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    What Happens if the Twins Can't Sign Yu Darvish?


    Tom Froemming

    When viewed individually, it's easy to see the logic behind all the moves the Twins have made this offseason. These are smart, low-risk investments in guys who should help the team improve next season. If you zoom out and judge the offseason as a whole, however, I can’t help but be unimpressed. Yes, it's important to keep in mind that we’re looking at an incomplete picture, but that doesn’t mean we can’t take stock of what’s happened so far and try to speculate about which direction the team might be headed.

    Image courtesy of Jake Roth-USA TODAY Sports

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    Every team in baseball has to do a little re-tooling each offseason, but as it stands right now, the Twins will have a number of big decisions to make at the end of 2018. Joe Mauer, Brian Dozier and Eduardo Escobar are all due to become free agents while Ervin Santana has a $14 million option. It seems like an easy decision for the team to pick up that option today, but a lot can change in a year.

    The front office has taken some small measures to shore things up beyond this year, signing Michael Pineda to a two-year deal and securing a modest 2019 team option in Fernando Rodney’s contract, but the fact remains that not much is certain beyond 2018. Who knows if Pineda can regain his old form, and even though Rodney’s in tremendous shape, it seems like you’re asking a lot to expect a guy to be a big contributor in what would be his age 42 season in 2019.

    What I see right now is a team that is trying to give itself a chance in 2018, but one that is also falling behind other contenders in the American League. At the same time, they've done virtually nothing to increase their odds of improving beyond next season.

    I think everybody (myself included) is hoping the team can land Yu Darvish, but would that move even make sense? It’s hard to answer that question. He certainly makes the team better, but how much would he really improve their chances of going deep into the playoffs? Is that worth giving him a potentially disastrous deal?

    Even if it doesn’t make the most sense from a purely baseball operations standpoint, I believe that it would be in the team’s best interest to make a big splash. I've been thinking this for a long time now. But what happens if the Twins fail to land that big fish they're after?

    If there’s one thing the Twins have, it’s flexibility. There is very little money tied up beyond next season, and the farm system is as healthy as it’s been in years. If the front office fails to sign Darvish or trade for a top-end pitcher who’s controllable for the future, then what? I figure they’ve got three options …

    1. Lower their aim.

    Darvish is an awfully high target. If the Twins can’t keep up with the competition, they could always turn to the other top-tier free agents that are still available: Jake Arrieta, Alex Cobb and Lance Lynn. The same thing could be said about the trade market. If the Twins can’t land a big fish (Gerrit Cole and Chris Archer seem to be the two guys most talked about), they could pivot to pitchers in the next tier down like Jake Odorizzi and Dan Straily. Both of those guys have some future control (Odorizzi through 2020 and Straily 2021) and would help improve the depth of the rotation.

    2. Go into sell mode.

    They could always revisit the idea of trading Dozier, Ervin or whoever else has value for pieces who are more likely to help in 2019/20. This would obviously make the Twins worse in 2018, but is it inconceivable that they could still be competitive? There are plenty of infield variations the Twins could assemble between Jorge Polanco, Escobar, Ehire Adrianza and even Nick Gordon. They could add a veteran free agent on a one-year or minor league deal into that mix for added security.

    In the rotation, maybe Trevor May could pick up the slack or they could catch lighting in a bottle with one of the rookies like Stephen Gonsalves or Fernando Romero. My point is I don’t think the Twins would be completely hopeless in 2018 without Dozier and/or Ervin. It would be a huge blow, and turn this upcoming season into more of a building year, but it’s likely the return in those trades could improve the outlook for the near future.

    3. Keep building for 2018, but maintain future flexibility.

    I hate the idea of staying in the middle ground, but this is actually starting to make a lot of sense to me. There are a lot of players rumored to be floating around on the trade market who will be free agents at this time next season. On the downside, those guys are only going to help you out in 2018. On the plus side, they’re not going to be nearly as costly to trade for as a guy like Cole or Archer. Which players am I talking about?

    Pie In The Sky: Josh Donaldson, Manny Machado and Cole Hamels (who has an option for 2019).

    More Realistic Targets: Andrew McCutchen, Nelson Cruz, Patrick Corbin, Brad Brach and Kelvin Herrera.

    I’d have a really difficult time seeing the Twins pursuing any of those pie in the sky guys, but it’s always important to keep in mind that we still really don’t know this front office. What if asking prices drop and/or this group doesn’t value one of its prospects like the rest of the market does? It could happen, but let's move on to more realistic options.

