Riverbrian

It's alright. You have a lot of posts that don't post that way in the bank. I gave you the benefit of the doubt that you responded before you read my follow up post. I spend a lot of energy on this website trying to speak generally, conceptually. just to avoid the specific player subjective opinion rabbit hole. The problem with that. It's hard to find footing with my general thoughts without specifics so I find myself in that rabbit hole more than I care to. This just kind of shows what happens when specific players are brought in. I don't have a strong opinion of Jett Williams or Bryce Eldridge or any of them. My strong opinion is... I want a young SS and 1B... I don't want to break camp with Kreidler or Fitzgerald on the 26 man roster. Especially on a 26 man roster that should be all about talent accumulation and major league talent identification.

I agree with your overall sentiment. I'm a big fan of your posts and attitude. May you live long and prosper. Just want to mention that rebuilds don't have to take a long time. Where you start matters. If the Team wants to back up another 1,000 miles to make it take longer... They can... they may not have to. They can also choose to drive 40 mph instead of 80 mph. Thinking they wouldn't have room or if they would be unwilling to make room for a healhy Eisenrich and a young Kirby Puckett on the same 1984 roster is driving 40 mph and yes... it will lengthen the rebuild. It's all about identifying talent right now. If they pour enough players through... they'll find talent. Find out who's Dave Meier and who is Tim Tuefel.

I don't know what other teams think. I also don't know if Bryce Eldridge can hit a major league sinker. Now what?

I had a post a couple of above this one explaining that I'm not qualified to determine the value of Jett Williams or any of the prospects being discussed. Just throwing names out there to make my point that the Twins need to do exactly what your last paragraph states. They need to get this right. I think they need to take their Ryan trade chip and get the biggest baddest prospect they can land. I call him a Jenkins type talent. And it's probably going to be hard to get that guy.

Honestly... this is where I have to trust my front office. I read scouting reports... I look at their AAA stats but... in the end... I'm just throwing out names when I really need a scout sitting next to me in North Dakota giving me more detail. I watched Culpepper, Jenkins and Mendez play one game in Wichita live. I had great seats and Jenkins and Mendez both hit the ball hard in that game. Culpepper was barely noticeable but I know I can't take that one game and say... Yep... Mendez is going to be a monster. The Twins and honestly most of the other 29 teams. I'm much more confident in my ability to identify. When I look at the Twins currently... I just really want a young SS and 1B to add to this mix. If the front office thinks that guy is Jett. Go get him... because I don't want to start 2026 with Kreidler or Fitzgerald on the 26 man. Let's load this thing up and start the upward trajectory.

I won't argue fiercely with you. Only slightly argue with you. I know you are on top of your stuff. I worry about his declining value and it's sure to decline. Those players you list are exactly what I want and I believe you are right... they are very very very very hard to acquire. We have a window this off-season to get the best that we can get because the best that we can get will surely be less as his club control time dwindles. Waiting for the trade deadline will knock some Ryan trade value off but the trade deadline can offer a scarcity increase in value because there are not very many sellers who has a Joe Ryan available for a deal. That competition could drive his value back up. However... the big risk is... Injury. If he gets hurt over the trade deadline and won't be available to deal or certainly not at the price we could ask for right now. The next trade window is the next off-season and now you have one year remaining at maybe 16 million, 14 million and his value is down significantly down. If the injury is Tommy John... All the value is gone... and I mean gone. We will get nothing and that is like losing a Walter Jenkins type talent because we didn't use this opportunity to get a Jenkins type talent. I think they gotta try and move him and hopefully the other teams will play ball with us. I also appreciate Milwaukee and Cleveland and I think the Twins need to pay attention to what they have been doing because that is where our club fits financially. The major difference for this off-season. They got a head start on this. Milwaukee can make their decisions on Woodruff and Peralta and make these type of decision knowing that they are strong candidates for making the playoffs. Cleveland can make their move with Kwan knowing that they are strong candidates for the playoffs without him. They got a head start and they can keep reloading in this fashion. The Twins have to get to where Milwaukee and Cleveland are first and they won't until they find some Sal Frelicks.

If the Twins move Buxton... Now you are probably talking about Jett. A little 5 foot 1 SS would become a fan favorite quickly and I'd love to see Jett push Brooks Lee so Brooks Lee can push Royce Lewis and even Luke Keaschall if he decides to look like Julien in his sophomore year.

Some of them may work and some of them will certainly fail. That's why I like having numbers on my side. That's why I don't like the Ty Frances of the world And... And... that's why I constantly talk about 26 players who can play, no such thing as a log jam, competition for playing time... not putting all your eggs in a single player basket. There are people who say give Brooks Lee 162 games... I'm not one of those guys. Brooks Lee needs to compete for his playing time. I want flat out competition and the players will tell you who is ready and who is not.

