Let's Just Roll With What We Have

USAFChief · October 22, 2014

I agree with this for the most part. I would like to a SP and and OF brought in and of course the bullpen revamped through some young internal arms, but really don't think the team needs to go throw big money around this winter.

Before you say no improvement, same team, blah, blah, blah......here is the Opening Day Roster from last year, the guys in bold will not or will not likely be on the team. Big difference.....no?

Kurt Suzuki
Joe Mauer
Brian Dozier
Trevor Plouffe
Pedro Florimon
Josh Willingham
Aaron Hicks
Oswaldo Arcia
Jason Kubel

Josmil Pinto
Chris Colabello
Eduardo Escobar
Jason Bartlett

Phil Hughes
Ricky Nolasco
Kevin Correia
Kyle Gibson
Mike Pelfrey ??

Glen Perkins
Jared Burton
Casey Fien
Brian Duensing ??
Sanuel Deduno
Caleb Theilbar
Anthony Swarzak

That's 7 players on the wrong side of 30 all gone and 1 Florimon....and could include Pelfrey and Duensing. 10 of 25! 40% of the roster! A possibility of replacing 9 guys 30+ is pretty amazing. Certainly a gigantic shift in the make up of the team, especially because of the influx we are already seeing with the younger players.

That team went 12-11 in April.

That team without them went 11-15 in September.

stringer bell · October 22, 2014

The reality is that the Twins have taken a large step on offense. There are a lot of good offensive ballplayers on the roster and they will score plenty of runs next year, as they did this year. The core of this team is okay and pretty young, but they need a competitive pitching staff and improved defense. IMHO, the minimum they need to do is add an outfielder (must be good defensively) and a starter. No matter how many pitchers you add, there is never enough. Reinforcements might be the very top prospects in baseball or maybe like this year, surprises will make their way to the majors.

I don't anticipate contention next year, but it is possible. The Twins owe it to their fans to do that much.

Edited October 22, 2014 by stringer bell

SwainZag · October 22, 2014

It feels like this article has popped up every one of the last three years. What ends up happening is players show flashes of brilliance but have an overall average or below average year and you start the next year with the same questions about the same players and the same article advocating for a question answering year. It's a vicious cycle.

It's a vicious cycle if you don't have the young players in the ranks come join the big league club. You then fill the holes with waiver claims, minor league FA's and guys who really have no business being anything more than a backup player in the Major Leagues. You promote guys too early and hope they stick and bring in guys on the cheap hoping they can turn it around.

With a 25 man roster slated to be stocked with players under the age of 28 and a lot more players moving their way up the ranks....the middle of 2014 was the beginning. 2015 should be fun to watch, even if there are some bumps in the road.

SwainZag · October 22, 2014

That team went 12-11 in April.

That team without them went 11-15 in September.

Haha I'm glad that's what you got out of that. Nothing like using some small sample sizes.

Otto von Ballpark · October 22, 2014

I guess it depends on what your vision of the future is. Are you interested in player development or a few more wins? Do you see Sano, Buxton, Meyer, Rosario starting 2016 together? If you do then why not get them as much MLB experience as possible. It really comes down to how you view 2016 to me.

Maybe they aren't ready or won't be ready there is a decent possibility that will be the case but I also don't see a FA left fielder or pitcher taking us to the playoffs next year. That being said I want to see the team invest MLB time in the future players that might make the playoffs.

Odds are the Twins agree with you as they are very patient but I just want to see the young guys move as fast as possible now and if they do I think 2016 will be a lot of fun.

Uh, nobody is suggesting going "all-in" for 2015, dealing multiple top prospects for veteran rentals. Pretty sure most proposed acquisitions this winter can help us in 2016 too, just like Hughes will probably help the 2016 team, like Willingham helped in 2014. If a prospect starts knocking at the door, the veteran can help as a trade asset too.

