Berardino: Mastroianni Out Awhile + My Twins Med Staff Rant

[ashbury]

Could you imagine if this was happening with Mauer, Morneau and Willingham?

 

When Mauer, Morneau and Baker (among others) had downtime, the meme became Small Market Is Bellyaching.

[ashbury]

Maybe Antoan Richardson will get a shot? He's been hitting in AA.

 

His OPS is currently .760 and that figure wouldn't be likely to go higher in the majors. Plus he's not on the 40-man, so who would you expose to waiver claims to get a few weeks of his services?

[The Greatest Poster Alive]

Should I direct user resumes your way so that you can personally approve of who is allowed to provide opinions on any given subject?

 

Or should the proprietors just shut the forum down now given that there would be no one left to discuss anything?

 

That's obviously not my point. What I'm saying is people present their baseless speculation as some sort of proven fact. Or in this case, claim to have any knowledge whatsoever on Mastriani's medical condition or the Twins handling of it.

 

There is plenty of room to discuss things without the inane BS that people attempt to pass off as evidence.

[The Greatest Poster Alive]

Yeah, people do crazy stuff to protect their jobs when they have titans of the game like Clete Thomas and Joe Benson breathing down their necks...

 

It's not to say that THIS year Mastriani has much to worry about with his 25 man roster spot... but Let's face it... He's on his last or 2nd to last year as a viable backup for the Twins (and there will be little market for him when he's done here)

 

Mastriani needs to impress to show his value to the REST of the league if he wants to continue to earn a paycheck above AAA

[ashbury]

inane BS

 

Is that the name of the JPG you use as your avatar?

[Willihammer]

I'm starting to think TGPA'a moniker and avatar combo wasn't an ironic jape

[jokin]

Give Hicks another 100-150 at bats. If its still bad, someone like Benson or such will have played themselves into contention. You can always make a trade down the road as well if it gets dire.

 

Maybe you give Rosario a cup of coffee in CF? Though he really isn't even close to ready...

 

So in other words, "they got nuthin"?

[ashbury]

So in other words, "they got nuthin"?

 

Or in other-other words, "they go with what they've got". For better, or for worse. I'm hoping for better, of course.

[zenser]

I'm not a doctor but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

[old nurse]

Is experience a requirement to second guess someone for something? Should we apply this to every critique made on this forum? Somehow I doubt the majority of people have top-level baseball experience.

It is one thing to second guess a game you watch. You have gained knowledge by reading, watching, or participating. It is quite another to second guess what you have no to very little experience participating in, watching or doing. There is a bit of a difference between medical and sports.

[ThePuck]

It is one thing to second guess a game you watch. You have gained knowledge by reading, watching, or participating. It is quite another to second guess what you have no to very little experience participating in, watching or doing. There is a bit of a difference between medical and sports.

 

Have you ever criticized the President?

[Alex]

It's not to say that THIS year Mastriani has much to worry about with his 25 man roster spot... but Let's face it... He's on his last or 2nd to last year as a viable backup for the Twins (and there will be little market for him when he's done here)

 

Mastriani needs to impress to show his value to the REST of the league if he wants to continue to earn a paycheck above AAA

 

Are these statements speculation or do you have some sort of expertise and facts here?

 

I'd think a guy like Mastro, who can play 3 OF positions actually isn't terrible at the plate and can steal bases in the majors like it's little league can have a decently career (especially if he approaches league average for OBP) . Even is Buxton, Hicks, and Arcia are all playing in the Twins OF 2-3 years from now Mastro will be a nice, affordable backup under team control.

[Shane Wahl]

Really? So we're all going to blast the medical staff (again) and no one is going to put any of the blame on Mastroianni, who undoubtedly continued to downplay the injury and -- by forcing his way through it -- ended up making it much worse?

 

These guys are professional athletes. It's their job to take care of their own bodies. If he's hiding a significant injury, that's his bad.

 

Yeah, no kidding. I put the vast majority of the blame on "Machoianni."

[Shane Wahl]

I think Hicks is slowing getting the hang of it. If not, then they could *really* reach and try out Danny Ortiz. Ortiz could end up being Mastroianni's replacement within a couple years anyway.

[snepp]

It is one thing to second guess a game you watch. You have gained knowledge by reading, watching, or participating. It is quite another to second guess what you have no to very little experience participating in, watching or doing. There is a bit of a difference between medical and sports.

 

Fair enough, I'll send half the resumes your way. Let us know who's qualified to comment and who should just take a walk on a given subject.

[jokin]

Originally Posted by Nick Nelson Really? So we're all going to blast the medical staff (again) and no one is going to put any of the blame on Mastroianni, who undoubtedly continued to downplay the injury and -- by forcing his way through it -- ended up making it much worse?

