Chapman to Cubs

[jimmer]

 

That could happen too. In that worst-case scenario, I'd imagine they tagged Chapman with a QO, and they draft another Torres type with their comp pick. 

Cubs can't put a QO tag on Chapman.

[Vanimal46]

 

Cubs can't put a QO tag on Chapman.

Ah, I didn't know that. Well, there goes that theory. 

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

It was a massive haul.

 

Aroldis Chapman is a reliever who will pitch for the Cubs 20-ish times in the regular season and the Cubs gave up a prospect rated between #28-41 by major publications.

 

That, in itself, it quite a haul. Whether Torrres is blocked or not has absolutely nothing to do with his value as a player.

 

No, the other players aren't great... But they're still worth something. It's a haul for the Yankees any way you look at it.

 

I commend the Cubs for going big in this way. I also acknowledge they gave up a hell of a lot to do it.

It's a good haul, no doubt.  But those limited regular season innings will help as the Cubs try to secure home field advantage in the postseason.  And of course, the Cubs hope they are followed by some much higher-leverage innings in the postseason.

 

The other thing about Torres is, he's a good prospect, but he's quite a long ways from the majors, and his future value is mostly being determined by his tools at this point (he's had a solid year at a young age at high-A but no standout skills have been demonstrated quite yet).  Lest we forget, Deolis Guerra was BA's #35 prospect in MLB when we got him in the Santana trade too, actually higher than Gomez (#52).

 

And the other players are worth very, very little.  Warren has been bad this year, requires a 40-man spot, and is in the middle of his arb years so he's no longer super-cheap.  Probably a nontender candidate this winter.  McKinney will require a 40-man spot this winter if they want to protect him in Rule 5, which they might not -- he looks like Ben Revere without the steals, average, low K rate, CF defense, etc.  Crawford would require a 40-man spot too, if he was actually worth protecting (I don't think he is).

 

So, in addition to Torres, they got a nontender guy a little early, and a couple fringe Rule 5 eligibles.

[jimbo92107]

Chapman takes pressure off the rest of your pitching staff. Shortening the game is no illusion, it's how the Yankees dominated with Rivera all those years. If the Cubs are flush with infielders, then it's a good deal to trade a top SS prospect for the game's best closer. It's a World Series year for the Cubs. 

[Mike Sixel]

Cameron had an interesting point.....RPs see twice as many innings in the post season as the regular season, so for teams that make the playoffs, their value skyrockets......

 

I would bet they are re-looking at WAR/$/etc.... stats on FG right now.....and we see some changes.

[Bob Sacamento]

 

It was a massive haul.

 

Aroldis Chapman is a reliever who will pitch for the Cubs 20-ish times in the regular season and the Cubs gave up a prospect rated between #28-41 by major publications.

 

That, in itself, it quite a haul. Whether Torrres is blocked or not has absolutely nothing to do with his value as a player.

 

No, the other players aren't great... But they're still worth something. It's a haul for the Yankees any way you look at it.

 

I commend the Cubs for going big in this way. I also acknowledge they gave up a hell of a lot to do it.

No a massive haul would have been giving up a McKinney or Torres for Fernando Abad which if we waited long enough is what could happen.  As Theo said "If not now, then when?"  

 

The reason you have a farm system is to help the parent organization whether its via callup or trade or whatnot.  The organization has depth throughout, Torres is a real good prospect but end of the day he is just that, a prospect.  A prospect that is 3 years away from the MLB and alot can happen in that time frame. Value is subjective, something is only worth what someone else will give you for it.  For the Cubs, his value wasn't as high as it was to the Yanks or many other organizations due to the Cubs depth and roster age.  The Cubs placed more value in Chapman for 3 months than the speculation of Torres in the future.

 

Chapman isn't your typical RP, this isn't acquiring Brad Ziegler or Fernando Rodney, this is THE BEST RELIEVER IN BASEBALL.

[Bob Sacamento]

 

Chapman takes pressure off the rest of your pitching staff. Shortening the game is no illusion, it's how the Yankees dominated with Rivera all those years. If the Cubs are flush with infielders, then it's a good deal to trade a top SS prospect for the game's best closer. It's a World Series year for the Cubs. 

Makes the 6th/7th/8th inning more palatable with Rondon and Strop in the mix than just Strop.

[bluechipper]

Theo Epstein said he and Chapman had a "heartfelt" conversation about off field expectations before the trade took place. Chapman tells the media he can't remember what the conversation was about. That looks real nice, and even more reason to root against the Cubs this year.

