2025 Vikings Offseason

[Mike Sixel]

No chance grant makes it to 30. If he's there with their pick, they take him. 

Your IOL still sucks, with a rookie QB....

[TheLeviathan]

1 hour ago, Mike Sixel said:

No chance grant makes it to 30. If he's there with their pick, they take him. 

Your IOL still sucks, with a rookie QB....

I disagree that the OL sucked last year and I upgraded RG, so I'm happy with it.  I think people are too stuck on dumping way too much cap space into guard because Sam Darnold held the ball for 87 seconds and made everyone look bad.  I want one run blocking upgrade and I'm good.

There seems to be wide disagreement about how far the DLs are going to drop in this one.  The combine might sort it out.  Other than Graham, guys like Harmon, Grant, Nolen, Stewart, and Tyleik Williams have a wide range of outcomes so far.  You could definitely be right that he's gone, but there should be someone as low as 30 from that group.

[nicksaviking]

Sorry, but the IOL was awful. This team isn't going to win a championship if they have zero chance at picking up two yards in 3rd and 2 or 4th and 2 situations. You don't always have to do it that way, but it absolutely HAS to be an option in the play book.

Also, I know we are going to disagree on Skataboo all off season, but if this team wants to be the high flying, high volume passing offense it thinks it should be, they need a RB who is electric and can make defenders miss in space, not a Jerome Bettis type who is just going to run people over. Those are just two different styles of offense. 

[TheLeviathan]

20 minutes ago, nicksaviking said:

Sorry, but the IOL was awful. This team isn't going to win a championship if they have zero chance at picking up two yards in 3rd and 2 or 4th and 2 situations. You don't always have to do it that way, but it absolutely HAS to be an option in the play book.

Also, I know we are going to disagree on Skataboo all off season, but if this team wants to be the high flying, high volume passing offense it thinks it should be, they need a RB who is electric and can make defenders miss in space, not a Jerome Bettis type who is just going to run people over. Those are just two different styles of offense. 

So, we don't want 350 pound, Eagles SB champion Mechi Becton because he sucks?  We aren't signing three IOL in FA.  It's simply not happening.  So anyone sitting here as a Vikings fan thinking "three IOL or bust" this offseason, prepare for disappointment.

This team has almost an entire secondary, DL, and running back room to replace.  They won't be using half their available payroll on the line.  It's not possible.  It's not wise even if it was.  

Also, these two thoughts are not totally in alignment.  A slasher, high flyer is a good way to blow those 3rd and 2s also.  The Vikings need to change their rushing culture.  The Chandler types aren't what wins in this offense.  You need someone you can rely on to move the ball forward and force teams to respect your play action.  That set you up for 3rd and 4.  2nd and 3. 

I get you don't like Skattebo, but you're underselling his athleticism.  He isn't Bettis.  He's a better pass catching version of David Montgomery.  Gibbs gets all the attention, but I guarantee you that Montgomery is a critical cog in making it all work.

[nicksaviking]

6 hours ago, TheLeviathan said:

So, we don't want 350 pound, Eagles SB champion Mechi Becton because he sucks?  We aren't signing three IOL in FA.  It's simply not happening.  So anyone sitting here as a Vikings fan thinking "three IOL or bust" this offseason, prepare for disappointment.

This team has almost an entire secondary, DL, and running back room to replace.  They won't be using half their available payroll on the line.  It's not possible.  It's not wise even if it was.  

Also, these two thoughts are not totally in alignment.  A slasher, high flyer is a good way to blow those 3rd and 2s also.  The Vikings need to change their rushing culture.  The Chandler types aren't what wins in this offense.  You need someone you can rely on to move the ball forward and force teams to respect your play action.  That set you up for 3rd and 4.  2nd and 3. 

I get you don't like Skattebo, but you're underselling his athleticism.  He isn't Bettis.  He's a better pass catching version of David Montgomery.  Gibbs gets all the attention, but I guarantee you that Montgomery is a critical cog in making it all work.