The idea that handing Eddie Rosario an opening day job in 2015 will help the 2016 team more than just signing someone like Melky Cabrera just boggles my mind. None of these guys (outside of Meyer and perhaps May) are even knocking on the door of MLB right now -- odds are if you don't acquire veteran reinforcements this winter, you're going to waste a lot of playing time on guys like Parmelee and Pelfrey next year (again). And when 2016 rolls around, you're going to have no path to contention other than all of your prospects excelling.

Dman · October 22, 2014

Uh, nobody is suggesting going "all-in" for 2015, dealing multiple top prospects for veteran rentals. Pretty sure most proposed acquisitions this winter can help us in 2016 too, just like Hughes will probably help the 2016 team, like Willingham helped in 2014. If a prospect starts knocking at the door, the veteran can help as a trade asset too.

The idea that handing Eddie Rosario an opening day job in 2015 will help the 2016 team more than just signing someone like Melky Cabrera just boggles my mind. None of these guys (outside of Meyer and perhaps May) are even knocking on the door of MLB right now -- odds are if you don't acquire veteran reinforcements this winter, you're going to waste a lot of playing time on guys like Parmelee and Pelfrey next year (again). And when 2016 rolls around, you're going to have no path to contention other than all of your prospects excelling.

From the other side no one is saying the team won't win more games with some good FA signings. but FA signings are not the guaranteed success you make them out to be. Many people wanted Drew at SS last year and Escobar performed better and we kept Burdi who could become a fast track bullpen guy. We got a prized pitching FA in Nolasco and what did that get us. I think Meyer could, have done as well as Nolasco.

Both Santana and Vargas came up and played well this year. If shortstop was blocked by a veteran we wouldn't know what we have and be out a draft pick.

Sure Melky would help this team in the short term likely little question there but where is he three years from now? You look at AA and it is lineup of Buxton, Sano, Polanco, AB Walker, Rosario, Berrios, Duffy, the list goes on. Agreed that most of these guys don't sniff MLB until at least. July if not later but once you have. Melky we won't see Rosario until the contract is up. That is just the way is works.

We have the pipeline we should use it not block it.

DocBauer · October 22, 2014

I am on the side of improving and augmenting the team talent.

That being said, there is a part of me that sees Meyer so close, Berrios ready by August or September, believes in Hughes, Gibson and a healthy Nolasco, likes who's I saw May finish and wonders at acquiring a FA SP. Likewise, when might Rosario be ready, and could Buxton be ready by the end of the season as well.

I don't want to spend to spend, or just offer short term results that could block someone in the pipeline, only to take a step or half step back.

BUT...and it's a big BUT...I don't only not to want to rush anyone, but I also believe there are holes that can be filled smartly to improve the team without necessarily blocking anyone.

I don't know that you can ever have enough pitching. So the Twins take a shot on a nice, high potential FA SP. And it turns out. Someone wouldn't make a deal for our over abundance if this happens if/when Meyer proves ready?

Right now, today, Buxton is a season away, slightly less hopefully. Rosario is half a season away, slightly less hopefully. Brining in at least one quality OF blocks who exactly?

You spend money you can actually afford to spend on a quality FA OF, a SP FA, and maybe a small deal RP Buxton-hopeful and you try to improve the ball club. You can always trade from additional depth if it turns out right.

Otto von Ballpark · October 22, 2014

From the other side no one is saying the team won't win more games with some good FA signings. but FA signings are not the guaranteed success you make them out to be. Many people wanted Drew at SS last year and Escobar performed better and we kept Burdi who could become a fast track bullpen guy. We got a prized pitching FA in Nolasco and what did that get us. I think Meyer could, have done as well as Nolasco. Both Santana and Vargas came up and played well this year. If shortstop was blocked by a veteran we wouldn't know what we have and be out a draft pick. Sure Melky would help this team in the short term likely little question there but where is he three years from now? You look at AA and it is lineup of Buxton, Sano, Polanco, AB Walker, Rosario, Berrios, Duffy, the list goes on. Agreed that most of these guys don't sniff MLB until at least. July if not later but once you have. Melky we won't see Rosario until the contract is up. That is just the way is works. We have the pipeline we should use it not block it.

Morales ultimately didn't block Vargas. Santana came up even though we had another starter at SS anyway.

