Two Years In: Do the Twins Regret Signing Carlos Correa?

2 hours ago, IndianaTwin said:

What would have been the reaction on TD (and elsewhere) if the FO didn’t give fans a heads-up last year about dropping the budget by $30 million and then did it anyway? I think the reaction would have been worse.

I very strongly disagree. How many would've noticed? Us on TD would, yes, but we're outliers. But announcing it in November before season ticket sales go into full swing? That's way worse than just letting it happen. Doing their same old same old "we're talking with people and just coming up short on trying to sign guys" bit all winter after individual game tickets go on sale after a mini playoff run instead of announcing publicly that you're cutting payroll? Way better for ticket sales. 

The average fan wouldn't have noticed and they would've sold tickets over the offseason and early into the season if they hadn't announced anything. The media would've connected them to a couple players throughout the offseason as "good fits" which would've grown fan excitement and increased ticket sales. Early season ticket sales would've been better which would've covered until the team got how and spent most of the summer as one of the best teams in baseball before the collapse. They almost undoubtedly would've sold more tickets last year had they kept their mouths shut all offseason and just kept with what used to be Falvey's favorite phrase "the Pohlads give us enough resources to build a contending team." 

They'd be in the same spot now of being almost universally despised, but they would've made more money last year. The bungled every PR situation they could the entire offseason. I don't know how anyone could argue differently. It was a complete and total disaster.

24 minutes ago, Jocko87 said:

He absolutely did not kick off Correa trade concerns this year.

One media member made up the scenario and others asked him about it. He is not in a position to say anything firmly with a sale over his head.

His answer was perfect in 49 states. And Puerto Rico.

His words don't matter when a dedicated group will only hear what they want to hear.

There's a "dedicated group" in all 49 states, Puerto Rico, American Samoa, Guam, the US Virgin Islands, and the CNMI. Acting like MN is the only state/fan base that has fans who take rumors and run with them is nonsense. 

The sale didn't change his answer one bit. That's a cop out. The sale didn't make it impossible for him to say "We get calls on Carlos and all of our players, but Carlos is our shortstop and we have no plans to trade him." That's a perfectly acceptable answer he could have given, but didn't. Anybody reading between those lines to say the Twins are shopping Correa is being immediately dismissed. 

His words do matter. He's the top non-ownership member of the organization. Everything he says matters. Especially now with the fanbase already in full on rebellion mode. It's not about the "dedicated group (that) only hear what they want to hear" it's about everyone else. Leaving the door open for interpretation during what he knows will be another slow winter where ticket sales will already be insanely low is bad PR for the guy now in charge of also driving ticket sales along with building a baseball team. 

People said it didn't matter when they announced the payroll decrease last year either. It does matter. It all matters. Whether it's just a stupid media group and fanbase who isn't smart enough to keep up or not, it matters and he needs to be better. He's in charge of it all now. Figure it out and quit saying things that get your fanbase to turn on you.

4 hours ago, old nurse said:

Considering that there are reports that the Mariners are fielding offers on Castillo does Dipoto them come across as a liar thus hurting PR and should go to classes?

No. The Mariners haven't traded Castillo. They reportedly also got offered Bohm for Kirby or Gilbert and turned that down immediately. Because every team gets calls on every useful player that could be reasonably seen as possibly available. 

If Dipoto is just looking to salary dump Castillo (or Falvey is looking to just salary dump Correa) then he needs to be looser with his stance. But if he's going to keep him unless he gets the price he's asking then you take the strong stance knowing the only way you actually trade someone from your rotation (or Correa) is if you get a deal that is an obvious win. If you bring back a massive package the fan base is excited that your offense isn't going to bring you down so much next year and you win the PR on the trade. Instead of having negative PR out there for a trade that may never even happen.

Do I think Derek Falvey, Rocco Baldelli and the 25 other players on the team regret the signing? Obviously not.

Do I think Joe Pohlad, who now wants to present an overly favorable cash flow to prospective buyers regrets it? Very obviously.

