Dozier Staying With Twins Will Create More Questions Than Answers

Trading Dozier is two steps back. The infield is better now than it would be if they traded Dozier. It's just not possible to sell it any other way.

 

What's there not to get about De Leon? I agree you have to give up something to get something, but my point is are the Dodgers really giving up something? I can't help but think they may be unloading a potential problem (there goes that smell again).

 

Once again, sometimes the best trades are the ones you don't make.

 

Who's that prospect the Dodgers had that came up and did so well this year? That would be somebody I could get behind. That guy and a higher risk decent arm from the lower minors as a slight sweetener is a trade I would go for with no reservations. The Dodgers won't do that, all they keep offering is the guy with the suspect shoulder and flinch whenever any other names are mentioned.

 

This has bad deal written all over it and I don't know how anybody can possibly see it any other way. All I keep picturing in my mind is Dozier and the Dodgers marching into the playoffs and possibly the world series and us speculating how long De Leon's Tommy John rehab will take.

 

This team wasn't a 103 loss team last year. A lot went wrong that is unlikely to go wrong this year. They also won't be a 90 loss team next year regardless of what happens with Dozier.

 

The Dodgers clearly don't want to step up and give us what a player like Dozier is worth, so screw 'em. We show them what our middle fingers look like and move on. If we're really talking about a move with long lasting implications, in the long term, it really doesn't matter if we do the trade now or at the trade deadline or even next year. Is it really so hard to imagine there being at least one contending team in need of infield help at the trade deadline? Or maybe somebody willing to give up more next off season? That's the team we want to be dealing with. That's the team that's going to give us the keys to their farm system. The Dodgers keep making it clear they are not that team.

 

All that matters is the haul. We get the deal we can't say no to or we say no. It really is that simple. So many Twins fans seem to think not trading Dozier is somehow a failure. At worst, it's a disappointment. A bad trade would be a disaster. If there is even a hint of a problem with what you're trading for, just walk away.

 

A package centered around a prospect with a potentially bad shoulder is a HUGE problem. Thinking otherwise is just not being realistic about the situation. I say don't just walk away, run as fast as you can!

 

Are you sure you're not smelling that smell? It's really strong and coming from the general direction of Los Angeles.

i agree the infield is better with Dozier than without it. That is because we do not know how Polanco will turn out. I doubt he'll be as good as Dozier but I don't think he'll bust either.

 

I believe giving up DeLeon+ is giving up something, but it depends on what the plus is. If it's not good, then you obviously don't do the deal. I don't even know why you and I are having this conversation as we both seem to agree on that though you think DeLeon is bad, so I'm guessing you'd be fine with a lesser value trade which I actually wouldn't be. If DeLeon isn't your centerpiece then who is? It won't be Bellinger or Urias, which means you'd rather have a lesser prospect than DeLeon and one who is also further away. I'm not okay with taking a trade with even less value. I'm guessing the pitcher you mean is either Stewart or Wood. Probably Stewart. I wouldn't want Stewart to be the centerpiece but as a second or third piece I'd definitely like him. I'd do DeLeon, Stewart and a throw in. Not sure the Dodgers would though. I'd actually prefer more than that but I'm trying to be more realistic.

 

The Twins lost 90+ games five out of the last six years. I don't know why you don't think it won't happen again especially with one of the worst rotations in baseball. It's fine to be optimistic but history is pointing to it happening again until they actually try to fix it. I do agree they are better than they showed last season, but right now I see this as an easy 90 loss team because pitching is part of the game. It's not impossible that they win more, but they've done it once in the last six years. That's an absolutely horrible percentage.

 

And a deadline deal for Dozier where you get more than you're being offered now is pretty unrealistic. Position players do get traded, but the prizes of the deadline are SP and RP which Dozier is not. There's too many things that can go wrong between now and then and to me they outweigh Dozier's value going up, which I see a slim chance at happening. Again, nothing is impossible but you have to play the odds.

 

If they wait until the next offseason then Dozier will just be a rental and will automatically lose value even if he has a good year. Again, you and I are arguing the same thing except you don't like DeLeon as a centerpiece and I do. Otherwise we're both saying "don't give away Dozier for junk."

 

What I don't want to happen is the Twins keep him, never trade him because they can't, and he walks for nothing or a 3rd round pick (and whatever the other pick was) by giving him a QO. Would I rather that happen then a bad trade, yeah because at least we benefit from having Dozier vs having junk but I still don't see this team going anywhere until they get 2-3 more SP's. And if the Twins don't get 2-3 more good SP's prior to Ervin being gone than they are going to need 3-4 more instead. The Twins will be bad until the pitching gets fixed. Plain and simple. And I'm frankly tired of hoping the in-house guys start getting the job done. Gibson has contributed but he's a 4/5 starter and then there was Garza drafted over 10 years ago. That's how far you have to go back to find a contributing pitcher and he didn't even contribute to us. Berrios may become something but we have no idea. Hughes health is in question as his surgery is fairly rare and which Hughes will even show up even if he is healthy? Duffey? May? Mejia? Santiago?

 

All I'm seeing is Ervin plus four question marks. Not sure how that equals greater than a 90 loss team. And a Dozier trade still does not guarantee anything but it's the best chip they have. It must be a good deal on paper though, which is what every fan who sees this as an opportunity is saying though it feels like you think we're all saying "trade him for anything!" Which we definitely are not. Very far from that actually.

Edited January 9, 2017 by Twins33

If I thought Dozier would be worth more at the deadline, I would keep him, and then move him. But I really do not. This team has the core to move forward. But obvious pieces are missing. And time, and reality are not on Doziers side. When and if this team matures, Dozier will either have declined, or walk in free agency, and his replacement, Polanco will likely be gone also. To this team Dozier and Polanco are like two things in your garage, that you only need one of. Neither will bring you what you really want in value, and will end up devaluing over the years. One has to go. Me? I turn the older, time limited one into something I need, and keep the long term one that fits into my planning. Keeping both, and having one sit there, deteriorating, is short sighted, and frankly stupid!

 

take your ball, go home, lose 85+ games with perhaps the worst pitching staff in the majors?

 

Losing only 85 games with the worst pitching staff in the bigs would be a huge accomplishment. Realistically we are looking at upper 90s in the loss column again. 

 

Personally I'm perplexed that Twins are not doing whatever they can to improve the staff. Just take the current deal and add a PTBNL/Cash rider on it. Work out the marginal B.S. later on like other teams do. It seems incredibly unlikely that the Dodgers would balk at that, unless there really is no deal on the table.

Edited January 10, 2017 by Doomtints

 

I guess a PTBNL might be workable.

 

But if the Twins accept cash as any part of a deal for Dozier, I'm heading down to 1 Twins Way with molotov cocktails.

If De Leon has 10 wins in 6 months, and Dozier is hitting .210 as he is prone to do for long stretches, why not? Heck, just take a dollar to complete the trade.

Edited January 10, 2017 by Doomtints