Dman

While I like that PECOTA has us as the top dog for our division this year I don't put much stock in projection systems because injuries and just a bad bounce here or there can make them irrelevant. It is fun to see where they have teams ranked but that is about it for me.

I am with you to some degree here. Baseball is such a long season is just surviving it with the best record throughout the year mean you are the best team? Looking to football as an example teams grow over the season. Maybe a young team starts the year out poorly but gels later and gets into the playoffs and wins it all Like the Giants did over the undefeated Patriots. Who was the best team that year the wild card team or the team with best record? To me if a team has been good enough during the year (i.e. at least over .500) then why shouldn't they get a shot? If they are soo bad then they could never upset the other team anyway, right? If they do have a shot isn't that part of the excitement and unpredictability of the playoffs? I fail to see how the watered down analogy applies. I think the new format would help with tanking and should again allow fans to be more interested in how their teams are doing longer into the season as it will take longer to be truly eliminated. I personally think the change could be very good for baseball.

I remember not that long ago saying this was a stupid pick by the Twins. Ahh feels so good to eat crow, He has done really well since the moment they brought him in. The bat is for real and with the improved defense he looks legit. I am still a big Rortvedt fan. He was close to breaking through last year with the bat and then got injured and seemed to tapper off. Rortvedt's defense seems outstanding to me. If the bat picks up he'll be right there with Jeffers. Not much for catchers behind them so maybe they pick someone up in the draft? Probably not with the lost picks and this being a pitchers draft. Still nice to have two young and very talented Catchers in the org though.

I would give the Dodgers an A+. They had to give up something and that was Verdugo. Although they gave up Downs and Wong they got back Graterol and Raley two slightly lessor prospects but still within Range of the two they gave up. They lost Maeda but gained Price again a fairly even trade off. So essentially for Verdugo and of course a bunch of money they get Mookie Betts. Absolute genius in my mind. Didn't lose much prospect value and gained a difference maker for the post season. Really, really well done. Boston B+. If they keep Betts this year and things go right for them on the pitching front maybe Boston has a shot hard to say but after that they have nothing left in the prospect pool at all and would still need to reset the cap to get rid of penalties. It is an absolute nightmare scenario. Instead for one year of Mookie they get a very good replacement in Verdugo. Granted not Mookie but in the end he might not be that far off and they get at least three years at reasonable rates as well which they desperately need. Same with Downs who if he keeps doing what he is doing can hopefully fill out second base in the future for them. The Catcher is a need they have and has an added bonus of being a utility player as well. All for one year of Mookie Betts with the added bonus of resetting the cap this year so they could go over next year if they need to add a couple more players to strengthen the roster again. It was a very solid and timely move for the Sox. They did very well IMO certainly much better than keeping Betts. The Twins B-. The Twins put themselves in a position that they needed another starter to start the season and while they got Maeda I am not confident he will pitch as well as we hope and don't believe he is the answer to our post season woes. Although they could afford to give up Graterol and Raley to achieve that I still think the Dodgers win this deal. Throw in the Second round comp pick and I know the Dodgers won this deal. Yeah the Twins got 10M but they lost the ability to move around in the draft and they lost two good prospects with 6 years of control for an older pitcher who may or may not age well. It is a win now move and I get that and I am not completely unhappy about it but because we gained only money and no prospects back that brings the grade down a notch for me. If the FO can explain why they needed the money and use it in a way that helps the team at the deadline then I would revise this grade to B+ but until I know it is B- for me. I was very pleased that our FO did not cave to Bostons demands and I am glad they got involved in a deal to make this team better. This FO is breaking all the old ways of doing business and I hope it leads to lots of future success.

Yep looks like if we are lucky he will be as good as David Banuelous. As predicted a total nothing burger return. Not sure why they felt they needed that 10M but I would have thought they could have gotten more for Raley than just money and a catcher who goes to the plate blind folded. Well they did kind of need to move Raley and at least they got something for him as he helped close the Maeda trade which is better than just releasing him but dang Friedman always wins these deals, always. I hope Maeda is better than I think he is going to be but if he gets through the first couple of months of the season pitching well, this will have been a good deal for us as well.

I was wondering the same thing. From the Dodgers end Is the conversation starter if you won't give us another prospect how about throwing in your 2nd round comp pick. Or from the Twins end so how much would you be willing to give us for Raley and our 2nd round comp pick? Since the Twins have done this before i tend to think they brought it up first but who knows. I just find it odd to trade the comp pick for money. Has any other team done that? I can't think of one. Comp picks have been traded for players but most teams keep them. I guess I don't know the prospect return on our end but I can't imagine it will be anything big. Will have to wait and see before judging this deal but I do find the money for the pick odd.

