Doc, you make some very valid points. The most important of which is that Minnesota Twins baseball, as a business, operates in a mature, if not declining, market place. MLB baseball in Minnesota is not a growth business.  Eyeballs are harder to attract, the core fan base is aging out and not being replaced, TV revenues are going down and will not be coming back, and there is only so much blood you can squeeze from the turnips via ticket prices and concessions.  All of us fans, especially those who want the Pohlads to spend crazily, have to keep this in mind.

The key, as in any business facing slow or negative growth, is to see how you can eke out marginal gains here and there.  You have a lot of good ideas.  It’s a tough spot to be in. Honestly, if I were an owner, and received less marginal benefit from the “prestige” of owning a team than others, I’d be selling.  There are better places to grow a couple billion if ego is not the gating factor.

Btw, it’s just not baseball.  The PGA is very similar. TV revs stagnating, balking sponsors, aging fan base, mature market, and departing star talent - the PGA is in a world of hurt too.  At least they woke up, hopefully not too late, and are trying to do a deal. 

I am one of those older fans closing in on 70. I would love to see a streaming alternative to satellite, as the cost of the extra's add up. I no longer attend games due to the cost, the access, and safety in the area. This last season I saw every game on TV, and kind of set my schedule around them. IMO the best thing the Twins could do is operate their own Bally's type programing, and maybe try to form a partnership with the Wild and even the Wolves. I don't know much about the details of doing such a thing, but I believe it is being done by another team or so.

Obviously I'd be delighted to see ticket prices go down, but they're already lower than any other major sport, and lower than the cost of other night-out entertainment options like going to a play or a concert. Concessions, on the other hand...

1 hour ago, Unwinder said:

Obviously I'd be delighted to see ticket prices go down, but they're already lower than any other major sport, and lower than the cost of other night-out entertainment options like going to a play or a concert. Concessions, on the other hand...

IMO baseball is a family event, where you fully enjoy the game as a family. But now that's very difficult for most families, Some can afford themselves once in ahile yet many can't even do that with this economy. Lower the tickets alone will have a small affect. To maximize we have to do more to create interest.

My first seven decades are in the books, so i qualify for your first point. Money is available to attend games but I'm loathe to spend cash on myself because the prices still shock me to an extent. When I do go to games, it is fun and I spend without worrying. I have had partial season tickets but find myself more comfortable listening or watching from home. Going to games takes time and beautiful days on the lake win out.

I'm not understanding the accessibility point. Whenever I go to the games I park in the North Loop. It is really nice around there with a ton of little shops plus a brewery right there. Safety? I'm sure there are issues but I don't go to strip clubs or the bars where all the hip people hang out. I would get carded and refused entry. I just stayed in an Airbnb downtown for four nights during Thanksgiving with my spouse and kids. We went out every day walking for hours and also went out at night. I think the scariest thing I ever saw in Minneapolis was Bob Lurtsema walking briskly along in a t-shirt on a January day where the temperature was -10 degrees F. 

The Twins will need to figure out how to get their games "out' on various media platforms. I have cable but am dropping it next week. I also have a subscription to mlb.com. There must be someone smart enough to put together a plan to make the games available so that people can watch or listen if they are interested.

Lastly, I cannot state what level of appeal the Twins reach as far as younger fans. When I go to games, I usually go with someone in their thirties who has called me up and asked to to a game. Looking around there seems to be quite a few younger fans but there must be someone who works for the Twins who knows all of those details.

The Twins are ok right now and old goats who have followed the team have seen plenty of lean years.

20 hours ago, tony&rodney said:

 

I'm not understanding the accessibility point. 

The Twins will need to figure out how to get their games "out' on various media platforms. I have cable but am dropping it next week. I also have a subscription to mlb.com. There must be someone smart enough to put together a plan to make the games available so that people can watch or listen if they are interested.

The point I was making about accessibility had nothing to do with Target Stadium, It had to do with being able to access games via streaming apps. So you can watch the games whenever & wherever you are & limiting "blackouts".

4 minutes ago, Doctor Gast said:

The point I was making about accessibility had nothing to do with Tarket Stadium, It had to do with being able to access games via streaming apps. So you can watch the games whenever & wherever you are & limiting "blackouts".

Ok. I agree that this is a problem that should be resolved. 

Hey doc ...

Since you touched on catching , did  you hear Endy Rodriguez  tore his acl or ucl and out for the season  of 2024 , I know liked him as a catcher because before he made his debut you were always advocating for the twins to trade for him ...

For those that need cheap streaming and can watch any game , any sport with no blackouts ....

I use uzzu tv.app ...

130 bucks for the year and has worked fine for me at home west of the cities  , but alittle  iffy sometimes at the lake on weekends when all the vacationers are using the towers  ...

On 12/13/2023 at 6:10 PM, Blyleven2011 said:

Hey doc ...

Since you touched on catching , did  you hear Endy Rodriguez  tore his acl or ucl and out for the season  of 2024 , I know liked him as a catcher because before he made his debut you were always advocating for the twins to trade for him ...

For those that need cheap streaming and can watch any game , any sport with no blackouts ....

I use uzzu tv.app ...

130 bucks for the year and has worked fine for me at home west of the cities  , but alittle  iffy sometimes at the lake on weekends when all the vacationers are using the towers  ...

Hey Bly;

When I heard that they were serious about getting Henry Davis (PIT Crown Jewel) back into catching again. My hope rose that PIT would be open to trade Endy. But my hopes were crushed to hear he got hurt during winter ball & lost for the season.