Also, we have multiple open outfield spots -- even if we sign Cabrera, there is still a wide-open spot for a prospect who pushes the envelope, or even the decent performing stopgap du jour.

Pitching-wise, I don't think Nolasco was a "prized FA" and I agree I would prefer not signing another like him. If we can't/won't snag an ace, a higher upside project like Masterson would be a good investment, though.

Could the Twins be late/stubborn in replacing a vet with a prospect, or move a guy out of position (i.e. Santana), and cause some frustration? Almost certainly. But I'd rather take a chance at adding a positive asset rather than rely fully on stopgaps and rushed prospects.

nicksaviking · October 22, 2014

I won't quibble here too much, except to say that given his track record, calling Hughes at #2-#3 starter at this point is perfectly acceptable. Shields' career low in IP is basically equal to Hughes' career best, and his career ERA+ (over 1900 IP) is basically the same as Hughes' single season best (in 209 IP). And Shields isn't exactly old or on any kind of noticeable downslope yet.

But because Shields career IP is so impressive, he has nearly 1,800 IP in eight years.

He's no longer missing bats, he's getting roughed up in the post season and he's turning 33. Shields was a better pitcher and his overall career will likely be better, but I'd rather have Hughes going forward. I wouldn't want that next James Shields contract. Perhaps his disappointing post season will help limit expecations and he won't get an unreasonable contract, but odds are he'll still get one that the buyer regrets.

Dman · October 22, 2014

Morales ultimately didn't block Vargas. Santana came up even though we had another starter at SS anyway.

Also, we have multiple open outfield spots -- even if we sign Cabrera, there is still a wide-open spot for a prospect who pushes the envelope, or even the decent performing stopgap du jour.

Pitching-wise, I don't think Nolasco was a "prized FA" and I agree I would prefer not signing another like him. If we can't/won't snag an ace, a higher upside project like Masterson would be a good investment, though.

Could the Twins be late/stubborn in replacing a vet with a prospect, or move a guy out of position (i.e. Santana), and cause some frustration? Almost certainly. But I'd rather take a chance at adding a positive asset rather than rely fully on stopgaps and rushed prospects.

As I think I said earlier yours is the safer sounder strategy and likely the Twins way of operating. My ideas are a bit pie in the sky but they are more in line with how I feel about this topic.

Mike Sixel · October 22, 2014

If half of the prospects don't work out for 2016, should they wait another 2-3 years at that point, or at that point can they try to make the team better even though the prospects didn't work out?

Because that is the point they are at now. Their prospects weren't all that good, so they have gaping holes all over the field. I'm at a loss to understand how signing Hughes was a good idea, but signing other players that might help out is a bad idea.

Another straw man.....no one is saying FAs always work out. No one.

sandbun · October 22, 2014

Absolutely, let's roll with what we have. After all, we certainly don't want to give the players the mistaken impression that the Twins organization cares about wins and losses. Just go out there and be good enough or promising enough to try to win some fans back into the seats. /sarcasm (Although it's hard to tell if that isn't the front office's thought sometimes)

I don't know about anyone else, but the story that came out a while back about how a Twins player was upset after a loss and another Twins player told him basically not to get worked up about it made me sick. Yes, it is true it's only a game and doesn't matter much in the grand scheme of things. But I don't like that losing is just something you get over, I want them mad. Losing is contagious. I don't think that culture dies if you take a 'let's just see what happens and hope everything and every prospect works out and fix it later if they don't' approach.