 

http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/aroldis-chapmans-first-meeting-with-the-chicago-media-did-not-go-well/

[jimmer]

I am rooting for the Cubs to win it all.  I knew my two favorite teams (Twins in the AL, Rockies in the NL) wouldn't be competing and the Cubs have been my 3rd team for a very long time.

[Otto von Ballpark]

I am rooting against the Cubs, because I like them as lovable losers.

[jimmer]

 

I am rooting against the Cubs, because I like them as lovable losers.

that's a little warped, but kind of funny :-)

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

that's a little warped, but kind of funny :-)

It's also true.  I liked Charlie Brown too, but I never wanted him to kick that football...

[jimmer]

 

It's also true.  I liked Charlie Brown too, but I never wanted him to kick that football...

Twins fans are like Charlie Brown, Twins FO is like Lucy. 

[nicksaviking]

Sounds like the Yankees have or would turn down the Nationals for a Andrew Miller/Lucas Giolito swap.

 

Would have been a pretty good year for Perkins to be a healthy top end closer again.

[Vanimal46]

Sounds like the Yankees have or would turn down the Nationals for a Andrew Miller/Lucas Giolito swap.

 

Would have been a pretty good year for Perkins to be a healthy top end closer again.

Wow, really? That looks like highway robbery for the Yankees.

[jimmer]

 

Wow, really? That looks like highway robbery for the Yankees.

Yeah, that idea was floated on Jeff Sullivan's chat today and he said if that's a real offer Yankees should jump on it.  He hinted that the Nats might balk at it if the deal got serious.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

Sounds like the Yankees have or would turn down the Nationals for a Andrew Miller/Lucas Giolito swap.

 

Would have been a pretty good year for Perkins to be a healthy top end closer again.

I am intrigued by Giolito at this point, more than enamored.  Still a tough offer to decline.

 

Although Miller has a 14.8 K/9 over the last 4 years, and a 1.86 ERA / 1.81 FIP the last 3 years.  And he is even better than that in this, the present season, at age 31, and is signed affordably for ages 32-33.

 

Perkins spiked up to 11.1 K/9 once, and also peaked at a 2.30 ERA / 2.49 FIP that year, and of course he's 33 this year.  Those numbers would still fetch something today, although I'm not sure quite what.  I don't recall, what was the market for relievers like in July 2013?  That would have been the time to trade him, I guess, and instead we extended him the following spring.

 

Actually you could make a good case that we should have bid on Andrew Miller ourselves in the offseason of 2014-2015!  I suspect NY would have paid whatever it took to get him, but at 4/36 he turned out to be a steal.  (We would have saved $22 mil too by trading and thus not extending Perkins...)

[Vanimal46]

 

Yeah, that idea was floated on Jeff Sullivan's chat today and he said if that's a real offer Yankees should jump on it.  He hinted that the Nats might balk at it if the deal got serious.

Yeah I would think it's more of the Nationals who would balk at it compared to the Yankees. IMO they would be insane to turn down 6 years of control with one of the top prospects in the game. 

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

Yeah, that idea was floated on Jeff Sullivan's chat today and he said if that's a real offer Yankees should jump on it.  He hinted that the Nats might balk at it if the deal got serious.

Perhaps.  Although Washington is cruising to the postseason again with a fairly leaky pen, so Miller would be incredibly valuable to them.

 

And while Giolito is obviously a top prospect, the Nationals do have Scherzer and Strasburg signed long term, have had little trouble developing quality starters around them, and also have Lopez as a top SP prospect too.  If they think it will take Giolito a few more years to harness his talent, there are worse ways to spend that asset than landing Miller right now.

[jimmer]

 

Perhaps.  Although Washington is cruising to the postseason again with a fairly leaky pen, so Miller would be incredibly valuable to them.

 

And while Giolito is obviously a top prospect, the Nationals do have Scherzer and Strasburg signed long term, have had little trouble developing quality starters around them, and also have Lopez as a top SP prospect too.  If they think it will take Giolito a few more years to harness his talent, there are worse ways to spend that asset than landing Miller right now.

I think it's win-win trade myself in that both teams get what they really need, but for me, as far as value goes, I'd say Yanks win that trade. There's tons of value to have Giolito for so many years of control. I think Yanks have to do that trade if they can.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

I think it's win-win trade myself in that both teams get what they really need, but for me, as far as value goes, I'd say Yanks win that trade. There's tons of value to have Giolito for so many years of control. I think Yanks have to do that trade if they can.

I think I agree.  It would be a fun trade to see as a fan, if nothing else!