3 hours ago, IndianaTwin said:

What would have been the reaction on TD (and elsewhere) if the FO didn’t give fans a heads-up last year about dropping the budget by $30 million and then did it anyway? I think the reaction would have been worse.

I don’t see it as a “heads up” to the fans, but more shifting the responsibility early. No reason for Falvey to say a word publicly about payroll at all.

The message at any point should have been “we like where we are at, so far, don’t see any deals that fit for us.” That would have been the loyal Terry Ryan type of thing to say. 

3 hours ago, Jocko87 said:

 

So let’s read what he said.  It nots the least bit different than what you wanted him to say.  It’s mealy mouth manager speak to answer a ******** question he is rightly annoyed that he has to answer.

Matter of fact, reading this again should give us full license to write a bunch of these crap articles about Buxton, Lewis, Duran, Jax, Pablo and Walker Jenkins.  He has obviously declared everyone available here.  Lifetime supply of clickbait!  

When he was pushed on Correa…the exact same thing.  There is no here here.  Don’t get bent out of shape because he didn’t use your preferred version of saying nothing.  And yes, your hypothetical quote is also a version of saying nothing.  

 

Nobody is bent out of shape. But "try to kick some creative ideas around" transitioning into leaving the door open to trading Correa is very different from shutting it down with "Correa is our shortstop and we have no plans to trade him." "Try to kick some creative ideas around" very much leaves it open to interpretation that they're having open and active conversations about trading Carlos Correa. "We get calls, but aren't planning on trading him" does not give that same kind of impression at all. They're not the same answer. They are more than the least bit different. His words matter.

Why is he annoyed he has to answer a question every head baseball person has to answer? Why are you acting like this is something every GM or POBO doesn't deal with? He's paid millions of dollars a year to run a baseball team. He can put on his big boy pants and answer the same question every other head baseball person answers. He's not "rightly annoyed." If he's annoyed by having to answer the obvious question then he should quit and find a different job.

And there have been articles about trading a bunch of people. And there will be every year. Because the honest answer is that every player is available for the right price. The question isn't what the honest answer is or whether or not this is a media driven thing and not really what Falvey meant, it's about letting the media drive the narrative or taking control of it yourself and stopping the continued deuteriation of the relationship between the team and the fans. "Well its the media and the fans should just be smarter" while shrugging their shoulders has been the Twins way of dealing with this stuff for a long time. And it's why they suck at selling tickets and driving revenue. DSP has been horrible at this stuff and Falvey seems to be taking his lead from him. Maybe MN fans really are the only dumb ones in the entire country and it just sucks that Falvey has to deal with this specific fanbase, but this is still the fanbase he has to deal with. The comments lead to more angry fans. After a complete disaster of an offseason last year and a complete disaster of an end to this season. "Fans should just be smarter" is not the correct response. Better statements is. Better PR is. Rebuilding the relationship between the team and the fans is.

The fans are pissed. You're now relying on fans to buy tickets to games and streaming packages for TV revenue. "Not my fault they misunderstood what I said, stupid media and stupid fans fault, not mine" is the wrong answer. Alienating your fan base even more than you have over the last 13 months is the worst possible outcome whether it's the fans fault or not. Telling the fans they need to change how smart they are isn't the right answer. That's the DSP approach. Changing how you act and speak as an organization is the right answer. Falvey and the Twins need to message better. If the last 13 months hasn't made that abundantly clear, I don't know what will. Blaming the moron MN media and fans is a cop out and not a solution. It's on the team to fix what they do. Not the fans.

4 hours ago, Schmoeman5 said:

Really! He was asked a question.  His response should be an easy answer. Along the line of. Yeah, sure. Other teams are inquiring about Correa. But we (the Twins) aren't even considering that as an option. Next question. 

I have no interest in Falvey giving definitive statements. Be vague, play company secrets close to the vest and let the other teams know as little as possible about your plans.

Will fans hate it? Yes. So what, keep as much on the QT as possible.