Should the Twins enter the Greinke Sweepstakes ?

[HitInAPinch]

 

When I started this topic I thought that the split would be about 50/50. When you have been burned as of late with signings such as Pelfrey and Nolasco and even with Hughes performance this year and only getting a half season out of Santana why wouldn't Twins Fans be hesitant to spend more on pitching? In my opinion the moves Terry Ryan has tried haven't worked out yet when it comes to the starting rotation. Does this mean he should stop trying and settle for what we have? If the Twins are serious about taking the next step a Number 1 is needed. Give me a guy who every time he takes the ball we could win scoring as few as 2 runs per game is worth the gamble. No things are certain but when you can sign a quality arm like this that may put you over the hump and have him pitch a one game wild card playoff or two times in a series, I say let the dice roll!

With what the Twins currently have as starters and the size and length of those contracts AND the expected size and length that Greinke and his agent will want, there's just no way Greinke's needs can be squeezed into the Twins rotation.  And by moving some of those current starters, you are looking at potentially weakening the rotation further.  It's just a bad fit.

 

I'm also questioning if this Twins team is actually ready for the next big step. I think we need to see some improvement in the everyday lineup before spending that kind of money.

 

I wish it were different.

[tobi0040]

There is literally no chance we offload the Nolasco or Santana contracts.  A chance exists that someone may take a majority of Hughes deal, but I don't know if that makes sense for us to do.

[tobi0040]

 

Completely out of context of your big market/small market discussion, but forget about the teams, in mass those contracts look horrible. Greinke (the younger version) was good. Scherzer had a good season but is definately still TBD, Lester, Tanaka and Darvish are TBD with giant red flags pointing toward regret.

Let's be the team that gets all the financial and statistical benefit from these kinds of guys when they're in their 20's and trade or get comp picks for these types of pitchers when their first contracts wind down instead.

 

History has been much kinder to those teams (get the younger player and flip them before the 7-8 year contract)

[Twinfan & Dad]

Twinfan & Dad, on 19 Oct 2015 - 9:19 PM, said:

Give me a guy who every time he takes the ball we could win scoring as few as 2 runs per game.

 

 

I was referring to Greinke ERA this year at 1.66 knowing that to repeat would be a miracle. Point being score two runs and he gives us a chance to still win. So here is your 1 ERA man for 2015.

[HitInAPinch]

 

There is literally no chance we offload the Nolasco or Santana contracts.  A chance exists that someone may take a majority of Hughes deal, but I don't know if that makes sense for us to do.

Of the bunch, I'd rather keep Santana. I feel Nolasco should be offered an injury settlement.  Hughes has also had injury issues in the past, and again now.

[Mike Sixel]

Completely out of context of your big market/small market discussion, but forget about the teams, in mass those contracts look horrible. Greinke (the younger version) was good. Scherzer had a good season but is definately still TBD, Lester, Tanaka and Darvish are TBD with giant red flags pointing toward regret.

 

Let's be the team that gets all the financial and statistical benefit from these kinds of guys when they're in their 20's and trade or get comp picks for these types of pitchers when their first contracts wind down instead.

that would require them to actually draft and develop pitchers, right? That has been one the issues here, they've not done it, for whatever reason, they have not done it well. It's easy to say "just draft them"......but almost no team is made up of guys they drafted w/o any FAs or traded for guys.

 

What would you recommend they do? Just never sign a FA or trade for a guy? How would last year have played out if they had no FA pitchers on the roster?

[Kwak]

 

Completely out of context of your big market/small market discussion, but forget about the teams, in mass those contracts look horrible. Greinke (the younger version) was good. Scherzer had a good season but is definately still TBD, Lester, Tanaka and Darvish are TBD with giant red flags pointing toward regret.

Let's be the team that gets all the financial and statistical benefit from these kinds of guys when they're in their 20's and trade or get comp picks for these types of pitchers when their first contracts wind down instead.

Yes, I'd like to live in Fantasy World too--where the Twins draft,sign and develop all of the top stars of the game.  But, they don't.  In fact, they rarely get this type of player.  When they do acquire one (or even a distant facsimile of one) the fans (including TD posters) clamor to keep this guy forever or complain long and loud about "losing him".  Sadly, I resign myself to live in the real world where Twins players are no where near as good as their fans proclaim.

[h2oface]

 

.......... the expected size and length that Greinke and his agent will want, there's just no way Greinke's needs can be squeezed into the Twins rotation.  

 

Greinke negotiates his own contracts. Or at least he did the last time he was on the market.

[h2oface]

 

Twinfan & Dad, on 19 Oct 2015 - 9:19 PM, said:
Give me a guy who every time he takes the ball we could win scoring as few as 2 runs per game.


I was referring to Greinke ERA this year at 1.66 knowing that to repeat would be a miracle. Point being score two runs and he gives us a chance to still win. So here is your 1 ERA man for 2015.

 

Greinke was often plagued by the Dodger pen, as was Kershaw. Many starts were 6 innings and 7 innings, and they left with a lead in a close game. The Twins pen was pretty bad, and that needs improved with the upgrade in starters. Too bad they starters don't/can't pitch complete games with that kind of ERA these days... and start every 4th day. Those were the days.

[HitInAPinch]

 

Greinke negotiates his own contracts. Or at least he did the last time he was on the market.

I'm reading that Greinke's 2012 contract was negotiated by Casey Close  [ 6yr. $147M].  But I have also ready the Greinke negotiates his contracts.  I don't know if it's the entire thing; I bet Close did the financial part.  More telling is Greinke's statement on what he looks for:

 

"There's a couple things I was really looking at with teams besides the money, I guess," Greinke said. "The No. 1 [factor] was to have a team that could have a chance to win a World Series for several years. ... My main goal was a team that was competing each year to get a World Series [title]. Also, I looked at the organizations some, the cities -- which ones we'd be most comfortable in and which ones we'd enjoy the most. Then also what my parents kind of liked and stuff like that."

 

So in other words:  Greinke will not sign with the Twins.  Period.

[Pius Jefferson]

From what I've read about Greinke it wouldn't necessarily be not wanting to play in a mid-market. It's the teams with higher payrolls are often the big city teams.

[h2oface]

 

I'm reading that Greinke's 2012 contract was negotiated by Casey Close  [ 6yr. $147M].  But I have also ready the Greinke negotiates his contracts.  I don't know if it's the entire thing; I bet Close did the financial part.  

 

Perhaps you could share the source of Casey Close negotiating the contract? That is news to me. Going to the meetings himself, agreeing on the points, and interviewing himself... to me that is the negotiation. Hiring someone to write it up and presenting it for approval of all the details and getting attorney or other eyes on it ....... I don't really consider the negotiation.

[HitInAPinch]

 

Perhaps you could share the source of Casey Close negotiating the contract? That is news to me. Going to the meetings himself, agreeing on the points, and interviewing himself... to me that is the negotiation. Hiring someone to write it up and presenting it for approval of all the details and getting attorney or other eyes on it ....... I don't really consider the negotiation.

And perhaps you could share your source that Greinke was the sole negotiator of his contracts?

 

But in the spirit of full disclosure:  http://m.mlb.com/news/article/40585162/

Paragraph 2. 

 

[Otto von Ballpark]

Probably just confusion.  Greinke indeed dropped his agent in 2011 and made comments about representing himself, but hired Casey Close in April 2012:

 

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2012/04/casey-close-to-represent-zack-greinke.html