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KirbyDome89

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Everything posted by KirbyDome89

  1. KirbyDome89
    Not damaged goods, just not likely to handle a starters workload thus less valuable in the eyes of Boston, hence the greater ask. I wasn't all that high on the deal when it was announced and I'm certainly not criticizing the Twins for pulling back; I think the asking price for Maeda was too much as well. I also don't think this was some elaborate play by the Red Sox, i.e. they didn't get "cold feet," and they didn't act in poor faith as far as we know.
  2. KirbyDome89
    I think Graterol lost a bit of shine in this whole ordeal, which is unfortunate for MN moving forward as they need to add pitching. I also don't think Boston is guilty of doing anything that we wouldn't want the Twins to do in this same scenario. The Sox almost certainly viewed Graterol as a starter. They obviously were aware of the shoulder issue last season, the prior TJ surgery, and his move to the pen this season, but once they dug into the medicals some red flag(s) must've shown up. Betts was moving regardless, so the notion that Boston got cold feet based on the return doesn't hold much weight. I'd also take anything Scott Boras says with a massive grain of salt. Boston wanted more after concluding that the starting pitching prospect they thought they were getting wasn't likely to start, and the Twins weren't interested in throwing in another top talent. MN walked, and I'm fine with that. If the roles were reversed, we'd be singing the praises of Falvey for not committing to a deal he wasn't comfortable with and/or attempting to extract more after his medical team determined the initial projection was lofty. It sucks that MN is left holding the bag in terms of rehabbing Graterol's luster, but I'm not sure I can fault the Sox for their part. Deals fall apart, or are amended, it happens.
  3. KirbyDome89
    I meant leverage in getting a deal done. Of course any of the three teams could back out at any point, nobody is being held hostage in the negotiations.
  4. KirbyDome89
    Both MLBTR and TD had projections higher than what Berrios submitted. They're not gospel, but dragging a guy you need to extend to an arbitration hearing over 300K seems to be losing the forest for the trees.
  5. KirbyDome89
    Me too, but I think Boston believed they were getting a true starter prospect in Graterol. I'm sure they're pushing for either Balazovic or Duran. I'm also not sure what leverage, if any, the Twins have right now. If the roles were reversed and MN was parting with a generational talent like Betts, I can't imagine the uproar if their only return was salary relief and a pitching prospect with uncertain medicals + a throw in.
  6. KirbyDome89
    Soooooo this is a new development..... https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/28644920/prospect-health-holds-3-team-trade-involving-mookie-betts
  7. KirbyDome89
    Where did I even imply that was the standard? They gave up a top pitching prospect for an average pitcher. As I said in OP you quoted, it's an understandable move. I agree with Steve though, in regards to where their season ends, I don't think the addition of Maeda moves the needle much. This strawman has popped up a few times in this thread. I've seen posters suggest they aren't happy with the trade based on value lost/gained, but I haven't seen any "fantasy," proposals, so I'm not sure why this is even being brought up. Count me amongst the feeble minded then. This organization hasn't won a single playoff game since 2004, and they haven't won a single series in nearly 20 years. This isn't the only team in the last two decades to possess elite talent. The results of choosing not to supplement it, and "hoping to get hot," speak for themselves. I'd rather not see a repeat....
  8. KirbyDome89
    I agree with each of you to a point. I would've rather seen a big package for a big return too. Maybe that wasn't possible right now, maybe it was and MN wasn't willing to pay that price. I've expressed concern that this move is a half measure, and I 100% see it as a move that solidifies a division title but doesn't get them out of a postseason series. That said, I've bitched nonstop about the risk of handing 2 rotation spots to Dobnak/Thorpe/Smeltzer, relying on Baily, Hill, and Pineda to all be healthy and effective, and crossing your fingers that nothing happens to Odorizzi and Berrios. I think MN probably could've made it to July too, even with a poor starting rotation, but I understand why the Twins pulled the trigger here. I just don't think it's a move anybody should love.
  9. KirbyDome89
    The quality of future adds is really what's in question. Do we believe the Pohlad's view his incentive laden deal as a bargain and therefore put their theoretical surplus towards more talent? Of equal importance is whether the FO views the low cost contract as a springboard for acquiring the front end talent they need. As I said in another post, if this is a move and not the move then the Twins are off to a good start. If this acquisition means the FO is content to sit out another deadline then I think we need to reassess the deal. Agreed on plugging a rotation hole for more than one year.