I also don't get the concern so many have with 'blockers'. Maybe, maybe in the short term they might hurt a team a little, and I'm not convinced that happens as often as people say. But in the long term, when has it hurt the Twins, or anyone, to have too many good players? When Mauer was ready and needed to be in the lineup, we had a tradeable asset in AJ Piersinsky. Was that really so terrible? Were the Twins really harmed a great deal by Morneau needing to improve his defense before he was allowed to replace Mientkiewicz even when his bat was better than Dougy's was? Does anyone really believe that hurt the team long term? Maybe Span could've been an asset over Gomez, but I doubt he would've been the difference between those teams going deep into the playoffs, and having Span not racking up playing time was why he had such a team friendly contract and why we were able to trade him for Meyer in the first place. Anyone really want to go back in time and reverse that decision? I know it sucks seeing a guy you want to be called up not getting a chance because the Twins don't have a spot for him - although sometimes they do and the team doesn't call him up anyhow, but that's a different discussion and not related to blockers. But when has having too many good players actually ended up hurting the Twins in the long run? And sometimes blockers end up blocking a guy who wasn't actually ready - looking at you Hicks. Maybe, just maybe, having blockers isn't such a bad thing.

Edited October 22, 2014 by sandbun

Otto von Ballpark · October 22, 2014

But because Shields career IP is so impressive, he has nearly 1,800 IP in eight years.

He's no longer missing bats, he's getting roughed up in the post season and he's turning 33. Shields was a better pitcher and his overall career will likely be better, but I'd rather have Hughes going forward. I wouldn't want that next James Shields contract. Perhaps his disappointing post season will help limit expecations and he won't get an unreasonable contract, but odds are he'll still get one that the buyer regrets.

My post wasn't advocating for Shields or making any sort of value claims about him -- I was just responding to a specific claim that Hughes is "more of an ace right now (and likely to be next year) than Shields." It took what is (thus far) a career year with a fluky historic low walk rate from Hughes just to match Shields' career run prevention mark (and still fell short of Shields' 2013-2014 run prevention marks).

nicksaviking · October 22, 2014

If half of the prospects don't work out for 2016, should they wait another 2-3 years at that point, or at that point can they try to make the team better even though the prospects didn't work out?

Because that is the point they are at now. Their prospects weren't all that good, so they have gaping holes all over the field. I'm at a loss to understand how signing Hughes was a good idea, but signing other players that might help out is a bad idea.

Another straw man.....no one is saying FAs always work out. No one.

Well I think the second half of 2014-early 2016 is different than the previous years, or likely the years that follow. We are finally at the point where we can expect to see the prospects that we have been promised for so long.

I think the feeling is that the Twins didn't have the young talent capable of getting a shot from 2011-2013, that's when they should have been signing the better quality free agents to 2-3 year deals. I'm glad to have Hughes, I'm not glad to have Nolasco. Signing another Hughes, which in turn blocks May or Meyer would be acceptable, signing another Nolasco would not be. I don't trust the front office to identify another Hughes though, as they have a much longer track record of finding disappointment on the free agent market.

If the prospects we've been waiting for don't pan out over the next season and a half, then it's time to recommence the call for the team to get more active in free agency.

Edited October 22, 2014 by nicksaviking

nicksaviking · October 22, 2014

My post wasn't advocating for Shields or making any sort of value claims about him -- I was just responding to a specific claim that Hughes is "more of an ace right now (and likely to be next year) than Shields." It took what is (thus far) a career year with a fluky historic low walk rate from Hughes just to match Shields' career run prevention mark (and still fell short of Shields' 2013-2014 run prevention marks).

I agree. I guess my point was that I feel that the free agents who are available and could be viewed as a top of the rotation option, will almost certainly turn out to be albatrosses due to the idea that they have all put a lot of innings on their arms, almost certainly the best innings of their career are already gone. Hughes performance going forward has little bearing on what I want this club to do with the pitching staff.

Major League Ready · October 22, 2014

I am torn on signing another SP. If you sign another SP you have that player, Nolasco, Hughes, and Gibson. Therefore, you have 1 spot available for May, Meyer, Malone, and Barrios. I realize Sps get hurt but that arrangement would not have provided much opportunity for prospects this year.

Many people here say the Twins need to embrace rebuilding. Signing FA SPs on the wrong side of 30 is not a sound strategy in rebuilding, especially the ones that require a contract where they are very likely no longer performing in the final couple years.