    Cutch and Cruz are both lefty killers and patient hitters who could really push this offense to the next level. You’d be potentially creating some playing time issues by adding one of these guys. Getting Cruz would certainly mean Robbie Grossman and/or Kennys Vargas would be gone and you’d be counting on Miguel Sano being able to play third base every day. McCutchen would allow for some more flexibility, making it possible to form some kind of a corner outfield/DH platoon.

    The only left-handed starter penciled in to the Twins rotation at this point is Adalberto Mejia, so Corbin could help even things out in that regard. He’s also pretty good. Corbin posted a 4.08 FIP and 2.54 K:BB for Arizona last season. Those marks were better than Ervin, Cobb and Lynn all posted last season.

    Brach has a 2.74 ERA, 1.13 WHIP and 9.5 K/9 as a right-handed setup man for the Orioles over the past four years. They lost closer Zach Britton to an injury. On one hand, they may opt to keep Brach to fill that opening, but on the other hand, Baltimore’s chances at being competitive seem pretty bleak.

    Herrera is coming off his worst year with the Royals, but he would represent a high-octane option for the Twins bullpen. Could moving him back into a setup role result in a return to form?

    Adding these one-year commitment guys would cost you some mid-level prospects that would hurt the system. They would also create further havoc for next offseason, but if this front office is as good as a lot of us here think, they should be able to play jazz. Why can't they just make it up as they go every offseason?

    Committing big money to aging players rarely works out. Plus, this plan builds in further flexibility. If the Twins got off to a bad start and were out of contention by the deadline, they’d have a bunch of the most attractive rental pieces to market. At the same time, if the young players like Gonsalves, Romero or any number of the relievers that are still in the system emerge, you've got some built-in turnover to create openings in 2019.

    Assuming the Twins lose out on Yu Darvish, what should they do? Feel free to offer up any other options I haven't detailed here. I'm sure there are a lot more than three directions they could go.

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    May and Hughes are starting the season on the DL. Can’t bank on Mejia, Gibson and Slegers to be consistent and healthy for 35 starts.

    This team needs two pitchers from outside the organization that are mid rotation types or better to think they have any real intention of competing in the playoffs in 2018.

    Our favorite team was in the hunt 2 of the past 3 seasons. If they made no changes whatsoever, they would still be stronger in 2018 than those 3 teams, and we have already made 3 solid moves with all kinds of time left. 

     

    We can contend in 2018, 2019, 2020, and 2021, blindfolded with one hand tied behind our back.

     

    You don't spent 100M for a game that may or may not occur. Interesting to note. The board was screaming for Berrios to start game 163 in 2015. I don't recall anyone wanting him to start game 163 in 2017.

     

    I'd rather have a team that has a chance to win a WS but could also tank due to injuries than to have a team that has a good shot at making the playoffs but has next to no shot at winning a WS.

     

    If by contend you mean maybe they make the playoffs, yeah I guess they have a good shot to do that. However that rotation puts them in an awful hole when trying to beat the top dogs to make it to the WS. It isn't close to good enough and Cobb and Lynn won't help in a one game playoff.

     

    And for the record, among the starters on the 40-man, I wanted Kyle Gibson to start game 163 last year.

    Plan B.  Sign Arreita or make a trade.  Lynn is not a fit here and Cobb is a #2/#3 type which will not move the needle much.  I preferred Chatwood to any of Lynn or Cobb.  That ship has sailed, so Twins will need to make a good move or just wait with what they have until 2019. 

    Grenke might be a good try depending on how many prospects the DBacks want against how much contract the Twins take.  If the Twins take most of the contract will the DBacks only take a couple of lottery tickets.  I would make the call and they wait it out. DBacks have to move soon on Martinez, so they may be motivated to deal.

     

    There are no signs whatsoever that they are ignoring 2018, in favor of 2019. Patience is a virtue.

    Their biggest signing is a pitcher who is coming off major arm surgery and is unlikely to see the field until 2019. The wait and see approach is fine at this point, there are still lots of dominoes to fall, but I think even the most patient fans would have to admit this FO hasn't done much the last two offseasons to improve this team for either the long or short term. Like you said, there's still time, but right now the Twins are watching the pack pull away. 

    Our favorite team was in the hunt 2 of the past 3 seasons. If they made no changes whatsoever, they would still be stronger in 2018 than those 3 teams, and we have already made 3 solid moves with all kinds of time left.

     

    We can contend in 2018, 2019, 2020, and 2021, blindfolded with one hand tied behind our back.

    this team doesn’t currently have enough pitching to win a 5 game series. Not even close. Pitchers and catchers report in what, 5 weeks? Time is tight to make 2-3 pitching acquisitions. If you’re waiting for the trade deadline it’ll cost a lot more than the Twins can afford.

