Would the Twins be 16-13 if Gardy were still here?

[jimbo92107]

There's nothing like better players to make a manager look good. On the other hand, why are the players better? Paul Molitor personally worked with Santana and other minor leaguers to shorten their swings and take better at bats.

 

I'll give Molitor credit for changing the personality of the team. They seem more professional today than they did last year. They seem more like a cohesive unit, and they seem more opportunistic, looking for ways to apply pressure. That's why Aaron Hicks is still down in AAA, he wasn't fully engaged in the game, not looking for ways to beat the other team. Baseball is a game of cat and mouse. If you're not busy stalking your prey, then you become the mouse.

 

That's also why I still like Torii Hunter. He's not the player he once was, but he still understands the importance of taking the extra base, hitting the cutoff man, and coming up with key hits. The team as a whole is doing a better job of that, and it has shown up in their record.

 

So I think Gardenhire would not have won this many games. Gardy wasn't motivating the guys to constantly apply pressure. The team was too passive the last few years. They have a much better attitude now.

[tobi0040]

 

I think the results would be about the same with Gardy. The difference will show, later in the season, after tough stretches of baseball. The Gardy teams would be more resilient. I expect Molly's team to be too brittle and mike break under pressure.  I hope not, but to me, Molly manages "scared".

 

I am not sure how this conclusion about Molitor managing scared can be reached so early in the year, especially as Nick pointed out....the team has been pretty resilient thus far.

 

I would also suggest that Gardy's W-L the second half of the season has been awful for at least the last four years.  Signaling to me that as the going get tough, things consistenly fell apart.

 

2014

44-50 first half.  .468
26-42 second half .382

 

2013

39-53 first half .424
27-43 second half .386

 

2012

36-49 first half .424
30-47 second half .390

 

2011

41-48 first half .461
22-51 second half .301

[Brock Beauchamp]

I am not sure how this conclusion about Molitor managing scared can be reached so early in the year, especially as Nick pointed out....the team has been pretty resilient thus far.

 

I would also suggest that Gardy's W-L the second half of the season has been awful for at least the last four years. Signaling to me that as the going get tough, things consistenly fell apart.

 

2014

44-50 first half. .468

26-42 second half .382

 

2013

39-53 first half .424

27-43 second half .386

 

2012

36-49 first half .424

30-47 second half .390

 

2011

41-48 first half .461

22-51 second half .301

Yeah, I was going to bring this up and forgot. Gardy's recent teams just fell apart later in the season.

[diehardtwinsfan]

I still haven't forgiven Gardy for lobbying to bring back Bartlett, Kubel, and Guerrier last season.  He wasn't committed to winning.  He just wanted a few of his old friends in the clubhouse.

If we want to talk about that, I haven't forgiven him for 2004 playoffs.

[Thrylos]

 

. The Gardy teams would be more resilient.

 

Have you checked the 'resiliency' of Gardy teams in September the past few years and in the post-season?   Not sure how resilient Belly Up is, but that's about it...

[DaveW]

I think at most a manager adds or subtracts 3 wins or losses in a year (at most) so I am guessing Gardy would have this team at either 16-13,17-12 or 15-14 at this point.

 

The twins are playing well because the pitching has been solid, and they are getting timely hitting

[twinsnorth49]

The name of this thread needs updating,

[DaveW]

 

Nope.  Because nobody would be on the DL yet.  Everyone would be day to day and have a single effective bench player to use.

 

Plus May would had been in Rochester and Milone in Minnesota.

 

Good riddance.

You do realize that the GM makes the roster moves,  correct?

[formerly33]

I don't know. I think that Torii Hunter actually plays a big role in this situation, even though there are still a lot of people who would like to stick a fork in him. We did have good examples last year - Joe Mauer, for instance, but did we have a real strong leader like Torii? I don't think so. You may disagree with me, but somebody can't just be a good example to be a leader. He has to be fun so that everyone wants to hang out with him and great so that he's respected. Age is also a huge factor here. Brian Dozier has the makings of being a great leader, but he is still establishing himself, and you can't expect him to lead a whole team.

 

Anyway, who else on the team has the cockiness that Torii has? He's instilled into the team something that Brian Dozier, a player who has never been on a contending team, could never have done this year.

 

So basically I think that Gardy would have had a good year, too. But I like Molly and his willingness to experiment. It's fun, entertaining, and, best of all, we're getting those wins. I may have been upset when we fired Gardy, but you know, I ain't complaining now!

[mikecgrimes]

I think a lot of stuff modern managers do at most alters 1 or 2 results a year, but the one thing that alters more then that is the defensive shifting.  I liked Gardenhire, but not shifting on it's own at this point was reason enough for the Twins to move on.  I also think Molitor and Terry Ryan are on the same page, you don't need the perfect roster if the manager has what he wants.  And the one reason I can safely say the Twins would't be 5 games over .500 is that Gardenhire teams always started slow.  Whats really sold me on Molitor is the recovery from the 1-6 start, I was ready to hate Molitor at that point because I knew this team was good enough that I should at the very least get to experience false hope at some point this season, 24 games later and I'd easily take 18-13 even had we started 6-1.