Herrmann Optioned, Fryer Selected

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

I was mainly just surprised by the timing. Fryer was crushing the ball early in the season. Now he's been struggling for a little while and was already working out with the USA team. 

"Crushing the ball"?  Fryer has 7 extra base hits this year. 1 in April, 2 in May, 3 in June, and now 1 (a HR, his first XBH that wasn't a double) so far in July.

 

I guess looking at his game log, his 2 doubles in May were on May 2nd.  So I guess he did have 3 doubles in his first 7 games this year, but that was still only good for a .130 ISO, lower than the *career* AAA ISO for Herrmann, or the 2015 AAA ISO for Pinto in a terrible year at the plate for him.

[Kirby_waved_at_me]

So, pretty long odds that the Twins would try to get one of these guys:

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2015/07/jonathan-lucroy-catcher-trade-market.html

 

Fryer and Suzuki are probably not going to cut the mustard any better than Suzuki and Herrmann.

 

Pinto's still on the DL in AAA, yes?

 

I thought Stuart Turner might make a move up the prospect lists, but he's struggled in AA and Mitch Garver is not doing much better in Ft. Myers....

 

Seems like the Twins will have to look outside the org to improve the catching this season.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

There's no evidence he'll hit worse than Herrmann either. Their minor league numbers are similar, with the edge actually to Fryer.

Their career minor league slash line is similar, but look at it by level -- Fryer's line is propped up by his A-ball performance 7 years ago, and also dominating a partial season in AA at age 25.

 

Herrmann beats Fryer in AAA performance handily (.730 OPS to .654), with a .028 advantage in AVG and a further .046 advantage in ISO, with similar K and BB rates, and without the benefit of getting to repeat AAA three times from ages 27-29 as Fryer has.

[jun]

 

Eric Fryer was working out with Team USA, preparing for the Pan-Am Games. However, he was added to the 40-man roster and summoned to the big leagues. Herrmann was optioned to Rochester.

 

To make room on the 40-man roster, Ricky Nolasco was placed on the 60-Day Disabled List.

 

Not a huge surprise, though the timing is a little strange.

Almost all my wishes came true. I want Pelfrey to start since he pitched well in Spring Training. I want May to be in the bullpen temporarily since he could strike people out at will and pitch multiple innings in a close game. I want Fryer to be called up since he's been hitting quite well in AAA and the Twins have been getting no production in catcher's position. Now my last wish is to see Kepler in a Twins uniform soon and Danny Santana be optioned back to AAA so that Escobar could get consistent playing time. No need for three utility players.

[Kirby_waved_at_me]

I guess the key for the rest of the season is finding out if giving Suzuki more rest can help him improve his hitting. If that means Fryer is out there twice a week, you're not really losing much at the plate compared to a tired Kurt Suzuki, but you are getting a defensive bonus. Assuming rest makes Kurt better when he does suit up, that could be a good thing all around.

 

 

[TheLeviathan]

Derek Norris...let's go after him aggressively.

[Kirby_waved_at_me]

 

Derek Norris...let's go after him aggressively.

I'd be up for that - what does San Diego need the most right now? They guys they added don't seem to have helped as much as they had hoped.

Do they need pitching? Neither Milone or Pelfrey (or both) would be enough I think - The Padres gave up a couple good young arms (Hahn and Alvarez) that were under team control until 2020 to get Norris.  

Would the villagers storm the castle if Alex Meyer was mentioned in an offer?

[Mike Sixel]

Won't SD want more than they gave up? Didn't they fire their manager for not winning now? I don't get why they would trade him, w/o a huge overpay.

[Kirby_waved_at_me]

I agree - Meyer would be one piece of a potential trade if the Twins wanted to go after Norris aggressively.

 

Just throwing out a name that would get the Padres to stay on the line.

 

Norris would be a long-term addition (he's not a free agent until 2019), so a prospect going out would not be as painful as it would be for a rental.

[Otto von Ballpark]

This past winter, Norris was traded for two guys: a 24 year old starter who was where Trevor May is now, without the stalls, struggles, and ERA-FIP discrepancy, plus a 23 year old reliever who was where we hoped Nick Burdi would be after this season (12.7 K/9 and 1.25 ERA in AA, plus 9 K's vs 3 hits and 1 run in his first 8 MLB innings).  I guess the A's also threw in an interesting albeit older A-ball starter (who is apparently injured now? hasn't pitched in 2015).

 

I don't think the Twins have the pieces they are willing to trade to land Norris.  And the Padres may not think Hedges is ready for prime time yet anyway (and Norris's value probably won't change if the Padres wait a year to deal him).

[jokin]

 

The Twins certainly have guys they should be able to remove from the 40-man -- but how does adding another such player make that easier?  If anything, it makes it harder -- Fryer is unlikely to be removed from the 40-man in the next month -- or it makes it more likely that Pinto is dropped instead.