In the end... it's going to be the money guys who will consider it because they can buy their superstar players. Dodgers, Mets, Yankees, Phillies, Jays, Red Sox, Giants and... Well... that might be it. Of that group... They would probably try to land Valdez and Suarez first before considering losing diamonds. The Mets need pitching but why trade Nolan McLean? They want to add to Nolan McLean and that brings you down to Baty, Vientos, Jett Williams territory. They are fine prospects but more of the same. The Phillies (Miller), Giants (Eldridge) and the Red Sox (Meyer) are the teams with a top level prospect to try and land. The additional problem is that those teams... if they lose out on Valdez and Suarez and King... they will call the Nationals for Gore, they will also call the Reds for Greene, they will call the Tigers to check in on Skubal trying to land that pitcher and keep Miller, Eldridge and Meyer in house. Maybe the Yankees consider giving up Rice. It's tough sledding on the GM hills.

Royce Lewis is probably the guy. Can't give up on him yet but a lot of shine has come off the chrome this past year.

This is exactly what I think. The Twins have a lot of the same type of options because there are a ton of these same types of options available on nearly every team to acquire. A lot of players cut from the same cloth.,, you describe them as Roden and SWR level. Jorgenswest will call them FV 45+ - 50 based on Fangraphs ratings. The Twins probably have more of these guys than most organizations and that's fine... actually... that's good to be loaded up with them because some of those players will exceed that rating. But... we don't need a bunch more to add to this growing pile. What the Twins lack and have lacked for years if not decades... is the superstar prospect. Walker Jenkins is perhaps the only player who fits into that bucket. These guys are tough to acquire because nobody wants to give them up. I believe the Twins will not consider any trade of Jenkins and the other 29 teams feel the same about their Jenkins level guys. It will take dynamite to shake them loose in a deal. Joe Ryan is the closest thing we have to T.N.T... actually the only player that could shake one loose so I think they should get the biggest baddest prospect that Ryan will produce and that's your deal whoever that might be. They may have to wait for the free agency pile of decent starting pitching talent to dwindle.... wait for the musical chairs to run out of chairs before the contenders get desperate enough to give one of them up. Until then... I would imagine the Twins can ask for the top prospect but I would expect an immediate counter offer... Umm... no... we are not giving him up but I'll give you 4 of these guys instead. This trading business is probably very difficult with 29 other shrewd trading partners.

Yeah Walker

Yes... Agreed At minimum.

Myself... My Opinion... For what it's worth. I don't think they need a full on rebuild. I also don't think they need to cut anymore salary but then again... I'm not watching the books. I think the Twins just need to concern themselves with getting return on the players that they are in risk of of getting nothing from and that would be Joe Ryan because his value is high and will only go down from here. And... Ryan Jeffers because he is a free agent next year. Perhaps the top catching free agent available in next years class which would make Jeffers probably a top trade option for any team that doesn't land Realmuto. We don't have to trade Lopez or Ober or Buxton. We can build around them. We need a young SS and a young 1B. And of course... build that bullpen back up. If Ryan and Jeffers can provide that... we would have a decent starting point with depth options for the road back and we could be back fairly quickly. You just let the players grow as quickly as possible as you sort out the winners and losers. We found a Luke Keaschall last year... let's see if we can find some more. We could have a decent enough core in place to actually strategically augment the roster with a better class of free agent by 2027 after the labor situation is sorted out. Just make 2026 about finding talent as quickly as possible and whatever happens... happens in 2026. No more Ty France band aids. Flood the system with players under team control. Show the world that you can develop. Don't narrow your development focus to a couple of players. Provide competition and sort out the winners and losers.

Unfortunately... not much was learned from that yester-year moment. There seems to be this default things are bad setting.... deep inside the souls of some that provides comfort.

I agree 100%. As much as people want to just chuck this season... and the next. This season matters huge.

What do the Twins get in return AFTER Byron asks to renegotiate his contract in order to waive his no-trade clause? If Byron's agent doesn't ask to renegotiate his deal. Byron will waste his leverage. Does anyone think he will waste that leverage?