I also think while no one says FAs always work out. Those same advocates do not put much weight on the impact over the course of the contract and they likely deterioration in production from these older FAs. If we sign a "Lester tye" for $20M or more and they end up like CC or Lincecum or any one of many other examples, the Twins are going to have $60M tied up in Mauer, Nolasco, and this mythical FA in 2016 & 2017 when there is a real chance they could be contending. Some will respond they will have plenty of cheap talent so they could afford. That is a very parochial view. What could they be if they had the $60M to spend to fill the holes necessary to be a dominant team?

Otto von Ballpark · October 22, 2014

I am torn on signing another SP. If you sign another SP you have that player, Nolasco, Hughes, and Gibson. Therefore, you have 1 spot available for May, Meyer, Malone, and Barrios. I realize Sps get hurt but that arrangement would not have provided much opportunity for prospects this year.

Gibson's coming off an 88 ERA+ season, Nolasco 73 -- and you want to guarantee them each a rotation spot PLUS keep two more spots wide open?

I guarantee you, of all the Twins problems in 2015, opportunities for starting pitchers (and outfielders) should not be among them.

TheDean · October 22, 2014

If we view Santana as a SS and Escobar as UT, I don't know where we're going to get proper OF depth to field an acceptable team. There is most certainly room for acquisitions in the OF.

In no particular order, names that have been brought up for the 2015 OF internally:

Schafer: probably a good 4th OF - only startable against RHP

Hicks: not yet starting caliber, maybe you make him prove he deserves a full-time role with VWL, Spring Training, and possibly AAA experience. Especially against RHP.

Rosario: didn't perform well in a shortened AA season, hasn't seen a AAA game yet

Sano scenario: Has no OF experience. He'll be using a newly-constructed elbow for the first time, aside from some practice in DWL and Spring Training. Hasn't seen a AAA game

Buxton: Injury concerns abound, has barely played at the AA level

Ortiz: Currently a strikeout machine, can't take a walk

Parm: Fairly certain he's not ML-caliber with the bat or with the glove in a corner OF spot. "Good enough" in RF, but a lot of fly balls will drop if he's playing opposite Arcia.

Arcia: He's our only "lock" in the OF. He's not going anywhere.

Quiz time: which players mentioned above had a season OPS above .700 in the league where he ended last season?

Answer: Arcia at .752 (OBP .300) and Ortiz .717 at Rochester with a .283 OBP.

Offense obviously wasn't an issue for the Twins last year, but the OF offense numbers got a boost from Santana, Fuld, and Hammer, none of which should be a Twins OF for 2015. Defense was an issue for the Twins last year, and the big upside of most of the names in this group is that they're competent with the glove (Arcia, Parm, Sano wouldn't qualify).

SwainZag · October 22, 2014

Gibson's coming off an 88 ERA+ season, Nolasco 73 -- and you want to guarantee them each a rotation spot PLUS keep two more spots wide open?

I guarantee you, of all the Twins problems in 2015, opportunities for starting pitchers (and outfielders) should not be among them.

Like it or not, barring injury I think you can conclude Gibson and Nolasco will both be in the rotation next year. One is 26 and coming off a much improved sophomore season and the other is owed big money the next 3 years. Both of them were hampered by bad defense and showed better than their ERA+ can show.

Rosterman · October 22, 2014

I am torn on signing another SP. If you sign another SP you have that player, Nolasco, Hughes, and Gibson. Therefore, you have 1 spot available for May, Meyer, Malone, and Barrios. I realize Sps get hurt but that arrangement would not have provided much opportunity for prospects this year.

Many people here say the Twins need to embrace rebuilding. Signing FA SPs on the wrong side of 30 is not a sound strategy in rebuilding, especially the ones that require a contract where they are very likely no longer performing in the final couple years.

I also think while no one says FAs always work out. Those same advocates do not put much weight on the impact over the course of the contract and they likely deterioration in production from these older FAs. If we sign a "Lester tye" for $20M or more and they end up like CC or Lincecum or any one of many other examples, the Twins are going to have $60M tied up in Mauer, Nolasco, and this mythical FA in 2016 & 2017 when there is a real chance they could be contending. Some will respond they will have plenty of cheap talent so they could afford. That is a very parochial view. What could they be if they had the $60M to spend to fill the holes necessary to be a dominant team?