No, I'd totally want Becton. Maybe they can't do three free agent IOL, but they can do two and draft one early. They still have money for the secondary and DL too.

But I wouldn't spend a dime on the RB free agent class. Jones was healthier than I thought he'd be, but just barely, I'd let him walk. I too am fine looking in the draft (and snagging a cheap, but still useful vet late in the season, maybe even Jones will still be there), but I still want the speedster who can make guys miss in the open field. Gibbs and Kamara almost NEVER blow a two down situation. You don't have to be big and bruising to run that game.

And perhaps I'm wrong, but I distinctly remember someone on this board promoting the ever living hell out of Alvin Kamara before the draft, begging the Vikings to draft him. I could have sworn that was you. Maybe not, either way, it was an all timer call for a 3rd round RB everyone thought was strictly a 3rd down player.

[TheLeviathan]

1 hour ago, nicksaviking said:

No, I'd totally want Becton. Maybe they can't do three free agent IOL, but they can do two and draft one early. They still have money for the secondary and DL too.

But I wouldn't spend a dime on the RB free agent class. Jones was healthier than I thought he'd be, but just barely, I'd let him walk. I too am fine looking in the draft (and snagging a cheap, but still useful vet late in the season, maybe even Jones will still be there), but I still want the speedster who can make guys miss in the open field. Gibbs and Kamara almost NEVER blow a two down situation. You don't have to be big and bruising to run that game.

And perhaps I'm wrong, but I distinctly remember someone on this board promoting the ever living hell out of Alvin Kamara before the draft, begging the Vikings to draft him. I could have sworn that was you. Maybe not, either way, it was an all timer call for a 3rd round RB everyone thought was strictly a 3rd down player.

That was me on Kamara, so trust me on Skattebo too.  :)  (Also, check out harvey.  Dude is a gasher like Gibbs)

If we didn't have 20 open roster spots I could see pushing more at guard, but I don't think our resources will allow for that.  I want one of the stud DTs and 1-2 RBs in this draft, but with our entire secondary in disarray I just dont think we can do more than splash for one guard.

That or we are starting 2-3 Shaq Griffin level players at DB to pay for that extra guard.

[Original_JB]

Re: Jones  Ignore the clickbait headline....

https://heavy.com/sports/nfl/minnesota-vikings/jones-contract-free-agency-oconnell-akers-chandler/

the gist:  The Vikings and RB Aaron Jones agreed to move the void date on his contract from this Monday until the final day before free agency

Don't think they'd be doing this unless they're trying to bring him back (at some lower price???)

 

[nicksaviking]

41 minutes ago, Original_JB said:

Re: Jones  Ignore the clickbait headline....

https://heavy.com/sports/nfl/minnesota-vikings/jones-contract-free-agency-oconnell-akers-chandler/

the gist:  The Vikings and RB Aaron Jones agreed to move the void date on his contract from this Monday until the final day before free agency

Don't think they'd be doing this unless they're trying to bring him back (at some lower price???)

 

Yeah, that's what I'd guess. Not a good year to be a free agent RB with the hype surrounding this draft class.

[TheLeviathan]

3 hours ago, Original_JB said:

Re: Jones  Ignore the clickbait headline....

https://heavy.com/sports/nfl/minnesota-vikings/jones-contract-free-agency-oconnell-akers-chandler/

the gist:  The Vikings and RB Aaron Jones agreed to move the void date on his contract from this Monday until the final day before free agency

Don't think they'd be doing this unless they're trying to bring him back (at some lower price???)

 

KOC was pretty clear he wants him back too.  I really hope that's not for more than 5M.  Jones was good for us, but he looked old/hurt too often down the stretch.

[gunnarthor]

Lots of interesting thoughts and links in this article. https://www.dailynorseman.com/2025/2/15/24366350/daniel-jones-sam-darnold-trey-smith-milton-williams

Two things sorta jump out at me.

