Make it Official! Twins 17, Rockies 9: Twins Punish Rockies

[Old Twins Hat]

New Yorkers are still waiting for the Thielbar curve ball to Giancarlo Stanton to come down in that one winnable game in the Bronx.

It wasn't a hanger either.  It was his best pitch.

[Whitey333]

It's amazing how one blowout game against a lousy Colorado Rockies team sku things for so many.  Yes they won.  They should be walking all over teams like that.  We are in the midst of another 13 game schedule of bottom feeders.  Let's take advantage all weekend against Oakland. IMO one reason we do not have a better record is because we have a mediocre manager.  He's permanently attached to his analytical spreadsheet and has very little feel for the game itself.  Play Lewis everyday.  It's time to dump Rocco and Falvey

[David Maro]

It is time to be concerned about Lopez,he looks like he is fighting every pitch thrown.He has not looked good for weeks,yes he had a good outing against the Astros.But you can't say he looked good in this or that outing.And the BP made this game way closer than it should of been.They now have the A's for 4 that will not be easy.

[bean5302]

3 hours ago, DJL44 said:

He admitted that the rise on his fastball is gone. Without that movement it is very hittable. 

Caleb Thielbar struggles in loss to Rockies (mlb.com)

It's a very good article. The Twins and Thielbar know exactly what is wrong. He's very aware that he needs to fix the problem or his career may be over. The question I have is why the Twins keep running him out there when his stuff is broken. He is not a pitcher they should be using in a tie game.

I think the problem is fixable but it may not happen this month or even this season. He is healthy and lefthanded which means he will keep getting chances.

I like Thielbar's commitment and his attitude about it all. He's an easy guy to cheer for, but as you say, he can't be used in medium/high leverage right now.

He's working a lot higher up in the zone with his fastball to try and compensate for what he thinks is a lack of rise, but I think that just results in the batter expecting the pitch to land high and it actually landing high so the batter puts the right swing into motion to zero in on the pitch. His rise isn't elite on the fastball, but it's been far above average this year.

His real issue is probably control/walks, and with him aiming higher, he's going to get more pitches called balls, dropping him behind in the count and forcing him into bad situations.

 

 

[DJL44]

19 minutes ago, bean5302 said:

He's working a lot higher up in the zone with his fastball to try and compensate for what he thinks is a lack of rise

Interesting. It could also be that he doesn't have the same finish on the pitch. If he lets go of the ball earlier it will spin less and locate higher. It might also explain the increased velocity. A pitch that "rises" is experiencing lift which means it is spending some of its thrown energy pushing air. We're talking about fractions of a second on the fingertips.

[insagt1]

A win is always nice. Period. However there should be some concern when you give up 9 runs (and the game was not played at Coors!) Thielbar is a guy you just love to cheer for, but reality is setting in, even by his own admission. I don't think he will be OK. Perhaps a stint in St Paul...but I think it may be pretty much over for him.

Lopez has to be a concern as well. He is not pitching the way he did last season and he just doesn't look like he is in command out there this year. Still half season left to correct, so not giving up on him. But he may be a cautionary tale. We need him to be better. Sooner the better.

On the bright side, teams don't often get 24 hits in a game, no matter who the opponent so it was great to see the bats flex. Hope this re-energizes a lot of the guys

[bean5302]

2 hours ago, insagt1 said:

A win is always nice. Period. However there should be some concern when you give up 9 runs (and the game was not played at Coors!) Thielbar is a guy you just love to cheer for, but reality is setting in, even by his own admission. I don't think he will be OK. Perhaps a stint in St Paul...but I think it may be pretty much over for him.

Lopez has to be a concern as well. He is not pitching the way he did last season and he just doesn't look like he is in command out there this year. Still half season left to correct, so not giving up on him. But he may be a cautionary tale. We need him to be better. Sooner the better.

On the bright side, teams don't often get 24 hits in a game, no matter who the opponent so it was great to see the bats flex. Hope this re-energizes a lot of the guys

I consider Lopez to be pretty similar to Jose Berrios in terms of value. Even though Berrios is chided against for his 2022 campaign (5.23 ERA, 4.55 FIP, 4.21 xFIP), Toronto went 23-9 (.718) in the games he started that year. Berrios gave the Blue Jays a quality start (5+ innings ERA under 4.00 or 6+ innings 3ER or less) in 19 of those contests.

Lopez has long been an up and down pitcher without many long streaks of dominant starts you'd associate with elite starters (aces).
Sonny Gray opened the season with 6 consecutive stars allowing 2 ER or fewer, and 9 of his first 10 games doing that. He only allowed more than 3 ER in 3 games last year, and only 2 with more than 4 ER.

Lopez did have a similar (but less impressive from an ERA/FIP standpoint) 6 game run as Gray last year, but he had 8 starts allowing more than 3 ER, and 7 of those more than 4 ER.

If you reframe expectations for Lopez to be Berrios, Lopez's rough start is a lot easier to accept, and a lot less worrisome than if you expect Lopez to be a front line starter.

[insagt1]

interesting comparison. i have to think that so far this season its hard to think that Lopez's season is anything other than dismal. Lately he can barely get thru 4 innings. He is giving up runs by the boatload. The ERA and WHIP make you want to cover your eyes. TWINS have to be concerned.

We need for him to turn it around 2nd half, because the team does appear to be righting the ship, especially offensively. I wasn't confident that this would happen but they once again are perhaps able to contend with Cleveland. (now if only they could beat them head to head) So a strong Lopez would be nice 2nd half.