DocBauer

I certainly can't disagree with your opinion or frustration Mike. And while there was certainly some hope ..(false hope?)...brought on by last year, I think most of the members here at TD were saying 2017-2018, if I recall my own memory correctly. Ryan was probably the one pushing for this season. But I have to say, while being patient sucks, there is a difference being patient for organizational change, and being patient for a rebuild to take place while waiting for prospects to arrive and watching a roster comprised of fill-ins vs watching a roster that is now being filled by young and talented players. I want Sano, Kepler, Berrios and everyone else to be ROY and all star caliber players immediately too. But we all know it doesn't work that way. Let's say the Twins lose 90 again in 2017 and can't contend but we see real improvement in these kids as the year goes on and the promotion of Mejia, Gonsalves, Garver and others. Not saying they WILL lose 90, just saying, it will be more entertaining, interesting and hopeful. Especially if the new guys at the top make some necessary changes.

Short answer...no. Long answer...it helps ease the pain. And as of now, there don't seem to be any names to place at the top of the draft list. But the June draft is still a long way away. Here's hoping a catcher, 3B or SP rises to the top. (3B to hedge bets, not because I'm down on Sano) Believe it or not, despite this disappointing and awful season, there are some things that happened that make me excited. *While a past defender of TRUTH, it was time for a change. Now we get it, along with what will be a close examination of the entire Twins structure. I'm nervous, but excited and cautiously optimistic. *More and more young talent at least got their feet wet at the ML level, even if some performances were underwhelming to this point. Despite never using the "Rebuild" word, it's what's happening. *There were some very positive performances amongst some OF, and more than a few SP and RP, particularly at AA and AAA. Even a top college player for the Twins to select next June, we probably won't see any help for at least a season, possibly two. But adding said draftee to Rosario, Buxton, Kepler, Sano and Polanco, others close like Garver, Palka, Walker and Gordon could be close. Besides Berrios...(don't lose hope)...there are 5 solid to excellent SP prospects that should at least finish next season at Rochester, if not make their ML debut. Am I straining for positives? Maybe. I prefer to think "looking" is a better word.

I was thinking more in the short term, year or two, with Polanco...if Dozier is moved...to help stabilize the infield, provide more depth and competition, until someone like Gordon arrives.

If Dozier is moved, Polanco to 2B is the obvious move. I think Escobar has shown enough in '14 and '15 to show what he can do offensively and defensively on an everyday basis. (Though in neither year did he start the whole season, so there could be some concern about running out of steam if someone isn't there till capably rest him once in a while) And Escobar hasn't been exactly awful this year, but hurt some, stuck behind the hot Nunez and now the Polanco audition. But no Dozier, we are short at least one viable ML infielder for the roster. Do we look for a quality utility player? Or do we look for another viable, proven ML SS? Do we consider Desmond and move him back to SS? Wondering on various thought on a veteran FA SS.

It's still a team game, built with many different pieces. One guy who is a stud, even two, doesn't make a winning team. Trout and the Angels come to mind at the moment. We here at TD have been waiting for these young told talents and other quality talents to reach the majors and play. "Rebuild, play the prospects", we all generally say and agree. Well, despite some poor handling of said youngsters, including a few ridiculous ideas of giving guys days off for the playing of Suzuki at DH for instance, these youngsters ARE here. And for the most part, they ARE playing. Sano and Rosario are the longest tenured at this point and they have approximately a year and a half at the ML level. But we should blow the roster up and start over? Why? How? We give up on rookies and near rookies just because they aren't immediate ROY and all star candidates? But somehow we're going to trade off these "failed" prospects and get something of better value back? Makes no sense. I'm sorry, but it is going to take patience. Not the kind of patience of losing baseball while waiting for prospects to arrive and playing stopgaps in the meantime. (mostly talking about position players at this point) We're talking about patience while actually playing said prospects. Now, the handling of these prospects on a daily basis, the the manager and coaches in charge of them, is a different arguement.

How and why do you play Polanco daily, almost exclusively at SS but not let Sano play daily at 3B to hone his skills there? It makes absolutely no sense! I don't know that anyone has soured on Escobar. I think it's more about knowing, more or less, what you have in him already. Personally, I'd have him and Polanco fight for the SS in ST, and the non-winner would be my utility infielder and probably still play a lot. But these last few weeks should be all about Murphy at catcher with some Centeno thrown in there as well, and Polanco at SS, Vargas at 1B or DH every day, but for goodness sake, unless there is some elbow concern, let Sano play 3B daily.