  10. KirbyDome89
    Bailey, HIll, and Pineda all have serious injury histories and concerns yet all three were signed this offseason. Maeda's contract is incentive heavy based on his physical when coming to the US, and the Dodgers have been throttling his IPs the last few seasons to alleviate some of that anxiety. I think moving Graterol has everything to do with where MN sees him heading forward, and what they think they can get from Maeda. Hopefully the FO is right.
  11. KirbyDome89
    I'd say I feel kind of "meh," more than anything. MN needed an arm. I'm on board with moving prospects to make that happen. Pushing one of Smeltzer/Dobnak/Thorpe out of a rotation spot is a positive. That said, this seems like a half measure. The FO landed another mid to back end rotation arm. There's value in solidifying the starting group, but they're still lacking at their greatest position of need, front end starters. If this is a move and not the move in regards to additions then I'm in favor. If this means the FO can be comfortable standing pat in July then we're being set up for another letdown in October.
  12. KirbyDome89
    Sure, I agree that truth is unwavering no matter how you arrive at it, but that isn't what's being questioned. If we're assessing character, then Fier's motives certainly should be scrutinized. Did his moral fiber suddenly grow so strong over 2+ years that he felt compelled to blow the whistle, or was he a jilted ex that watched his former team and current rival, which kept him off the playoff roster in 17', win the AL West ahead of Oakland and make deep playoff runs, while the A's failed to make it out of the WC game? Fiers isn't the "good guy," more than any other player on that 17' roster, and he certainly benefitted from having an offense that knew what was coming.
  13. KirbyDome89
    Fiers blowing the whistle on his old team 2 years later doesn't place him in a category above anybody else on that squad; i.e. he isn't the "good guy," either. IMO his motivation for bringing the story to light is fairly questionable. Altruism wouldn't be my first guess as to why he started talking.
  14. KirbyDome89
    Brooks initially posted it, but by the logic used here didn't the Twins cheat the entire league last year, the AL Central in particular, by riding Pineda's hot second half to a division title? As far as links to MN and cheating, it's a fallacy to prove a negative. That doesn't mean the Twins are entirely innocent here. Most fan bases would be better off reserving judgement. It's entirely possible all of this is more widespread, or that using video to gain an advantage runs much deeper than what is currently being reported. We can name individual players who were caught using PEDs during the 90s/early 00s, but we also know the problem went well beyond those individuals. While MLB tries to clean up their house, they very well could be content to let Houston and Boston bear the brunt of public scrutiny.
  15. KirbyDome89
    The Twins shouldn't do anything. They're not in any position to take a moral stand after signing Pineda and Cruz to contracts post suspension. Marwin is still a valuable utility option off the bench, there's no reason to even consider voiding his contract. Good luck to MLB with handing out individual punishments. A strong players union on top of the near impossibility of discerning which players benefitted and to what extent all but ensures punishment at an individual level isn't going to happen.
  16. KirbyDome89
    If MN pulls the trigger on Boston's offer of Lester, Ellsbury, ect I'd imagine we'd have a different view of the trade. I agree that no prospects should be untouchable, and the team has put themselves in a position where they now need to spend prospects alongside $$ to bring in postseason pitching. That said, I think all too often prospects of all tiers are lumped together. The type of prospects MN will need to move for an ace (Kirilloff, Larnach, Balazovic, ect) have a much better shot at contributing to a major league club.
  17. KirbyDome89
    That uncertainty about what might be available and how it stacks up against previous FA classes or trade deadlines only strengthens my point, no? There have been opportunities to add and management has consistently passed. Pitching was an issue when this FO took over 3+ years ago. It continues to be today, and the corner they've painted themselves into grows tighter every time the goal posts move. I think the price of deadline acquisitions is being downplayed. Bargains and "assigned value," aren't typically found in July, and so far we've seen no evidence that this FO is willing to move off of either. IMO there's a very real chance that this team enters the postseason with Berrios as their best arm. I hope I'm wrong.....
