over a substantial cadre of players, including ones on the player's exec committee and negotiating committees.

In terms of getting a CBA that improves finance balance, the Pohlads aren't entirely the villains either. (They're villains because the owners are always the villains, but not necessarily on this aspect. I'm sure the Pohalds first choice to flatten the playing field by taking money from the players...but they're more likely to agree to a cap & floor arrangement that wouldn't net cost the player's anything than some of the player's represented by Scott Boras)

None of these parties are on the fan's side. Not the player's union, not Scott Boras, and never the owners.

Literally all he's doing is his job at the best of his ability doing what is best for his clients. How can anyone paint that, at all, as villionous? This sort of foolishness is going to be why a lot of ignorant fans start blaming the players when the owners shut down the sport.

HarmonK03 · July 22

1 hour ago, IndianaTwin said:

In a recent interview, Shelton said that a current goal is to "give Roden extended run." I think that's a good move.

But on your question, they already burned an option this year in his not making the Opening Day roster.

What has he done to earn this extended run. In nearly 200 ab's in the major leagues he has a batting ave. 191 and OPS of .544. You seriously going to take AB's away from Keaschall or Larnach for that kind of production. If you are trying to force someone into the lineup it should be a top prospect like Jenkins. Roden was not a good pickup and he is only taking ab's away from players who have more of a future with the Twins.

DJL44 · July 22

Scott Boras has legitimate Hall of Fame credentials.

mikelink45 · July 22

9 hours ago, DJL44 said:

Then why would you have faith in someone performing worse than Roden in AAA?

Is there a reason that Jenkins has been the number one prospect on TD and other platforms and Roden has not?

DJL44 · July 22

9 minutes ago, mikelink45 said:

Is there a reason that Jenkins has been the number one prospect on TD and other platforms and Roden has not?

Yes, because prospects are ranked on upside potential, not on current production. Besides, Roden exhausted prospect eligibility with the Blue Jays. Luke Keaschall doesn’t get ranked on prospect lists anymore either.

Jacksson · July 22

The long term approach with his career and the organization is to leave him off the 40 man roster until he has to be added and let him finish the year at AAA while gaining more experience and confidence. He won't see the field in Minneapolis, only in St. Paul.

DocBauer · July 22

I think Jenkins, as a supee talented prospect at 21yo is doing very well at AAA currently. And I can't wait to see him with the Twins. There are no real holes in his game. The only real "deficit" is that he's still developing his power. It's there, he just hasn't learned to tap in to it yet.

A couple days ago...can't recall if it was the Futures Game or not....he hit a laser shot opposite field double down the LF line. It was a thing of beauty, and almost as pretty as a HR, but impressive as it shows what he's capable of doing.

I think he's got 30HR potential. But that might be a 2-3 years down the road. But if he hits 35-40 DBLs and only 25HR, that can make him just as dangerous of a hitter. Especially considering he should be a good AVG and OB% hitter.

But I have zero problem letting him "cook" a little more at St Paul until the deadline at least. Long term, it only helps his development, and does nothing to slow his career. His current hot streak is great. But I don't want him promoted just because of that. I still want to see him barrel up balls a little better with a decent launch angle. He learns to do that, the doubles and homers are going to naturally come.

Right NOW Larnach and Bell are doing very well in their roles. But we still don't know if they're going to be around in 2 1/2 weeks. The 4 straight losses to the Cubs and Guardians are putting a real damper on the idea of being buyers at the deadline. But there's still games to be played between now and the deadline. And a couple more weeks at AAA aren't going to hurt Jenkins in the least. Nor is he guaranteed to actually help the Twins immediately win. The offense hasn't been the problem, at least against RHP.

So NO, Jenkins doesn't have to be promoted immediately. But I DO believe if the Twins decide to do sell Jeffers for a decent haul, and Larnach, and Bell for whatever they can get, I'd absolutely love to see Jenkins get his debut and get his feet wet for 2027. And Roden can finally get a real shot at playing time as well. By then, K-Pepper might/should be ready for SS, letting Kreidler be the Super Utility guy. Maybe Gonzalez gets a shot as well? He's been doing pretty well the last couple of months despite season numbers being dragged down to his poor start.

And let's not forget Rodriguez might/should be ready about mid August. And even if he is granted a 4th option year due to injury, he sure could use an opportunity to get his feet wet at the ML level as well.

Sands should be back very soon. It sounds like Raya's injury was actually very minor, so he should be back soon. Does CJ get a shot come August? Even if the Twins don't end up buyers, but limited sellers instead, there's still a LOT to play for! For the TEAM, there is reaching and exceeding .500 with a POSSIBLE...but remote...possibility of still sneaking in to the playoffs with a sudden 2 month run the way the Tigers did recently. PLUS, there is playing for PRIDE to finish the season strong. PLUS, there is building for 2027 as a TEAM and organization as a whole.

Playoffs or not, how about talented prospects coming up and building a bridge for 2027 and making life really difficult for every team they face that also has playoff plans? I'm reminded of Indians manager commenting in Major League where he stated he'd like to give prognosticors a "great big sh*t burger to eat".

We still don't know if the Twins are limited sellers, or limited buyers. But NO, to Jenkins immediately. But YES to seeing him and others come August 4th and beyond. No matter what, there ARE things to still play for.

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