Just read it. Meh. Not saying there aren't questions and issues, we've discussed them at length on here for the entire season, and some before now. And the author does target the yo-yo affect the Twins have had with some of these guys. But honestly, there was nothing informative offered in any fashion. In fact, while not defending what appears to be some mismanagement by the Twins in several cases, it reads like trolling to me. Look, not every top prospect is going to work out, whether it be the Twins or someone else, we all know this. And some guys, like Dozier, don't start out as top prospects but become top players. It's part of the complexity and beauty that is baseball. But really, a little perspective should be in order. Sano has shown real ability and real flashes and will continue to get even better. Kepler has advanced quicker than even I, a staunch supporter and believer, thought he would. Now that he's getting a chance to play, has Polanco done anything to decrease our opinion of him? Buxton, fairly or unfairly, has had Mike Trout comparisons at times, who also struggled his first year. And as the author states, Buxton has only about a full season's worth of experience at this point.He's massively talented, only 22, and actually seems more comfortable since this last recall. Rosario? Look at the flash and ability he showed last season. He starts off terrible this year, goes down to AAA, and has played quite well since his return. Stewart is mentioned. What isn't mentioned is his first half of A ball this year, still a winning record, low ERA at AA while being one of the youngest players there. Berrios? Again, a poor start to his ML time, but it's only a few starts, he's very talented, and I wouldn't be jumping off a bridge due to a top young pitching prospect struggling in such a short period of time getting his feet wet. Are there some concerns? There are. But all these guys have less than 2 full years at the ML levEl, some are in their first, and some are young enough to have not made it that far yet. Sheesh!

Why on earth you wouldn't take a high level prospect like Polanco, with his bat and potential, and NOT play him at a spot where he has played before, could still develop, and could fill a hole/need at the ML level is beyond comprehension to me. The minors are all about development! They decided he couldn't play SS? Well they sure changed their mind about that now haven't they? Maddening! Is Polanco a finished product at SS? No. But he can refine footwork and other mechanics with time. His arm can be strengthened somewhat as well. But my concern is his bat in the lineup, getting to and fielding balls. I will take that over a few deep throws from the hole he can't make. (in theory)

Ownership probably thought he was over qualified.

Just a thought, nothing concrete to back it up, but I think it's just bad verbiage in order to "sell" optimism to the fan base. A new GM, as stated previously, would probably keep Molitor for now anyway, with some suggested changes to the staff. The roster, and the entire developmental staff are probably of greater concern initially than ridding oneself of the manager.

