Time for Roden and Kreidler to go down

[Vanimal46]

6 minutes ago, stringer bell said:

 

I'd put it at 99.9% that Jackson would be claimed by someone. There seems to be a couple of catching transactions every day. Finding someone like Jackson with some skills plus someone that fits in well in the clubhouse has some value. There is a gap between the catching prospects and the minors and they really don't have anyone if either Jeffers or Caratini gets hurt. I put in another thread that I think the Twins need less from a 13th guy than most other teams because of all the positional flexibility and also carrying three switch hitters. Two weeks from Tuesday they can add another position player. I wouldn't be surprised. They have gone a month with three catchers and now have less than that before they can add an additional player.

 

Whether Jackson gets claimed or not, who cares? Have I traveled back in time to the Ron Gardenhire era? He's had 13 PAs in the last month. I want the most talented players up right now to contribute in any game as a "contending" team.

If we're worried about losing a 3rd catcher, then there must be a lot of people skeptical about Tom P's quotes to invest in the team. I am quite sure we can acquire another catcher for next year. 

[clone52]

3 hours ago, Vanimal46 said:

Jeffers or Caratini’s playing time gets bumped up and they can call up long time org filler Banuelos to play 2 out of 10 games. 

Yeah, that could work.

 

Then Jeffers or Caratini get dinged up in in game 1 of the playoffs and Banuelos has to fill in.

If playoffs were out of the picture, it's a no brainer.  And it really hasn't been a concern carrying 3 catchers until Buxton is back.  Twins always had the gaping Roden hole to fill so if they wanted a minor leaguer up, keeping 3 catchers doesn't hurt.

 

Honestly, I would maybe send Martin down for a bit in that scenario now.  You would want Jenkins, Larnach and Buxton to get plenty of OF time plus you would still have Keaschall and Clemens (and Kriedler).  If you wanted Sabato over Jenkins, you still have plenty of OF of you sent Martin down.  He has been struggling (until Monday), so it might actually help him and he could come right back up Sep 1.

[Vanimal46]

1 minute ago, clone52 said:

Yeah, that could work.

 

Then Jeffers or Caratini get dinged up in in game 1 of the playoffs and Banuelos has to fill in.

If playoffs were out of the picture, it's a no brainer.  And it really hasn't been a concern carrying 3 catchers until Buxton is back.  Twins always had the gaping Roden hole to fill so if they wanted a minor leaguer up, keeping 3 catchers doesn't hurt.

 

Honestly, I would maybe send Martin down for a bit in that scenario now.  You would want Jenkins, Larnach and Buxton to get plenty of OF time plus you would still have Keaschall and Clemens (and Kriedler).  If you wanted Sabato over Jenkins, you still have plenty of OF of you sent Martin down.  He has been struggling (until Monday), so it might actually help him and he could come right back up Sep 1.

What if all 12 of our outfielders get hurt tomorrow? 

[clone52]

1 minute ago, Vanimal46 said:

What if all 12 of our outfielders get hurt tomorrow? 

Oh come on.  1 catcher injury and another catcher getting dinged up is FAR more likely than the plethora of organizational OF depth all getting hurt.

What is the downside to my alternative idea of sending Martin down?  You conveniently ignored that in order to just take a pot shot.

[HarmonK03]

2 minutes ago, clone52 said:

Oh come on.  1 catcher injury and another catcher getting dinged up is FAR more likely than the plethora of organizational OF depth all getting hurt.

What is the downside to my alternative idea of sending Martin down?  You conveniently ignored that in order to just take a pot shot.

 How often has that scenario happended and what are the odds, you can't plan for every contingency.  What happens if Lee and Culpepper get hurt and Kreidler gets dinged up, what are you going to do.  You have depth but you can't go 5 deep everywhere.

[Vanimal46]

3 minutes ago, clone52 said:

Oh come on.  1 catcher injury and another catcher getting dinged up is FAR more likely than the plethora of organizational OF depth all getting hurt.

