2016 Election Thread

[drjim]

 

Oh, I fully agree people who support the man feel slighted in some way.

 

But I still believe they're stupid, as they've routinely voted against their own interests for the past several decades.

 

I'm not sure what outcome these people expected as we rolled back taxes, deregulated corporate and financial sectors, weakened labor rights, and created a system that slowly eats away at the middle class.

 

Yet here we are, arguing over Muslim refugees. What is happening with Voldemort is the very definition of demagoguery. While the country goes to hell in a handbasket around us, we're talking about immigrant rapists (and some, I assume, are good people).

 

You don't think loose immigration laws have hurt this population? You don't think expanded welfare hurts this population? Are you sure Obamacare is a net positive? And yes, I think tax cuts, even small ones, do help them.

 

Remind me again how exactly have they voted against their interests? Neither party does anything for their interests, so that seems kind of difficult.

[Mike Sixel]

All I can do is point to the states that act like MN, and how their economies are doing, and states that act like WI, KS, and MO, and how their economies are doing.....and wonder, which philosophy actually works.

 

We KNOW that if the GOP wins, they'll start another ground war that they refuse to pay for by raising taxes to pay for it. They talk a big game about balanced budgets, they talk a good game about accountability and paying as you go, but no one on that side is willing to actually PAY FOR the costs of those wars. In other words, the exact opposite of accountability.

[Willihammer]

I read something recently that 75% of the people in Iowa - much less the rest of the country - haven't even begun to think about the election or haven't made a decision who to support yet.

 

The people who have made a decision and are vocal on both sides of the aisle in support of either Voldemort or Sanders are the most extreme elements of their respective parties. They do not reflect the viewpoints of the big, quiet middle. That big middle will start to weigh in around February and the polls will start to change dramatically when it happens.

 

And Voldemort is going to have a very active enemy that will start to throw around its weight in the coming months. That enemy is the Republican Party itself. The movers and shakers of the GOP know a Voldemort nomination will reduce their party to a laughing stock in November and they will do everything in their power to stop that from happening. That means governors refusing to support Voldemort. That means Senators and Congresspeople throwing their support to establishment candidates. That means big party money going to support the likes of Rubio, Christie, whomever.

 

The two party system of this country doesn't only prevent a third party from rising to power. It also prevents anti-establishment candidates to gain traction if the party doesn't like them. And the party hates Voldemort.

You might be right but 1. Trump's policies are really not that out of line from the rest of the candidates. They're actually more reasonable in some cases (ie on taxes). And b. R's want to beat Hillary, whether that guy comes with a pedigree or not is secondary. And the polls in Iowa and SC indicate that the base is starting to realize another evangelical is going to be crushed in a general. Trump is the only one who stands a chance.

[Squirrel]

 

You might be right but 1. Trump's policies are really not that out of line from the rest of the candidates. They're actually more reasonable in some cases (ie on taxes). And b. R's want to beat Hillary, whether that guy comes with a pedigree or not is secondary. And the polls in Iowa and SC indicate that the base is starting to realize another evangelical is going to be crushed in a general. Trump is the only one who stands a chance.

So, you think this country is in better hands with Voldemort Hitler than Hillary?

[drjim]

 

All I can do is point to the states that act like MN, and how their economies are doing, and states that act like WI, KS, and MO, and how their economies are doing.....and wonder, which philosophy actually works.

 

We KNOW that if the GOP wins, they'll start another ground war that they refuse to pay for by raising taxes to pay for it. They talk a big game about balanced budgets, they talk a good game about accountability and paying as you go, but no one on that side is willing to actually PAY FOR the costs of those wars. In other words, the exact opposite of accountability.

 

Minnesota is fundamentally a much stronger state and should always have a better economy than Wisconsin, Kansas and Missouri.

 

It also can't be ignored that Minnesota has some of the biggest gaps between whites and minorities and college educated and non college educated in the nation. Democrats are certainly the better party if you are a college educated white person.

 

I lean Democrat, and nothing the Republicans are offering at the moment is doing much to change my mind, but there is a whole lot going on out there that can't be ignored. Even when Trump inevitably goes down, all that he represents isn't going away.

[Mike Sixel]

never claimed MN was perfect.......