My algorithm is being overloaded with reaction to a single sentence from Jeff Passan and I knew it would. And with that overloading... the crowd goes wild believing it. This is pretty simple. Could Buxton get traded... Yep absolutely... Would he waive his no-trade... I would certainly hope so because not being willing to even consider it is just wasting your leverage and limiting his options... closing doors. His no trade clause is his leverage. It is his protection. It's his ability to choose who he plays for. That is the important thing to understand as everyone loses their minds. If he chooses to be inflexible in regards to that leverage, all the no trade clause does for him is guarantee that he is in Minnesota through the 2028 season and he is looking for a new contract at age 35 and he's not going to get a 5 year deal at age 35. If he wants a bigger pay check... it's this current contract. Being absolutely inflexible with his leverage would be a terrible mistake even if he wanted to remain a Twin for life. That leverage could get his deal reworked. More money? Longer Term? Chance for a title? It's in his best interest to be flexible in all considerations. He can always say no if he doesn't like the team or if he would rather remain a Twin but he will have options to consider. If he isn't willing to waive. There is no sense for the Twins front office or the other 29 teams to have a second of trade conversation. Once he does the sensible thing... it's out there and Passan has a sentence to share with the world. As an example... Let's say... The Mets and Twins strike a deal that both teams are happy with. You know that Buxton's agent will be on the phone to get his contract reworked to get the no-trade dropped. 15 Million a year for the next 3 years. Nope... I'm Byron Buxton... you want me in New York to play CF and you want me to waive this thing. I want 25 Million per and an extra year. That's Byron's leverage at work. Once Buxton does that... If the Mets are willing (not a sure thing). It will drastically change the value of the return. The value would be lowered to the point that the Twins are no longer happy with the return so they pull the deal off the table. Basically... I'm saying. Buxton willing to waive his no-trade? Not a shock... Sensible in my opinion. However... it doesn't mean that Buxton is desperate to leave. He's just willing to use his leverage to his advantage and he can't do that with a flat out... I will not waive under any circumstance. I always assume that the front office and Byron's agent are talking and each is looking out for their own best interest and this is just how it works.

The only information that I can utilize myself is BBTV and that of course is faulty because sometimes those deals don't match up on BBTV and ultimately deals will be made based on individual assessments. Overall BBT does a pretty good job overall. Take Burridge or Eldridge for example. If I'm the Giants... he's 20 years old and the 2nd most valuable player in the organization. I'm trying to talk the you as the Twins into a package of lesser players instead so I can keep my potential superstar and get my needed pitcher... I'm offering that 18 year old Gonzalez kid and Roupp and a Reggie Crawford and hopeful that you like those players and it's better than what the Red Sox are offering. You as the Twins are asking for not only my potential superstar and more so we are ways off. So I call the Nationals and ask about Gore and you call the Brewers and ask about Made plus a throw in. In the end... the market will find itself.

Yeah... If Byron is willing to waive the no trade clause. The front office would know because it's rather important information to any trade discussion. Can't have a serious conversation with the Red Sox if Byron isn't willing to be shipping up to Boston. Passan can pick up that type of information quite easily but it's quite possible the information is going to lack some nuance.

LOL... Yes I did. I like calling him Burridge accidentally.

Could be Buxton's agent. Could another team spilling the info. I have no idea but I'm willing to bet that Zoll and Falvey have fielded calls from teams interested in Buxton. If they have fielded calls from team interested in Byron. The no trade clause would have to be discussed or there is no discussion. So... If Byron is willing to waive it. The word is out. However... it still doesn't mean that Byron will waive it... he may not want to go to Cincinatti or that the Twins will trade him... or even get offered what they feel is a worthwhile offer. But... Yeah... I can hear "Mets on line one" Phillies on line two".

The Twins will win each and every trade if they can develop major league talent out of the acquisitions. If they fail to do that. They will lose each and every trade they made. It's TBD at the moment.

That is the real choice... just not the choice that I'm asking. To trade or not to trade is the real shakesperian question. Along with trading at the deadline... or next off-season... or next seasons deadline. In consideration of Arb numbers typically doubling. 18M would be estimate on the remainder of his service time. That comp pick mention does matter because you would get something back... providing the Twins at least extend the 22 to 25 million qualifying offer in order to get the comp pick. If he Woodruff's that QO. we are at 40 million for 3 years and no comp pick nor a Jenkins type acquisition. Either way... the money to me is a secondary concern at the moment because the Twins have trimmed quite a bit of payroll. They can afford Ryan and others. It's simply... do you trade or do you not trade and what can you get back if you trade him. I'm trying to narrow that choice and just focus on... if the Twins decide to trade him. Let's say the Twins decide to trade him. Let's say they are looking for a deal and Passan raises his current 50% trade possibility to an 80% Jeff McNeil trade like possibility. Do you go for a 1 for 1 trade to get the highest rated single player you can get your hands on... A Walker Jenkins like talent? IF BBTV has it nailed and Ryan is a 52 value and Burridge with the Giants is also 52 value. Do you just go as big as you can get for one player. Or Do you split his value into two or three or even more players. We have a lot of holes to fill. Grab a 30 and 20 value or a 20 and two 15 value players? There is no way of knowing what anyone would offer. San Francisco would probably keep want to keep Burridge and try to sell the Twins on multiple players. My vote is go big... get the biggest baddest single prospect you can get for Ryan. I was just curious how others felt.