What is the downside to my alternative idea of sending Martin down?  You conveniently ignored that in order to just take a pot shot.

That's fair sorry. I would activate Buxton and send down Roden. Then call up either Rodriguez or Jenkins for Martin. 

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

12 minutes ago, Vanimal46 said:

Whether Jackson gets claimed or not, who cares? Have I traveled back in time to the Ron Gardenhire era? He's had 13 PAs in the last month. I want the most talented players up right now to contribute in any game as a "contending" team.

If we're worried about losing a 3rd catcher, then there must be a lot of people skeptical about Tom P's quotes to invest in the team. I am quite sure we can acquire another catcher for next year. 

Varland was a below average pitcher for years.  He showed a bit of promise last year yet everyone lost their mind when he was traded for a massive overpay at the time. Basing anything on where an individual is on the current pecking order is meaningless. Varland started 7 or 8 in the bullpen last year and is a closer now.  Jackson has done everything right this year which is why they are willing to give him a chance this year. They should have traded Jeffers at the deadline, and if they intended to dump Jackson then he should have been traded.  The dodgers gave some decent flyers to get a defensive only catcher but is a good teammate. So this catcher you think can be easily replaced has more value this year and next than most here realize,  

[Vanimal46]

1 minute ago, Hawkeye Bean Counter said:

Varland was a below average pitcher for years.  He showed a bit of promise last year yet everyone lost their mind when he was traded for a massive overpay at the time.

This is where you lost me. The Varland trade was universally hated in real time and in hindsight. Also, for years? Brother we traded him with 5 years of control left. 

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

5 minutes ago, HarmonK03 said:

 How often has that scenario happended and what are the odds, you can't plan for every contingency.  What happens if Lee and Culpepper get hurt and Kreidler gets dinged up, what are you going to do.  You have depth but you can't go 5 deep everywhere.

Go ask the Dodgers. 

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

Just now, Vanimal46 said:

This is where you lost me. The Varland trade was universally hated in real time and in hindsight. 

I still like that trade but I’m not like most. If you didn’t understand the parallel that’s on you. You think Jackson is easily a replaceable.  Judging by not trading him at the deadline the Twins obviously have bigger plans. 

[HarmonK03]

2 minutes ago, Hawkeye Bean Counter said:

Go ask the Dodgers. 

In the playoffs specifically as the scenario was laid, not during the season.

[Vanimal46]

Just now, Hawkeye Bean Counter said:

I still like that trade but I’m not like most. If you didn’t understand the parallel that’s on you. You think Jackson is easily a replaceable.  Judging by not trading him at the deadline the Twins obviously have bigger plans. 

Comparing a 31 year old backup catcher who has 13 PA in the last month to Varland is wild man. 

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

30 minutes ago, clone52 said:

Oh come on.  1 catcher injury and another catcher getting dinged up is FAR more likely than the plethora of organizational OF depth all getting hurt.

Edited- Nm

[HarmonK03]

4 minutes ago, Hawkeye Bean Counter said:

@HarmonK03- gets your facts straight. This example said nothing of the playoffs or your post. Is changing the goalposts or lying  your general strategy in trying to win an argument. 

Then Jeffers or Caratini get dinged up in in game 1 of the playoffs and Banuelos has to fill in.  This is the quote from the earlier post I was referring to.

So before you accuse someone of lying, have your facts straight.

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

4 minutes ago, HarmonK03 said:

Then Jeffers or Caratini get dinged up in in game 1 of the playoffs and Banuelos has to fill in.  This is the quote from the earlier post I was referring to.

So before you accuse someone of lying, have your facts straight.

Edited-
 

I found the single line you claim you were responded to but I didn’t see you quote it. In either case getting multiple catchers hurt is not that unusual and trying to defend it because it doesn’t fit your view is silly, 

[Cory Engelhardt]

37 minutes ago, Vanimal46 said:

Whether Jackson gets claimed or not, who cares? Have I traveled back in time to the Ron Gardenhire era? He's had 13 PAs in the last month. I want the most talented players up right now to contribute in any game as a "contending" team.