  18. KirbyDome89
    Smeltzer, Dobnak, and Thorpe have about 100 IP and 13 total starts combined. I wouldn't call that battle tested. It's very possible they become the 18' versions of Gonsalves, Mejia, or Slegers. This team is ready in the sense that they have bodies to fill rotation spots, but that shouldn't the bar to clear for a group that's expected to actually compete in a postseason series. The cost of a SP isn't going to be more palatable at the deadline. Kicking the can down the road once again and waiting 3+ months to acquire the front end arm they so desperately need is less than ideal....
  19. KirbyDome89
    I don't understand this Seth. 1. Aside from Graterol, all of the depth is of the same talent level; 5 spot starter ceilings, with a decent chance they're AAAA and won't stick on a major league roster. There are questions about whether Graterol is even going to be a starter. I understand that almost no team has 6-8 solid starters rostered, and MN can probably get by rotating through Dobnak, Smeltzer, Thorpe, and Graterol in that last rotation spot for a short while, but you said it yourself, they're depth. Ideally none of them are handed a rotation spot out of ST, and certainly guaranteeing them 2 spots plus a potential 3rd due to injury/ineffectiveness is far from ideal no? Depth is an asset when it stays as that, not when it's filling out nearly or more than half of your rotation early in the season. 2. The big league team in April isn't the place for tryouts. The huge lead the Twins built up through early June last year won them a division title. The games early in the season matter just as much as the ones in September. I'm not sure why anybody is endorsing the Twins "seeing what the have," by running a bunch of question marks through the last two spot in the rotation, especially considering the fact that the two pitchers they're counting on to return at midseason each have serious injury histories. I've beaten it to death in other threads, but again, if they roll into the season with the staff as currently constructed they're begging for trouble. One bout of ineffectiveness from Bailey, one minor injury or even some general soreness/fatigue for Odorizzi or Berrios, and the rotation starts to look like something resembling Rochester more than MN.
  20. KirbyDome89
    And only one of those 100 win teams failed to win a single playoff game. Shockingly enough it was the team that started Randy Dobnak in game 2 of the ALDS. MN feasted on a historically terrible division to win 100+ games. Win total is a hollow comparison amongst MN, Houston, and NY. The Twins were the only AL playoff team with a losing record against clubs over .500 last year if you want to dig a little further. I'm all for racking up easy Ws while the opportunity presents itself, but this rotation, as currently constructed, looks set up to repeat the postseason failure we've become all too familiar with.
  21. KirbyDome89
    Unequivocally yes, they need at least one other starter. They can probably mash their way to a division title in the weak Central but it'll be another disappointing postseason appearance if MN doesn't acquire somebody that'll slot into one of the top two spots in the rotation. Rich Hill is far from a guarantee to even pitch this year. Pineda has his own laundry list of past injuries. Homer Bailey was largely ineffective and/or injured for 4+ seasons before a "strong 2nd half," last year where he was essentially a league average pitcher. Relying on Smeltzer, Thorpe, Dobnak, and Graterol to fill 2 rotation spots for any length of time is negligent. As of right now, if Berrios or Odorizzi are forced to miss any time over the first couple months, or Bailey simply isn't effective, an extremely potent offense could be wasted.
  22. KirbyDome89
    That might simply be a product of an "ok," Sox teaming beating up on two awful division opponents. The AL East has two bad teams, but I'd take Boston over the ChiSox. The AL West is easily stronger top to bottom, same goes for the NL Central. The NL East is likely the best division in baseball. Maybe the NL west? Maybe. SD is in a similar spot as the Sox, and if SF and Colorado both implode, intentionally or not, I can see an argument for the Sox slotting in above them. That said it'll be hard for the bottom of that division to match how terrible both Detroit and KC will be this season. The Central will boast two of the 3-4 worst teams in baseball again.
  23. KirbyDome89
    The tweet is incredibly misleading. He'll play 81 games at home this year, and a vast majority of those ABs won't come against AAAA guys like the Twins were running out the years those Toronto teams would tee off at Target Field. I agree the Central is easily the worst division in baseball, and he'll see some subpar pitching, but it won't account for anywhere close to the percentage of poor pitching used to generate the stat lines in that tweet.
  24. KirbyDome89
    Those stats were amassed against a lot of really poor Twins pitching scattered across some terrible teams in the mid 2010s. I'm a big fan of the signing, but Donaldson isn't going to face Tommy Milone, Mike Pelfrey, Kevin Correia, ect.
  25. KirbyDome89
    I approve
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