The thing is...it is only money. And the more money you have, the bigger mistakes you can make going towards a payoff that could, basically, wipe out your losses.

The Twins signed Mauer, made him a franchise player (like Puckett before). If you take his salary out of the payroll equation and call him goodwill or marketing, which is really what it was and is and will be if he doesn't totally tank, you have more money.

What, the last four years the Twins were paying Pelfrey, Blackburn, Baker, Nathan to pitch nothing for the team This happens. You plan for it. You absorb it. You jettison it at some point if you can and make it someone else's problem.

You cut Pelfrey after spring training if he isn't ready. Don't send him to Rochester to block someone else. He's not in the plans or 2016.

Do you keep throwing Nolasco out there just because he is owed money, and not play the rooked who is shining and the true future? Management has to eat crow, be willing to admit mistakes and move forward.

Our management makes mistakes and seems to say "we are not going to overspend on first round draft picks," "we got burned on Japan and won't do that again," "we listened to fans and spent on free agents and look what happened, we won't do that ever again," "one of our guys is a free agent and he should take a hometeam discount because he shined for us and was vastly underpaid the past six years."

Better yet: "Lock-in to your 2015 season ticket package and you'll get free $1 dome dogs at every game, ketchup extra though."

When you make profits, you can gamble, for sure, with those profits. You may lose, but you may win.

nicksaviking · October 22, 2014

Gibson's coming off an 88 ERA+ season, Nolasco 73 -- and you want to guarantee them each a rotation spot PLUS keep two more spots wide open?

I guarantee you, of all the Twins problems in 2015, opportunities for starting pitchers (and outfielders) should not be among them.

But it won't be Gibson or Nolasco losing a rotation spot to a new free agent. It will be Meyer and May. If I thought for a second that Nolasco actually had to win a job in spring training I'd be on board, but no one really thinks that. There was no reason May or Meyer couldn't have competed for a rotation spot out of spring training last year, but they were never given a chance because of all the "depth" this team thought it had at the position.

Edited October 22, 2014 by nicksaviking

TheLeviathan · October 22, 2014

Can we restart the conversation without the silly False Dilemma of Promotion/Talent Pipeline vs. Free Agency? I'm really tired of the notion these two can't co-exist.

bird · October 22, 2014

Pino was such a better option that he was released at the end of the season. Having seen them all pitch, I can't put Pino, Logan, Gilmartin,or Johnson even close to Meyer's class as a future MLB pitcher. Meyer's stuff is just way better. Meyer misses bats, and buckles knees. It is very debatable that Meyer wasn't just as ready at the times the Twins chose Pino and Logan. Meyer was lasting just as long into games as most of the Twins' starters were, and that Pino and Logan did after they got there. We will never know how he would have done because he was never given the opportunity, so all the talk is just that.

It's OK to dream into the future about Meyer, but I think you're making a huge and inaccurate assumption to say that Meyer would have buckled knees and missed bats. Maybe he would have simply missed the plate and been pulled after three innings, five walks, and 70 pitches. No one on this site has ever argued that Meyer's ceiling is lower than a single one of these guys. Pino was likely regarded from the start as a one-year guy, and he was a terrific addition, giving us some nice starts up until he was injured. They didn't cut him because of his performance per se.

bird · October 22, 2014

Can we restart the conversation without the silly False Dilemma of Promotion/Talent Pipeline vs. Free Agency? I'm really tired of the notion these two can't co-exist.

Agreed. I can't remember a season that we didn't have at least three staters go down for extended periods.

Shane Wahl · October 22, 2014

I basically totally agree with this. Meyer to the bullpen initially as Milone gets a shot to start would be my only change.