 

The gap is an interesting issue.....is it bigger because everyone has a lower standard of living in those other states, therefore the gap is smaller, but a higher percent of the entire population is worse off, or because MN has an inherently unfair system, or something else/combo?

 

I agree, though, the Republicans aren't giving me much reason to move toward them right now. Denying science, assuming the capitalism always works like some sort of god (false idol, imo), and wanting to deny rights to some groups of people? Can't tolerate that. 

[Craig Arko]

So, Twinsnorth, what's the work visa situation look like in Canada for engineers? I've always wanted to see Halifax.

[Craig Arko]

A post from one of my other friends: "Trump is what you'd get if Internet comments suddenly became human and ran for President."

[twinsnorth49]

 

So, Twinsnorth, what's the work visa situation look like in Canada for engineers? I've always wanted to see Halifax.

Well, the railroad isn't what it used to be.........wait, that's not what you meant, is it?

[twinsnorth49]

All joking aside, I'm sad for America right now, how does it get to this? How on earth is this man still able to run for public office after something like this? It's truly frightening, there needs to be a wide spread, vigorous rejection of what he proposed and the Republican party needs to utterly disavow him as a candidate.

 

If not, see you all up here soon, seriously.

[mikecgrimes]

 

 

The two party system of this country doesn't only prevent a third party from rising to power. It also prevents anti-establishment candidates to gain traction if the party doesn't like them. And the party hates Voldemort.

 

Disagree the problem is lack of participation, even if you don't feel you belong in a room full of nut job Republicans or wacky Democrats your voice can only be heard at caucuses.  If even 25% of Americans participated in the process it would be a game changer.  I'll be there supporting Ted Cruz my support will be counted. 

[TheLeviathan]

I could be wrong but to caucus do you not have to be a party member?

 

If so then no thanks, I dont want to officially associate with either stupid party.

[mikecgrimes]

 

I could be wrong but to caucus do you not have to be a party member?

If so then no thanks, I dont want to officially associate with either stupid party.

 

I was on the executive committee of the Independence Party into 2007.  I caucused as a Republican in 2008 no questions asked.  Oh and I didn't vote for John McCain.  Trump supporters will be at Republican answers so from my persepective you can clearly not be a Republican and participate in the process.  Democrats are a little more strict about the process from what I hear, but if need be you can fake it.

[biggentleben]

 

I was on the executive committee of the Independence Party into 2007.  I caucused as a Republican in 2008 no questions asked.  Oh and I didn't vote for John McCain.  Trump supporters will be at Republican answers so from my persepective you can clearly not be a Republican and participate in the process.  Democrats are a little more strict about the process from what I hear, but if need be you can fake it.

 

And again, we discuss more reasons why the system is broken...

[Willihammer]

 

So, you think this country is in better hands with Voldemort Hitler than Hillary?

Ha, because I referred to her as Hillary? I think its about a coin flip personally. I would vote Trump if there was some assurance he would not actually follow through on his nuttier ideas like deporting of millions of Mexicans. But he is too risky to get my vote although I cannot bring myself to vote for Clinton either.

[Squirrel]

Ha, because I referred to her as Hillary? I think its about a coin flip personally. I would vote Trump if there was some assurance he would not actually follow through on his nuttier ideas like deporting of millions of Mexicans. But he is too risky to get my vote although I cannot bring myself to vote for Clinton either.

The fact you would consider voting for this modern-day Hitler tells me all I need to know.

[TheLeviathan]

I will say this, Trump is an awful human, but let's be real about Hillary: she's pretty terrible too.

 

Would it shock anyone if tomorrow, for political expediency, she became a Republican?  It's a sad state of affairs that we look at Hillary Clinton as a shining beacon of a candidate.

 

Pretty sure I'm sitting this election out.  By which, of course, I mean voting for Kodos.

[Willihammer]

 

The fact you would consider voting for this modern-day Hitler tells me all I need to know.

Lol judge much? Sorry you feel that way about me Chitown. Have an upvote anyway.

[Craig Arko]

Screw it.

 

 

[twinsnorth49]

The fact you would consider voting for this modern-day Hitler tells me all I need to know.

The fact any American would even consider voting for him explains exactly how ****ed your poor country is.

[Mike Sixel]

Well, on the good side, the Republican leadership decided to largely come out against religious bigotry. It took them some time, but they did it, I guess.