First...the positive.... And now to address your issues. LOL But seriously, while sooooo much of the roster shows Flux and guys still developing, the truth is, called this or not, the team really has been going through a rebuild and youth movement. This had to happen. If you discount Mauer and Dozier...possibly Plouffe if he is indeed gone...the entire starting OF, the left side of the infield, probably DH and catcher as well, will all be manned by young players in 2017. And we have absolutely seen glimpses of their potential. But on to your list. Sano: Play him and have him lose a couple of pounds. Cannon for an arm, charges balls well, and his hands seem OK. Sure he's had some bad throws, what young 3B doesn't from time to time? The biggest problem has just been some badly botched plays. But not only is he still young and developing, but the whole RF issue has to have messed with him this season. IF there is any concern over his elbow being anything other than minor, maybe bring back Plouffe on a friendly deal after his poor season. It's easy to assemble a 12 man player roster, for the most part, for next season. Who is #13? Maybe Plouffe as a 3B/1B/DH/PH who could play some spot OF. Might not be a bad idea as long as you're not committed to playing him every day. But put Sano at 3B daily and let him play and develop. And if it really doesn't work, move to 1B after Mauer. May: He could be, body willing, be an excellent bullpen piece. And maybe his injuries this year were as simple as simple as flare-ups and adjustments. But for a team in such need of SP, to insist on moving a strapping, hard throwing young SP to the bullpen is ridiculous. They may have wasted an entire season of his potential growth with this move. Put him back in the rotation! Hughes and Perkins: Expect and plan on NOTHING. Perk is probably done. Hughes has a shot, but he's a dark horse. He could rebound back in to his 2014 version, possibly reinvent himself as a strong bullpen arm, potential closer...throw harder buy shorter...or also be done. What happened to both is unfortunate. But don't plan on either one when building the next team. Jay: Agreed Jay doesn't belong on this list. You stated yourself hus rotation move would take some time. I was very encouraged by what he did at A ball. He'll begin next season in the Lookouts rotation. Let's at least wait until next year before adding him to a list like this. SS: Some bad luck here and more mismanagement by the Twins. As long as he got time off to not wear down over the course of an entire season, we've seen enough of Escobar the precious 2 seasons to feel relatively good about him...if healthy. Polanco doesn't play a single milb game at SS to make room for a journeyman? And then, once promoted, he's put back at SS! The fact that he's looked this good to this point is a testament to previous experience, talent and potential. You roll with these guys for '17. Both have talent, both are young and quite young, and you ARE in a rebuild. Catcher: You have some options to work with in Murphy, Centennial, Garver and the upcoming Turner. But it's not enough. But Suzuki is not the answer. You need one more option here. You can either identify one quality vet that you think can rebound and help lead the team for a season or two, OR, you can identify a guy via rule 5, DFA, milb FA that you think has a legitimate shot and go get him. I almost lean toward the younger FA question mark guy. Poor planning on the Twins to this point. But Murphy could rebound. I've seen some good from Centennial. I like Garver's potential a lot. If Turner's bat could come around a bit more he could be solid. But again, some poor planning. Bullpen: IMHO, it's not as bad as you make out. Roger's and Pressly have looked pretty good. So did Tonkin before being turned in to a long reliever. Add a closer as you develop one, find another decent LHRP somewhere, use Duffy as a long and middle man and spot starter, then audition for the final spot. I don't think the bullpen is that far off. And we sure have a lot of live young arms to audition in 2017. But you are absolutely correct that they waited too long to look at some of them. Rotation: We all know this is the #1 issue facing the Twins. Some talented kids aren't ready yet, and there are question marks surrounding who's available. But Santana has pitched well enough to believe he has at least one more good season left in him. We've seen Gibson do a lot better, and I'm talking just last season. Just a bad year or injuries, or do we need a different pitching coach? After that I'm just not sure. Santiago is nothing great, but his career numbers are mostly solid. A year ago, or even the years before that, we'd have been excited to have a guy like him amongst our starting 5. You have to believe Berrios will get it together. He's just too talented, been so productive in his milb career to believe otherwise. I still like May, but due to his IP this season, he may be a 5th SP only. Hopefully Mejia is very close. Gonsalves has a real chance to contribute sometime in 2017. Is any of this perfect? Absolutely not. And once again, it's easy to point fingers at player mismanagement: poor coaching, quick hooks, in the wrong spot, etc. But there is no quick FA fix. Even if you are on board with moving Dozier, you still have to find the right trade partner and players to make it happen. (you also shuffle the deck chairs somewhat as now you have to find at least one more infield option to add to the player mix) Other than better health and a dose of better luck, could the Twins have handled this situation better? Absolutely. May should have been starting at some point. Not a single game audition for Wheeler but guys like Dean got multiple shots? And do they just not "get" Berrios or what? Right now, I really feel you have to roll with all the various options you have on hand, work with them, place them in mental and physical situations to succeed, and wait for guys like Mejia and Gonsalves to contribute.

I echo the winning sentiment. Learning how to win is part of the winning process. Tip of the cap to Jake Mauer. Every year your top players leave, a few solid but not quite ready for advancement players remain, and a whole different group of players come in. And Jake has had a number of top prospects come through his locker room. But he's also had different team makeups, and this season the position players and offense were questionable. At least early in the year. But taking his team to the playoffs 4 straight years is quite the accomplishment.

