Any thoughts on the top of the 8th yesterday?

[Brock Beauchamp]

But it is still impossible for me to ignore 0-12 from Dozier, Mauer and Willingham.

 

That's going to happen on a fairly regular basis, which is why three guys can't carry a lineup. This offense needs at least 2-3 more capable bats than they currently have on the roster.

[Mr. Brooks]

What I think is that if Pinto is not going to catch most of the games, is not going to DH, and is not even going to be used as a pinch hitter, then he needs to be in AAA playing every day.

[Linus]

I'm not a big Gardy fan but no amount of managing is going to overcome your best hitters being totally absent. With a short bench, I'm sure he didn't want to burn two players with one move. It really does beg the question: what exactly is Bartlett going to do this year?

 

Of all the things that happened yesterday, the most frustrating was Plouffe's AB in the ninth. Takes a fastball right down the middle for strike one, waves at a slider he couldn't have hit with a rake for strike two and takes a feeble swing at a splitter at his ankles for strike three.

[Linus]

What I think is that if Pinto is not going to catch most of the games, is not going to DH, and is not even going to be used as a pinch hitter, then he needs to be in AAA playing every day.

 

This. This again. For whatever reason, its seems like Gardy got his way on some of the roster decisions and they just don't make sense.

[Mr. Brooks]

With a short bench, I'm sure he didn't want to burn two players with one move.

 

 

Of course it's not ideal to have to burn 2 players with 1 move, but I think that 'saving' bench players for a situation that is unlikely to come up is silly. Same with saving your best relief pitcher for a situation that might never come up, or a situation that most any pitcher in the league should be able to handle (3 outs, nobody on base, 3 run lead).

[Otto von Ballpark]

I'm not a big Gardy fan but no amount of managing is going to overcome your best hitters being totally absent. With a short bench, I'm sure he didn't want to burn two players with one move.

 

Why even burn one player, when it is at best a lateral move?

 

My sense is that Gardy knew he should be pinch hitting for Florimon late in a close game, which is generally sound, but then really didn't bother to re-analyze the problem after removing his top two bench bats from consideration.

[Marta Shearing]

This is an indictment on Florimon.

 

If he's such a terrible hitter that he needs to be sac bunting in the third... and then is pinch-hit for by Escobar... he shouldn't be in the lineup at all.

Its an indictment on Gardenhire wasting Pinto's bat on the bench to guard against the highly improbable scenerio of Suzuki getting hurt. Herrmann should have made the team over any of these three; kubel, bartlett, escobar.

[jorgenswest]

It was the full bench. 4 players. It is not going to get better than that.

 

The Twins will need to pinch hit for Florimon this year. The best batter on the bench is likely Kubel, Colabello or Pinto. Bat them and pinch run Escobar if they get on. No reason to save them when it is the 8th inning and the Twins are losing. Burn to players and give the team the best chance to win the game.

[Riverbrian]

I would have used Pinto for Florimon in that situation. Escobar as pinch runner if Pinto reaches.

[Linus]

It was the full bench. 4 players. It is not going to get better than that.

 

The Twins will need to pinch hit for Florimon this year. The best batter on the bench is likely Kubel, Colabello or Pinto. Bat them and pinch run Escobar if they get on. No reason to save them when it is the 8th inning and the Twins are losing. Burn to players and give the team the best chance to win the game.

 

Well, I agree with you but Kubel wasn't an option against Sale and Bartlett wasn't an option because he can't hit. So, its Pinto (which I would have gone with but Gardy won't) or Escobar. I do agree with Spy that Escobar, while a better hitter than Florimon, isn't really the kind of guy you are looking for to provide a big hit late in a game. Its almost a nothing move which brings us back to the real problem and that is the construction of the bench.

[LaBombo]

He probably should have bunted in the 8th, too. Not that the outcome would have been any different. I wonder if Pedro's appendectomy is affecting his right handed swing. Or if Gardy got a bit excited with the bench move there.

Bunting to move a runner already in scoring position over when you need three runs is probably not a good use of one of only six remaining outs.

 

But I completely agree with your second theory about making a move for the sake of making a move, and it's definitely not just Gardy. Time and again it seems managers will call for a sac or steal when the out is more valuable, bring in a pinch runner or hitter who is only a tiny bit better, or make a pitching change that gives the platoon advantage yet is a net wash.

 

Why? Out of the perfectly understandable desire to 'do something'. The feeling is that if you're not making moves, you're not really managing, you're just watching the game from a really awesome seat. Nothing could be further from the truth, but it's easy to see how it can happen.

[Willihammer]

Not necessarily disagreeing with anything I've read here, but I do believe that Escobar is/could be a much, much better hitter than Floriman. Escobar had a nice AVG in the minors and a great stretch to start the year last year. How can you all bemoan (perhaps rightly so) Floriman's bat and not feel that ANY substitution was for the good in that spot?

 

That being said, Pinto should have been put in there. If you're not willing to give him that AB due to the catcher thing, AND you're not willing to let Mauer catch 2 innings, then drop Bartlett like's he's hot and bring up Hermann.

 

Any guy coming off the bench cold is going to do worse than when he starts. Whatever marginal advantage Escobar might have over Florimon would be erased by the fact that he'd sat all game and Florimon had already seen Sale twice.

 

IMO the best move for that spot, in decending order:

 

1. PH Pinto

2. PH Bartlett

3. Leave Florimon in

4. PH Kubel

5. PH Escobar

[amjgt]

Perhaps this was mentioned in the last dozen or so posts that I skipped past, but what about a double switch?

 

Pinto in for Florimon and Escobar in for Suzuki.

 

Of course, I would immediately counter with, "but Suzuki is up two batters later, what's the point?" Perhaps, then, that points more to a failure of lineup construction.

 

IF you plan on Catching Suzuki regularly (especially against lefties)

and

IF you plan on playing Florimon regularly

and

IF Pinto will regularly be your best RH bat off the bench (always going to be him or Cola', right?)

 

Then you need to construct your lineup differently. Suzuki needs to bat soon before Florimon in the order, not soon after.

 

That way, if Suzuki gets on base and Florimon comes up, you can PR Escobar or Bartlett for Suzuki and PH Pinto for Florimon.

 

If, lets say Florimon comes up first in the inning, you can do that same thing (without the Pinch Runner) and you've at least "burried" your inferior batting Suzuki replacement much further away in the batting order that inning.

[amjgt]

Expounding on that just a little....

 

Once Hicks proves his worthiness and gets moved up to 1st or 2nd in the order, this might take care of itself.

 

That would probably slot Suzuki 7th in the order, which, in the above scenario, is right where he should be.

 

Who's currently our emergency catcher? (I assume Mauer isn't allowed to even own a catchers mask at this point) Escobar? Bartlett?