 

These guys are professional athletes. It's their job to take care of their own bodies. If he's hiding a significant injury, that's his bad.

 

 

 

Yeah, no kidding. I put the vast majority of the blame on "Machoianni."

 

Except you both are ignoring the fact that the broadcast media guys, starting in the first week of the season, went to great lengths, and in detail, about how debilitating and painful the injury to Mastro actually was. And you ignore that this repeated the familiar Twins pattern over the last few years of "wait and see".

[jokin]

I think Hicks is slowing getting the hang of it. If not, then they could *really* reach and try out Danny Ortiz. Ortiz could end up being Mastroianni's replacement within a couple years anyway.

 

Methinks that's a "reach" too far. Thomas would probably get the nod, if only to provide more of his swinging "air conditioning" for the fans, as the weather finally begins to heat up.

[old nurse]

Fair enough, I'll send half the resumes your way. Let us know who's qualified to comment and who should just take a walk on a given subject.

When someone here actually has a clue as to why the medical staff would have a hard time thinking a bone density issue then they can criticize the medical staff on this case.

 

Blast away on how they handled the roster when a player can't play.

[The Wise One]

In understanding medical diagnosis and treatment it seems to me many on this board accumulated their medical knowledge by watching Star Trek. Just wave the gizmo and get the diagnosis and cure.

[Nick Nelson]

And you ignore that this repeated the familiar Twins pattern over the last few years of "wait and see".

Yes, that is how basically every team operates. You guys have a weird conception of how sports medicine works. Athletes routinely play through minor injuries. Didn't the article say they'd already done two MRIs?

[cmathewson]

It is one thing to second guess a game you watch. You have gained knowledge by reading, watching, or participating. It is quite another to second guess what you have no to very little experience participating in, watching or doing. There is a bit of a difference between medical and sports.

 

If you watch sports enough, and complement this with reading, you can get a pretty good education on sports injuries. How many people knew what a meniscus was before Mauer tore his in 04? How many people knew what a UCL was before Liriano tore his in 06? It's not rocket science. As a tech writer and tech journalist, I have written stuff that is far more complicated than orthopedics (super computing, robotic motion control, etc.). I am no expert at any of these things, but I can understand it well enough to write about it.

 

The one thing that we can't do is look at an MRI or other diagnostic image and say anything helpful. That takes trained diagnosticians. And it is rocket surgery. As good as diagnostic imagery is today, the difference between a bone bruise and a stress reaction or hairline fracture is a matter of reading shadows. Get five diagnosticians in a room with the same film and the odds of consensus are low.

 

What we can do without a degree in medicine is read reports about how a team is managing an injured player and compare it to what other teams do. In this case, the facts are clear. According to published reports, Mastroianni told Gardy he couldn't play for a full day at the start of the season. So Gardy played him as a pinch runner and late-inning injury replacement. Even in limited duty, he would be sore after a two-inning assignment. He also told him that the leg was not improving, several times.

 

At that point, it was time to look for a plan B--someone who can play for a whole game if needed. The Twins didn't do that. They kept him on the roster and mostly unavailable for 17 days before making the decision. When Mastro tried to play a whole game, he aggravated the injury. Now he will be out for at least an additional month. Woulda coulda shoulda. But if they had done things the way most teams do (DL him and let him rest the injury for 15 days), he'd be in a rehab assignment by now, and available for duty by May 1.

 

None of what I just wrote requires a degree in medicine. It just takes a brain and a computer. All of us are qualified to offer such opinions on this board, imho.

[Guest USAFChief]

In this case, the facts are clear. According to published reports, Mastroianni told Gardy he couldn't play for a full day at the start of the season. So Gardy played him as a pinch runner and late-inning injury replacement. Even in limited duty, he would be sore after a two-inning assignment. He also told him that the leg was not improving, several times.

 

Again I'll ask...can you point me to the published reports?

[The Wise One]

If you watch sports enough, and complement this with reading, you can get a pretty good education on sports injuries. How many people knew what a meniscus was before Mauer tore his in 04? How many people knew what a UCL was before Liriano tore his in 06? It's not rocket science. As a tech writer and tech journalist, I have written stuff that is far more complicated than orthopedics (super computing, robotic motion control, etc.). I am no expert at any of these things, but I can understand it well enough to write about it.

 

The one thing that we can't do is look at an MRI or other diagnostic image and say anything helpful. That takes trained diagnosticians. And it is rocket surgery. As good as diagnostic imagery is today, the difference between a bone bruise and a stress reaction or hairline fracture is a matter of reading shadows. Get five diagnosticians in a room with the same film and the odds of consensus are low.