2 hours ago, Bigfork Twins Guy said:

I recently read that the Pirates and Penguins just jointly created a company to televise their games.  I know this model failed back in the Midwest Sports days.  Wonder why it didn't work for us but seems to be a Pittsburg solution now?  I hope the Twins explore this option.

What killed baseball, based on observing my kids, is the slow pace of play all of those years.  It got a bunch better this year, but my take is it was too late as those lost fans are water under the bridge and will not come back.

I also think baseball, like other sports, are kind of pricing themselves out.  The economy also is not helping.

I disagree with the statement of baseball being killed.  I'd suggest it's stronger than ever.

Quote

 

I disagree with the statement of baseball being killed.  I'd suggest it's stronger than ever.

This statement is absolutely true.
Having worked as a volunteer in youth baseball over the past 2 plus decades, I can safely say that baseball is embraced by today’s kids. Quietly enjoying growing numbers.

Should the Twins ever really become a perineal contender, it will only lead to even more kids playing.

Media reports like to grab on to doom and gloom, but their reporting of baseball numbers being ‘down’ is simply not true.

4 hours ago, Ex-Iowegian said:

This statement is absolutely true.
Having worked as a volunteer in youth baseball over the past 2 plus decades, I can safely say that baseball is embraced by today’s kids. Quietly enjoying growing numbers.

Should the Twins ever really become a perineal contender, it will only lead to even more kids playing.

Media reports like to grab on to doom and gloom, but their reporting of baseball numbers being ‘down’ is simply not true.

thank you for your contribution to the sport

On 12/12/2023 at 12:18 PM, Karbo said:

I am one of those older fans closing in on 70. I would love to see a streaming alternative to satellite, as the cost of the extra's add up. I no longer attend games due to the cost, the access, and safety in the area. This last season I saw every game on TV, and kind of set my schedule around them. IMO the best thing the Twins could do is operate their own Bally's type programing, and maybe try to form a partnership with the Wild and even the Wolves. I don't know much about the details of doing such a thing, but I believe it is being done by another team or so.

Remember the Victory sports channel?  That didn't go over too well.  

On 12/12/2023 at 3:23 PM, Doctor Gast said:

IMO baseball is a family event, where you fully enjoy the game as a family. But now that's very difficult for most families, Some can afford themselves once in ahile yet many can't even do that with this economy. Lower the tickets alone will have a small affect. To maximize we have to do more to create interest.

Maybe lower the prices of the seats in the bad areas like the upper deck, but raise the prices of the seats in the prime areas like behind home plate to off set the costs.  I'm also guessing they probably lost money on concessions and beer because of the new pitch clock??? I mean if games lasted 30 min longer wouldn't they sell more beer?  Just a thought.

On 12/15/2023 at 3:29 PM, se7799 said:

I disagree with the statement of baseball being killed.  I'd suggest it's stronger than ever.

I mean for teams to be signing 700 million dollar contracts the game must be doing pretty well. 

For the Twins to really be successful as a business they need to figure out how to reach people.  I mean I totally understand the idea of lowering ticket prices and I can also see that if the Twins do well then that will also help bring fans.  But winning is probably the wrong solution.  I mean everyone wants to win, but what I'm trying to get at is that the Chicago Cubs until a few years ago were perennial losers never winning the big one, on top of that most of the time just being really bad, but they still had a huge fan base.  Red Sox very similar, not always bad, but were lovable losers for a very long time.  How are they able to have such a huge following and not do well.  Then on the other hand, the inventors of analytical baseball, the Oakland A's who have had lots of successful seasons, no WS victories since the last 80's or early 90's.  But under Billy bean had lots of playoff runs, however they have alienated their fan base to a point where no one comes to the games.  Similar with Tampa Bay, a team that is often very good but no fans come to the games.  So somehow the Twins need to reach out to the whole state of Minnesota, North Dakota, Iowa, parts of Wisconsin, and South Dakoka because the people in those states all could be Twins fans.  Maybe they need to be active in the public schools, or park board systems, put money aside to redo or build baseball parks in towns in these areas, where the Twins brand can be stamped on a field kids play ball at.  I'm just coming up with ideas to make lifelong Twins fans regardless of their win loss record?  I also think it's cool that the Saints are now the Twins AAA team, I get the fact that they can bring in a reliever in one day and send him back the next.  But doesn't almost seem like the Saints and the Twins are competing with one another for nightly fans?  What if their AAA team was in Sioux Falls or Fargo.  Still really close where players could be brought in quickly, but there would be Twins fans created in those areas because they could follow those ball players from their area to the Twins.  I don't know all of the answers, I'm just shooting out ideas.

15 hours ago, Twodogs said:

Remember the Victory sports channel?  That didn't go over too well.  

Yes I do. Would it have failed with today's internet and cable though?

1 hour ago, Karbo said:

Yes I do. Would it have failed with today's internet and cable though?

I think it failed because they didn't do a great job of putting agreements together for the mediums that would be showing victory sports.  I mean living in California, I know for that short period of time I had no access to Twins games.  Thank God with my direct TV package that I could watch the other teams broadcast.  I think back then they thought they were just going to force people to have to get Victory sports network.  Once they realized that wasn't going to work they shut down instead of trying to cut some deals.  It was probably a great idea, probably trying to copy the YES network, but they failed in actually getting the product out there on the platforms people could see.  Now with the Internet so much more of a player, if they did something like that again they'd need to get those deals in place in a few more platforms.  Because there is still cable, there is still satellite but now there are more platforms that need to be addressed.  I think it would be great, especially if you could get the owners of all of the different teams to go all in on their own network.  But they have to do some serious planning and deal cutting to get it done.