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

Well, on the good side, the Republican leadership decided to largely come out against religious bigotry. It took them some time, but they did it, I guess.

Outright bigotry, yes. But some of the GOP candidates aren't above using some of the same fear-mongering tactics Voldemort is proposing, only on a lesser scale.

 

Ted Cruz is calling to "suspend for three years refugees from countries where ISIS or al-Qaida control a substantial amount of territory".

 

I've become pretty depressed about this situation. I'm truly embarrassed for my country. We're supposed to be better than this. We're supposed to help people who need help. It's what we're supposed to believe in as a nation, so much that it's emblazoned on our most iconic national ****ing monument.

 

****. I'm just so ****ing depressed about this.

 

http://www.npr.org/2015/12/09/458973053/cruz-wont-criticize-trump-but-offers-his-own-plan-to-bar-refugees

[Mike Sixel]

I agree, Brock. I think the bigotry is alive and well.

[drjim]

Bigotry was always there, and it, along with fear, has always been exploited. Usually just a little less explicitly.

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

I agree, Brock. I think the bigotry is alive and well.

People are scared and that's understandable... But if we've learned anything in our history, it's that fear shouldn't drive policy, especially when millions of innocent people are in imminent danger.

 

Those people need our help. We have the ability to help them. If that's not what America is about, I don't want to call myself an American.

 

I'm disappointed, to say the least. The small-minded nature of recent American policy doesn't hold with the (probably naive) ideals I hold for this country.

[Squirrel]

 

Outright bigotry, yes. But some of the GOP candidates aren't above using some of the same fear-mongering tactics Voldemort is proposing, only on a lesser scale.

 

Ted Cruz is calling to "suspend for three years refugees from countries where ISIS or al-Qaida control a substantial amount of territory".

 

I've become pretty depressed about this situation. I'm truly embarrassed for my country. We're supposed to be better than this. We're supposed to help people who need help. It's what we're supposed to believe in as a nation, so much that it's emblazoned on our most iconic national ****ing monument.

 

****. I'm just so ****ing depressed about this.

 

http://www.npr.org/2015/12/09/458973053/cruz-wont-criticize-trump-but-offers-his-own-plan-to-bar-refugees

I won't 'like' this because what's to like about it. But I'm right there with you. And the more the rhetoric of hate and fear flies, the more it takes root in every day life.

[Squirrel]

 

 

People are scared and that's understandable... But if we've learned anything in our history, it's that fear shouldn't drive policy, especially when millions of innocent people are in imminent danger.

 

Those people need our help. We have the ability to help them. If that's not what America is about, I don't want to call myself an American.

 

I'm disappointed, to say the least. The small-minded nature of recent American policy doesn't hold with the (probably naive) ideals I hold for this country.

And acts like this are the result, at a public event, assumptions based on this hate and fear, and will increase, unless we stand and say 'Enough!'

http://m.startribune.com/my-run-in-with-hate-speech-at-a-minnesota-vikings-game/361117251/

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

I won't 'like' this because what's to like about it. But I'm right there with you. And the more the rhetoric of hate and fear flies, the more it takes root in every day life.

There's just so much fear and so little common sense (and decency) being applied to this situation. Candidates are literally politicking with other peoples' lives right now and it's disgusting.

 

ISIS is not going to attempt to go through the refugee process to get into America and if they tried something so idiotic, they'll almost surely be caught in the process. Our refugee immigration system is one of the most rigorous and difficult methods to reach America. Any competent member of ISIS is going to use one of the many less difficult routes to reach America or they'll simply enter illegally.

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

And acts like this are the result, at a public event, assumptions based on this hate and fear, and will increase, unless we stand and say 'Enough!'

http://m.startribune.com/my-run-in-with-hate-speech-at-a-minnesota-vikings-game/361117251/

I saw that earlier. A horrible situation, to be sure.

 

And then I read the comments. Any respect I had for America - Minnesotans in particular - dropped to nearly zero.

[Squirrel]

 

I saw that earlier. A horrible situation, to be sure.

 

And then I read the comments. Any respect I had for America - Minnesotans in particular - dropped to nearly zero.

Yeah ... I made the mistake of reading the comments, too. I almost cried. But I'm at work. The thing is, politicians aside, people need to start standing up to this kind of ****. Complacency is the other evil.