First, we know pitching is a huge issue, but this thread is about the lineup and offense. Second, while I don't dismiss varying statistics or their relevance, if you look long and hard enough, you can find stats that can support almost any argument. A guy can hit well with RISP but have little power or few runners OB in front of him, but another guy can have a lower RISP AVG but be a big RBI producer due to power and actual RISP. Sometimes it's the chicken and egg theory. A lineup has to be about the makeup of your team, do certain guys just appear more comfortable in certain spots for whatever reason, etc. I think sometimes it can be a "feel" thing and less analytical. Ideally, this team should thrive better offensively when Buxton can bring his considerable talents to the leadoff spot. Even if he's just beginning to fulfill his potential. (*note, I think Polanco is a solid secondary option here). I like Mauer in the 2 spot due to contact and OB...for as long as he's on the team and in the lineup. I believe Kepler has the ability to be the team's best overall hitter, AVG, OB, power and speed, so I think he's your future 3 hitter. Those first 3 should provide Sano and Dozier many RBI opportunities as well as provide OB opportunities for the hitters behind them. Vargas, if he continues his development, has power and solid OB ability behind those two. Rosario and whoever is at catcher, actually have a chance to hit in the lower third of the lineup with runners often OB. Then you have Polanco turning the lineup over again for the top of the order

A couple things: *I think he tries too hard sometimes. Your choice of the word "aggressive" to describe him is dead on. But teams also need that kind of player and personality, especially when they are as athletically gifted as Rosario. Time and experience should help Polish him though. *With his tools and potential, I wouldn't even think of making a 4th OF any time soon. If he plateaus or someone else flat out takes the job, OK. Not saying he will, but what if Granite is the real deal, plays a good LF, and provides speed and OB ahead of Buxton in the lineup, for instance? *Rosario will be sooooo much the better ballplayer if he just curbs some of that aggressiveness and quits looking like a drunk lumberjack on those pitches that are head high, in the dirt, or headed outside toward the dugout. With his natural ability, just a little more restraint will make him that much more effective and dangerous. *Looking at his milb track record, he hit and produced everywhere except first his "second" stint following his suspended first half a couple years ago. And while he has never been a BB or OB machine, I believe he never had a AVG vs OB differential that was lower than around 40-42%, meaning he wasn't immune to a walk. Again, a little more Polish and restraint, and look out. A dynamic 6-7 place hitter with quality defense.

First, let me come clean that I haven't watched enough of Polanco at SS to form an overly accurate opinion, though I have watched him some, and have seen a couple replays, and heard general praise on the radio broadcasts, (for what those are worth). But I also haven't seen...or heard...anything that says he can't play the position, or that he's looked bad out there. You HAVE TO PLAY HIM to see what you have. FINALLY they are. And as young as he is, getting his first real taste of ML ball, and havingto re-a climate himself to the position somewhat after not playing there the entire season, I think he's done quite well. In fact, considering those factors, the fact that he doesn't look awful may be the best indicator of what is to come. If you take the time to do a little research...and I have previously...you would be surprised by some of the error totals accumulated by "top" SS early in their careers. And the point is well taken that not all players excel in both sides of the game. Top defense can help offset average or less offense in a player and his net worth, and quality offense can offset average or slightly below defense. Polanco, and we could/should include Sano in the same breath, looks like he can do the job while swinging a quality stick. Like Sano, he has the ability to continue to improve, but only if given the chance. IMHO, Sano at 3B just about every day, Polanco the same at SS...though he still has to earn it over the "has looked better before this season" Escobar...Dozier at 2B, Mauer and Vargas at 1B with Park in a "get healthy and prove it" position. Escobar makes for a fine utility guy who will probably still play a lot.The defense on the right side will be solid to good. The left side will be a work in progress. But so what? Really, we're talking about a couple of young, budding talents. And with the exception of a couple of veterans, we're talking about a very young and rebuilding team. And you're not willing to live with some mistakes and errors from such talented youngsters? Give me our starting OF next season, hopefully a quality FA 4th/fill-in OF and a solid closer, (hopefully 1 more decent LHRP) to help ease all of the Twins young RP arms in to their roles, and I'm actually feeling pretty good about a lot of things.

For many reasons, I feel it's time for Plouffe to move on. But I have been a fan and supporter for some time. I think because he wasn't an all star and didn't play on winning teams, some fans are harder on him than he deserved. Nice solid player who will find a home. From a strictly selfish baseball reason, I wonder, IF the Twins decided to bring him back in 2017, would a down and injury filled season allow them to do so cheaply?

Palka's SO numbers don't concern me at this point. He's also shown the ability to hit for AVG and still take some BBC for decent OB. A dip on his promotion to AAA shouldn't be surprising. I wish I knew more about his defense, but I could see him as an OF/DH/1B candidate. I just want to see Gordon continue to develop PERIOD. But if I were to nit pick, I'd like to see the OB come up a little more. Granite intrigues me. Could he be a solid hitting, speedy 4th OF? Could he be a legitimate every day LF and leadoff hitter with Buxton hitting a spot or two lower with his power potential?