If I remember correctly the Twins were always enamored with his defense and speed. The bat speed was there for power as well the one missing thing and it was a big one was the hit tool. In general I don't like it when teams take guys with poor hit tools early in the draft because far too often guys that don't have a good one never really develop one. You can have the other 4 tools but without the hit tool it all goes down the drain. Cavvy is very young and certainly has plenty of time to develop so no need to panic just yet but I still think he is a bit of a gamble. Most high schoolers that start out in pro ball don't do well their draft season. We should know more about how well things are going to go after this year if he doesn't get hurt.

Raley was going to have a tough time getting a shot with the Twins and he was kind of clogging the the 40 man as a redundant outfielder. We need to add Kirilloff to the 40 man at the end of this year so an outfielder needed to move Raley makes sense. If that is what needed to happen to make the trade go through I am fine with that. I don't know how Fredman does it but he always gets value. I think Raley is going to be a very good major league player in time he just needs some opportunity. I hate losing Brusdar just absolutely loved that kid but this makes sense for the Twins. I hope that pitching pipeline is ready to produce so we don't have to keep making deals like this but I really think they did the right thing here. I think the Dodgers win this trade long term but I also think we needed this move at this time.

Friedman really helped Bloom out big time. So Boston ended up not getting a pitcher at all in this deal? I knew no one would give them a top 100 pitcher for Meada and I knew LA wouldn't do it either. I fail to see how Boston got much more in the new deal and certainly nothing close to the two top 10 prospects they were pushing Minnesota for. Position players are safer bets so I guess there's that and Friedman the smarter GM picks up Graterol and gets 6 years of a high octane arm. He also picks up the Twins 2nd round comp pick and they have been good at finding guys in the early rounds. That guy never loses a deal. The Dodgers are going to be good for a very long time. Happy for the Twins as well though. Picking up another solid starter to start the year is huge given the issues we have. Maeda is on a performance driven contract so if does poorly at least they won't have to pay for it. Also he could be moved to the pen and help that way. The Twins like to have a flexible roster and this guy fits right into that. Hate to see Graterol go. Like Friedman I believe he is going to be just fine in the Major leagues and if he ever does develop that change up I still think he can start but maybe that is my blind optimism talking. Also hate to lose that second round pick as it makes the draft less exciting but we now have a team where you sacrifice the future for the present happy with move even though we lost a second and third round pick this year Really, really happy with the FO. They really seem to know what they are doing.

I think we should get out of this deal. I like Maeda as go now move but I like Graterols potential as well. I wouldn't mind having the kid back. He seems like one of the few power bullpen arms we have so wouldn't be bad to keep him.

The Dodgers are giving the Red Sox everything they could ever hope for what other team can step in and offer anything close to this?

Yeah it is time to get out of this deal. Need to deal with a team that deals in reality not fantasy. If Meada is awesome why aren't the Twins out and another team in? I don't think Boston wants this deal to go through. If they got two top 10 guys and Verdugo from LA for one year of Betts that would be robbery. LA is also saving them from cap hell. I say kill the deal and let them keep Mookie or let LA deal with there unrealistic demands. Friedman would never give up two top ten prospects in this deal why should we?

I was thinking somewhat the same thing. I guess first they need to find out if another team values Maeda more than the Twins then they still get the deal done just with another team, but if that doesn't work then related to what you said I was wondering if the Dodgers would take on Graterol and then Give Boston Josiah Gray. He and Brusdar are ranked about the same in the top 100 and if Boston is satisfied with his physical then all LA loses is one top 100 prospect for another. If Boston still wants more than that then I say have a good year and good luck when Mookie Leaves next year.

And we are officially out of the trade per MLB trade rumors. Glad we didn't budge. I guess Boston\Dodgers found a better offer for Maeda? Happy to have you back Brusdar. I hope you close out\shut the door on many games against the Sox in the future. Thank you FO for not caving!! I am fine with this result given the circumstances.

And we are officially out of the trade per MLB trade rumors. Glad we didn't budge. I guess Boston\Dodgers found a better offer for Maeda? Happy to have you back Brusdar. I hope you close out\shut the door on many games against the Sox in the future.

There was nothing for the Twins to hide as Graterol is not currently injured he is all systems go at this time. His agent said the same thing and on top of that said the specialists that checked him out had no concerns about his arm at this time. The Twins had already publicly stated that they were likely going to use Graterol in the pen this year. So again not hiding anything. The issue is a subjective one. He could be a starter and never have another arm issue no one knows at this point but there are some red flags that could give a team pause. Brusdar has only pitched 100 innings once in his career so far. Granted he is still only 21 so he hasn't had many opportunities to pitch that many innings. Last year he suffered a shoulder impingement. Shoulder issues can be a really serious issue for a pitcher because there generally is no good way to fix those other than rest. From what I understand there are things in his medicals that could mean he is a greater risk for serious injury down the road but again that is subjective no one really knows it might just be X percent more likely. It is not definitive. So I am not sure exactly what the Sox are up to here. They want us to cover that risk by adding another top 10 prospect to the deal? And yet they and or the Dodgers won't give us anything for the potential injury risk that a 32 year old pitcher might have? That doesn't sound fair to me. With pitchers there is always risk of injury so if you don't like it then maybe don't trade for pitchers trade for position players instead. I still think the Sox are dirty here until someone can come up with something really good about the medicals. And if the medicals really are that bad then why haven't they said look this guys arm is ready to fall we need somebody else? No they are asking for another top 10 prospect on top of Graterol. What they are doing and asking for doesn't add up to me.