1) the offseason plan where we get RG Smith, S Holland, DL Williams, and CB Samuel. Man, if we actually pulled those, or even three of those four, I'd be thrilled.

2) KAM's comments about how fixing the offensive line, along with Seattle's GM's comments, is not quite as simple as people think and KAM suggesting, among other things, "It could come from how we do things from a pass protection standpoint." I think this is the closest we've seen to a conflict between him and KOC. KOC said we have to get better talent, the GM maybe suggesting we need better schemes. I also could be over thinking this but it'll be interesting to see. I've said multiple times I love KOC but I do want him to bring in another offensive mind outside of the McVay tree. I hope he does.

[TheLeviathan]

2 hours ago, gunnarthor said:

Lots of interesting thoughts and links in this article.

 

Two things sorta jump out at me.

1) the offseason plan where we get RG Smith, S Holland, DL Williams, and CB Samuel. Man, if we actually pulled those, or even three of those four, I'd be thrilled.

2) KAM's comments about how fixing the offensive line, along with Seattle's GM's comments, is not quite as simple as people think and KAM suggesting, among other things, "It could come from how we do things from a pass protection standpoint." I think this is the closest we've seen to a conflict between him and KOC. KOC said we have to get better talent, the GM maybe suggesting we need better schemes. I also could be over thinking this but it'll be interesting to see. I've said multiple times I love KOC but I do want him to bring in another offensive mind outside of the McVay tree. I hope he does.

I really liked his mock offseason, though a few things should be pointed out:

1) That OL would be a dream but Booker ain't making it to 23 much less 43.  That trade-down effectively takes us out of the mix for the high end DTs.  (Though I love Phillips)  Henderson is a nice scoop.

2) The secondary would be Theo Jackson, Metellus, Holland, Samuel, Blackmon, and the rookie he took.  The DL would be Milton Williams, Harrison Phillips, and the two rookies he took.

So the offset of signing those guys is those two areas of the defense are a little shaky.  You can fill it out with Jerry Tillery types, but it's shaky.

3) Man I hope that Darnold trade is an option.  Being able to net a pick in the 70s of this draft is going to land us a good player.

[TheLeviathan]

So Pro Football Network now has a mock draft simulator and offseason simulator!

https://www.profootballnetwork.com/nfl-offseason-salary-cap-free-agency-manager

Restructures/Cuts: Restructure O'Neill for 3 years, save 8.2M, Extend Oliver save 5M, Extend Metellus save 4M, Cut Ingram and save 3M, Extend Van Ginkel save 4M.  Cap room 87M

Resigns: Harrison Smith Retires, Slap Darnold with franchise tag, we found out at the combine that Vegas will give us 73 and 218 for him.  WR Powell 2 years 1.5M, RB Cam Akers  1 year 1.5M, Dan Feeney 2 years 1.5M, DT Jalen Redmond 2 years 2M, DT Jerry Tillery 1 year 2M, TE Johnny Mundt 1 year 1.5M, S Theo Jackson 3 years 2.5M, CB Murphy Jr. 4 years 19M  Cap Room 50M

Free Agency: QB Carson Wentz 2 years 2.5M, OG James Daniels 2 years 8M, OG Will Fries 3 years 8M, Jevon Holland 4 years 17M, LB Devin White 1 year 2M, OT Cody Ford 1 year 2M Cap Room 7.5M

Draft: (24, 73, 97, 140, 161, 218):  Enter the draft looking to add DTs and RBs from a historic class.  