Revisionist thinking is always interesting, but I remember being down the Twins didn't grab Gonsalves in the 2nd round. Man was I happy when they later snagged him and felt they got a potentially huge steal. Despite a rough introduction to the majors, Berrios has everything needed to be successful. So does Gonsalves. Jury is still out on Stewart and Jay, but the talent is there. Jorge looks good, Romero excellent. Man, if he could follow the fast tracks of Berrios and Gonsalves next season, things start to look bright.

NOT saying don't trade Dozier if you could really add a #2 type starter, or a top, top prospect ready to burst on the scene, plus someone else to balance the trade. And maybe I'm selfish about BD or short-sighted, but as much as we need pitching, especially SP, and as much as I like Polanco as a young talent, I'm still not sure if losing Dozier's bat, and replacing him with a high end starter gets us to where we need to go. It might a lot, don't get me wrong, but whether it's our current coaching staff, bad luck, whatever, Berrios finding himself would be huge. May could really help, IMO, and Gonsalves could be ready...along with Mejia...at some point in 2017. And you can also mix in, of course, Santana and Gibson along with maybe Santiago, for now. There is a big part of me that says this is smarter in a 2017 approach. BD won't turn 30 until after the season starts. He's not old. He made some nice adjustments this season. He is cost controlled, could possibly be resigned,(just not another big long term deal please), and would probably have mid-season trade value next year.

Generally agree with everything stated. I'd like to keep Boshers around, if possible, but don't think I'd risk a 40 man spot on him. Too many guys to add this year. The one guy I'd quibble about is Centennial. The Twins need help at catcher. While Centennial is nothing special by any means, he's generally OK behind the plate, at it, and hits LHRP. I'd really like to keep him for ST 2017. But you also have to protect Murphy, Garver and Turner, so I get it. May not have room. But I still may quibble a bit on him.

Ultimately, if he can play SS, would be awesome to see a combination of Polanco and Buxton in the top 2 spots. I understand your thoughts on some combination of Dozier/Sano hitting that low. I've thought about that also. My thought process is Mauer may be of more value in the 2 hole rather than new the bottom. I also feel Dozier/Sano in the 4-5 spots should provide...pretty regularly...runner (s) on base when they hit. Other than poor clutch hitting, one thing that has hindered the offense is a lack of runners on base when the Twins hit dangers. Dozier/Sano also do a pretty good job of getting OB themselves. This means some opportunity for the next DH and Rosario. Just my thoughts. Not sure if they are right or not. Lol

Ultimately, I really like Kepler in the #3 spot. I like how he looked there earlier in the year. He should provide AVG, OB, and a fair amount of power with decent speed. Then I like some bombination of Sano and Dozier in the 4 and 5 spots. The only thing I'm not crazy about is a pair of LHRP hitters followed by a pair of RH hitters. But again, I think Kepler is the perfect #3 hitter...eventually at least.

Makes little sensearly! As of now, Suzuki will be a FA and would seem to be out of the Twins plans for 2017 entirely unless the new GM loves him for some reason. Not saying he shouldn't get to play a game or two here and there, but he's been paid decently by the Twins. And not to sound insensitive, but he should be paid now to sit and let Murphy and Centeno play out the remainder of the year. I mean, seriously, playing Suzuki at this point could mean...maybe...a win or two more. Maybe. And that potential win or two, if even possible, does nothing for Murphy, Centeno, or the 2017 Twins.

I believe winning can help winning in the future. It helps build confidence. And it sure is more fun than losing! But what's most important right now is playing the youngsters, getting them experience to be more prepared for next season. That's more important than the wins themselves at this point. But, if we could do that and still finish with the top pick, we'll, that's just a nice little reward for having to suffer through this season.

Good for Beresford! He deserves it, and really deserved it more last season. I'd like to bring him back again next season, milb contact or not. This might entice him to return. About time Vargas was back up! Now play him Molitor! I have not given up on Duffey as a starter. Last year, and at times this year, we've seen what he is capable of as a ML SP and it can be good. But there is a definite need for a true long man in the pen. He could be that guy and your #6 starter when you need that fill in guy.