    I don't want anything to do with any of these "top free agent pitchers." Do you really want to sign Yu Darvish to a 6-7 year deal? Then you have Alex Cobb asking for $20M a year?

     

    The worst part of the slow winter deals is Scott Boras is pulling all the strings and will get the lower end guys signed first before the big players sign unless the money is completely insane.

    From 2013-2016 Tillman was very valuable. He averaged 32 starts a year with a solid 4 year ERA in an AL hitter’s park. I would imagine if he hit free agency a year ago he would be seeking 20 million a year for 4-5 years. Given his age, he would have ranked above Lynn and Cobb.

     

    One shoulder injury later and he is looking for a make good one year deal. Someone will give him a shot. I hope it works out for him. His poorly timed injury cost him tens of millions.

     

    From the Twins perspective an incentive laden one year deal would make sense whether or not the sign Darvish. If I were his agent I would advise he go to a team like the Padres, White Sox or Royals who might be more patient early in the season. They would then hope for a good first half to flip him at the deadline.

    As a broad, general statement, I think it's folly to invest heavily in free agents, but more palatable to acquire young players, but in this specific instance, there has been so much smoke, so many signals even from the front office, it's almost a self respect thing at this point that I want the Twins to get Darvish. I want to know that Minnesota is a desirable location for a top free agent for my own satisfaction as much as anything

    From 2013-2016 Tillman was very valuable. He averaged 32 starts a year with a solid 4 year ERA in an AL hitter’s park. I would imagine if he hit free agency a year ago he would be seeking 20 million a year for 4-5 years. Given his age, he would have ranked above Lynn and Cobb.

     

    One shoulder injury later and he is looking for a make good one year deal. Someone will give him a shot. I hope it works out for him. His poorly timed injury cost him tens of millions.

     

    From the Twins perspective an incentive laden one year deal would make sense whether or not the sign Darvish. If I were his agent I would advise he go to a team like the Padres, White Sox or Royals who might be more patient early in the season. They would then hope for a good first half to flip him at the deadline.

    Tillman seems to be like the pitcher acquired to round out the rotation after signing Darvish because your tapped out and don’t trust both Mejia and Gibson.

    Tillman seems to be like the pitcher acquired to round out the rotation after signing Darvish because your tapped out and don’t trust both Mejia and Gibson.

    I trust both Mejia and Gibson more than I trust Tillman, which is not saying a lot. A Tillman signing would be merely the embodiment of the saying that there's no such thing as a bad one-year contract - on the 25% chance that he bounces back to what he once was. Except, that it would take up a 40-man spot and (I assume) a 25-man spot, both of which are currently kind of full. And the ceiling for Tillman hasn't been very high for a long time, unless you're a team with a sturdy bullpen because even his best years lately have been of the "six inning pitcher" variety.

    Tillman looks like the kind of guy who could end up having a nice 2nd career out of the pen. 

     

    But he's going to get another shot at starting this year, and the Twins already have a half dozen guys who should be fighting for the 5th spot. So maybe next year if he understands going in that he's destined for the pen?

     

    Of course it would. I’m guessing that perhaps the FO wants to see what they have currently first. Are there 5 starters among the current ML, AAA and AA squads? If the team is competitive and needs a starter, I could see a mid- season trade.
    I guess I’m just suspicious of the Pohlads and whether there is money to sign a front line starter for 2018.

     

    In the cold and snow of Maine, I've had time to think deeply and seriously about Twins pitching.  #SAD!!!  But to be serious, to me there is just one question for the front office this summer:  How do you evaluate your top five minor league pitchers.  If the answer is three or more will be on the Twins by 2019, then don't pursue any free agent starters.  If only two are certain to make the Twins, go after Darvish/Arrietta (who ever the value as the top free agent).  If you think one or none will make it, then forget the top guys and go after two or three next level free agents.

    Does ANYONE have ANY information on when Darvish might make his decision?

    If Darvish makes his decision while in Japan, and then crosses the International Date Line, we might find out yesterday!

     

    If the Twins cannot sign Darvish, I would ignore the next level (Jake Arrieta, Alex Cobb and Lance Lynn) as all three would mean losing a second round draft pick. 

     

    I'd set my sights on Jason Vargas. A lefty, with the Royals last year, he won 18 games, even though his ERA was above 4.00.  The Royals paid him $32 m over 4 years; entering his age 35 season, we could get him maybe for three years for $18 m?

     

    Not as big a splash as landing Darvish, but it would help. The Twins should want a top pitcher like Darvish, but if they cannot land him, they should keep looking. There are other good fish in the MLB sea.

     

    i think losing the pick for Lynn would be an okay tradeoff.  Cobb meh not so much.




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