 

What we can do without a degree in medicine is read reports about how a team is managing an injured player and compare it to what other teams do. In this case, the facts are clear. According to published reports, Mastroianni told Gardy he couldn't play for a full day at the start of the season. So Gardy played him as a pinch runner and late-inning injury replacement. Even in limited duty, he would be sore after a two-inning assignment. He also told him that the leg was not improving, several times.

 

At that point, it was time to look for a plan B--someone who can play for a whole game if needed. The Twins didn't do that. They kept him on the roster and mostly unavailable for 17 days before making the decision. When Mastro tried to play a whole game, he aggravated the injury. Now he will be out for at least an additional month. Woulda coulda shoulda. But if they had done things the way most teams do (DL him and let him rest the injury for 15 days), he'd be in a rehab assignment by now, and available for duty by May 1.

 

None of what I just wrote requires a degree in medicine. It just takes a brain and a computer. All of us are qualified to offer such opinions on this board, imho.

 

How do you aggravate a bone density issue by playing on it? If a bone density issue were aggravated it would become a fracture. You do not have a medical degree and you can post opinions, but please don't think it is based on knowledge. AT best it is limited information filtered through someone else.

It takes a DEXA scan, not an MRI to detect bone density issues.

[jokin]

Yes, that is how basically every team operates. You guys have a weird conception of how sports medicine works. Athletes routinely play through minor injuries. Didn't the article say they'd already done two MRIs?

 

You'll have to cite evidence that this is how "every team operates." Whereas, there is a boatload of evidence that his is how the Twins operate. And I do have a decent knowledge of how sports medicine works, none of it is/was "weird" (I've had multiple players diagnosed with lower limb stress reactions, leading to anywhere from recommending 15 days complete rest to complications ultimately leading to stress fractures, wiping out entire seasons). The Twins top spokespeople in the broadcast booth, on a daily basis, provided repeated evidence that there was every indication that his injury most certainly wasn't a minor one. The willingness to begin the season, "willfully", with only one healthy and available CF, who was making the jump from AA besides, is on the Twins.

[The Wise One]

You'll have to cite evidence that this is how "every team operates." Whereas, there is a boatload of evidence that his is how the Twins operate. And I do have a decent knowledge of how sports medicine works, none of it is/was "weird" (I've had multiple players diagnosed with lower limb stress reactions, leading to anywhere from recommending 15 days complete rest to complications ultimately leading to stress fractures, wiping out entire seasons). The Twins top spokespeople in the broadcast booth, on a daily basis, provided repeated evidence that there was every indication that his injury most certainly wasn't a minor one. The willingness to begin the season, "willfully", with only one healthy and available CF, who was making the jump from AA besides, is on the Twins.

 

If you have had multiple players with stress reactions then you ought to be the expert on prevention.

[cmathewson]

Again I'll ask...can you point me to the published reports?

 

Let me look in the Strib blogs archives. That's where it was published (Phil Miller I think). Though it might have been Berardino.

[cmathewson]

How do you aggravate a bone density issue by playing on it? If a bone density issue were aggravated it would become a fracture. You do not have a medical degree and you can post opinions, but please don't think it is based on knowledge. AT best it is limited information filtered through someone else.

It takes a DEXA scan, not an MRI to detect bone density issues.

 

He was able to play enough for nine innings in one game. At the end of that game, he had to make an awkward cut in the outfield. He limped off the field. The next day he was caught limping around in warm-ups in a way he had not been limping around prior to that. So they sent him to the training room, where the medical staff found out he had aggravated the injury the night before. When he left the clubhouse in a walking boot, he was on the DL. Whatever injury he had, he had aggravated it.

 

The Twins reported it was a stress reaction. I said in a previous post that didn't make sense because you don't send a guy to get an MRI with a stress reaction. It sounded more like a impact fracture to me, based on the diagnostic test ordered and the fact that he had aggravated an injury that started with him fouling a ball off his leg near his ankle.

 

That's just using what is reported with facts you can learn from WebMD. All this stuff is reported in the daily newspapers. It shouldn't even be all that controversial.

[cmathewson]

Arcia recalled as Mastroianni disabled by foot injury; Hicks dropped in order | StarTribune.com

[Guest USAFChief]

Arcia recalled as Mastroianni disabled by foot injury; Hicks dropped in order | StarTribune.com

Not to harp on this, but the posted article doesn't prove any of the following: According to published reports, Mastroianni told Gardy he couldn't play for a full day at the start of the season. So Gardy played him as a pinch runner and late-inning injury replacement. Even in limited duty, he would be sore after a two-inning assignment. He also told him that the leg was not improving, several times.

 

[jokin]

If you have had multiple players with stress reactions then you ought to be the expert on prevention.

 

Helpful post as always, TW0