I say that mainly because Boston doesn't like the return. I don't think the Dodgers care who gets Meada as they are giving that return to Boston. From everything I read the Dodgers aren't doing anything more it is strictly Boston and the Twins thus my earlier statement. The Dodgers could be calling and shopping him too I have no idea but I haven't heard of them doing anything and Boston is asking MN to up the return so it sounds like a Boston issue to me. If they don't like the return if I were them I would shop Meada to other teams and see what they are willing to offer especially if the Twins are not going to move on what they are willing to give. The Dodgers could do the same but they already had a deal setup and are not in discussions with Boston to offer more so it seems to me unless MN caves this is a take it or leave it deal unless Boston can find a return they like better then what Minnestoa is offering for Meada. I suspect it will be hard to find a return that includes a top 100 pitcher and whether Brusdar is a starter or in the pen he helps Boston because they need pen help badly as well. I think Boston will have an even harder time selling the return if they don't get a top 100 pitcher in return. They don't really need position players they need pitching and I don't think many teams will be willing to give that level up for Maeda.

Since it is taking this long and Boston apparently isn't getting what they want from the Twins I have to believe Boston is shopping Maeda around and looking for some other team to pay their high price. I honestly can't think of anyone else that would give up a front of the rotation type top 100 prospect for Meada. Maybe I am way off on that assumption but young pitching is hard to tear away from teams.

If that is the case they should have just walked away. He is the only pitcher with top of the rotation upside beyond Duran. Paying that for an old pitcher just seems wrong to me.

This is Friedman we are talking he never overpays and never gives up a top three prospect but I am sure he expects the Twins to do it.

I agree Boras states in there that their medical eval is pretty much a joke. They are just doing this because they are taking it in the shorts from their fans and the Boston Media. I am glad someone is finally calling them out. This is not a good first look for Bloom at all. What a disaster all the way around. Either take the deal as it stands or say no deal.

While I agree with you for the most part it probably depends on how the trade was structured. Maybe the Doggers traded Maeda and Verdugo to Boston with the understanding that whatever they got for Madea they would send to Boston. In that case then Boston has to be happy with what MN gave and if not would need to deal with MN to get what they want. They were satified with Graterol to start with. The changed their mind. The Dodgers are already giving up Verdugo who is a very good outfileder as it is. Probably as good as Larnach will be whenever he is ready. The are giving up 5 years of control of Verdugo and taking on 30M in salary for Betts. To top it off they are taking on another 15M in salary and have to take Price in the deal. For the Dodgers to stay under the cap they have to salary dump one of their players and to get rid of him they needed to add another player to the deal. All to get 1 year of Mookie Betts. That would be more than I would be willing to give in that scenario. I would not be adding anything else in as they are litterally saving Boston from all the bad decisions they made in the past and giving them a very good replacement for what they have lost. Whatever return they got from MN for Maeda should have been gravy. To get a top 100 prospect that throws 100 is another very good get and again they are getting all of this for just 1 year of Mookie Betts. While I don't understand prospect value the way FO's do if that isn't enough for Maeda I would say I am out. I know Maeda has a fantastic contract and really fits with what the Twins are trying to do but he is also 32 with an injury past as well thus his structured contract. How many more bullets are in that arm. Getting 4 years out of him seems unlikely, certainly Possible but unlikely. So the Twins have injury risk just like Boston with Graterol. Who is protectiing us in this deal? If they want the Twins to throw in Raley or Jax or both fine but to go top 10 just make sense to me unless you don't really want this deal to happen.

Player evaluation is really hard. There is a lot of information I don't have when making my passionate rants. I am really battling myself on this one. Part of me really wants Maeda even if the price hurts and the other side wants to just walk away and let another team pay the price. I will probably be disappointed with either outcome.

Risky, but if he pitches well and doesn't get injured he would be a very attractive piece at the deadline. Not sure how their fan-base would react to that. Getting a 32 year old pitcher and potentially not helping your cap situation might be a tougher sell than a getting a young top 100 prospect in Graterol.

They have leverage as long we want Meada. How badly do we want him and what is his defined value and will the FO pay more than that just to get him this year. That is the question but I don't believe the Red Sox want him, no.