If we're worried about losing a 3rd catcher, then there must be a lot of people skeptical about Tom P's quotes to invest in the team. I am quite sure we can acquire another catcher for next year. 

This is where I'm at too. I have to think there are starting level catchers out there who would be available for a top 10 prospect in our system somewhere too. Especially with the apparent numbers game in our outfield especially.

I mean, let's say Jeffers does move on after we put the QO on him, They are going to want another starting level catcher right? Why couldn't a pairing of Austin Wells, who seems to have fallen a bit out of favor in New York, with Caratini, but serviceable until Lackey is ready in 2028? 

And I just literally threw a (figurative) dart at a dart board.

[clone52]

23 minutes ago, HarmonK03 said:

 How often has that scenario happended and what are the odds, you can't plan for every contingency.  What happens if Lee and Culpepper get hurt and Kreidler gets dinged up, what are you going to do.  You have depth but you can't go 5 deep everywhere.

We have organizational depth everywhere else man.  At catcher we are talking about 1 injury and then a guy getting dinged up for a couple of days and having to start a guy in the playoffs with a career, minor league OPS of 0.623 and a K rate higher than 30% and no power.

Think of how much you would hate Kriedler being a playoff SS starter and not just a defensive replacement.  Kriedler has FAR better minor league stats than Banuelos has.

[clone52]

Just now, Cory Engelhardt said:

This is where I'm at too. I have to think there are starting level catchers out there who would be available for a top 10 prospect in our system somewhere too. Especially with the apparent numbers game in our outfield especially.

I mean, let's say Jeffers does move on after we put the QO on him, They are going to want another starting level catcher right? Why couldn't a pairing of Austin Wells, who seems to have fallen a bit out of favor in New York, with Caratini, but serviceable until Lackey is ready in 2028? 

And I just literally threw a (figurative) dart at a dart board.

For next year, Jackson is definitely replaceable.  For playoffs this year, not so much.

 

Gotta convince me that having 3 catchers this year reduces the playoff chances this year before I would send Jackson packing.

[clone52]

32 minutes ago, Vanimal46 said:

That's fair sorry. I would activate Buxton and send down Roden. Then call up either Rodriguez or Jenkins for Martin. 

Any.thoughts on Sabato if some reason they decide Jenkins or Rodriguez isn't ready?  Plugging Sabato in at 1B or DH against lefties could really be a big boost to this offense if his minor league breakout transitions to the majors.

[Vanimal46]

6 minutes ago, clone52 said:

Any.thoughts on Sabato if some reason they decide Jenkins or Rodriguez isn't ready?  Plugging Sabato in at 1B or DH against lefties could really be a big boost to this offense if his minor league breakout transitions to the majors.

How many LH starters are we facing in the next week?

I wouldn't be afraid to call him up for that role. I don't think Sabato is a mid or long term solution, so why not see if he can catch fire short term? This team has a clear weakness against left handed and breathing pitchers. 

[Church of Kreidler]

As TD's Grand Poobah of the Church of Kreidler, just chiming in to say that I find it rather funny that a post partly about sending Kreidler down has morphed into Discussion #172 about The Jackson Problem, and the only commentary on Kreidler in the thread being "eh, having him here isn't hurting anyone."

[mnfireman]

44 minutes ago, clone52 said:

Any.thoughts on Sabato if some reason they decide Jenkins or Rodriguez isn't ready?  Plugging Sabato in at 1B or DH against lefties could really be a big boost to this offense if his minor league breakout transitions to the majors.

Bell and Lewis are two of the teams better hitters, plus Garver and Buxton DH occasionally... so no 

[KirbyDome89]

5 hours ago, Riverbrian said:

A third catcher is not important in regards to the every day roster... it's almost superflous and I say almost because Jeffers and Caratini will get some DH work where an injury can occur.

However... if they feel he would get claimed they will wait as long as they can before they attempt to get him through because they could try to get him through... get claimed and then Jeffers or Caratini gets hurt. 