At 24: WR Golden falls, Washington calls to trade up offering 29 and 61 for 24 and 140.  Snatch that.  At 29: DT Kenneth Grant and Nolen are on the board, we take the zero technique in Grant.  At 61: We have our choice of the Ohio St. Running backs - take Trayveon Henderson.  At 73: CB Denzel Burke continues the Big 10 run at the draft.  At 97: Giants offers us 104 and 134 for 97 and 161.  Bills then offer us 107 and 171 for 104.  So we take that too.  At 107: CB Cobee Bryant  At 134: WR Pat Bryant  At 171: RB RJ Harvey At 218: OL Jacob Gideon

Final Roster:

QB: McCarthy, Wentz, Rypien

RB: Henderson, Akers, Harvey, Chandler, Ham

WR: Jefferson, Addison, Nailor, Powell, Bryant

TE: Hock, Oliver, Mundt

T - Darrisaw, O'Neill, Ford

G - Daniels, Fries, Brandel, Feeney, Gideon

C - Bradbury, Jurgens

DL - Grant, Phillips, Redmond, LDR, Tillery, Taimani

Edge - Gink, Greenard, Turner, Murphy, Richter

ILB - Pace, Cashman, White, Asamoah

CB - Murphy, Blackmon, Bryant, Burke, McGlothern

S - Holland, Jackson, Metellus, Ward

IMO, the line is better and deeper on offense.  Harvey and Henderson are awesome backs.  Bryant is a fun upside reciever.  This caters well to the young QB.

The cost of that is much less depth in the defensive front and a much younger secondary.

[Mike Sixel]

31 minutes ago, TheLeviathan said:

So Pro Football Network now has a mock draft simulator and offseason simulator!

https://www.profootballnetwork.com/nfl-offseason-salary-cap-free-agency-manager

Restructures/Cuts: Restructure O'Neill for 3 years, save 8.2M, Extend Oliver save 5M, Extend Metellus save 4M, Cut Ingram and save 3M, Extend Van Ginkel save 4M.  Cap room 87M

Resigns: Harrison Smith Retires, Slap Darnold with franchise tag, we found out at the combine that Vegas will give us 73 and 218 for him.  WR Powell 2 years 1.5M, RB Cam Akers  1 year 1.5M, Dan Feeney 2 years 1.5M, DT Jalen Redmond 2 years 2M, DT Jerry Tillery 1 year 2M, TE Johnny Mundt 1 year 1.5M, S Theo Jackson 3 years 2.5M, CB Murphy Jr. 4 years 19M  Cap Room 50M

Free Agency: QB Carson Wentz 2 years 2.5M, OG James Daniels 2 years 8M, OG Will Fries 3 years 8M, Jevon Holland 4 years 17M, LB Devin White 1 year 2M, OT Cody Ford 1 year 2M Cap Room 7.5M

Draft: (24, 73, 97, 140, 161, 218):  Enter the draft looking to add DTs and RBs from a historic class.  

At 24: WR Golden falls, Washington calls to trade up offering 29 and 61 for 24 and 140.  Snatch that.  At 29: DT Kenneth Grant and Nolen are on the board, we take the zero technique in Grant.  At 61: We have our choice of the Ohio St. Running backs - take Trayveon Henderson.  At 73: CB Denzel Burke continues the Big 10 run at the draft.  At 97: Giants offers us 104 and 134 for 97 and 161.  Bills then offer us 107 and 171 for 104.  So we take that too.  At 107: CB Cobee Bryant  At 134: WR Pat Bryant  At 171: RB RJ Harvey At 218: OL Jacob Gideon

Final Roster:

QB: McCarthy, Wentz, Rypien

RB: Henderson, Akers, Harvey, Chandler, Ham

WR: Jefferson, Addison, Nailor, Powell, Bryant

TE: Hock, Oliver, Mundt

T - Darrisaw, O'Neill, Ford

G - Daniels, Fries, Brandel, Feeney, Gideon

C - Bradbury, Jurgens

DL - Grant, Phillips, Redmond, LDR, Tillery, Taimani

Edge - Gink, Greenard, Turner, Murphy, Richter

ILB - Pace, Cashman, White, Asamoah

CB - Murphy, Blackmon, Bryant, Burke, McGlothern

S - Holland, Jackson, Metellus, Ward

IMO, the line is better and deeper on offense.  Harvey and Henderson are awesome backs.  Bryant is a fun upside reciever.  This caters well to the young QB.