 

My primary concern is that the Twins think this might "fix" their catching deficiency.  For the bullpen equivalent, it would be like if they had just added Jason Frasor or Scott Atchison instead of O'Rourke.  It's at best a sideways move that doesn't address the actually issue and further clogs the 40-man.

 

How do you come to that conclusion?  Both Herrmann and Fryer are both highly inconsequential figures, easily removed, and Pinto's days as a major league catcher are likely over, as well.  If the Twins aren't actively looking for a catching upgrade as well as at least one or two pen upgrades with their surplus of prospects relative to the limited open 2016 available roster spots, then they're not doing their proper due diligence.

[d-mac]

 

Eric Fryer was working out with Team USA, preparing for the Pan-Am Games. However, he was added to the 40-man roster and summoned to the big leagues. Herrmann was optioned to Rochester.

 

To make room on the 40-man roster, Ricky Nolasco was placed on the 60-Day Disabled List.

 

Not a huge surprise, though the timing is a little strange.

 

File this under the "why bother?" section of roster moves. Nothing to see here. 

[TheLeviathan]

Won't SD want more than they gave up? Didn't they fire their manager for not winning now? I don't get why they would trade him, w/o a huge overpay.

If we want to solve the catcher problem we will have to overpay. Norris may be available due to Hedges.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

How do you come to that conclusion?

I should have asked you: how does having Fryer rather than an open spot on the roster "make it easier for them to subtract below-replacement guys"?

 

I guess technically they can't subtract a guy from an open spot, but at best, this is a lateral move.  At worst, it suggests they *might* value one of these below-replacement guys more than they should.

 

Fryer just got added so he's unlikely to get dropped right away -- now what if Herrmann resumes hitting .300 at AAA and Pinto is still in injury limbo?  I could see them holding on to all 3 of them for a little while longer, and having one less spot be flexible.  And for what gain, really?  Suzuki's not going to suddenly blossom as a hitter catching slightly less than before, and in any case, Fryer isn't going to enable them to rest Suzuki any more than Herrmann.

 

if anything, they probably should have used the 40-man spot to continue auditioning more bullpen help in advance of the trade deadline, to better determine our needs in that area.  Adding Fryer does nothing: they still need catching help.

[DaveTMpls]

 

Maybe this has less to do with chosing Fryer over Herrmann but instead this is chosing Fryer over Suzuki.

 

Considering how infrequently Herrmann played, I think it could be assumed the team always liked Fryer better, but wanted him getting regular time, or perhaps giving the AAA pitchers regular time with the better defensive catcher.

 

Not only is Fryer hitting and getting on base while Suzuki is not, Suzuki isn't blocking pitches in the dirt well and can't throw anyone out.  If I were to guess, I'd bet that Fryer is the primary starter going forward.

I sure hope you're right, Nick.  Fryer is an excellent defensive catcher, and that's where he will make his contribution.

[Kirby_waved_at_me]

Fryer is starting today, though it is a day game following a night game...

[DaveTMpls]

 

File this under the "why bother?" section of roster moves. Nothing to see here. 

I disagree.  Catcher is primarily a defensive position.  Fryer>>Suzuki behind the plate.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

Considering how infrequently Herrmann played, I think it could be assumed the team always liked Fryer better, but wanted him getting regular time, or perhaps giving the AAA pitchers regular time with the better defensive catcher.

Wanted Fryer to get regular time?  This is Fryer's 3rd season in the organization, and they've given him 259 and 206 plate appearances in his first two.  It took Pinto largely sucking and hurt to get him more than that.

[Otto von Ballpark]

Fryer was in the Herrmann role (sole backup) for a large portion of last season.  He started 19 out of 74 games from his call-up in June 2014 until the time Pinto came back in September, or 26%.

 

Herrmann started 19 out of 84 games this year, or 23%.

 

That's a difference of less than 1 start per month.

[jokin]

 

I should have asked you: how does having Fryer rather than an open spot on the roster "make it easier for them to subtract below-replacement guys"?

 

I guess technically they can't subtract a guy from an open spot, but at best, this is a lateral move.  At worst, it suggests they *might* value one of these below-replacement guys more than they should.

 

Fryer just got added so he's unlikely to get dropped right away -- now what if Herrmann resumes hitting .300 at AAA and Pinto is still in injury limbo?  I could see them holding on to all 3 of them for a little while longer, and having one less spot be flexible.  And for what gain, really?  Suzuki's not going to suddenly blossom as a hitter catching slightly less than before, and in any case, Fryer isn't going to enable them to rest Suzuki any more than Herrmann.

 

if anything, they probably should have used the 40-man spot to continue auditioning more bullpen help in advance of the trade deadline, to better determine our needs in that area.  Adding Fryer does nothing: they still need catching help.

 

If they spend time doing ruing over any of the things you are contemplating for longer than 5 minutes, than that's time wasted that hopefully is being spent on outside upgrade options.  No one else from the bullpen not already on the 40-man is worthy to be added right now, and if they somehow suddenly become worthy, than one of the catchers will be easily removed from the 40-man (or possibly 60-dayed, in the case of Pinto).