 A decision will have to be made when Buxton is off the IL. Could it be Jackson? Maybe. 

As for the subjects of this this topic... Roden and Kriedler.

Patience is required with players just getting their feet wet. Can we show just a little bit of patience with Roden. Who knows what he will become but if you are going to toss him after 55 AB's. We know what he will become. 

Kriedler has been better than expected. He's slumping a bit but his playing time is going to reduce due to the presence of Culpepper... and Culpepper will also require a little patience. 

In the meantime... Roden had a great game today. Congrats Alan... Enjoy yourself.  

 

Roden is over 200 career PAs with a mid .500s OPS. 

Slumping a bit is an understatement if we're talking about Kreidler. He has an OPS in the low .400s over the last 6 weeks. 

Neither of these guys has any track record of hitting Major League pitching. How much patience can this team afford if they're desperately trying to win games, and what's the reward for said patience?

[Cory Engelhardt]

58 minutes ago, clone52 said:

For next year, Jackson is definitely replaceable.  For playoffs this year, not so much.

 

Gotta convince me that having 3 catchers this year reduces the playoff chances this year before I would send Jackson packing.

What if I told you that Jenkins, Rodriguez and Buxton will all be here by playoff time.

Would that change the equation for you on if a 3rd catcher is necessary?

[KirbyDome89]

1 hour ago, Vanimal46 said:

Whether Jackson gets claimed or not, who cares? Have I traveled back in time to the Ron Gardenhire era? He's had 13 PAs in the last month. I want the most talented players up right now to contribute in any game as a "contending" team.

If we're worried about losing a 3rd catcher, then there must be a lot of people skeptical about Tom P's quotes to invest in the team. I am quite sure we can acquire another catcher for next year. 

This. 

The Twins were such firm believers in Jackson earlier this year that they opted to pay Caratini $7M to be replacement level and tried to shop Jackson after tendering him an offer. Now he's suddenly so indisposable that they're burning a roster spot on a team allegedly trying to compete this season in order to keep Jackson in the organization? C'mon...

[jaimedude]

I think Kriedler has earned his spot, and the chops on defense to remain.  I  can live with his weak bat.  Because he has versatility and is a plus defender in both infield and center field he should remain.

 

[Dave Lemke]

4 minutes ago, Cory Engelhardt said:

What if I told you that Jenkins, Rodriguez and Buxton will all be here by playoff time.

Would that change the equation for you on if a 3rd catcher is necessary?

No. None of them can catch if Jeffers or Caratini get hurt.

[Vanimal46]

2 minutes ago, KirbyDome89 said:

This. 

The Twins were such firm believers in Jackson earlier this year that they opted to pay Caratini $7M to be replacement level and tried to shop Jackson after tendering him an offer. Now he's suddenly so indisposable that they're burning a roster spot on a team allegedly trying to compete this season in order to keep Jackson in the organization? C'mon...

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2026/03/twins-shopping-alex-jackson.html

Just adding on to your post with a receipt. But now he's a 100% chance of being claimed. Okay. 

[Cory Engelhardt]

2 minutes ago, Dave Lemke said:

No. None of them can catch if Jeffers or Caratini get hurt.

You are still talking about the backup to the backup. Not the backup. The backup TO the backup.

And that's only IF either the starter or the backup get hurt. Which they haven't. 

IF one of them gets hurt in a game, then the other finishes that game and the Twins can call up someone from AAA to be there by the next game right? To be the backup again.

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

23 minutes ago, KirbyDome89 said:

Roden is over 200 career PAs with a mid .500s OPS. 

Slumping a bit is an understatement if we're talking about Kreidler. He has an OPS in the low .400s over the last 6 weeks. 

Neither of these guys has any track record of hitting Major League pitching. How much patience can this team afford if they're desperately trying to win games, and what's the reward for said patience?

Roden is short a hit coded as an error an a triple that was coded as a single because it was a game winning hit. Roden OPS would be just under .700 with those changes for the year. Clemens didn’t have a track record either prior to last year. Even still Roden has options.