The cost of that is much less depth in the defensive front and a much younger secondary.

If that all happened, it would work for me, but I have a hard time not taking Grant and not trading down. Oliver does nothing for me, but I get others like him. I'd trade/cut and move on and take a mid/late round small OG or big TE to replace him .....

[TheLeviathan]

47 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

If that all happened, it would work for me, but I have a hard time not taking Grant and not trading down. Oliver does nothing for me, but I get others like him. I'd trade/cut and move on and take a mid/late round small OG or big TE to replace him .....

I totally get that.  This draft is loaded at TE and I love a bunch of dudes that will be available in the 3rd round.  So...honestly, if I were running the Vikings - I'd extend Oliver and trade Hockenson.  Oliver is easy to get for like a 4M cap hit and he's well worth that.  He can start at TE and the team will be just fine.

Downside is this is a lowpoint in Hockenson's value, so it's not likely to be a wise move.

[Mike Sixel]

1 hour ago, TheLeviathan said:

I totally get that.  This draft is loaded at TE and I love a bunch of dudes that will be available in the 3rd round.  So...honestly, if I were running the Vikings - I'd extend Oliver and trade Hockenson.  Oliver is easy to get for like a 4M cap hit and he's well worth that.  He can start at TE and the team will be just fine.

Downside is this is a lowpoint in Hockenson's value, so it's not likely to be a wise move.

I'd move on from Hockenson also. But they won't. 

[Mike Sixel]

1 hour ago, Mike Sixel said:

I'd move on from Hockenson also. But they won't. 

Why? Because I want the core of the team to mature with the new QB. 

[gunnarthor]

On 2/17/2025 at 4:36 PM, Mike Sixel said:

I'd move on from Hockenson also. But they won't. 

I don't think they should. He'll be 28 next year and I thought he played ok for a guy coming back from nearly an entire year long injury plus no training camp to get in a rhythm with the new QB. 

Also, with some issues around Addison, they'll need another dependable option for McCarthy. 

[Mike Sixel]

4 minutes ago, gunnarthor said:

I don't think they should. He'll be 28 next year and I thought he played ok for a guy coming back from nearly an entire year long injury plus no training camp to get in a rhythm with the new QB. 

Also, with some issues around Addison, they'll need another dependable option for McCarthy. 

I'm ok with that. I think next year is a transition year, and I'd rather move a year early, but I get it 

[Mike Sixel]

Cannot tag Murphy due to an extension of something or other, so they need an agreement in the next week .. or he's a free agent. 

[TheLeviathan]

3 hours ago, gunnarthor said:

I don't think they should. He'll be 28 next year and I thought he played ok for a guy coming back from nearly an entire year long injury plus no training camp to get in a rhythm with the new QB. 

Also, with some issues around Addison, they'll need another dependable option for McCarthy. 

Which is totally reasonable...but I don't see the big play threat out of him.  And I worry his injury issues (which preceded his stay in MN) are only going to continue.

I'd rather have a tightend who can block the hell out of the running game or looks like he's damn near a WR.  Hockenson seems like he's ok to good at both, but not dynamic.  And he's paid like he's dynamic.

[Vanimal46]

Just catching up on this thread. If Kenneth Grant is available at 24 that’s a no brainer sprint to the podium pick. I think he will be a top 15 pick. It’s rare to be that big, with pass rush ability. 

Hockenson had 95 catches in 2023, on pace for well over 100 before the dirty hit that blew out his knee. He’s not going anywhere and fans will remember how good he is after a full offseason being healthy. 

[Vanimal46]

An early list of “My Guys” in this upcoming draft: Note that I’ve been focused mostly on RB and DL…

RB: Omarion Hampton, TreVeyon Henderson, RJ Harvey, Bhayshul Tuten

IOL: Grey Zabel

DL: Walter Nolen, Alfred Collins, Kenneth Grant, Derrick Harmon 

 

[gunnarthor]

The few draft things I've read say this is a good draft for RB and DL so, yay!