Winston Smith · October 22, 2014

Prospects are never a sure thing so anytime you can add players that are better than what you have now do it. If the prospects are good enough you'll find a place for them.

bird · October 22, 2014

But it won't be Gibson or Nolasco losing a rotation spot to a new free agent. It will be Meyer and May. If I thought for a second that Nolasco actually had to win a job in spring training I'd be on board, but no one really thinks that. There was no reason May or Meyer couldn't have competed for a rotation spot out of spring training last year, but they were never given a chance because of all the "depth" this team thought it had at the position.

nick, I think the flaw in this is an underlying belief that the Twins were just as clueless as we were regarding the stage of development and readiness of these guys. I disagree that they were not auditioned for starting spots because of "depth". I doubt you could've found a close observer that thought May or Meyer were likely to outperform Nolasco out of the shoots last spring.

nicksaviking · October 22, 2014

Prospects are never a sure thing so anytime you can add players that are better than what you have now do it. If the prospects are good enough you'll find a place for them.

I'd like to think so, but this team continues to opporate like pitching prospects are delicate flowers that can't possibly handle the MLB spotlight unless the team has no other options. They have no problem throwing AAAA guys to the wolves, but if it's an honest to God prospect, they seem inclined to find any excuse to resist letting them take their lumps at the MLB level. This needs to stop and signing more Kevin Correia's to multi-year deals isn't going to encourage the front office to let the (hopefully) future arms sink or swim. This team isn't cutting bait on a starter in thier first year of a multi-year deal even if the prospect is ready.

I'd love a one year deal for a Justin Masterson, I'd hate a three year deal for a Brandon McCarthy.

nicksaviking · October 22, 2014

nick, I think the flaw in this is an underlying belief that the Twins were just as clueless as we were regarding the stage of development and readiness of these guys. I disagree that they were not auditioned for starting spots because of "depth". I doubt you could've found a close observer that thought May or Meyer were likely to outperform Nolasco out of the shoots last spring.

No but there would have been plenty to predict they would have outperformed opening day starters Correia, Pelfrey and perhaps even Gibson. Even if they would not have outperformed them, there really should have been next to no concern about Pelfrey and Correia losing out in what was clearly destined to be another losing season.

Winning doens't happen until the young guys get their feet wet.

Otto von Ballpark · October 22, 2014

Like it or not, barring injury I think you can conclude Gibson and Nolasco will both be in the rotation next year. One is 26 and coming off a much improved sophomore season and the other is owed big money the next 3 years. Both of them were hampered by bad defense and showed better than their ERA+ can show.

But it won't be Gibson or Nolasco losing a rotation spot to a new free agent. It will be Meyer and May. If I thought for a second that Nolasco actually had to win a job in spring training I'd be on board, but no one really thinks that. There was no reason May or Meyer couldn't have competed for a rotation spot out of spring training last year, but they were never given a chance because of all the "depth" this team thought it had at the position.

Perhaps I wasn't clear -- I have no illusions or desire that Gibson and Nolasco be denied 2015 rotation spots, and one or both may even succeed. But at this point, neither is the kind of pitcher you want to give a spot without a backup plan. Same for Milone, same for the prospects... basically every SP the Twins have except Hughes. If we could add another starter like Hughes near the top of the depth chart, and push out the Pelfreys and Darnells at the bottom (or at least relegate them to other roles), I can't see that as anything but a positive for the Twins, in 2015 and beyond. That doesn't mean it's a burning priority, that we have to dramatically overpay or sell the farm for, but if it could be done, it would be a great move forward from 2012-2014.

Same for the outfield -- right now, Arcia is really the only internal option we can trust out there without a safety net (although even he might benefit from using an actual net in the outfield ). An outfield addition that pushes Parmelee or Schafer off the depth chart (or at least firmly into non-starting roles) and prevents us from rushing Rosario, Ortiz, and Hicks (again) should be welcomed.

Now, if you don't trust management to add another veteran starter and still leave a spot to be shared by Meyer/May (i.e. pegging Pelfrey and Milone a lot higher on the depth chart than most outside observers)... well, that's a lot deeper issue. (The outfield isn't so bad in this regard; as I've stated, there are no promising outfielders knocking on the door of MLB like May and Meyer are.)

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Should Emmanuel Rodriguez get a call-up to the Twins today?