[TheLeviathan]

2 hours ago, gunnarthor said:

The few draft things I've read say this is a good draft for RB and DL so, yay!

It is.  Like....4th round will be full of guys worth taking shots at in those position groups.  It's stupid good.

[nicksaviking]

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/vikings-hire-keith-carter-as-assistant-offensive-line-coach

New assistant OL coach. Good. I wanted Chris Kuper replaced as I think that OL isn't just ineffective up the middle running the ball, but absolutely lost when they get out in space for screen and swing passes. The language O'Connell used about the new guy makes me think he also knows the current OL coach perhaps was lacking:

“I want to get stronger overall,” O’Connell said. “I love what Chris Kuper’s been able to do in that room, but I wanted to take the opportunity to get a former [head position coach] that’s been involved in some of the best rushing attacks over the past four, five, six years in football. I think he’s at a great time in his career where he really wanted to come to Minnesota, and I really think he’s going to be able to help us a lot, infuse some things into our run game.”

I think the 'but' says it all. And it sounds like the 'assistant' might be more title than a function. The new guy sounds like he has more experience and success than existing guy.

[TheLeviathan]

I'm glad they are bringing in other minds to help, that show the emphasis they have.

[gunnarthor]

12 hours ago, TheLeviathan said:

I'm glad they are bringing in other minds to help, that show the emphasis they have.

Agreed. One of my biggest concerns is that KOC is immune from helpful criticism - let's see if he brings in other offensive minds but bringing in a guy from run-first teams is a legitimately good sign.

[nicksaviking]

3 hours ago, gunnarthor said:

Agreed. One of my biggest concerns is that KOC is immune from helpful criticism - let's see if he brings in other offensive minds but bringing in a guy from run-first teams is a legitimately good sign.

I'm wondering why you get that impression? 

[TheLeviathan]

4 hours ago, gunnarthor said:

Agreed. One of my biggest concerns is that KOC is immune from helpful criticism - let's see if he brings in other offensive minds but bringing in a guy from run-first teams is a legitimately good sign.

I actually think he gets a bad wrap by MN media, particularly Barreiro.  He's framed as a dogmatic guy who wants to rip the ball down field and ignores the running game, but I don't think either is true.  He came from McVay's tree.  The same tree that ran Todd Gurley into an early retirement.  And made 5 yard throws to Kupp all the rage.

I think KOC is a pretty flexible guy and I think the success he's had so far reflects on his ability to match his scheme to the talent he has.  He hasn't run because his backs have been bad and his center can't hold the point of attack.  He doesn't throw underneath because Sam Darnold was literally one of the worst QBs in the league last year in short yardage accuracy.  

Frankly...I think he's exactly the kind of coach you want to have: the one that will find the optimal path no matter what is thrown at him.  (Hell...we'd have picked 5 or so spots higher last year if he hadn't worked miracles with Josh freaking Dobbs)

[Mike Sixel]

22 minutes ago, TheLeviathan said:

I actually think he gets a bad wrap by MN media, particularly Barreiro.  He's framed as a dogmatic guy who wants to rip the ball down field and ignores the running game, but I don't think either is true.  He came from McVay's tree.  The same tree that ran Todd Gurley into an early retirement.  And made 5 yard throws to Kupp all the rage.

I think KOC is a pretty flexible guy and I think the success he's had so far reflects on his ability to match his scheme to the talent he has.  He hasn't run because his backs have been bad and his center can't hold the point of attack.  He doesn't throw underneath because Sam Darnold was literally one of the worst QBs in the league last year in short yardage accuracy.  

Frankly...I think he's exactly the kind of coach you want to have: the one that will find the optimal path no matter what is thrown at him.  (Hell...we'd have picked 5 or so spots higher last year if he hadn't worked miracles with Josh freaking Dobbs)

People still listen to Barreiro? Huh.